Trope Pantheons Discussion

I am actually legitimately scared that someone here is going to see this possible tension and take this seriously and starting deleting absolutely everything that seems even slightly over-represented.

#Properly Paranoid

You know what? I'm going to bed and hopefully this will have simmered down in the morning. Or better yet it turned to be a nightmare. Selamat malam!

Edited by SuperWIKI1 on Oct 9th 2019 at 12:36:00 AM

Nintendo not a real good example since it's a company with multiple I Ps. Same with DC and Marvel.

Do you know what a joke is or do you need Joking Mode potholed into everything?

That's it, i'm getting me mallet. Pantheon is cancelled ClownEmoji

But still, we can’t just start deleting profiles by the masses just because we think they’re too much. If we aren’t careful, those things we axe will be underpresented in comparison.

Also, it’s morning in the west US coastline, so you have every right to be Properly Paranoid

I do know but I am actually a very pessimistic and paranoid person in general. And I've seen this argument plenty of times since I came by, so it's no stretch to think that some big reform will be passed in the future that not all of us will be happy with.

May not actually sleep tonight. I ate too much. HA!

.

Edited by SuperWIKI1 on Oct 9th 2019 at 12:46:32 AM

Let's put it short.

Garbage will always be deleted and only that. Only unbiased opinions are allowed when a problematic profile or trend occurs. As of now, nothing drastic is going to happen.

Failing to comply will results in a army of hamsters taking over the pantheon

Well, at least it ain't an army of Skaven.

Edited by CrimsonShark on Oct 8th 2019 at 5:48:48 PM

YES to hamsters invading. Unless they're cybernetically augmented.

Suggestions for Kayaba?

Prototype mode

Kayaba/Heathcliff]] Akihiko Kayaba, The Game Master God (Heathcliff, Commander, The Strongest Man, The Living Legend, The Paladin, The Crimson Knight, The Game Master of Death, SAO's Char Aznable, Master of the Cyberverse)

^Heathcliff 

^{As the Game Master} 

• Potential House: Gameplay (House of Gaming)
• Greater God which borders on Overdeity in the Cyberverse, Quasideity in real life
• Symbol: The Knights of the Blood Emblem
• Alignment: Lawful Neutral, formerly Lawful Evil
• Portfolio: Created a Death Game Based on his Dream Of Creating A Floating Castle, Anti-Villain, Leader of the Knights of the Blood Guild, Main Antagonist of the Aincrad Arc, Big Good, Gives Players A Fighting Chance to Survive, Game Master, Seemingly Indifferent About The Deaths in SAO, More Ethical Than The Other SAO Villains, Has Unparalleled Swordsmanship as Heathcliff With A Title To Match, Uploaded His Consciousness To The Internet At the Expense of His Physical Body, Has A Grudging Respect for Kirito and Asuna
• Domains: Death Games, Gaming, Technology, Science
• Herald: Rinko Koujiro (his Love Interest and partner)
• High Priest: Suguru Itakura
• Allies: Kuroto Dan, Lain Iwakura, Shiro Kanzaki, Noah Kaiba, The Machine, Cortana, Hackerman, The Laughing Man, Char Aznable,
• Odd Friendship: Two-Face, George Lucas, Jigsaw^note yes, really
• Worthy Opponent: Kazuto Kirigaya/Kirito
• Rivals^note can lean into Friendly Rivalry from time to time (on their end):
  • Gaming and technology related: Seto Kaiba, Tony Stark/Iron Man, 9S
  • Swordsmen and Fighters: Guts, Future Trunks, Jaime Lannister, Kaito Kumon/Kamen Rider Baron
• Teeth-Clenched Teamwork: Masamune Dan, the GUAG White Hats, the Lyoko Warriors, Takatora Kureshima, Krim Steinbelt, and by extension most other good-aligned Kamen Riders, most if not all superheroes in the Pantheon, possibly The Master of Chaldea, Shuichi Akai
• Enemies:
  • Gaming and Technological Experts: Nobuyuki Sugou, Quinella, SHOCKER (especially Ryoma Sengoku, Tenjuro Banno, Enter) Masami Eiri, Kite, Master Control Program, HAL 9000, XANA, SHODAN, SKYNET and the Terminators, all Evil-aligned members of the Grand United Alliance of Machines, the Decepticons (especially Soundwave), Ex-
  • Others: Nearly every Evil-aligned deity that isn't a Knight Templar or a Well-Intentioned Extremist in some way, but special mention goes to The Black Organization, HYDRA, Gregor Clegane, Dio Brando, Light Yagami, Teru Mikami, The Brave Companions
• Respects: Artix von Krieger, Link and the GUAG Sacred Knights
• (Grudgingly) Respected by: Every single gaming character and gamer in the Pantheon, possibly Phineas and Ferb
• (Actually) Respected by: The Grand United Alliance of Chaos
• Opposes: The Godmodder, The Sibyl System, GIf.fany, every demon in the Pantheon
• Opposed by: Emu Hojo and the other unambiguously good Ex-Aid Riders, Shinji Kido, Optimus Prime, Katniss Everdeen, Akihiko Sanada, Zamasu, Kei Shirogane, Shizuka Hanekura, Conan Edogawa, Eren Yeager, Mikasa Ackerman
• Despised by: The Grand United Alliance of Law
• Pities: All deities in the Pantheon that were unlawfully experimented on and deities who sacrificed everything in pursuit of their goals. Yes, even Griffith
• Conflicting Opinion (on their end): The entire SAO cast, especially Asuna Yuuki and Yui (yes, that includes Abridged Kirito and Asuna)
• The Game Master of Death. That's what haters in the Pantheon call Akihiko Kayaba. The insult rings hollow, for he is one of the few video game developers to truly embrace his craft. But as his moniker suggests, he embraced it a little too much.
• Akihiko Kayaba pioneered the rise of the VRMMORPG genre, creating its first game, Sword Art Online, accessed via the NerveGear device. The game's setting of Aincrad was based on Kayaba's childhood vision of a floating castle, and he worked long and hard to make this vision a reality. But of course he had to go and mess it up. When Sword Art Online's official gaming service launched, he trapped about 10 000 players in the game and issued an ultimatum: beat the Final Boss on the 100th floor, and everyone will be allowed to log out. Until this was done, whenever a player's HP reached zero, his or her NerveGear would send a fatal pulse of microwave radiation into their brain, killing them. In the midst of the turmoil and confusion, he logged into the game under the username 'Heathcliff', becoming the leader of a high-level clearing guild called the Knights of the Blood, and a key figure in helping the players clear the floors of Aincrad. However, previous encounters clued Kirito in as to his true identity and he was exposed on the 75th floor soon after its boss was defeated^* His original plan was to reveal himself on the 95th floor and become the game's Final Boss on the 100th floor, but it didn't come to pass. Heathcliff then challenged Kirito to a duel, promising to free all the players if he lost. Kirito won (after a fashion), causing Sword Art Online and its Deadly Game to be ended prematurely before ever reaching the final floor.
• As for why he did all of that? Aside from creating the 'floating castle' from his childhood dreams, he seems to have forgotten.
  • Abridged Kirito and Asuna have a theory, though whether it applies to this Kayaba is up for debate: the whole thing was Christmas Rushed, he was sleep deprived as he tried to finish it before the deadline, and that the whole dying-in-the-game-means-dying-for-real is actually a glitch that he, in his sleep-deprived mind decides it would be best to to cover up as intentional. Kayaba himself admits that's an interesting if hilarious theory, but sadly that wasn't the case.
  • A more plausible explanation that Kayaba has admitted to be closer to the truth is that he felt frustrated and limited by the arbitrary rules that govern the current reality and wished to exceed them by supplanting it with his own. Thus he created Sword Art Online to be as sensory and seemingly realistic as possible to support this.
• Having planned to do so long before he enacted his death game, he used a remodeled FullDive machine to upload his consciousness into the virtual world permanently to escape justice. In the process, his brain cells were fried, killing his physical body. His Virtual Ghost resurfaced during Kirito's duel with Oberon, giving Kirito his administrator ID and account. This allowed Kirito to utterly wreck Sugou as Kayaba's admin privileges outranked his.
  • During the events of Project Alicization, he transferred his virtual consciousness into a robot body in an attempt to save those on the Ocean Turtle when its reactor underwent meltdown. Unfortunately, that resulted in his permanent death as it meant obliterating his virtual consciousness in the process.
• Reports from the House of Technology and the GUAG White Hats indicated that Kayaba could have programmed a backdoor to duplicate and re-upload his consciousness onto a random server in the event of his death, but this was never proven and cynics proclaimed the findings to be a hoax. That is, until Kuroto Dan noticed an anomaly in one of his father's prototype Kamen Rider Chronicle beta servers, a digital intelligence similar to that of Yui. When the data was extracted from the server and analyzed, it was revealed to be the fragmented data of Kayaba. Kuroto enlisted the help of his ally Krim Steinbelt and advice from Tony Stark to consolidate Kayaba back into human form, after which he was brought before the Court of the Gods. Kirito and his friends chose to remain neutral in the session as they were torn whether to completely forgive Kayaba for whatever atrocities he's committed. Ultimately, he was allowed to ascend to the Pantheon under the trope of Game Master, though under probation.
  • It is a little known fact that the SCP Foundation discovered Kayaba first, though his data was too fragmented at the time to discern that it was him. Mobile Task Force Mu-4 operatives were tasked with bagging and tagging him, but automatic protocols switched him to another network in the Pantheon before any further events could ensue. The most Kayaba remembers of the incident is a anti-malware probe with the SCP logo on it reaching for him (yes, that's a thing).
• For his first months in the Pantheon, he was barred from accessing any and all forms of modern technology and sent for therapy sessions in the House of Health and Diseases in an effort to ensure that his future endeavours are more ethical and less self-indulgent. He was also stripped of access to his in-game persona of Heathcliff. In the meantime, he was allowed to consult with the many game designers and researchers in the Pantheon to figure out what to do with his new lease of life. This probationary period has since ended, and Kayaba can access his in-game persona of Heathcliff in the Pantheon just like the rest of the SAO cast.
  • He doesn't like partaking in the Pantheon's many conflicts though, so he rarely uses his avatar in full-on combat unless the immediate need arises.
• The SAO deities in the Pantheon, especially Kirito and Asuna, are divided on him. They fault him for trapping them in the game, but most of their negative sentiments regarding him have more or less subsided. Asuna attributes that to the fact that the years she spent in SAO with Kirito were the best years of her life. They maintain that Kayaba's actions were still immoral and that his probation was well-deserved. Helping the players clear the game may have been to him a good deed, but that wouldn't need to happen if he hadn't started the incident in the first place. Lack of Empathy indeed.
  • Not to mention that he brought the VRMMO genre into the mainstream, attracting its own new wave of criminals and unsavoury individuals that would antagonize Kirito and company in the wake of the SAO incident. Laughing Coffin, the most infamous PK^* Player Killing guild in SAO reveled in countless killing sprees knowing full well that Kayaba would be blamed for it all. They also turned out many cyber-criminals using VR games as their modus operandi, including Death Gun (L.C. members XaXa and Johnny Black as well as XaXa's brother Kyouji) and leader PoH (Vassago Casals). Both would meet grisly fates at Kirito's hands, though Death Gun less so.
  • Naturally, that means he is the target for the many complaints regarding Sword Art Online's more trivial logistical problems. There've been a few fellows who've had quite a bit to say about Kayaba's ability in designing Sword Art Online (the game). And that's without taking into account that he turned it into a Deadly Game.

• The other good-aligned SAO deities never experienced the horrors of his death game but had to deal with its resultant fallout, so they aren't exactly thanking him for that. LLENN stands out as her friend Pitohui entered severe depression over not logging in to SAO on the day the players were trapped in the game and missing out on the fun.

• Kayaba has had a hand in the origins of nearly every person that has menaced Kirito and his friends due to creating the means of their crimes in the first place, and he has made it a personal goal of his to make them see the light of virtual reality and that it was created with the good of the populace in mind, not for evil purposes such as mind control and warfare.
  • Nobuyuki Sugou has long been Kayaba's bitter rival since their university days, and was extremely critical of his detached nature. He also courted his girlfriend a few times to disturbing effect. Kayaba is incredulous at how Sugou has failed to learn from his past mistakes and continued to use mind-control technology for his own ends. And for a terrorist organization no less! Kayaba has nursed thoughts of talking to him but has shelved the idea after seeing the many atrocities he has committed in the name of SHOCKER alongside other depraved individuals. He had quite a few words to say about this:
  Kayaba: Sugou always believed that I was being too close-minded with my vision. He kept telling me FullDive technology had far more potential than I thought it had. While I shrugged it off because I was too focused on my dream, perhaps he was right. If only I knew then that I was talking to a Complete Monster with no regard for the sanctity of free will. And now that monster is working for people worse than I can imagine...
  • He never got to meet her personally in his homeworld, but with the knowledge that Quinella was spawned from the whims of a JSDF agent, he isn't at all surprised at how twisted she turned out. Nevertheless, he created the floating castle of Aincrad (aside from the fact that it was a death game) as a world for players to roam freely and enjoy themselves, hence he views Quinella's tightly-controlled world built to worship her and her alone as the utter perversion of what a virtual world ought to be. Quinella would thank Kayaba for being the inspiration for her creation and that of her fellow bottom-up AIs, just as long he swears fealty to her as a new Integrity Knight. Needless to say, that's not happening.
• This hardened Kayaba's resolve to return to his roots and further his study of the virtual world. His temple is a giant gaming laboratory of sorts, though his real place of residence in the Pantheon is in a more remote location far from the vicinity. When not working on what he does best, he can be seen contemplating and reflecting with his girlfriend, herald, and unintentional partner-in-crime Rinko, who attends to his every need. She admits that her partner is detached somewhat, but does have a soul. They never go to the House of Love for dates or anything, nor engage in public displays of affection. Most of their devotion to each other is expressed in their mutual passion in furthering the growth of the VRMMO genre and for them, that's enough.
• Due to his flawed sense of morality, he has no qualms about rubbing shoulders with more morally dubious deities. One is Two-Face, whose more evil side served as his assigned lawyer during the court case. Once programmed a trip down memory lane for Harvey in a personalized Soul Translator, in hopes that seeing the many bad choices he made and all the alternative paths he could have chosen could bring him a peace of mind and re-unify his split halves. Kayaba was very hopeful that this would allow Harvey to attempt living on his own terms again instead of by pure chance. Surprisingly, the experience proved therapeutic for him, and when asked whether it helped, Harvey said 'I'll think about it'.
• Whether grudging or sincerely, every member of the House of Technology and Gaming looks up to him for his tireless efforts to improve VR technology and devices

• Unsurprisingly, he's fought against knightly beings in the likes of King Arthur, Arturia Pendragon, Link, Alm, Celica, Lucina, Ike and many more. His greatest challenge comes from Artix von Krieger whose chivalry and reputation reminds Archaon a lot about Sigmar. He reciprocates by calling Artix a Worthy Opponent above all else. While he is understandably opposed by most Keyblade Wielders, Archaon respects Sora, Aqua and Roxas, stating that they are able to give him a difficult time, yet also remind him of the good old days at the same time. And due to his ability to oversee prophecies and the future, he sees Shulk as a noteworthy foe. That said, he is more than ready to kill any of them if need be.

Edited by SuperWIKI1 on Oct 9th 2019 at 12:50:09 AM

To avoid having to remove any Assassin's Creed Gods, couldn’t we just group some of them together under Assassins with Ezio? I think I remember some asking for any ideas for grouping about a week or two. It would give us a chance to ascend other gods, and we wouldn’t have to find other titles to ascend any assassins. And we could just edit a new character, assuming they’re actually a member of the creed.

I’m behind on the franchise so I don’t know much of the new characters.

Edited by AzureLegacy on Oct 8th 2019 at 12:57:04 PM

So, regarding Shining Goodness, can someone (since I allegedly shouldn't) work on the Shining Force for it, or is it better in the hooves of Shining Armor, leaving Names to Trust Immediately free for someone else? I think Names to Trust Immediately has plenty of potential alternatives if ascending the Shining Force is a bad idea.

I'll start up a profile just in case.

Excessive-Menace is against reworking Shining Armor, but what do the rest of you think?

I was initially up in arms about the constant group reworks though I guess I’m okay if it doesn’t mean they’ll be deleted

This is my take on the matter: Grouping sometimes proves detrimental to a character's profile as it means diluting their Pantheon characterization by grouping them together. Things like grouping the Persona deities actually made the combined profile look better without squandering individual detail. It remains to be seen whether a similarly good level of detail will be maintained with an A.C. grouping.

Good grouping: Reiner, Bertolt and Annie (Warrior Titans)

Bad grouping: Eren, Mikasa and Sasha (Survey Corps)

Edited by SuperWIKI1 on Oct 9th 2019 at 1:03:30 AM

No the assassins shouldn't be grouped and leave at that. It was just one user lashing out while most of us are simply neutral on the subject. There isn't really an overflow of AC profiles so need to crack down on them. Once they reach the hundred mark like Pokemon do franchises do become a problem

It was mostly just an idea. If it works, ok. If it doesn’t, then it doesn’t.

Thanks for talking about it though.

Edited by AzureLegacy on Oct 8th 2019 at 1:05:53 PM

I feel like I may have misworded my intentions. My point is that maybe it would be nice to tone down on the Assassin's Creed suggestions since you just ascended another pair from the same franchise. Maybe focus on another if anything, new one.

@Kayaba - You have a section of the profile containing a paragraph that's from Archaon. HOW DARE YOU PLAGIARIZE ME!!!

Anyway, now that I've seen it, Kayaba is not going to have a good relationship with Archaon, what with his Destroy the World Mindset, though Kayaba might see him as a Worthy Opponent on his end. About my copied paragraph, I'm guessing you're having it as something to reword in your own accord, which I'm cool with.

Also, probably he could be met with some disdain from Elliot, after finding out his ambitions did kill a lot of people.

Edited by CrimsonShark on Oct 8th 2019 at 6:10:07 PM

• (Grudgingly) Respected by: Every single gaming character and gamer in the Pantheon, possibly Phineas and Ferb

Now I may have an issue with this but isn't this shilling? Not every gaming character and gamer character would recognize his authority. I mean, he isn't too important anyway after the events of the Aincrad debacle.

To add a little to the previous topic, I'd much rather avoid any kind of conflict based on whether or not we have "too many" characters from singular franchises, as that's VERY subjective and would more likely than not just turn the forum into a warzone which would ruin the fun for everybody.

Popular franchises are pretty much guaranteed to have a large number of characters in the pantheon, as they tend to stick out more. That's not me arguing that they should be included for that reason, it's just a basic fact as demonstrated by the large number of ascenscions from Pokémon, Kamen Rider, Street Fighter, Final Fantasy, etc.

If a trope fits and the forum approves, I don't see any reason to not include them. If a character doen't fit their trope, then explain why, if a better candidate exists, present them. Otherwise, we just end up with needless purges which could potentially result in more work later down the line, like how I saved the character profiles from Queen's Blade and am currently planning to rework them.

for Francoeur and Pi and Richard Parker. Wouldn't Snoopy from Snoopy, Come Home be a better candidate, since he's the Trope Namer?

Edited by TheWikiaEditor on Oct 8th 2019 at 9:10:25 PM

All this arguing just makes me want to get three ideas off my chest:

• Francoeur from A Monster in Paris for Cute Monster: Francoeur is a flea that turned seven feet tall due to a freak lab accident. However, he has a friendly and harmless personality and anthropomorphized features, plus he can't talk but can sing. All this makes him a very adorable flea monster.
• Shadow, Chance and Sassy from Homeward Bound: The Incredible Journey for Tropey, Come Home: The three are a family's pets that are left in a farm when the family moves to the city. They escape the farm and travel miles across mountains and forests to get back to their owners.
• Pi and Richard Parker from Life of Pi for Lost at Sea: A boy and tiger duo who get shipwrecked in the Pacific Ocean. The story details how they survive for more than two hundred days in a little lifeboat until they reach the American coast.

Wouldn't Lassie be a better choice for Tropey, Come Home?

Edited by Donnietu on Oct 8th 2019 at 12:13:51 PM

I really agree but don't have anything else to add, so take a

for Francoeur

She could potentially take Timmy in a Well, or This Index Barks if it comes to that (I think she's an important enough character to justify taking it).

Note that I couldn't work on Lassie.

@Wikia: Snoopy is already up and he's not the Trope Namer. Not to mention he only did that like, once in a long career of doing a variety of things.

Edited by wootzits on Oct 8th 2019 at 8:27:10 PM

@wootzits: Go ahead with your three ideas.

Edited by r-lock256 on Oct 8th 2019 at 12:28:34 PM

Update on the Wolf Man so far.

Lawrence Stewart Talbot, Cursed God of Wolf Men (Larry, The Wolf Man, Mr. Talbot)

• Adopted from: Whirl RX
• Demigod. Lesser as the wolf man.
• Symbol: A cane with a silver wolf head with a pentagram
• Theme Song: This
• Alignment: True Neutral. Chaotic Evil as the wolf man.
• Portfolio: Doomed Protagonist, Stalker with a Crush, Tragic Monster, The Charmer
• Domains: Curses, Beasts, Tragedy, Werewolves
• Allies: Bruce Banner, Jon Talbain, Greymane, Remus Lupin
• Enemies: Count Dracula, Frankenstein's Monster, Godzilla (?), Fenrir Greyback
• Larry Talbot was a practical man returning to his homeland at Llyanwelly to reconcile with his father. Everything seemed to be going well, until he got bitten in the chest by a wolf. As it turned out, that was the local werewolf, and now Larry carried that curse. Since then, he has been struggling with the beast within as he looks to lift the curse.
• Reports of a werewolf attack have spread in a local village in the Pantheon with some people initially assuming that the attacker is an animal. This led the Pantheonic Police to investigate. Upon looking at the attacker’s footprints, it is revealed that he is the Wolf Man, who was spotted and captured by the cops who were armed with shotguns that shoot silver bullets. Once the Wolf Man reverted to his human form, they were debates on what to do with him. However, they come to the conclusion that as one of the most recognizable werewolves in fiction, he was chosen to represent Wolf Man.
• Unfortunately for Larry, he is still suffering from lycanthropy and will transform into the beast. Luckily, well, as lucky as he can get, the transformation is very infrequent and far apart. He can also take solace that even if he does transform, there are plenty of people who could take care of him. As in life, he is trying to find a cure for him infliction.
• As far as his interactions with other werewolves go, he seems to get along with Remus John Lupin, whom he sympathizes with for how much he’s had to rein in his instincts and causes his wolf form to be hairless and emaciated. Sometimes, Lupin supplies Larry with Wolfsbane potion to help him out. He is also on good terms with both John Talbain and Greymane. However, he doesn’t like Fenrir Greyback for turning Lupin into a werewolf and seeking to convert as many as he can.
• Has made friends with Dr. Bruce Banner after learning of the Hulk and how their situation are very similar. While he has heard of Hulk's rampage, he also learned that it's heroic and more sympathetic. Larry bemoans that there is no way that his wolf self can ever be considered a hero.
• There has been rumors going around that the wolf man fought against Godzilla in a situation very similar to Frankenstein's Monster and Baragon. However, few believe in these rumors and that if Godzilla really fought the wolf man, it might have been just a radiated wolf.

I think Imhotep can be added as an enemy.

@wootzits I found that Snoopy is already in the pantheon and I agree with your suggestion for Lassie, so for Shadow, Chance and Sassy.