Trope Pantheons Discussion

EDIT- Fecking page topper again >.< Thumbs up for Black Bolt, for context

Edited by KaoticKanine on Oct 16th 2022 at 7:47:43 AM

"Do not create a trope page for a story until the story is fully completed."

I have a question about this rule. I've seen various profiles for incomplete series, even ones that add many new elements each episode. What do we do about these profiles, such as the Madness Combat ones? Has this rule been changed?

Who wrote that. That feels like something shoehorned in without this forum knowing.

Edited by M1gamiTensei on Oct 17th 2022 at 12:12:38 PM

Pantheon server for all who click here. Freaking lost $410 and I am hunting down for a nuke to reign down.

I checked the History page of Pantheon.Trope Pantheons, and it was added by HotmanX32 way back in April 20, 2019. I don't believe that rule was discussed beforehand.

Edited by Excessive-Menace on Oct 17th 2022 at 12:31:35 PM

THE GOLDEN AGE WILL RETURN AGAIN!

@Cardboard Bot: I think that was back when we had Pantheon Stories, which we don't do anymore.

TV Tropes Pantheon Group Members Database

It's a rule of thumb that when a series is very story driven we tend to wait till the series is over to start adding characters. Otherwise we run the risk of profiles getting outdated fairly quickly (it happened with RWBY and with Steven Universe)

But we can add profiles before the series ends. Madness Combat takes their sweet time releasing new episodes

Uni cat

So Long-Runners are exempt? Makes sense, as there would otherwise be nothing from Doctor Who and similar media in the Pantheon for the next millennia.

Edited by m-95 on Oct 17th 2022 at 9:53:38 AM

Please visit the "AITA" forum game

Most likely companions would get a wait period. Most likely "wait until they leave The Doctor".

Though, for the Doctor it might be "wait until the next Regeneration to add stuff from the previous".

Seems like that rule was meant for Pantheon-related stories. There was an issue before of stories in the past Pantheon that had pages only to have no written input in wordpress. Kind of like reservation but in a story format that doesn't exist.

Finally, after much delay, here is a draft for Ornstein and Smough's rework. To iterate, Ornstein and Smough are dual bosses that are fought simultaneously during the climax at Anor Londo, meant to protect a Goddess. Ornstein is a dragonslayer who hunts dragons for sport while Smough is an executioner who is a cannibal and finally became a knight after much tribulation.

Suggestions are welcome.

Ornstein & Smough, Divine Dual Bosses (Ornstein: Dragonslayer Ornstein, The Old Dragonslayer, Captain of The Knights of Gwyn; Smough: Executioner Smough, Knight Smough)

• Intermediate Gods
• Symbol/Weapons of Choice: The Dragonslayer Spear and Great Hammer for Ornstein and Smough respectively
• Leitmotif: Ornstein & Smough
• Alignment: Lawful Neutral (Smough is often mistaken as Chaotic Evil), for Gwyn and his family Lawful Good
• Portfolio: A pair of demigods tasked to defend Gwynevere in Anor Londo, challenging bosses, with Ornstein's speed and Smough's strength combined, dons armor that is both intimidating and impossible to wear for humans, actually not fond of each other
  • Ornstein: The captain of the Four Knights of Gwyn, wields the Dragonslayer Spear which is imbued with lightning, fast in combat as opposed to Smough, might be an illusion in Anor Londo with the real Orntein alive and finding his mentor beyond the city
  • Smough: The Executioner of Anor Londo who is a cannibal, wields a Great Hammer combined with his inhuman strength, has sincere loyalty to Gwyn and his kingdom to the point that he is the last demigod in the city, wishes to be a knight but only accomplished it in his last moments, the only one who protected Gwyndolin and died following Aldrich's invasion
• Domains: Knights (and Executioners), Gods, Bosses, Dual Fights, Dragon Killing
• Heralds: Lord's Blade Ciaran and Hawkeye Gough, the remaining Four Knights (shared with Artorias), the Silver Knights and Royal Sentinels of Anor Londo, Dark Sun Gwyndolin (for Smough)
• Allies: Gwyn (their King), Knight Artorias (member of the Four Knights), Lina Inverse
• Additional Relationships: The Chosen Undead and Bearer of the Curse, Undyne (Rival for Ornstein)
• Special Relationship: The Nameless King (for Ornstein)
• Avoided by: Most human beings (for Smough)
• Enemies:
  • Those who reside within Anor Londo and beyond: Manus, Father of the Abyss and by extension, his Children, Pontiff Sulyvahn (for Smough)
  • Others: All dragon-based deities in the Pantheon (for Ornstein) the most notable being the House of Dragons especially Smaug, Rathalos and Rathian and Davion the Dragon Knight, the Dovahkiin, Hiccup and Toothless, King Allant
• During the Chosen Undead's mission to reach to the Kiln of the First Flame, he first had to attain the Lordvessel which would grant him entrance to it, however such artifact was located within the city of the gods, Anor Londo, a city placated with gold and a history worth eons. Many knights were found guarding the abandoned city but none are more fierce and challenging than the demigods guarding the Lordvessel and the Goddess holding it, Dragonslayer Ornstein and Executioner Smough. Upon entering the cathedral, Smough was assumed to be the only one the Chosen Undead was meant to fight, until Ornstein came down to assist, and thus sparked a more terrifying boss duo he encountered. After multiple deaths and revivals to the bonfire, with assistance from Knight Solaire, the demigods were felled and the Lordvessel was acquired. Even at the end of the journey, Ornstein and Smough's battle remained the most fierce, rivaled only to Lord Gwyn himself.
• The two demigods were tasked by Gwyn to guard the Lordvessel and such, stayed in the cathedral for many long years. Even before such conscription, histories of the two were revealed, with Ornstein, the thin-scaled knight, to be a Captain of Gwyn's Four Knights which granted him authority over most knights, and Smough, the fat one, to be an executioner hated by everyone in the city for being a cannibal. The Age of Fire was a boon to the demigods that existed but as the fire faded, soon many demigods left, leaving the two, alongside Princess Gwynevere, the only notable members within the fading city. By the time the Chosen Undead arrived, the city was seen as golden but empty and the two were the last barrier between him and the path to the Kiln. Ultimately, their defeat, alongside the reveal that Gwynevere was an illusion and Anor Londo truly was empty, would seal their fates.
  • Following the endless cycles of the Age of Fire, another sight was seen, during the Bearer of the Curse's entrance to the Kingdom of Drangleic, a figure with similar stature to Ornstein. This discovery lead to the credence that Ornstein survived the encounter and fled, however, this Dragonslayer was eroded with the Abyss, hinting that he too succumbed to the dark. That notion was finally ended when the final visit to Anor Londo by the Ashen showed their true fates. The Ornstein that the Chosen Undead (as well as the same Dragonslayer found by the Bearer of the Curse) fought might have been an illusion with the real Ornstein having already left the city, attempting to find a lost mentor while Smough retained in his post, ultimately dying at the hands of the Cathedral of the Deep when they invaded Anor Londo.
• During Gwyn's rule in the Pantheon, he wanted to expand his temple, as well as place his guard should unwanted visitors invade his space. This became a main motivator for Gwyn to reinstate the Four Knights of Gwyn, however the Pantheon only allowed few positions with reasonable titles, thus he was forced to comply by bringing the Captain of his Knights, Dragonslayer Ornstein whilst also begrudgingly bringing Smough as well. Upon inspection, Gwyn made reasoning of how these two were an exemplar showcase of paired boss fights, with tenacious difficulty and notoriety. Thus both Ornstein and Smough were added to the Pantheon's list of gods. Upon their ascension, they were placed as the main guards of Gwyn's Temple, though they share their own temple in the House of Gaming, and are meant to ward off intruders. Those who survive the flurry of Silver Knights and Sentinels will be forced to face Ornstein and Smough combined, and to put it simply, the fight will prove their title's worth.
  • One quirk that increased their difficulty, beyond the idea of fighting two polar opposite bosses back-to-back, was that should one of them be slain in combat, one will absorb the power of their fallen combatant, giving an increase in power while gaining a new moveset. Ornstein will briefly offer his respect to the body before absorbing it, while Smough will simply just smash Ornstein flat if the Dragonslayer falls first, letting out a chuckle as he does so. This resulted in the Chosen Undead simply running out of Estus Flasks in the middle of the fight and dying right after. This mechanic has made them one of the few infamous deities within the House of Gaming, as Ornstein and Smough's infamy has become one of the few inspirations for what would be dual bosses in many difficult action RPGs.
• They are among one of the few demigods who were raised in the city of the gods, Anor Londo, as such, they are loyal to Gwyn and him only. They will follow his orders and will fight alongside him and his allies but will not follow orders from anyone else. Beyond that however, their king has granted them independence in the Pantheon and has allowed both demigods to traverse the Pantheon as they see fit. Regardless of their whereabouts, they will answer to any order he has made. One of which being the imminent slaying of anyone related to the Abyss, those within Lordran and beyond. This order was issued when the sighting of Manus, Father of the Abyss was confirmed, and the latter regarding the entity's offspring, the Children of Dark were also seen roaming the Pantheon. Should they be spotted, it is advised for the two to fight alongside together, as reckless charging to either of the two will result in corruption, the most obvious case being Ornstein himself. When not facing the two, they will be waiting within the House of Gaming, patiently for the Chosen Undead to arrive for another rematch.
• A special ruling was made by Gwyn during the presence of a great fog that shocked the House of Royalty and their neighbors. Gwyn and his allies, including his Four Knights and fellow Lord Soul Bearers, would engage in combat against the Boletarian King known as Allant XII. After the Deep Fog inflicted much chaos within the House of Royalty, it only further rallied Gwyn's order. Both the Dragonslayer and Executioner have been told to follow Gwyn's decree to stop Allant, knowing that the Deep Fog will continue to spread as well as protecting Anor Londo and the First Flame from falling at the hands of the fallen king. It became a first priority that both have been dropping their habits in order to follow it. To Gwyn's allies, taking down Allant is the main priority, while the King himself is more fixated on the state of the First Flame.
• Ornstein, the golden thin knight with a spear, is one of The Four Knights of Gwyn making him a knight with high authority among Gwyn's forces. As such he continues to serve his lord and has no issue working with any of Gwyn's newfound allies in the Pantheon. However, when he is not serving him, he is often regarded as the Pantheon's most infamous dragonslayer due to his Knight Templar-esque mentality regarding dragons of any kind. He will be often seen in the distance, ready to strike and zoom in to his prey, all of this either for sport or following tradition with Gwyn. This mindset of his stems from Gwyn's equal hatred of dragons during the Age of Ancients and can be seen from his lightning spear, an element hated by dragons, and his entire trophy set of dragon heads, giving credibility to his title. Many dragon-based deities have their guards intact in the case Ornstein appears at an unlucky time.
  • As the Captain of the Four Knights of Gwyn, he is happy to see his ally Artorias within the Pantheon, though his state is far different from what he remembers of him as Artorias is corrupted beyond repair. Whatever valor Artorias had has been torn apart into a maddened version of the knight, something that has caught the Dragonslayer's attention. Although worried about his state, several changes have been made to Artorias' corrupted state and is often see working alongside him, though it should be stated that he only works with him when the remaining Four Knights are together and is ready to put him to rest should he spiral out of control. Some of the more observant deities realize that the Dragonslayer may suffer a similar fate should he be corrupted by the Abyss as well as evidenced by the supposed "Old Dragonslayer" within Drangleic. Smough on the other hand has respect for Artorias, though it took very long for Artorias to respect him back, only till he died as a knight was he given the same respect.
  • While many may remember him from his fight in Anor Londo, the reality was that he left even before the Chosen Undead entered the city. He traveled outside of the city to find his old teacher, the one that taught him the way of his combat, in this case it was Gwyn's firstborn "The Nameless King". Why he decided to go and what happened when he found him are unknown, what is known however is that he has decided to forgo hunting Dragons for sport as a new more important task is at hand. In the case of the Pantheon, he has stopped hunting dragons for a while, but as some would say, old habits die hard and Ornstein is still accused of hunting dragons at random times. One of the main reasons why he has taken stops from his habit comes from the fact that the Nameless King has loyalty to all dragonkind. Any comments between Ornstein and Gwyn's firstborn have been met with silence.
  • Dragonslayers in general have a mixed reception within the Pantheon, some have an ounce of respect, such as the Dovahkiin, and Ornstein resides in the other side, despised. Considering he hunts dragons for sport, and for some, decapitating their heads as a trophy, this is understandable to most, especially those who wish no harm to anyone. His hunts have become notorious that the House dedicated to dragonkind has issued no mercy should Ornstein and his knights come to slay dragons either on his decision or Gwyn's orders. During his earlier hunts, Smaug was nearly slain on multiple occasions, helped by the lightning spear he wields, which is shown to have a great effect against dragons and when Smaug was not enough, a bunch of Rathalos and Rathians were found missing in the House, only to have some of the heads found in Ornstein's trophy showcase. The situation grew worse when Davion was reported to have been hunted down by Ornstein on several cases, eventually wounding Slyrak in the process and nearly killing the Dragon Knight. An unanimous agreement by Bahamut, Tiamat and Io resulted in the kill-on-sight order given when Ornstein enters the House, stopping his hunts... until he found another way.
    • When he was considered banned in the House, it would not take long till other dragon-based deities were spotted outside the three draconic guardian's reach, allowing him to take advantage of his sport. Both the Dovahkiin and Hiccup and Toothless faced Ornstein and were heavily injured, as the Dovahkiin intervened before he could attempt on cutting Toothless' head off. It was at this moment that Ornstein realized the crucial relationship between him and the Nameless King that he backed off and has avoided the two of them, namely that if he tries to hunt them down, his mentor will be notified and a beating will ensure. Reports of Ornstein's hunts have died down but there is still hints that he has not backed down just yet. This was confirmed when he was found to be very good friends with Lina Inverse, a fellow deity feared by dragons, hence the Dragon Spooker moniker. Since lightning has shown to be very effective at killing dragons, she has been clamoring to learn more of his techniques, something that other draconic beings have been on the edge.
  • He is known as a master of the spear, one of the few to master such elegant weaponry, made even better by his lightning strikes he can make. When Undyne, a friend to the Chosen Undead and Bearer of the Curse, noticed the Dragonslayer, she was at awe as his armor is remarkably similar to hers, a relic that she does not wear anymore. Alongside his mastery of the spear, she is very interested how Ornstein managed to slay many dragons so much that she is willing to learn, though Ornstein is not a teacher, that goes to his mentor, the Nameless King.
• On the other side, Smough, the fat one, is the city's Executioner, often being the one that kills subjects sent by the demigods to be executed guessing by his role. He is treated with worry by many of Gwyn's allies, like Gwyn they recognize his strength and power, but his sadistic personality and hunger for human flesh has earned the ire of many to the point that - outside of Gwyn and Ornstein (and even then Ornstein is not fond of him either) - most can't stand him, and he hates them back in return. He stands out both from a physical and a notorious standpoint. Despite this, he is very loyal to his king and has attempted many times to earn himself as part of The Knights of Gwyn, as such he is often seen treating his allies with respect, though his sadism and evil laughing when fighting has not won him any favors.
  • Cannibalism is one of the very few things people are reminded of when Smough is mentioned, as tales have spoken how Smough grinds the bones and remains of the executions he made, mostly humans, into spices. This has made human-based deities avoid him at all costs, so much that whenever one fights the duo, some would rather prefer being impaled by Ornstein than smashed by Smough's Hammer. This has also made outside relations between the Executioner and other Pantheonic deities very little, no one wants to be associated to an executioner who turns his kills into spices. Even visitors would rather visit Ornstein himself than the Executioner. At one point, Ornstein, out of pity, tried to make Smough change his addiction. In what can only be described as a recreation of Homer's Phobia, it only made Smough more addicted to his cannibalistic tendencies.
  • Most people thought it was impossible but at long last, Smough surprised everyone with a revelation that he finally achieved his dream of knighthood. Unfortunately there was a catch, he ended up being the only knight defending Anor Londo from the Cathedral of the Deep's invasion to the very last. He was also the only knight to not desert his post. He understands completely that he is not a good guy by any means, but Gwyn and his bloodline mean more to him than most people know. This also made him enraged when Pontiff Sulyvahn was seen on the Pantheon, wanting to take revenge after how he desecrated Anor Londo and fed Gwyndolin to Aldrich as an "offering".

I swear Loid, you can't draw worth shit!

Idea: I don't think Devil in Disguise has been nominated yet(and if so, please tell me so I don't look stupid for long), so I'm nominating the Alternates and "Gabriel", Divine Horrors of Disguised Demons

Reasoning: 1, the disguising part: The Alternates are all about pretending to be others to get their goals. They shapeshift into humans, kill the original, take on their original identity and attack people close to them quietly and silently, then leave to steal another identity. 2, the demon/devil part: They are the creations of Satan and go after religious people the most. They are also supernatural abominations, having the ability to pretend to be humans and drive them insane. That abomination part...you can just take a look at my avatar to get a good idea of what they look like.

If the reasoning is not enough, then we can settle for "Gabriel" AKA Satan only.

Edited by CardboardBot on Oct 17th 2022 at 8:29:08 PM

@r-lock256 & CrimsonShark
Late regarding the Dino title, I was the one who suggested that Kyorugers should have Dinosaur Media but noone got the thumbs for that. But I think your reasoning for The Gang of Seven to have the title are very good and I'm fine with the current titles they have now.

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@HamanaHamanaHamana
I'm assuming Juli and Juni would only by the Mini-Boss title once the profile is done and that's fine.

• Ornstein - He would likely be allied with non-human non-dragon slaying dragon haters
  • Gnasty Gnorc - it was them as their allies, and also doesn't like dragons but not a dragonslayer and is not a human
• Smough - He would likely be allied (or teeth-clenched teamwork) with other non-human flesh eaters. There are surprising amount of human and good non-human deities in the Hall of Flesh Eaters so, I don't think he would be fully welcome there.
  • Pennywise, SCP-953, Lord Crumb
  • Human Flesh Eaters like the The Bakers or The Hag would oppose him
• Enemies:
  • Saint Martha and Saint George are two dealt with dragons before, with Saint George being a dragon slayer himself.

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@JNHZ31161 - Frisk

My only critique is to do spelling and grammar checks, which I think you can fix in your next draft. So far, the intro looks good. Here's some suggestions not already suggested by others:

Allies:

• All-Loving Hero - Avatar Aang, Avatar Korra, Wander
• Kid Heroes Who Defy The Odds - Finn the Human (he grows to be a Badass Pacifist later on), Dipper and Mabel, Timmy Turner
• Friendly Monsters - Mike and Sully, Shrek and Princess Fiona
• Reedemed villains or The Atoner - Zuko
  • I can also see Frisk being friend with Iroh as well since both a peace loving

Enemies:

• Villains Who Won't Change - Simon Laurent
• Fantastic Racist - Also Simon Laurent

Other Suggestions:

• Johnny Bravo - They both flirt a lot, plus Johnny has a kindheart childish personality and gets long with kids so Frisk could make friend with him.
• The Batter - Since OFF is one of Undertale's inspirations, I wonder who Frisk would feel about this morality ambiguous character here.

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Lucas Grey/The Shadow Client
Unless you have additional suggestions or critiques, this profile is considered done.

• s: Excessive-Menace, CrownlessMimic, KaoticKanine

Thumb Mode

Lucas Grey, The Cool-Headed God Of Rebelling Against Authority (The Shadow Client, The Militia Leader, The Terrorist, Boss | Original Name: Subject 6)

• Potential House: Rebellion and Revolution
• Rank: Lesser God
• Symbol: A black human silhouette with black smoke coming out of it; alternately, his Long Coat
• Theme Song: "Legacy" Theme
• Alignment: Chaotic Neutral with a heavy dose of Knight Templar
• Portfolio: Ascended Extra, Badass Longcoat, The Chessmaster, Combat Pragmatist, Originally Named Subject 6, From Same Super Assasin Project As Agent 47, But Was Forgetted After He Escaped, His Militia vs Illuminati-like Group, Plans To Take Them All Down, As Revenge For All The Suffering He and 47 have Been Thought, Later Becoming an Aid to 47, Freedom Fighter Labelled As A Terrorist, Necessarily Evil, Offed Himself To Prevent Him and 47 from Being Captured, Sound Kinda British But Isn't British
• Domains: Planning, Betrayal, Militia, Revenge, Defiance
• Herald: Olivia Hall (his protégé)
• High Priest: Jim Stark
• Followers:
  • Straight Example Followers: Hawkeye (M*A*S*H), Rose Hathaway, Sal (Dumbing of Age)
  • Parody/Deconstruction Followers: Craig Hoffman, The Skateboarder Kid
• Special Relationship with: Agent 47 (His Childhood Friend and Clone Brother)
• Allies^note While they share some of his ideas and temperaments, the only person he truly trust in the Pantheon is 47. He's only allied with them to suit his goals but nothing personal. : Lelouch vi Britannia, Edmond Dantes/The Count of Monte Cristo, V, Charles Victor Szasz/The Question, Aiden Pearce, Elliot Alderson/Mr. Robot^note Mr. Robot is more than happy to work with Grey while Elliot is weary around him., The Basterds, Alex (Street Fighter), Suzaku Kururugi, Jeremiah Gottwald
• Teeth-Clenched Teamwork: San Francisco DedSec, Tyrell Wellick, Phillip Price
• Enemies: The Illuminati, The Pantheonic Illuminati (Bill Cipher, Gill, Urien, Kolin, Vandal Savage), Big Brother, O'Brien, The Patriots, The Dark Army
• Distrust: Marvel's Illuminati (Steve Rogers/Captain America I, Stephen Strange/Doctor Strange, Charles Xavier/Professor X, Reed Richards/Mister Fantastic, Tony Stark/Iron Man, T'Challa/Black Panther, Blackagar Boltagon/Black Bolt), The God-Emperor of Mankind and The Imperium of Mankind
• Respects: Spartacus, Frank Castle/The Punisher, Roberta (Black Lagoon) (One-sided for the first three as they don't respect him back due to conflicting views on his actions), Duke Togo/Golgo 13
• Respected by: E-123 Omega, Thorgrim Grudgebearer
• On Speaking Terms With: Stan Pines, Rick Sanchez
• Pities: Winston Smith, Julia, Rolo Lamperouge, Mewtwo, People Have Their Memory Forcebly Wiped
• Opposed by: Nearly Every Employer or Organization In The Pantheon, Especially The Houses of Commerce and Leadership, Most Members Of The Council Of Shadows, Good-Aligned Members of his Hall
• Opposes: People Who Believe In One World Order, Evil Scientists, Cruel Father Figures, Memory Wipers and Alterers, Especially Charles zi Britannia and Shukuro Tsukishima, Those Who Do Elorate and Violent Heist (like The PAYDAY Gang), Evil-Aligned Members of his Hall
• Conflicted Opinion On: Solidus Snake, Adrian Veidt/Ozymandias, Cornelia li Britannia
• Annoyed by: Dan (Dan Vs.)
• When the International Contract Agency or ICA discovered that a mysterious figure was manipulating them by strategically leaking info to several of 47's clients, to put a hit on specific people for the figure's own benefit, the ICA's top assassin Agent 47 and his handler called this shadowy figure "The Shadow Client". Upon further investigation, it's revealed that this Shadow Client, who goes by the name of Lucas Grey, a former mercenary and bodyguard with a mysterious past, runs a highly effective militia. Their goal is to take out the high-ranking members of Providence, an Illuminati-like organization that secretly runs the world. Shockingly, this Shadow Client seems to know 47 himself, as he was able to identify several of 47's past targets, whose hits remained unsolved or listed as accidental. When 47 confronts Grey in a run-down facility in Romania, Grey makes The Elusive Hitman remember Grey's true identity despite having this memory wiped from him. 47 vaguely remembers him as his childhood friend and part of the same super clone assassin experiments that made 47 himself, whose original name is Subject 6. Grey then convinces 47 to reinstate their childhood pact by taking down all of Providence, the one who funded their creation, to which 47 joins him on this mission. After disbanding Grey's militia to cover their tracks and partially regaining 47's memories with a serum, the two, along with 47's handler and Grey's hacker protégé, continued their crusade against the all-powerful organization.
• While he eventually saw its top operatives taken down one by one, Grey never lived to see the world free of their influence. After being found and surrounded in the forest by several armed operatives working for Providence, Grey met his end as he shoots himself to prevent 47, who hid among the operatives, from saving him and blowing his cover. Grey woke up in one of the rooms in the House of Life and Vitality and noticed that the bullet hole in his head was gone. At first, he thought he was captured and bought back somehow, so he tried to escape the place but was shunned to see an otherworldly view outside of the House. After being spotted by the House's caretakers, they calmly tried to convince him at they meant no harm to him and let him know that his death lead him this to place as he was likely chosen for a "Trope" to represent. While still distrusting them, he decided to go with their advice to go to the Court of Gods and find some answers, since it seems like he was not going back to his realm. After The Court explained to him what being Deified means and despite being in front of an all-seeing High Court, Grey flat-out refuses to give out further details when questioned about his past. The Court then decided to conduct their own investigation as to why Mr. Grey seems to naturally distrust them.
  • The System Records have found an interesting running theme in some parts of Grey's past. He was the one who convinced a young 47 to start a pact of rebellion due to their creator's harsh mistreatment of them. After escaping and starting a new life as the head of security to a Bank CEO, he learns of his boss's connection to Providence. Learning that he cannot run away from his past, he snapped and killed his employer, starting his crusade against the Organization that he felt wronged him and gave his creator the power to abuse them. Even after getting reunited with 47, he distrusts 47's most trusted handler, simply because he "doesn't like executive decision makers". Indeed, while The Court understand his distrust of authority and motives to do what he did and granted the Providence and its member were known to do some shady stuff like abusing their power and putting hits on their enemies, some of the Court deities had argued that he could have also prevented his death by simply letting go of his past in the first place. Providence and most of their members technically had nothing personal against him and Grey didn't stop his crusade after likely knowing of his cruel creator's death when tracking 47's kills. All this while displaying a cool and calm demeanor and looking like an grown up greaser with his long coat.
  • After being summoned by The Court and explained their findings, Grey would receive his rebellious title. He would accept the title under the condition that they would show him what happens after his death. His request was granted and Grey saw the fruits of his labor as Providence was fully taken down, liquidated of all its assets, and all its potential successors were "neutralized". He was proud of what 47 has done as he trusted him to continue his work even after he passed. He also begrudgingly admits his respect for his handler's contributions and resistance to being its new leader but still resents betraying 47 for his mission to work. After receiving his title, Grey was escorted to his new temple, which resembles the abandoned and decayed facility he and 47 grew up with, but no longer so. A strange choice but he's fine with it as long as it helps him connect to his roots since he knows he can never shake off his past anyway. It is even has two bloody hand prints on a replica room where 47 and 6 made the pact all those decades ago.
• As he tries to get used to Life within the Pantheon, Grey decided to check his Hall neighbors hoping to find like-minded people like him. Rise Rousenin reminds him too much of Diana considering they both use the strategy of working from the inside to dismantle an old system. He respects Spartacus, as both of them are former mercenaries who lead a bloody revolution against their oppressors. Spartacus respects Grey for not using his revolution to take power for himself, though he is conflicted that Grey does all this as an act of personal revenge more than any personal empathy for the suffering of others (asides from maybe his closest friend 47). While he does understand why Shogo Makishima wanted to take down his system of government, Grey was too off-put by his lack of empathy as it reminded when his creators tried to suppress their clone's emotions to be a more effective killer. While Grey has his emotions intact following his escape, this also results in him feeling guilt for everything he has done, and thus he cannot ally with someone who lacks guilt for their horrible actions. Everyone else doesn't seem to relate to him as the good-aligned ones consider him too violent and revenge-driven to ally with him and while Grey views the evil-aligned ones as even worse than the organization he masterminded to take down.
• There is one person in his Hall who is most similar to him, it's Lelouch, a former Britannian prince who rebelled against his empire after his Emperor father expressed apathy to the death of his mother and the crippling of his sister. Both started a revolution in a desire to revenge the unfortunate fate of their sibling. Both are cold, calculative, intelligent, and ruthless in battle, but Grey is more hesitant in taking out innocent civilians than Lelouch is. Both are compassionate about their subordinates, but Grey is less so but he justifies that his subordinates know the risks of joining his cause and that's why he doesn't feel too sad for them when they get killed. Both are impressed that they managed to fulfill their respective goals after their deaths due to their trust in their closest ally. Grey more so since he didn't expect a teenager would be capable of such a feat and he find him useful as Lelouch helps him navigate within the Pantheon. Not to mention, he has a Geass, a supernatural ability bestowed upon him, which in his case, grants him the power to control or alter people's minds by only looking into their eyes once. While Lelouch pities his upbringing, The Former Zero still thinks Grey's militia experience and strategic skills could be useful for him in the future.
  • His interactions with Lelouch also made him aware of his other members of his family. He doesn't have a strong opinions on Nunnally though Lelouch's brotherly admiration of her reminded him of his own for 47. He's a little mixed on his view of Cornelia given that she is a Princess General who used to not be afraid to put her own people in damage to ensure victory, but despite her Heel-Face Turn and new found care for the lives of other, he's still doesn't fully trust her. His father Emperor Charles zi Britannia already got some bad impression from Grey for being a uncaring ruler and father who only about his Assimilation Plot to rewrite the world without lies. Learning about Lelouch's capture and subsequent rewriting of his memories by Charles' Geass to suit his agenda made Grey's blood boil, being reminded how his Creator wiped 47's memories following Subject 6's escape, continuing to being trained as an assassin as a result. He was also learned of Rolo, an assassin pretending to be Lelouch's brother sent by Charles as a spy while Lelouch had his memories wiped and altered. Grey pity his past as a child assassin being used for his Geass of stopping one's perception of time and for his self-sacrifice to prevent his new-found "brother" from being killed when Lelouch was surrounded by own armed militia.
• Since he's no longer a wanted criminal in this realm, he then decides to explore the Pantheon upon Lelouch's advice and hopefully get himself employed in his new life within it. Unfortunately, words spread very fast in the Pantheon as soon he discovers that no employer in their right mind would want to hire him for any position. If you are known as the bodyguard who murdered the guy you are supposed to protect, masterminded the takedown of all his associates and the world-spanning secret organization he answers to, to say that your job prospects would be really low would be an understatement. The Houses of Commerce and Leadership especially don't want to accept his application, with the good aligned members still opposing him for his bloody revenge trail, even if they sympathized with his troubled past. He could have a chance to get employed by the many Crime Bosses at The Houses of Villainy, Crime and Transgressions given that he once allied with a powerful drug cartel but they would prefer more loyal or stronger guards/minions than take a risk with him. These rejections devastated Grey as he feels Providence's life-ruining influence on him seemed to persist even after they are gone. But something irked him as this information shouldn't have spread so fast and so widespread in such a short amount of time he's in here and he was sure during his Court Title hearing that his personal information would be confidential to the larger public.
• Grey was one of the few who was able to deduce the existence of the Providence when even the ICA's top analysis think its existence is only theoretical. The Former Militia Leader theorized that such similar organization must also exist in the Pantheon given the world spanning scale of reach, and figures that the news was spread this early, likely to prevent him from gaining influence that could one day be used to take its members down, given his track record. To confirm his theory, he asked his herald Olivia, a talented young hacktivist, to hack into The Pantheonic Database and search for Providence or similar groups. Thankfully they have not ascended yet but she did informed him that there exist several similar organizations named "Illuminati" (the actual origination, the one led by 5 individuals and the one led by Marvel's Heroes). Grey noticed that one of Marvel's Illuminati members was Captain America, a member of the Court of Gods. While it was tempting to just point a finger at him given his influence, Grey had to rule him out given that The Captain could have vetoed his ascension and title picking in the first place or at least keep him in surveillance if Grey was a danger to his group (which Grey should be aware for, given his experience as the former head of security). Despite being a secret superpowered group dedicated to protecting the world, he still distrusts Marvel's Illuminati given that the members themselves are not infallible to in-fighting or betrayals.
• Next to check on the list is the actual Illuminati, an all-seeing organization seemingly responsible for every conspiracy known to man. Unlike most people who would be paranoid of the mysterious organization, Grey doesn't seem to be intimidated as he thinks they are likely a group of normal evil rich folk with too much money and time on their hands. Next on his list is Bill Cipher, the leader of the other Illuminati and a dream demon who can access people's minds, who once bought upon Weirdmageddon when he gained a physical form. While it is unlikely the demon had anything to gain anything from Grey's joblessness given that he's a very powerful manipulative being on his own, Grey theorized that Bill may be manipulating everyone in order to get his physical form back. Next is Vandal Savage, an immortal caveman, leader of his world's Illuminati, claiming to be responsible for many conflicts in human history. Vandal's tendency to exaggerate his claims, wishing to rule over all of humanity, and his belief that the weak should be eliminated is enough to get Grey to really dislike him. Then there's Street Fighter's Illuminati led by its Emperor Gill, its President Rival, Gill's brother Urien and Gill's loyal assistant Kolin. Being a world-manipulating organization is bad enough but when you are also mixed in kidnapping, brainwashing, and genetically enhancing your members to do your bidding, it's sure to make Grey enrage deeply. Whether they are responsible for his joblessness or not, he feels he could not like let them slide and influence the whole Pantheon, potentially creating people like him and 47 again. He knows it would be foolish to take one or several of them by himself, especially since he's only a genetically-enhanced "human", albeit more skilled in planning and combat than the average clone.
• Grey discussed with Lelouch his troubling findings and his plans for making a counterforce to keep the Pantheon's Illuminati members from gaining more power. Lelouch agrees and suggests making allies with his allies first before searching for more on his own. Among Lelounch's immediate allies offered to join at Lelounch's behest were Suzaku (former Knight of Seven and a deity who cannot self-terminate) and Jeremiah (his loyal deity who can cancel a Geass' command). Jeremiah was quick to accept the offer while Suzaku was a bit skeptical at first given Grey's past actions, but Lelouch rest assured him that Lelouch would "take care" of the matter should Grey betray his friends in anyway. The three felt neutral towards each other but Grey finds them useful for his goals them their skills and their effectiveness in the field. Grey also found an ally in V, an anarchist vigilante and fellow freedom fighter with a knack for explosives. Grey took pity on his past of being experimented on by his government and understands why he rebelled, V pities Grey for his past as well. While he admits being impressed by the effectiveness of Ozymandias' plan to unite the world under a common enemy, he does not approve of his killing of all those involved in his plan to make his plan work, wanting to keep collateral damages to a minimum. Lelouch also tried to submit a request for Grey to join The Council of Shadows given that both he and Bill Cipher are both members and prevent the other Big Bads from completing their schemes. Its Council members immediately rejected the application fearing that Grey could endanger the existence of the group, if he had access to the information on who their members are.
• The Former Militia Leader then tried to recruit other people to join his cause. At first, he had difficulty finding another deities from Gill's world to take down Gill and his associates, mostly because they are either too good-aligned or evil-aligned for his interest. He did successfully get Alex, the New York Bruiser, on his side as Grey can get behind on Alex's desire to get revenge on Gill for hurting his father figure. Having recruited eccentric but effective freedom fighters before, he decided to convince The Question to join his cause, due to his really good intelligence gathering and deductive skills as well as possible knowledge on the actually Illuminati. While skeptical at first, thinking that Grey was an Illuminati spy (which offended Grey), The Question eventually did take up his offer to ally with The Former Militia Leader, simply because he was impressed that Grey's deductive skills and was able to uncover his version of the Illuminati by himself. Grey also consider recruiting The Imperium, led by the The God-Emperor of Mankind, given that they were able to abolish their world's Illuminati from ruling humanity. However, he decided against the idea as he distrust someone who claims does not want to be worshiped as a "God" yet calls himself an Emperor, manipulating humanity from the shadows and enacting his own version of peace and order into other alien races.
• Grey gave careful consideration when recruiting members of his new Illuminati counterforce. First is that they have to be skilled in combat but need to do as little collateral damage as possible (i.e. not harming non-targets) unless it could benefit the cause, such as using the death of his son to lure reclusive multi-billionaire father out and carry out his kidnapping. His son was a murderer who got away with his crimes due to his connections so it was fine to take him out anyway. The second is that he prefers to not hire people who specialized in heists (especially violent heists like The Payday Crew). He made the mistake of putting one of his lieutenants in charge while he was away, which said lieutenant planned to turn his militia into their own private heist crew if they weren't "taken care of" by 47 and Grey's not making that same mistake again. Third is to always do a background check to make sure he doesn't have any moles among them, as his other lieutenants once tried to do a loyal test on a newer recruit. O'Brien, a fellow rebel leader opposing the tyrannical ruling party Big Brother, tried to join causes but Grey quickly distrusts him and turns his offer down. He was right in turning him away seeing through his background check reveals he was a mole for the very organization he was allegedly fighting against and their Party has been on Grey's enemy list ever since.
• Tried to recruit the tourist trap owner Stan Pines upon hearing his defeat of Bill by his hands. Stan was at first alarmed given that a known terrorist is visiting his shop but was relieved and somewhat flattered when Grey lay down the offer for him. Stan, however, declines the offer he prefers not to be involved in the Pantheon's higher affairs, preferring to focus his time looking out for his grand-niece and nephew. He did give some advice on how to defeat him by mind-wiping himself when Bill is in his mind, though Grey is hesitant to use this method given his experience in mind-wiping. Still, he is aware that drastic measures are needed if he wants to defeat a powerful foe like Bill. Stan even recommends him one of his friends who he thinks is overqualified for the job. Said friend was Rick Sanchez, self-proclaimed world's smartest man, and former galactic rebel with a dark past filled with vengeance, how was unfazed when Grey visited into his temple. Rick also declines Grey's offer as Rick has long past his freedom fighter/rebel phase, and while he can theoretically take all its members down, he kinda views it was a waste of time since there would be others like their group who can pop up once they are gone. Rick also noted that Grey reminds him of his daughter who became a space rebel who may or may not be a clone of his daughter as well. Grey is unsure make to make about Rick cloning his daughter to make his original daughter live her own life or himself at one point but at least Rick doesn't treat his clone daughter like pure crap most of the time.
• The next recruitment destination was The House of Revenge and Retribution, which Rick passingly mentioned that Grey make be a good fit among the deities there. To no one's surprise, many of those deities think his revenge quest is excessive, to put it mildly, but Grey does have a few supporters there. E-123 Omega, one of Dr. Eggman's robots with a grudge against his creator, respects him for rebelling against Grey's own creators for not treating him with respect like he was, though that's probably the nicest thing he can say about this "meatbag". Thorgrim Grudgebearer, The High King of the Dwarfs, also doesn't see anything wrong with his actions, given that his race is known to hold grudges and take revenge for those who have wronged them, even if their aggressors are long dead. Despite Grey's reputation, an unlikely ally came from one of the Heads of the House, Edmond Dantes, The Count of Monte Cristo, who sees a bit of himself in Grey. Both are chessmasters who came from nothing and built themselves to later take revenge on the people who they believed wronged them, though The Count's aggressors directly led his life into ruin rather than just reverence by association. Grey told Dantes about the Illuminati threat, and The Count agreed to ally with him, having dealt with power-hungry men before. before, and agreed to ally with him, Forgiveness be darned.
• One of the considered recruits in the House of Revenge and Retribution was a maid by the name of Roberta, who used to be a guerrilla and trained assassin for a communist terror group. Her skill and high efficiency in combat and stealth are what leads Grey to seek her out but when he did and gave his offer, she refused. One is because she did not want to associate with people who were once allied with any drug cartel after learning that the revolution she killed for was once a front for them. She would also rather wait for her young master to ascend first than join Grey's cause but she did hear of someone with highly skilled combat training who was not residing in this House. The said deity was Frank Castle aka The Punisher, a former Marine turned brutal vigilante who declared a personal war against the criminal underworld after the slaying of his family. Upon meeting with him and hearing the offer, Frank states that he prefers to work alone and he doesn't appreciate people who follow in his footsteps declaring their own war on those who wronged him. That said, Frank does understand Grey's need to prepare for the Illuminati threat, even though he has no interest in joining him, so he recommends one of his allies that would gladly help him out. The Basterds, a commando unit formed during WWII to instill fear among Nazis by killing them. Upon their ascension, they have since upgraded from killing Nazies to declaring war on villains and the mooks that work for them. Grey met their commanding officer Lt Aldo Raine to discuss the Illuminati threat, agreed that it would be bad news if the group were to take over the Pantheon and agreed to have his men join his cause while still under Raine's leadership.
• He was informed by some of his recruits that he had a lot in common with Solidus Snake, a super-solider clone created by another Illuminati-like group called The Patriots. Solidus was one of the clones created to retain a figurehead for their organization in the image of The Legendary Soldier Big Boss and Solidus would later rebel against them after learning of their plans to control The Internet and free speech, thus preventing anarchy as they control the world. Grey was actually approached by Solidus, offering join him fight The Patriots after hearing what he did in his world. He considered recruiting Solidus was as well until he was given info via profile check that their motivations for rebelling don't align with each other as while Grey rebelled out of revenge, Solidus rebelled because their censorship plans goes against his ideals of American ideals of freedom and equality for all and his plans have a legacy to be remembered by (which was his true plan). Further, while Grey sympathized with his past as a child soldier, he cannot sympathize with his ruthless and harsh training of child soldiers in his later years, something Solidus doesn't seem to regret until the end of his mortal life. Thus Grey cannot think to hire him for his cause or join his cause either. The other deities from his world are also considered for recruitment but his intel on each of them reveals that they are either too busy fighting The Patriots (who already have a presence in the Pantheon) or swore off dealing with The Patriots unless they crossed paths, which means that it's safe to assume that they are not interested fighting off any groups like them either. Grey has also taken notes of how to deal with The Patriots and their endless gambits should they cross paths but for now, he would rather focus on one seemingly all-powerful organization at a time.
• His former militia not only has a lot of field operatives but also operatives in cyberspace, which are needed to hack and collect sensitive information relating from the corporations and people related to Providence. There are quite a few hackers in the Pantheon Grey can look for potential recruits, but not a lot are willing to side with his cause. Fortunately, he did find a quick ally with Aiden Pearce, a "Cracker" or a computer criminal who tried to avenge and investigate the death of his niece, only to end up weeding out criminals and corruption plaguing his city. Being interested in Grey's cause and despite being part of the GUAG White Hats, Aiden admits he feels more in his element with Grey's team since Grey doesn't mind hiring other criminals, and doesn't mind Aiden getting his hands dirty if he has to. Although preferring to work alone, Aiden is willing to help him out on his hacking-related requests if needed, though he told Grey that he might have difficulties getting the San Francisco DedSec, another group of hackers from his world, to be fully on board with working with him given that they are likely not willing see past Grey's past actions lightly. Through Aiden, Grey got acquired and allied with another rebel cybervigilante Elliot Alderson and his dark-alter ego Mr. Robot.
  • Through his deductions after speaking with Grey, Elliot is surprised that someone like him didn't have any malicious intentions (beyond just revenge) for his crusade in his mortal life but Elliot is still wary of him due to his brutal methods. Mr. Robot meanwhile sees a lot of himself in Grey, being unafraid to take down an organization in its entirety at the cost of ruining lives and companies to do it. Grey notices some "odd quirks" in Elliot but doesn't mind that much. Having heard of Providence from Grey, Elliot suggested being wary of The Dark Army, an anarchistic cyberterrorist collective who have asserted control over most of the world's banks and governments and generally being incredibly ruthless towards anything they see as a threat. Elliot suggested to Grey should try to talk with Tyrell Wellick and Phillip Price who were CTO and CEO of E Corp respectively and were forced into an alliance with Elliot once The Dark Army superseded them as the greater threat, to see if they are interested in joining his cause. Tyrell's hacking skills and Price's knowledge of The Dark Army may be useful to Grey but given their business ties (and Tyrell's often psychotic impulses), Grey wouldn't be too trusting of them. Given that both are trying to live in peace in the Pantheon (and both are wary of Grey's reputation), they declined to work exclusively with Grey and are only inclined to team up with him as long as Elliot is with them or is involved in some of Grey's plans.
• Ever since the start of his new crusade, Grey has been trying to ascend 47 in this realm but he needs to wait until 47 returns from his retirement to ascend again. Until one day, he heard the news that several people had been murdered in their temples similar to the methods 47 would use. Grey turned his method of profiling to track 47's position locations. Due to this, he ran into Golgo 13, another skilled hitman with superb marksmanship skills. While Grey is a bit impressed by his skills and reputation, he thinks 47 still outclasses him given that Golgo's not that very good at disguising himself. While uninterested in joining Grey's cause, Golgo did give info that where 47's temple might be located, as his temple was hidden from anyone but his followers. But knowing 47, Grey knows that 47 cannot stay in his temple for very long and decides not to track it down. The two brothers eventually reunited in Grey's temple after 47 decided to confirm the rumors of The Shadow Client's presence in the Pantheon. It was the first time since they set foot in the Pantheon that they each cracked a smile on their faces.
• It's clear that Grey highly admires and highly respects 47 a lot, to the point that he thinks so other assassins even come close to him. Despite his stoic demeanor, 47 also shows care for Grey to some extent as he is wore his coat shortly after Grey died. Genetically, both of them are enhanced human clones, with the major difference in that Grey has hairs due to his imperfect genes while 47 has no visible hairs. Grey's emotions are not tampered with and therefore he can feel the suffering 47's kill have cause, who the Elusive Assassin has no qualms with in his kills. Both received Special Ops training in their younger years, making them highly skilled in combat, marksmanship, infiltration, etc. Grey worked as a mercenary before he was hired as a bodyguard but nowadays, he would rather have 47 do the killing as he gives the intel to him. He did lay down some plans with 47 as they are planning on a siege soon following intel that there would be a meeting among the Illuminati members soon. 47's relative anonymity upon the wider Pantheon (being known only to other assassins and a few non-stitching civilians) would help him a lot on this plan.
• The Question was able to gather intel of a secret meeting to control the deities in the Court of Gods and when and where it would take place. So, the group formulated a plan to foil a meeting by the Pantheonic Illuminati with Dantes agreeing to finance the operation. While aware that these deities cannot die within the Pantheon, the best option that Grey oppose is to stall them so that it would take longer for them to formulate a new plan. Aiden and Elliot were able to hack to get floorplans for the secret location and volunteered to hack the security system as well. The Basterds agreed to take care of some of the field operatives guarding the place while V provided some explosives, both as a distraction and infiltrations (like blowing up a small hole in the wall or a locked door). Alex requested to handle Gill personality (at his request) to keep him distracted while 47 would silently dealt with the other members. Lelouch (aided by Suzaku and Jeremiah) was able to control a team of scientist deities a few weeks earlier to make/reverse engineer the memory-erasing serum among other things at Grey's request. The Shadow Client served as mission control in all of this.
  • Vandal Savage was neutralized via the serum placed in ammo inside 47's tranquilizer gun (as one of 47's clever and out-of-the-box ideas). Both Urien and Kolin were dealt with by The Elusive Assassin with a well-timed "accident". The Illuminati members are not present in the meeting but it is expected that the incident would make them either fear for their safety to do anything or at least delay their plans for a while until things cool down. This leaves Bill Cypher, who Grey tried to summon alone and spoke to Bill in Grey's mindscape. Bill was skeptical thinking it was another ploy but Grey reassured him that he had no ill intentions of killing him as he wish to be a vessel for Bill in the hopes the two of them would work on taking the Illuminati and Main Pantheon Leaders down, seemingly reiterating his distrust for those who are run on top. Tantalized by the offer, Bill checks his mindscape, doesn't see a gambit involving him, and offers his hand to his soon-to-be-puppet. However, before Grey can shake Bill's hand, blue flames started to appear around them, to which Bill can only disappointingly mutter:
    Bill Cypher: .siht htiw pu emac did yug tsrif eht nehw lanigiro saw ti tsael tA !no emoc hO ^note Oh come on! At least it was original when the first guy did came up with this.
  • Both 47 and Lelouch discovered Grey's sleeping body in his temple with a dart on his neck and a window open next to him. It was a good thing 47's very skilled at his long-distance marksmanship and Lelouch has his Geass to make Grey forget the final steps of the plan. Lelouch quickly gave 47 the antidote that the other deities made, which 47 quickly inject into Grey's neck. He recovered soon after that and it took some time to remember everything but seeing the bloody print replica on his temple did speed up the process. Finally experiencing what is like to have your memories taken kinda haunts him and he feels more sorry for what 47 had to endure. Grey knows that all of the Pantheonic Illuminati would live again and have their memories back somehow. For now, he seems content to have finally found himself a purpose in the Pantheon even after all the rejection he had when he first started here.
• Other Minor Information: 1) Not much is known about what Grey's private life or hobbies are when not plotting something, so it's not known which Houses he would frequently go to. 2) Grey is also not really interested in running his temple as he finds that most of his followers rebel to make themselves look cool rather than for a serious cause. It is rare for someone as like-minded as him to come here as he later discovers that his appointed Trope is often used to make fun of people (usually younger people) who try look cool without thinking logically about their situation or the authority they rebel against. Grey's only advice to these wanna-be rebels is to be aware of what is around them. 3) He has heard of Dantes' rivalry with another deity named Dan, a revengeful short-tempered God who was the original holder of The Count's current title. Grey tried to approach Dan to join his team at some point as a sort of talented wildcard but Dan refused to join him as long as Dantes is on his team. Funny enough, all three men seem to have a knack for revenge quests. However, being someone who takes things seriously given his past experiences, Grey finds some of Dan's childish and petty revenge quests a bit annoying to him.

"Do you realise what kind of world you've been shaping? [...] I live in that world. I have seen the consequences. I have felt the cost. That's what defines me."

Edited by lawliet-saw-whet on Oct 25th 2022 at 5:52:38 PM

Mood Status: Currently suffering from cringe.

for the grey man

for Susbriel and the impostors

THE GOLDEN AGE WILL RETURN AGAIN!

@Carboard Bot: wootzits reserved Devil in Disguise for Woland.

---

Draft for Piranhas.

The Razorteeth piranhas were created as part of a government plan to turn the tide of the Vietnam War, with another batch of genetically-modified piranhas created later on that can fly.

The Lake Victoria piranhas are prehistoric and survived for many years through cannibalism, with a later set of piranhas that hatched being capable of evolving to become capable of moving on land.

Looking for suggestions for interactions, including those who might be interested in them.

The Operation Razorteeth and Lake Victoria Piranhas

• Lesser Deities
• Symbol: Themselves
• Alignment: Chaotic Evil
• Portfolio: Attack of the Killer Whatever
  • Razorteeth: Bioweapon Beast
  • Lake Victoria: Artistic License – Marine Biology
• Domains: Piranhas, Carnage
• Rivals: Bruce/Jaws
• Wary Observation from: David Attenborough, Steve Zissou
• Operation Razorteeth was set forth by the US government to create deadly piranhas in order for the country to gain an advantage during the Vietnam War and was canned once the war ended. The piranhas managed to survive and were tended to by one of the scientists behind the project until the pool they were in is drained, unleashing them onto many unsuspecting innocents, including those at a summer camp and a newly-opened summer resort. Destroying them with industrial-grade pollution wasn’t enough as another piranha-related attack was about to be under way, this time at an island resort. Not only was the attack caused by piranhas created as bioweapons similar to the previous incident, but they are capable of flying.
  • An earthquake has hit Lake Victoria, Arizona, unleashing plenty of prehistoric piranhas that have managed to survive for at least 2 million years potentially through cannibalism. A spring break party taking place turns into a bloodbath as the piranhas cause untold amounts of casualties and the instigators just happen to be baby piranhas, with the adult ones being larger and presumably much deadlier. A campaign to eradicate the fish that resulted in Lake Victoria being abandoned wasn’t enough as another batch of piranhas hatched out of a cow’s carcass and caused another deadly attack, this time at a sexed-up water park in Cross Lake. Not only was the attack just as deadly as it was back in Lake Victoria, but the piranhas are capable of evolving to walk on land.
• Summertime was about to begin in the Pantheon and with it a variety of beachgoers and party animals who wanted to have some fun in the sun. Given the number of incidents that occurred involving deadly animals running amok in different beaches, safety measures were put in place to prevent any sort of accident from happening, but it wasn’t enough to stop a massacre from unfolding. A few days prior to the beginning of summer, a break-in at a top secret faculty resulted in several kinds of deadly fish being unleashed into the waters of the Pantheon and the piranhas were about to enter the beach where that summertime party was taking place. What followed was a bloodbath leading to the deaths of many present, ranging from partygoers to people trying to protect others from the dangers of the piranhas. A drastic measure was taken to prevent any more casualties from the piranhas, resulting in the beach becoming an abandoned wasteland after the survivors were evacuated, but since there were many more piranhas coming to the Pantheon, a specialized area where they could be contained and difficult for them to break free was made for the safety of others, but it hasn’t stopped any more incidents related to them from happening.
• The highly aggressive nature of the piranhas led Steve Zissou and David Attenborough to try and figure out what made these particular fishes hostile to others even if they know the risks involved with trying to interact with a group of fish that can eat them alive. Attenborough was particularly disgusted with how the piranhas related to Operation Razorteeth were artificially created and saw it was mankind tampering with nature leading to disastrous consequences, especially when it came to genetically modifying them to fly. As for the prehistoric piranhas that attacked Lake Victoria and Cross Lake, while they were believed to be pygocentrus nattereri according to a marine biologist that kept one of them, both Attenborough and Zissou could tell that these prehistoric piranhas behaved nothing like a typical red piranha. The idea of prehistoric piranhas evolving so that they could move on land was something that was of curiosity for both Attenborough and Zissou when it came to the idea of how sea creatures can evolve, but since neither want their documentaries to lead to murder during filming, they opted to be very careful when it came to studying these creatures, especially since a couple of piranhas they took in for studying ended up escaping when Zissou and Attenborough weren’t looking (though the two didn’t get hurt while they had ownership of these piranhas).
• While there were additional piranha-related films, the 1978 film featuring the Operation Razorteeth piranhas was one of several movies that copied Jaws to the point that it was almost subject to a lawsuit. Steven Spielberg, director of the original Jaws, enjoyed the original Piranha movie, though not only has he not said anything about later installments of that series, but he knows to keep his distance from these creatures given their hostility. The shark from Jaws nicknamed “Bruce”, found itself in violent rivalry with not just the Razorteeth piranhas, but the prehistoric ones as well when it came to causing terror in aquatic settings. While the shark is a larger creature and can eat a group of piranhas easily, a large number of piranhas would be able to eat the shark just as easily, especially if the shark has been weakened by something. Speaking of famous filmmakers and movies about piranhas, the follow-up to the Razorteeth piranha attack was the first film to be directed by James Cameron, but given how production on that film ended up being problematic, the movie isn’t something Cameron is willing to talk about much, if at all, even if he’s acknowledged it as his first directorial effort.

Edited by r-lock256 on Oct 17th 2022 at 11:56:03 AM

Frisk: Oboromaru according to Word of God is the direct inspiration for Undertale’s Pacifist/Genocide mechanics. Demons, mechs, and undead don’t count against the player in terms of Live A Live’s version (which foreshadows Ode Iou and his 3 lieutenants true nature). Its Fanon (by a very significant majority of the fandom) that he went pacifist. Note you get Oboro’s Infinity -1 Sword for going pacifist.

Ornstein and Smough: Nozdormu is immune to lightning and Chromie resists it. Nice way to troll Ornstein. Dn D Blue and Bronze dragons are immune to lightning. Most dragon type pokemon resist lightning and are infamous for hitting MUCH harder than their size suggests.

Respected by most gamers in the pantheon for being one of the few Dual Boss fights that’s actually done right in terms of design, opprutunities for isolation tactics, and general challenging but fair difficulty.

Prometheus and Pandora can be considered precursors to the duo mechanically and in terms of helping make Dual Boss popular. They are a tag team fight rather than a Dual Boss but follow a roughly similar premise (no power up but share a huge health bar).

What’s the actual case for Vulkan to be deleted (besides being arbritary)? The defense has already presented evidence backed by lore including the older pre 5th edition material that he should stay. Very much qualifies under the SCARY part of the trope.

Plus there’s already three votes for keep under “merely old (at least pre 2014) just needs rework/update”.

Edited by magnum12 on Oct 17th 2022 at 6:33:49 AM

@ JNHZ31161: Angela and Roland's stories culminate in both of them changing for the better.

Angela abandoned her desires for revenge and freedom born from a millennium of neglect and suffering in a time loop in favor of fulfilling the plan to fix the world she had once sabotaged out of spite as well as sparing Roland after his attempt on her life to break free from the cycle of violence that is omnipresent in their setting.

Roland took steps to move past his nihilistic cynicism as well as his anger and grief surrounding the death of his wife and unborn child by setting aside his revenge and returning Angela's mercy in kind and genuinely standing by her side as her friend.

@ lawliet-saw-whet:

@ r-lock: There's that famed account of Theodore Roosevelt witnessing a school of Amazon piranhas shredding a cow into a skeleton in just seconds, though such conditions were artificial when in reality they're quite timid, omnivorous fish with a preference towards carrion. Of course, these piranhas are no-such creatures.

All my fault, you say...? What fault? I daresay it's all thanks to me.

@Lucas Grey: I think his title should be worded like this:

Lucas Grey, The Cool-Headed God of Rebelling Against Authority

TV Tropes Pantheon Group Members Database

Wow, I actually had a notepad file on my desktop where I planned to propose "Gabriel". But I gave it up because I asked this thread about reserved tropes work ([1]), which kinda shot down my plan. So I don't think the Alternates and Gabriel would work - Unless you want to ask Wootzits. What a weird coincidence.

If you're curious:

Edited by m-95 on Oct 17th 2022 at 10:08:22 AM

Please visit the "AITA" forum game

Huh. Don't worry, I've finally found a trope for Mandela Catalogue itself. I can only propose it next page though, but I have another question.

What to do when making a profile for an entire work? Do we yeet in all the characters? If it's Analog Horror or something similar, is it just a collection of tapes and if the characters are real In-Universe do we include them in the profile?

Not to sound rude, but ... you don't.

The closest thing we have is Dominions Expansion, which is for settings and locations, but not exactly works.

EDIT: Actually, now that I think of it, you could do something like: Mandela County, Unholy Site of Analog Horror as a Dominion.

Edited by m-95 on Oct 17th 2022 at 10:24:16 AM

Please visit the "AITA" forum game

You could probably just get away with giving Gabe and the Alts Analog Horror by themselves, since horror villains are typically considered the faces of their subgenres.

SKREEEEEEEONK!

For the piranhas, there are a ton of water Pokemon in the Pantheon and there are two in particular that they wouldn't want to fight, which are Gyarados and Kyogre. The former is a giant and angry sea serpent that hits hard and the latter is essentially an orca who can cause floods, and hits incredibly hard. While that would be good in theory, it would cause harm to them. Groudon would be their bane due to going Primal and drying out any water, which would kill them. Any chef would probably try to cook them, but I'm honestly not sure if people eat piranhas (they probably do). One thing is for sure, and that's any trident wielder would be able to sit there and kill them easily, akin to shooting fish in a barrel. Aquaman, Steve & Alex, Poseidon/Neptune, and others would sit there and keep going until the threat is taken care of. Dynamite fishing (yes, this exists) would really anger them, so opposition to anyone who uses explosions.

Ha ha ha. What a story, Mark.

Welp, finished up Jack's rework. Now accepting votes.

Jack Skellington, The Personification of Halloween (The Pumpkin King, Jack Skeleton, Mr. Unlucky, Bone Daddy, Bone Man, Captain Jack, Inventor of Holiday Spirit)

• Greater God
• Symbol: His Black Bowtie
• Theme Songs: This is Halloween or Jack's Lament
• Alignment: Chaotic Good
• Portfolio: Spooky, But Not Remotely Evil, Friendly Skeleton, The Performer King, Loves All Things Scary, Incredibly Nice, Can Kick Ass When Necessary, The Good King, Occasionally Tires Of His Fame, Mood-Swinger
• Domains: Holidays, Skeletons, Scaring, Stop Motion
• Allies: Santa Claus, Nicholas Saint North, Buddy Hobbs, Sans and Papyrus, Sir Daniel Fortesque, The Dancing Skeletons, Peppermint Butler, Koume Shirasaka, Skid and Pump, Dipper And Mabel, The Grinch, Sully And Mike
• Enemies: Oogie Boogie, Freddy Krueger, SCP-4666, Scarecrow, Pitch Black, Fiddlestick, Spinal, Winterbolt, Mad King Thorn, The Headless Horseman, Jack O' Lantern
• On Good Terms With: Luigi
• The ever-cheerful Jack Skellington is the "King" of Halloween Town, and by extension the representative for Halloween itself. As its most skilled monster, Jack essentially runs the town, and therefore is responsible for organizing Halloween every year, preparing various tricks and spooks for the holiday. While incredibly friendly and caring towards the residents, he often feels bored by the repetition of doing basically the same thing every year, and yearns for something different to spice things up. One Halloween, he seemingly gets his wish when he stumbles upon Christmas Town and discovers Christmas, promptly launching a scheme to replace Santa Clause for the year so that he can finally do something different. While initially successful at taking over, his attempt at Christmas ends in disaster, and he realizes how badly he screwed up and rushes to fix his mistake, managing to save Santa Clause from being killed by the sadistic Oogie Boogie. Having gained new ideas for the next Halloween, Jack resumes his original job with a now-returned passion, albeit never quite losing his desire to make every Halloween more interesting than the last.
• Jack has actually been in the Pantheon for quite some time now, and it's all thanks to Santa Claus. Having understood his new friend's desire for inspiration, he figured that the Pantheon would be perfect for some ideas considering the abundance of spooky but benevolent deities, as well as it being good at keeping him in check in case of Jack pulling another stunt like last time. Jack, when Santa discussed the plan with him, was ecstatic at the idea and rushed to the Pantheon, where he was chosen to represent Halloween itself considering he ran the thing to begin with. Jack spends most of his time exploring the Pantheon in search of more inspiration for next Halloween, though he has found the time to relax and enjoy the more pleasant bits of the realm. Unfortunately, it wasn't long until his most hated enemy, Oogie Boogie, ascended as well, with Jack being perfectly willing to delay his plans just to foil the burlap sack whenever he causes trouble.
• While their first meeting wasn't ideal to say the least, what with Jack kidnapping him and nearly ruining Christmas, ultimately Santa Claus forgave him and Halloween Town for their hair-brained scheme and undid all their damage in the span of a night. Jack later helping save Christmas and all other holidays from a revived and power-hungry Oogie Boogie essentially made the two legitimate friends, with Jack frequently visiting him for ideas on how to make Halloween more scary. One time he visited Christmas Town only to find out that another version of Santa has taken over for the holiday, that being the Badass Santa Nicholas Saint North. While initially suspicious of Jack thanks to his hijacking of Christmas, a bit of talking with him showed that Jack legitimately thought hat he was doing Santa a favor, as well as clearly regretting the incident, and was eventually warmed up to the skeleton.
  • Another visit had him run into Buddy Hobbs, a human that was raised as an elf, and as a result had the maturity and hyperactivity of a child. This caused some trouble when he mistook Jack for a monster invading the North Pole, scaring him into trying to warn Santa Claus about him coming. After Santa explained that, no, it wasn't a hostile creature coming to kill everyone, it was his old friend Jack, Buddy maned upland decided to meet him face to face. It didn't take long for the two to become fast friends, with the two bonding over saving Christmas once, even if Jack was responsible for his incident. Helps that Jack was able to keep up with Buddy's hyperactivity to see he's a legitimately kindhearted man.
• Since Halloween is an incredibly popular holiday with kids, it's no surprise that Halloween Town is beloved by fans of Halloween, with children all over the Pantheon often visiting Jack's domain to enjoy some frights guaranteed to be harmless fun, as well as score some candy. Jack himself gets along extremely well with them, with most kids finding him an incredibly cool, not to mention surprisingly nice, mascot for the holiday. Notably frequent guests include Koume Shirasaka, a girl with a love of everything ghoulish and spooky, and Skid and Pump, two extremely hyperactive children who celebrate "Spooky Month" every chance they get. Jack has happily invited anyone to visit and experience its horrifying joys.
  • One summer night, as Jack was brainstorming ideas for Halloween as usual, he unexpectedly got a pair of visitors in the form of twins Dipper and Mable Pines, complete with costumes and candy bags. Dipper found the place fascinating and was constantly asking about the place and it's history, while Mable was just having fun and hanging around with the residents. While Jack didn't mind them at all, he was curious why they were there in the middle of summer, so he went and asked them what brung them here. Dipper casually explained that, back in Gravity Falls, the town loved Halloween so much that they created a whole second version called "Summerween" just to celebrate it further, even gaining a urban legend called the Summerween Trickster. Jack found the idea both fascinating and hilarious, and after letting the two enjoy their time in Halloween Town made plans to visit the town next summer just to investigate their holiday.
• As one of the Pantheon's most well-known Friendly Skeletons, Jack's kindness has earned him a plethora of bare-boned buddies, often hanging out with them on the rare occasion that he isn't looking for ideas for Halloween. Papyrus is shown to think that Jack is "extremely cool", with him often showing Jack his puzzles in an attempt to impress him. His brother Sans also finds him good company, with the two trading skeleton puns whenever they meet up, to Papyrus's dismay. The infamous Dancing Skeletons highly amuse Jack, and he's often invited them to Halloween Town to entertain the civilians, even at times joining in himself for fun. Sir Daniel Fortesque is admired by Jack for saving his kingdom from an evil sorcerer, especially since he had to work for his initially unearned reputation as a hero, and has usually lent a hand in defending Halloween Town from any attacks. Not all skeletons that he met were friendly, however: one skeleton he approached, the giggle-happy undead pirate Spinal, attempted to kill him so he can add him to his crew of the damned. Luckily, Jack had packed his Soul Robber with him that day and proved to be a match against the pirate with his agility and weapon, eventually driving him off after a tough battle.
• Some of Jack's misadventures often involve a certain Sora visiting Halloween Town, usually to stop any Darkness that was invading the town, as well as Oogie Boogie being up to his usual shenanigans, including being part of an alliance of Disney villains led by Maleficent. Jack often assisted Sora in fighting the Heartless, revealing that he was quite adept with black magic of all things. His most notable feat, however? He was actually able to tame the usually hostile Heartless into dancing with him, and it ended up working for the most part, at least until Jack tried giving them an actual heart. Either way, Jack has always welcomed Sora to his town with open arms, occasionally letting him get a sneak peak at whatever plans for Halloween he's got cooked up.
• Now, Of there's one thing that can legitimately piss of Jack, it's using scares to actually harm people, as it goes against everything he and his people's philosophy regarding scares. It's the primary reason why Oogie Boogie's one of the very few people he actively despises. Now when he learned that Freddy Krueger as a sadistic sociopath that not only terrorized and killed people in their dreams, but also preferred to haunt children, Jack was livid. There's been more than one occasion where he was directly responsible for thwarting on of his killing sprees early, this earring his personal ire as well. Jack has a similar bone to pick with other fear inducers as well: Scary Scarecrows Johnathan Crane and Fiddlesticks are two scarecrow themed fiends who use fear to commit acts of evil, with the former using a special fear toxin to induce fear for his crimes and the latter being a sadistic demon who taunts others with the last words of his victims, as well as Pitch Black, an incarnation of the Boogeyman himself that plans to bury the world in fear, and uses phobias to do so. Jack's often been quick to stand against these horrifying fiends, often dishing out his own brand of horror against them.
• Second to that is people that attempt to ruin Christmas, as it reminds him of how not only he nearly ruined the holiday, something he heavily regrets, but also how Oogie nearly took over all holidays out of revenge against Santa Claus. Granted, Jack did so out of complete obliviousness, while those he opposes generally did it intentionally. He considers the worst of the lot to be Winterbolt, the former ruler of the North Pole that sought to reclaim his throne by overthrowing Santa, and was one of the more despicable of his universe's villains. Notably, Winterbolt had initially sought out Jack for an alliance, mistaking his takeover of Christmas as more malicious than it was, only for Jack to instantly reject his offer, calling him a bully that picks on others smaller than him. The two had been at each other's throats ever since.
• If Jack has any reason to leave Halloween Town, it's to find ways to make the next Halloween even more terrifying than the last. Motivated by sheer boredom at doing the same thing every year, Jack has dedicated himself to finding new ideas to keep his passion for the holiday alive, and the Pantheon has done a wonderful job of giving him new ideas for the holiday. James P. Sullivan and Mike Wazowski are two monsters that Jack frequently employs to help teach new terrifying tricks to the denizens of Halloween Town, and while the two are more in the business of making children laugh nowadays, they recognize that Jack seeks to bring joy to everyone and are generally cool with teaching a few tricks. He's also recently made a friend in Peppermint Butler, the needlessly creepy butler to Princess Bubblegum, who Jack finds to be a goldmine of wonderfully spooky ideas. PB is generally happy to share some ideas with the Pumpkin King, although even Jack has found his taste in spookiness to be a bit much for his intended audience sometimes.
  • Initially, Jack didn't really have much reason to talk with The Grinch, usually just acknowledging him as a good example of someone fixing their mistakes, even if the Grinch was still known to be a bit of a grouch. That was, until he learned about what used to be "Grinch Night", where every now and again The Grinch would visit Whoville with his Paraphernalia Wagon, a mechanism capable of creating all types of terrors, and use it to terrorize the village. While Jack frowned upon his initial use of it, especially for a reason as petty as "the wind annoying him", he was entranced by the sheer potential of such a machine, and sought after the Grinch, confident he was redeemed enough to use it to entertain. While the Grinch was initially just annoyed at the skeleton's offers and just wanted to be left alone, he eventually caved in and took up Jack's offer, having missed terrorizing others with his machine. Since then, the Grinch has visited the town on his Wagon to expose the residents to his machine, which the civilians usually end up loving for its sheer spookiness.
• Go ahead and mention SCP-4666, or The Yule Man, around Jack and see what happens. Ever since he first heard of him and what the bastard does to children, Jack has dropped all evidence of his cheery self and has dedicated himself to seeing him dead, considering the Yule Man to be even worse than Oogie even if he's a more personal rival. The first Christmas the Yule Man was active was the most notable: what 4666 at first considered an easy season for victims turned into a night-long fight with the Pumpkin King, who was dedicated to making sure he didn't get a single soul that year. While the Yule Man had initially wrote off Jack as a goof, he was promptly fought off-guard when the skeleton was able to evade everything he threw at him, tracking him down everywhere he went and putting up more than enough of a fight when attacked. Eventually 4666 was forced to flee after the night ended, having realized that Jack wasn't gonna give up anytime soon. Ever since then, both parties have been quick to take any opportunity to take each other out.
• One day, Halloween Town was caught off guard by an attack by the cruel King Boo, who had seen the town and thought it would be an awesome new base for his operations. Deciding to perform a sneak attack on the town, having heard of Jack's combat prowess, he had at that point captured nearly all of the residents and was currently threatening Jack into giving him the town, otherwise he'd have the residents killed. That was, until he himself was caught off guard by a certain someone: his nemesis Luigi, who had caught wind of his plan and decided to come and stop him. With the help from Jack, the duo were able to turn the tables on the psychotic specter and his minions, managing to capture them and rescue the residents. Jack especially was impressed by Luigi, if mostly how he risked his life to stopping King Boo despite very clearly being terrified out of his wits by both him and the town itself. Luigi was initially nervous to meet up with the Pumpkin King at first, but it didn't take long for him to see him as a kindhearted man, and the two left on very good terms. Jack has since invited Luigi to enjoy Halloween Town, and while Luigi's too nervous to accept the invite, he appreciates the offer every time.
• Back when he first arrived, it didn't take long for Jack to figure out that there were other Halloween-themed spirits roaming about, and initially he thought that he could befriend these spirits so as to spice up Halloween. Unfortunately, the first god he encountered happened to be Mad King Thorn, a psychotic undead king who tormented everyone on the holiday, and was a complete douche to boot. Jack was naturally distraught that his competition was someone like him, and since then the two had a rivalry over their ideas of the holiday. The later spirits that ascended afterwards unfortunately weren't much better: the Headless Horseman was a damned spirit who could change all of his surrounding to Halloween, while Jack O' Lantern was an undead trickster who could only rise on Halloween night and wanted to make it last forever. While Jack did feel bad about their less than ideal backstories, as well as finding their dedication to the holiday morbidly impressive, he ultimately can't support their actions and usually finds himself opposing all three spirits.

Edited by DoodSlayer136 on Oct 17th 2022 at 8:46:18 AM

NOISE IS CALLING, PICK UP PHONE

for Jack'O the skelly

THE GOLDEN AGE WILL RETURN AGAIN!