Memetic X Cleanup

Should we be concerned that Godzilla vs. Kong has an entire sub-page, despite the film not having been released yet?

The very existence of that page seems like a knee-jerk reaction. Not everything that was popular on Twitter for like 2 days should be listed as a meme.

I found this on Fantasia:

• Memetic Mutation: Sorceror Appearance Mickey pretty much became the icon of Disney next to red-shorts-and-yellow-boots Mickey, so it's only natural that he would get tons of memes as an honor.
  • The magic brooms also have their share of recognition by the internet.

Neither of these sound like actual memes, it's just character popularity. Alright if I cut?

It might be Breakout Character if Sorcerer Mickey counts as his own character distinct from Mickey Mouse? Since he became super popular in Disney merchandising afterwards, and I think that's more a corporate thing than an audience popularity thing.

Personally I'd consider Breakout Character the more appropriate trope here, since tropes are flexible and it's a specific incarnation of Mickey.

Edited by AlleyOop on Mar 2nd 2021 at 4:27:45 AM

Luca already has a bunch of examples, despite the film not being released yet:

• Memetic Mutation:
  • Comparisons to Call Me by Your Name were common when the film was first announced, due to both films being set in Italy and involving friendship between two boys (although the latter is more on the LGBT spectrum, though that hasn't stopped Ho Yay interpretations for Luca).
  • Comparisons of the big fisherman's design to Tim Lockwood.
  • The setting of the film in Italy, quite expectedly, drew plenty of jokes from fans of JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Vento Aureo, with many jokingly comparing the main protagonist Luca with the character Leaky-Eye Luca from JJBA.
  • Because of Pixar's tendency of having "What if X had feelings?" trope as the main basis of their films, people joked that this film is about what if Italians had feelings. People from Liguria, specifically, played with the meme "What if Genovesi have feelings?" with the answer being "No, they don't"
  • Due to how the disguise easily comes off in contact with water, many people suggested that raining will pretty much screw the boys over.

Both of those comparisons are ridiculous and I haven't even seen people compare them. I think I've seen some comparison of the fisherman to Tim Lockwood though.

The "What if X has feelings" one is more of a spinoff of the meme for Pixar itself.

I don't think the "what if it rains" thing should count because there's a good chance the movie itself will address that. Maybe it could be an early Stock Parody Joke?

Found this on Dora and the Lost City of Gold

• This bizarrely creepy review from The Hollywood Reporter, where the writer seems incredibly invested in the characters' sexuality for some reason and is disappointed the movie never goes into that. Given that this is a PG movie with characters who are in high school^note not to mention that Isabela Moner was seventeen while filming, the author ended up being accused of being an ephebophile.

Does... does this even so much as count as a reference, let alone a meme? I’ve never even heard of this and I’ve certainly never heard anyone make memes out of it.

Never heard anybody even talk about that.

Memes.South Park has a lot of "memes" that are more just "quotable moments" because they don't explain anything more than the episode that featured the quote.

An example without context is literally the definition of a ZCE.

A lot of the examples on The Legend of Zelda are just quotes without explanation aside from where they came from.

Riverdale could use some help. Lots of low-context fandom in-jokes and possible character bashing.

Fate/Grand Order also needs some evaluation. There is a massive amount of them that are just memes from other works being used for this one, and realistically some of them should go onto other Fate/Nasuverse works because thats where they originate from.

I can help out with the FGO stuff. Likewise, Neon Genesis Evangelion is full of entries that are just shouted quotes whose label notes are just explanations of where they came from, rather than context on how they function as memes.

I removed some memes two days ago but troper Rebel Falcon re-added them back saying "You can't just remove memes just because you think they are "pointless". They are legitimate memes regardless of whether one sees them as pointless. Especially when memes typically are pointless in general.", so I wanted opinions on some of those entries to avoid an Edit War.

For the memes I see it as less about notability, but are they memes that originated from somewhere else and got mildly adapted to refer to the game, as a form of Snowclone? Or does the FGO version at least offer some kind of Original Flavor take if it is? Otherwise delete.

For example I removed the ORA ORA ORA example because that's ultimately a Jojo meme that turned into an overarching nickname for anything with Rapid-Fire Fisticuffs. FGO is not special in that regard. And "protect her smile" is a generic "waifu" meme.

Here were the ones I removed:

• Astolfo's Monster Cock^{Explanation (VERY NSFW!)} In Febuary of 2021, an Astolfo cosplayer posted a collection of photos comparing the size of his penis to a can of Monster Energy Drink on Twitter, and the sheer number of people commenting on this caused "Astolfo" to reach the Trending page. Memes were made poking fun at the absurdity of the whole situation, such as wondering what the poor guy who writes the descriptions for trending topics must be going through, and freaking out as Faye Mata (a.k.a. Astolfo's VA in the Fate Apocrypha English Dub) posted a tweet commemorating the occasion, not realizing why he was trending until afterwards. And as a result, Astolfo became somehow associated with the Monster Energy Drink in many fanworks, in a similar vein of Puella Magi Madoka Magica and Morning Rescue Energy Drink
• AS MY FIRST DECREE, YOU SHALL ONLY CALL HIM PRINCESS BEDIVERE!/You lied to me... You dirty boy./etc.^Explanation Running away with this joke, fans would often quote the Broly movie of Dragon Ball Z Abridged, which had a similar gag with Trunks..

I removed the first because I don't quite know if that really should be on there due to the meme itself being a bit....squick in nature, plus it seems directed towards Fate Apocrypha instead of FGO, where the character was first introduced.

The second was because it was just a straight up quote from another work.

First one is worthwhile I think, though it can be sanitized as "Astolfo's Monster Energy" or something similar.

Bringing up the following example from Invincible (2021):

• Memetic Mutation: Due to Omni-Man being voiced by J. K. Simmons. Expect whole lot of J. Jonah Jameson jokes abound. Mostly involving pictures of Spider-Man.

That's a ZCE.

These were added to the Zack Snyder's Justice League meme page. They both seem politically charged and don't come across as legit memes.

• Joss Whedon's reputation as a feminist icon first took a hit in 2015 with an Unfortunate Implications-laden line from Black Widow about her inability to have children in Avengers: Age of Ultron and it continued to sink over the years with increasingly more critical reevaluations of his previous works, an acrimonious public divorce, and especially in 2020/2021 with Ray Fisher and Charisma Carpenter alleging they suffered abusive behavior at his hands while working with him, which was corroborated by other actors who worked with Whedon. This, combined with positive reviews of the Snyder version praising it for utilizing Cyborg better and giving Wonder Woman more agency (and all around doing better by its female and POC characters, both major and supporting), has led to variations on the meme of Grant Gustin (who plays the Arrowverse Flash) posing cheerfully over Oliver Queen's grave with Whedon's career being what's dead and buried while Snyder was ultimately vindicated.
• "WTF I like Zack Snyder now" [[labelnote:Explanation]]Many movie watchers who had been critical of Zack Snyder and the #ReleaseTheSnyderCut movement in the past gained a newfound respect for Snyder when he disassociated himself from an alt-right reactionary YouTube channel and stressed support for victims of anti-Asian violence.

"WTF I like X now" is its own entire meme by itself, so we don't need to list individual instances of it like that.

First one is definitely more Fallen Creator or YMMV material, second is a generic meme.

Bringing up the following examples from Cruella:

• Memetic Mutation:
  • The term "Disney's Joker" caught on with both supporters and detractors who noted the clear influence in the marketing.^note Principal photography for Cruella was well underway at the time of Joker's release, and the project had been in development for many years.
    • In addition to that, there are jokes referencing Joker’s ending, where Cruella finally gives the Dalmatian puppies “what they fucking deserved” which leads to a montage of her shooting all 101 of them.
  • Many point out she acts more like Harley Quinn.
  • Some have also likened the trailer to "Grouch"; the Sesame Street-themed Joker parody on Saturday Night Live thanks to both being Darker and Edgier trailers about characters from children's entertainment.
  • A fair amount of jokes "Girlboss Cruella", poking fun at Disney apparently trying to make Cruella some kind of symbol of rebelling against the patriarchy and sticking it to the (literal) Man, seemingly missing the point that her original character was a rich woman who skins puppies and turns their skins into coats and is named "Cruel Devil".
  • There's quite the amount of jokes about the "May 2021" release date on the teaser poster. Due to its graphical style, it can be read as "May Zozi".

Keep the first and merge it with the third bullet; I’ve seen the film called “Disney’s Joker” numerous times before, including some references to the “Grouch” sketch. The other bullets and the sub-bullet can go, however.

Edited by jandn2014 on Apr 1st 2021 at 7:09:08 AM