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To-do list:

  • Sweater Girl was renamed to Sexy Sweater Girl due to misuse for any girl wearing a sweater. Both off-site and on here, it's defined as bombshells wearing body-hugging sweaters to accentuate their bustlines, with other sites adding that they typically wear bullet bras underneath the sweater to make their boobs appear bustier.
    • Clean up on-page examples.
    • Clean up wicks.

    Original post 
Sweater Girl lately suffers from excessive misuse and ZCEs for people who don't recognize the pre-existing term and stereotype used off-site, mistaking it for any girl who wears a sweater or girls who always wear sweaters a.k.a Limited Wardrobe.

Let's review the history of the trope briefly. A TRS thread was made in 2013, where it concluded with redefining Sweater Girl to focus on the intention of characterizing the attractiveness/sexuality of the character in a reserved or wholesome manner to match it with its definition outside the site. Both off-site and on here, it's defined as bombshells wearing body-hugging sweaters to accentuate their bustlines, with other sites adding that they typically wear bullet bras underneath the sweater to make their boobs appear bustier. However, the previous thread was just an attempt to make the trope match the usage of the term off-site, but it didn't fix/clean up the ZCEs and misuse, and here we are.

The issue was raised here, as well, although it was left unanswered. So, I took matters into my own hands and made the wick check which confirmed that our concerns are true.

The quick results are as follows:

  • 10/55 or 18% are correct examples.
  • 24/55 or 44% are misuse for women who just wear sweaters without fanservice.
  • 21/55 or 38% are ZCEs, other forms of misuse, and unsortable examples.

Long analysis: Less than a quarter of the wicks are correct and follow the off-site use of this trope. Meanwhile, the rest of the wicks, the majority, are misuse for any time a woman wears a sweater, regardless of her bust or fanservice or other forms of misuse. And being an appearance trope with a non-indicative name, it indeed attracts ZCEs, which make 38% of the overall wicks. This trope might have more correct examples, so getting rid of it wouldn't be a good idea.

[Points the microphone in the audience's direction] What do y'all think should be done?

Wick check:

I suspect that Sweater Girl suffers from misuse and might be a ZCE magnet due to its broad non-indicative name. The trope is about women wearing tight, non-tacky sweaters for fanservice. Standard appearance trope check, y'know?

Wicks checked: 55/55.

  • Quick results:
    • 10/55 or 18% are correct examples.
    • 24/55 or 44% are misuse for women who just wear sweaters without fanservice.
    • 21/55 or 38% are ZCEs, other forms of misuse, and unsortable examples.

  • Long analysis: Less than a quarter of the wicks are correct and follow the off-site use of this trope, while the rest of the wicks, the majority, are misuse for any time a woman wears a sweater regardless of her bust or fanservice or other forms of misuse and being an appearance trope with a non-indicative name it indeed attracts ZCEs, which make 38% of the overall wicks. This trope might have more correct examples, so getting rid of it wouldn't be a good idea.

  • Solutions:

    open/close all folders 
    Correct - woman wears a tight sweater for fanservice (10/55) 
  1. Bust-Contrast Duo: Sweater Girl and Sexy Secretary Joan Holloway (Busty) and the more Hollywood Homely and Plucky Office Girl Peggy Olson (more average in bustline) start off like this in Mad Men with Peggy starting off as very naive and shy while Joan is seductive and the Alpha Bitch looking forward to quitting her job before marriage. They both undergo Character Development where Peggy becomes savvier, more confident, and stronger while Joan really leans into her natural strength and demands to have her intellect and experience be taken seriously. — Joan is busty so it counts
  2. Fanservice Costumes: A busty woman wears a tight-fitting sweater.
  3. Navel-Deep Neckline: Humorama: Many of the women in the gag cartoons showed off lots of cleavage. When not wearing Stripperiffic outfits, many wore low cut tops and tight-fitting sweaters. Likely for fanservice
  4. Characters.Archie Comics: (Veronica), Veronica's clothing trademark is wearing tight fitted sweaters of any color. She's Ms. Fanservice after all
  5. Characters.Doki Doki Literature Club: (Yuri), Yuri wears a beige sweater when meeting with the protagonist outside of school to work on the festival decorations. However, it probably isn't just subtle fanservice. Notice that it has long sleeves... — Played With example?
  6. Series.Charmed 1998: The girls of like wearing sweaters. In one episode, Phoebe wore a white sweater with fur-trimmed sleeves.
  7. Fate/Grand Order - Sabers G to M: (Ibuki-Douji), She wears a light pink sweater in one of her Ascensions which really serves to accentuate her large bust. When asked, she says she wanted to get acquainted with clothes from the modern age, and seems to be really attached to that sweater in particular. When reaching her third ascension, she's almost annoyed at having to take it off in favor of her divine garments.
  8. Characters.My Hero Academia Main Characters Families: (Fuyumi), Has worn form-fitting turtleneck sweaters several times, which due to how buxom she is and the stripes on her sweater greatly emphasize her very large boobs. The author has further emphasized this by having some of this art (including a Twitter sketch and a coloured volume back cover) involve her lying on her back or raising her hands in the air to push her chest forward even more on display.
  9. Film.Bande A Part: Odile is given to tight sweaters. In the scene where they're dancing in the cafe, Godard in his narration says Odile is wondering if the boys are noticing her breasts moving underneath her sweater.
  10. Film.Pleasantville: Jennifer is taken aback when she puts on the typical sweater and bullet bra.
    Jennifer: I could, like, kill a guy with these things.

    Misuse - A female character just wearing a sweater in general, no fanservice + contextless potholes (24/55) 
  1. Contractual Purity: "Centerfold" by the J. Geils Band. The speaker fondly remembers a young blue-eyed, sweater-clad girl from school that he had a crush on way back when, and sees her again as an adult later...in a porn magazine. He is initially shocked as it clashed with her squeaky-clean image, but eventually, he not only accepts it but embraces it.
  2. Peek A Bangs: Star Spangled Rhythm ridiculed Veronica Lake's hairstyle in song, along with Paulette Goddard's sweater and Dorothy Lamour's sarong. The musical number's punchline was a "peek-a-boo bang" on the face of Adolf Hitler, who is blamed for dictating the fashion.
  3. Sexily Modest: When Bitch-Sensei in Assassination Classroom undergoes a Good Costume Switch, swapping out of short-skirt and cleavage-baring top for a modest sweater and Proper Tights with a Skirt. The male students actually find her far more attractive afterwards for doing so. — A fanservice-y character but wearing a sweater wasn't for fanservice purpose but the opposite
  4. Anime.Shenmue: Nozomi, with the Asian cultural differences applying to her.
  5. Blog.Adventures In Lurning: Sketchbook is this and it is adorable.
  6. BojackHorseman.Tropes P To S: Joseph Sugarman's secretary is said to be this in the 1940s flashbacks.
  7. Characters.Birds Of Prey 2002: (Batgirl), About half of Barbara's wardrobe are cardigans.
  8. Characters.Buffyverse Willow Rosenberg: Season 3 Willow.
  9. Characters.Despicable Me The Gru Family: (Edith), Wears a pink sweater in her normal attire. — She's a child at that
  10. Characters.Gravity Falls Mabel Pines: Under Large Ham: You take a Cloudcuckoolander, feed her a bag of sugar, give her a massive collection of home-made sweaters and a Cute, but Cacophonic voice that seldom goes below 75 decibels, and you've got Mabel Pines. Sometimes she can be really over the top.
  11. Characters.Invader Zim A Very Tall Problem: (Mooshi, Ina, Zii, and Aka), Mooshi's outfit is a simple pink sweater.
  12. Characters.No 6: (Safu), She often wears sweaters that her grandmother knitted for her.
  13. Characters.Kaguya Sama Love Is War: (Rei), Onodera's most prominent physical characteristic is the buttondown sweater she wears during the colder months.
  14. Characters.Sailor Moon Ami Mizuno: Crystal adds a gray sweater to her school uniform.
  15. Characters.The Loud House Adults: (Agnes), She wears a turtleneck.
  16. Fanfic.A Snowflake In Spring: Of the non-form-fitting variety. Elsa's trademark article of clothing is her oversize blue sweater, the sleeves of which are long enough to cover her hands. She considers their thickness and weight a "shield" against the outside world. — Shoehorn
  17. Fanfic.Pretty Cure Heavy Metal: Under Ascended Extra: Kaori Furuya has a more major role in a few episodes of World Tour in Japan-centric scenes, and she's shown practicing with the Oriyama Ballet Company. Especially in recent times, she feels comfortable spending company time wearing a loose-fitting sweater that exposes her shoulders and tight-fitting slacks. — An excerpt of a long example
  18. Film.Anchors Aweigh: Susan wears a purple fuzzy sweater in a few scenes.
  19. Film.Mr Arkadin: Milly is really stress-testing a sweater in the scene where she confronts Arkadin about his Nazi-friendly past.
  20. Film.The World Of Suzie Wong: Gwennie Lee wears cardigans and hand-hiding sleeves to emphasise her cuteness. — Misuse + Cute Oversized Sleeves
  21. Franchise.Barbie: A number of her outfits over the years. The early 80s set "Fashion Jeans" included a pink, fuzzy sweater, even though a doll with that name could have included any kind of top.
  22. Literature.Alice Series: Under Good Bad Girl: Jill, who's mentioned to be sleeping around with Justin, Elizabeth's former crush.
  23. Literature.Then Again Maybe I Wont: Tony buys Lisa a sweater for Christmas and uses his binoculars to watch her try it on.
  24. Recap.Law And Order Special Victims Unit S 6 E 16 Ghost: Alex is mostly wearing cardigans in the episode.

    ZCE/other misuse/uncertain (21/55) 
  1. Happy Holidays Dress: Compare Sweater Girl, Homemade Sweater from Hell, Costume Porn, Stylish Protection Gear, An Ice Suit.
  2. Meaningful Appearance: She may be attractive, but she likely won't flaunt it.
  3. Sexily Modest: In period pieces this can be a subversion of the Old-Timey Ankle Taboo — or in fact overlap with it; may also overlap with Form-Fitting Wardrobe, Proper Tights with a Skirt and Sweater Girl.
  4. The '70s: Came back from The '50s with a vengeance.
  5. AdaptationalAttractiveness.Web Original: The animated webcast adaptation of the unfinished Doctor Who story "Shada" did this with two different characters:
    • The graduate student Clare was, in the TV story, dressed in frumpy 1970s office-style clothes. In the animation, she is redesigned as a late-1970s punkette, in a tight fluffy sweater, mildly Goth make-up, and a studded leather dog collar. — Not sure if this is meant for fanservice or not
  6. Characters.Archie Comics: (Betty), Like Veronica, she can be seen wearing form fitting sweaters. I think it's for fanservice, but she's not as fanservice-y as Veronica, so idk
  7. Hannibal – Supporting Characters: (Abigail), Downplayed, but almost always wears sweaters whenever we see her. — Limited Wardrobe
  8. Characters.Spider Man Trilogy Main Characters: (MJ Watson), She wears sweaters a few times. — A correct example but as written lacks context
  9. Characters.Stranger Things Main Cast: (Nancy), While she isn't as busty (by quite a long way; her bras are too big for her) as most examples of the trope, she is a Dude Magnet who is seen wearing sweaters or sweater like tops which fits in with her Midwestern environment while still showing off her figure. — Don't know if it's a shoehorn or a downplayed example
  10. Characters.The Quintessential Quintuplets: (Miku), Unlike Ichika, who wears hers around her waist, she's always seen in her baby blue button up sweater as part of her uniform, even wearing it under her blazer. — Limited Wardrobe
  11. Characters.Trixie Belden: (Beatrix), No context given
  12. Characters.Vegas 2012: (Yvonne, in The Sheriff's Department's folder), No context given
  13. Characters.World Of Horror: (Moriko, Main characters' folder), The sweater she wears by default not only suits her well, but plays a critical role in unlocking her, as somebody who's seen the news report about her can recognize the 'Bloody Sweater' as belonging to her. — Plot-relevant clothes, def not this trope
  14. Creator.Lana Turner: She was also well-known in her heyday as the Sweater Girl of the screen. I know she's an example but this doesn't explain how the trope applies to her and not everyone knows her
  15. DarthWiki.Miley Small: A rare male example with Mike. — This is an Always Female trope
  16. Film.Definitely Maybe: Emily constantly wears sweaters. — Limited Wardrobe
  17. Film.Glen Or Glenda: Including loaning the sweater.
  18. Film.Wild River: Carol and Betty both have their moments.
  19. Radio.The Goon Show: Referenced in The Mighty Wurlitzer, where Moriarty swears "By the great sweaters of Sabrina!"
  20. Recap.Daredevil 2015 S 2 E 10 The Man In The Box: Under White Shirt of Death: After killing Jacques, Elektra is a white Sweater Girl of Death. — The trope used in name only
  21. Series.Hart Of Dixie: Most of Lemon's clothes are this. — Limited Wardrobe

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jul 12th 2023 at 3:42:16 AM

selkies Professional Wick Checker Since: Jan, 2021 Relationship Status: Star-crossed
Professional Wick Checker
#1: Jul 2nd 2023 at 1:08:59 PM

To-do list:

  • Sweater Girl was renamed to Sexy Sweater Girl due to misuse for any girl wearing a sweater. Both off-site and on here, it's defined as bombshells wearing body-hugging sweaters to accentuate their bustlines, with other sites adding that they typically wear bullet bras underneath the sweater to make their boobs appear bustier.
    • Clean up on-page examples.
    • Clean up wicks.

    Original post 
Sweater Girl lately suffers from excessive misuse and ZCEs for people who don't recognize the pre-existing term and stereotype used off-site, mistaking it for any girl who wears a sweater or girls who always wear sweaters a.k.a Limited Wardrobe.

Let's review the history of the trope briefly. A TRS thread was made in 2013, where it concluded with redefining Sweater Girl to focus on the intention of characterizing the attractiveness/sexuality of the character in a reserved or wholesome manner to match it with its definition outside the site. Both off-site and on here, it's defined as bombshells wearing body-hugging sweaters to accentuate their bustlines, with other sites adding that they typically wear bullet bras underneath the sweater to make their boobs appear bustier. However, the previous thread was just an attempt to make the trope match the usage of the term off-site, but it didn't fix/clean up the ZCEs and misuse, and here we are.

The issue was raised here, as well, although it was left unanswered. So, I took matters into my own hands and made the wick check which confirmed that our concerns are true.

The quick results are as follows:

  • 10/55 or 18% are correct examples.
  • 24/55 or 44% are misuse for women who just wear sweaters without fanservice.
  • 21/55 or 38% are ZCEs, other forms of misuse, and unsortable examples.

Long analysis: Less than a quarter of the wicks are correct and follow the off-site use of this trope. Meanwhile, the rest of the wicks, the majority, are misuse for any time a woman wears a sweater, regardless of her bust or fanservice or other forms of misuse. And being an appearance trope with a non-indicative name, it indeed attracts ZCEs, which make 38% of the overall wicks. This trope might have more correct examples, so getting rid of it wouldn't be a good idea.

[Points the microphone in the audience's direction] What do y'all think should be done?

Wick check:

I suspect that Sweater Girl suffers from misuse and might be a ZCE magnet due to its broad non-indicative name. The trope is about women wearing tight, non-tacky sweaters for fanservice. Standard appearance trope check, y'know?

Wicks checked: 55/55.

  • Quick results:
    • 10/55 or 18% are correct examples.
    • 24/55 or 44% are misuse for women who just wear sweaters without fanservice.
    • 21/55 or 38% are ZCEs, other forms of misuse, and unsortable examples.

  • Long analysis: Less than a quarter of the wicks are correct and follow the off-site use of this trope, while the rest of the wicks, the majority, are misuse for any time a woman wears a sweater regardless of her bust or fanservice or other forms of misuse and being an appearance trope with a non-indicative name it indeed attracts ZCEs, which make 38% of the overall wicks. This trope might have more correct examples, so getting rid of it wouldn't be a good idea.

  • Solutions:

    open/close all folders 
    Correct - woman wears a tight sweater for fanservice (10/55) 
  1. Bust-Contrast Duo: Sweater Girl and Sexy Secretary Joan Holloway (Busty) and the more Hollywood Homely and Plucky Office Girl Peggy Olson (more average in bustline) start off like this in Mad Men with Peggy starting off as very naive and shy while Joan is seductive and the Alpha Bitch looking forward to quitting her job before marriage. They both undergo Character Development where Peggy becomes savvier, more confident, and stronger while Joan really leans into her natural strength and demands to have her intellect and experience be taken seriously. — Joan is busty so it counts
  2. Fanservice Costumes: A busty woman wears a tight-fitting sweater.
  3. Navel-Deep Neckline: Humorama: Many of the women in the gag cartoons showed off lots of cleavage. When not wearing Stripperiffic outfits, many wore low cut tops and tight-fitting sweaters. Likely for fanservice
  4. Characters.Archie Comics: (Veronica), Veronica's clothing trademark is wearing tight fitted sweaters of any color. She's Ms. Fanservice after all
  5. Characters.Doki Doki Literature Club: (Yuri), Yuri wears a beige sweater when meeting with the protagonist outside of school to work on the festival decorations. However, it probably isn't just subtle fanservice. Notice that it has long sleeves... — Played With example?
  6. Series.Charmed 1998: The girls of like wearing sweaters. In one episode, Phoebe wore a white sweater with fur-trimmed sleeves.
  7. Fate/Grand Order - Sabers G to M: (Ibuki-Douji), She wears a light pink sweater in one of her Ascensions which really serves to accentuate her large bust. When asked, she says she wanted to get acquainted with clothes from the modern age, and seems to be really attached to that sweater in particular. When reaching her third ascension, she's almost annoyed at having to take it off in favor of her divine garments.
  8. Characters.My Hero Academia Main Characters Families: (Fuyumi), Has worn form-fitting turtleneck sweaters several times, which due to how buxom she is and the stripes on her sweater greatly emphasize her very large boobs. The author has further emphasized this by having some of this art (including a Twitter sketch and a coloured volume back cover) involve her lying on her back or raising her hands in the air to push her chest forward even more on display.
  9. Film.Bande A Part: Odile is given to tight sweaters. In the scene where they're dancing in the cafe, Godard in his narration says Odile is wondering if the boys are noticing her breasts moving underneath her sweater.
  10. Film.Pleasantville: Jennifer is taken aback when she puts on the typical sweater and bullet bra.
    Jennifer: I could, like, kill a guy with these things.

    Misuse - A female character just wearing a sweater in general, no fanservice + contextless potholes (24/55) 
  1. Contractual Purity: "Centerfold" by the J. Geils Band. The speaker fondly remembers a young blue-eyed, sweater-clad girl from school that he had a crush on way back when, and sees her again as an adult later...in a porn magazine. He is initially shocked as it clashed with her squeaky-clean image, but eventually, he not only accepts it but embraces it.
  2. Peek A Bangs: Star Spangled Rhythm ridiculed Veronica Lake's hairstyle in song, along with Paulette Goddard's sweater and Dorothy Lamour's sarong. The musical number's punchline was a "peek-a-boo bang" on the face of Adolf Hitler, who is blamed for dictating the fashion.
  3. Sexily Modest: When Bitch-Sensei in Assassination Classroom undergoes a Good Costume Switch, swapping out of short-skirt and cleavage-baring top for a modest sweater and Proper Tights with a Skirt. The male students actually find her far more attractive afterwards for doing so. — A fanservice-y character but wearing a sweater wasn't for fanservice purpose but the opposite
  4. Anime.Shenmue: Nozomi, with the Asian cultural differences applying to her.
  5. Blog.Adventures In Lurning: Sketchbook is this and it is adorable.
  6. BojackHorseman.Tropes P To S: Joseph Sugarman's secretary is said to be this in the 1940s flashbacks.
  7. Characters.Birds Of Prey 2002: (Batgirl), About half of Barbara's wardrobe are cardigans.
  8. Characters.Buffyverse Willow Rosenberg: Season 3 Willow.
  9. Characters.Despicable Me The Gru Family: (Edith), Wears a pink sweater in her normal attire. — She's a child at that
  10. Characters.Gravity Falls Mabel Pines: Under Large Ham: You take a Cloudcuckoolander, feed her a bag of sugar, give her a massive collection of home-made sweaters and a Cute, but Cacophonic voice that seldom goes below 75 decibels, and you've got Mabel Pines. Sometimes she can be really over the top.
  11. Characters.Invader Zim A Very Tall Problem: (Mooshi, Ina, Zii, and Aka), Mooshi's outfit is a simple pink sweater.
  12. Characters.No 6: (Safu), She often wears sweaters that her grandmother knitted for her.
  13. Characters.Kaguya Sama Love Is War: (Rei), Onodera's most prominent physical characteristic is the buttondown sweater she wears during the colder months.
  14. Characters.Sailor Moon Ami Mizuno: Crystal adds a gray sweater to her school uniform.
  15. Characters.The Loud House Adults: (Agnes), She wears a turtleneck.
  16. Fanfic.A Snowflake In Spring: Of the non-form-fitting variety. Elsa's trademark article of clothing is her oversize blue sweater, the sleeves of which are long enough to cover her hands. She considers their thickness and weight a "shield" against the outside world. — Shoehorn
  17. Fanfic.Pretty Cure Heavy Metal: Under Ascended Extra: Kaori Furuya has a more major role in a few episodes of World Tour in Japan-centric scenes, and she's shown practicing with the Oriyama Ballet Company. Especially in recent times, she feels comfortable spending company time wearing a loose-fitting sweater that exposes her shoulders and tight-fitting slacks. — An excerpt of a long example
  18. Film.Anchors Aweigh: Susan wears a purple fuzzy sweater in a few scenes.
  19. Film.Mr Arkadin: Milly is really stress-testing a sweater in the scene where she confronts Arkadin about his Nazi-friendly past.
  20. Film.The World Of Suzie Wong: Gwennie Lee wears cardigans and hand-hiding sleeves to emphasise her cuteness. — Misuse + Cute Oversized Sleeves
  21. Franchise.Barbie: A number of her outfits over the years. The early 80s set "Fashion Jeans" included a pink, fuzzy sweater, even though a doll with that name could have included any kind of top.
  22. Literature.Alice Series: Under Good Bad Girl: Jill, who's mentioned to be sleeping around with Justin, Elizabeth's former crush.
  23. Literature.Then Again Maybe I Wont: Tony buys Lisa a sweater for Christmas and uses his binoculars to watch her try it on.
  24. Recap.Law And Order Special Victims Unit S 6 E 16 Ghost: Alex is mostly wearing cardigans in the episode.

    ZCE/other misuse/uncertain (21/55) 
  1. Happy Holidays Dress: Compare Sweater Girl, Homemade Sweater from Hell, Costume Porn, Stylish Protection Gear, An Ice Suit.
  2. Meaningful Appearance: She may be attractive, but she likely won't flaunt it.
  3. Sexily Modest: In period pieces this can be a subversion of the Old-Timey Ankle Taboo — or in fact overlap with it; may also overlap with Form-Fitting Wardrobe, Proper Tights with a Skirt and Sweater Girl.
  4. The '70s: Came back from The '50s with a vengeance.
  5. AdaptationalAttractiveness.Web Original: The animated webcast adaptation of the unfinished Doctor Who story "Shada" did this with two different characters:
    • The graduate student Clare was, in the TV story, dressed in frumpy 1970s office-style clothes. In the animation, she is redesigned as a late-1970s punkette, in a tight fluffy sweater, mildly Goth make-up, and a studded leather dog collar. — Not sure if this is meant for fanservice or not
  6. Characters.Archie Comics: (Betty), Like Veronica, she can be seen wearing form fitting sweaters. I think it's for fanservice, but she's not as fanservice-y as Veronica, so idk
  7. Hannibal – Supporting Characters: (Abigail), Downplayed, but almost always wears sweaters whenever we see her. — Limited Wardrobe
  8. Characters.Spider Man Trilogy Main Characters: (MJ Watson), She wears sweaters a few times. — A correct example but as written lacks context
  9. Characters.Stranger Things Main Cast: (Nancy), While she isn't as busty (by quite a long way; her bras are too big for her) as most examples of the trope, she is a Dude Magnet who is seen wearing sweaters or sweater like tops which fits in with her Midwestern environment while still showing off her figure. — Don't know if it's a shoehorn or a downplayed example
  10. Characters.The Quintessential Quintuplets: (Miku), Unlike Ichika, who wears hers around her waist, she's always seen in her baby blue button up sweater as part of her uniform, even wearing it under her blazer. — Limited Wardrobe
  11. Characters.Trixie Belden: (Beatrix), No context given
  12. Characters.Vegas 2012: (Yvonne, in The Sheriff's Department's folder), No context given
  13. Characters.World Of Horror: (Moriko, Main characters' folder), The sweater she wears by default not only suits her well, but plays a critical role in unlocking her, as somebody who's seen the news report about her can recognize the 'Bloody Sweater' as belonging to her. — Plot-relevant clothes, def not this trope
  14. Creator.Lana Turner: She was also well-known in her heyday as the Sweater Girl of the screen. I know she's an example but this doesn't explain how the trope applies to her and not everyone knows her
  15. DarthWiki.Miley Small: A rare male example with Mike. — This is an Always Female trope
  16. Film.Definitely Maybe: Emily constantly wears sweaters. — Limited Wardrobe
  17. Film.Glen Or Glenda: Including loaning the sweater.
  18. Film.Wild River: Carol and Betty both have their moments.
  19. Radio.The Goon Show: Referenced in The Mighty Wurlitzer, where Moriarty swears "By the great sweaters of Sabrina!"
  20. Recap.Daredevil 2015 S 2 E 10 The Man In The Box: Under White Shirt of Death: After killing Jacques, Elektra is a white Sweater Girl of Death. — The trope used in name only
  21. Series.Hart Of Dixie: Most of Lemon's clothes are this. — Limited Wardrobe

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jul 12th 2023 at 3:42:16 AM

MacronNotes (she/her) (Captain) Relationship Status: Less than three
themayorofsimpleton Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him from Elsewhere (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Abstaining
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
#3: Jul 2nd 2023 at 1:18:14 PM

I like Option 2. It's a good compromise between "rename" and "D-O".

TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#4: Jul 2nd 2023 at 1:24:47 PM

Rename. I don't think the DO page is necessary since the definitions (tight sweaters emphasizing boobs for fanservice) are the same; the new page can just include "the trope's name derives from the term 'sweater girl' something something 1950s" in the description. The benefit of a rename will be the assurance that we go through the wicks.

selkies Professional Wick Checker Since: Jan, 2021 Relationship Status: Star-crossed
Professional Wick Checker
#5: Jul 2nd 2023 at 1:28:25 PM

Are the names suggested in the OP good? Any other rename suggestions?

themayorofsimpleton Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him from Elsewhere (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Abstaining
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
#6: Jul 2nd 2023 at 1:28:39 PM

[up][up] Good points. Switching to rename.

Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Jul 2nd 2023 at 4:28:47 AM

TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
Amonimus the Retromancer from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle
the Retromancer
#7: Jul 2nd 2023 at 1:28:57 PM

Not confident in busty sweater idea as it may be close to Form-Fitting Wardrobe.

Before the thread I've thought there would be examples of "turtleneck sweather / soft clothes = Nice Girl", but I guess these aren't as commonly described.

Edited by Amonimus on Jul 2nd 2023 at 11:29:30 AM

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#8: Jul 2nd 2023 at 1:34:42 PM

Rename. I don't think the DO page is necessary since the definitions (tight sweaters emphasizing boobs for fanservice) are the same; the new page can just include "the trope's name derives from the term 'sweater girl' something something 1950s" in the description. The benefit of a rename will be the assurance that we go through the wicks.

I agree.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jul 2nd 2023 at 3:35:06 AM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#9: Jul 2nd 2023 at 1:34:54 PM

Form-Fitting Wardrobe is for drawn clothes. Though there may be overlap with drawn characters who frequently wear tight sweaters, the original appeal of the sweater girl is that she is a real person, and the boobiness of her sweater transgressive with the mores of the time.

Sexy Sweater Girl, Tight Sweaters Are Sexy (gender neutral, though I suppose men wearing sweaters that cling to pecs or abs something are not out of the question)

selkies Professional Wick Checker Since: Jan, 2021 Relationship Status: Star-crossed
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#10: Jul 2nd 2023 at 1:54:11 PM

I avoid adjectives like "sexy" to prevent creepiness/gushing/etc. "Fanservice" is the safest option here.

RandomTroper123 She / Her from I'll let you guess... (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
selkies Professional Wick Checker Since: Jan, 2021 Relationship Status: Star-crossed
Professional Wick Checker
#12: Jul 2nd 2023 at 2:35:52 PM

I don't think making this gender-neutral is a good idea. This is a phenomenon that happened with actresses and female characters. Bc eveb sth as simple as this was sexualized. This targeted women.

RandomTroper123 She / Her from I'll let you guess... (Not-So-Newbie) Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
She / Her
#13: Jul 2nd 2023 at 2:45:34 PM

[up]I agree as this is Always Female and I don't recall the description mentioning non-female examples.

EDIT:[down]I wasn't trying to suggest you were suggesting that. Sorry if it came across that way.

Edited by RandomTroper123 on Jul 2nd 2023 at 3:44:55 AM

Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#14: Jul 2nd 2023 at 2:53:30 PM

The sweater girl phenomenon is naturally Always Female and I never said it wasn't. I don't think the female skew has to go away even if we choose a gender neutral trope name. But in my personal experience, the "X is Sexy/Attractive" type of trope name helps emphasize that it's an attitude expressed by the work, not a gush avenue (e.g. Mixed Ancestry Is Attractive).

Edited by Synchronicity on Jul 2nd 2023 at 4:53:55 AM

MorganWick (Elder Troper)
#15: Jul 3rd 2023 at 12:36:57 AM

My preference when a previous thread didn't fix the usage to match the redefinition is to actually fix the usage and only rename if it doesn't work, and that's especially the case with a pre-existing term like this, but that doesn't seem to be the way the thread is going and it's easy to see it still being used for Exactly What It Says on the Tin Chairs-y examples, cleanup or no.

GastonRabbit MOD Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#16: Jul 5th 2023 at 2:43:33 AM

I hooked a crowner for whether to rename.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
Berrenta How sweet it is from Texas Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
How sweet it is
#17: Jul 5th 2023 at 6:44:52 AM

Pitching Sweater Service as another option.

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GastonRabbit MOD Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#18: Jul 9th 2023 at 3:26:11 AM

Calling in favor of renaming. What are our options?

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
selkies Professional Wick Checker Since: Jan, 2021 Relationship Status: Star-crossed
Professional Wick Checker
#20: Jul 9th 2023 at 4:51:19 AM

I'd rather keep the term's off-site name. Sweater Service is very ambiguous.

GastonRabbit MOD Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
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selkies Professional Wick Checker Since: Jan, 2021 Relationship Status: Star-crossed
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#22: Jul 9th 2023 at 9:59:19 AM

If Tight Sweaters Are Sexy wins, that means the trope will be made gender-neutral and adjusted as such.

Tabs Since: Jan, 2001
#23: Jul 9th 2023 at 10:22:53 AM

[up] I'm not into that name because it suggests a generalization than an instance of sweater fanservice or one shapely character in a sweater. If it does get picked, though, the description will still say that this is Always Female, actresses were called sweater girls, etc. (cuz the vote was to rename, not change up the description a significant way). I don't think the trope could work for a male character with massive pecs since the toplessness taboo where the sweater girl trope is used applies only to women, but I suppose it's not impossible.

Edited by Tabs on Jul 9th 2023 at 10:23:19 AM

GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#24: Jul 9th 2023 at 10:40:36 AM

[up][up]No, it doesn't. It just means the name would be changed. We'd need another crowner if we wanted to do anything with the definition, and I see no reason to do that if the issue was the original name and not the definition, so I don't intend to run any more crowners after the new name is decided.

Edit: Tabs ninja'd me by also saying that a name change doesn't automatically mean a definition change.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jul 9th 2023 at 12:44:37 PM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
selkies Professional Wick Checker Since: Jan, 2021 Relationship Status: Star-crossed
Professional Wick Checker
#25: Jul 10th 2023 at 9:09:20 AM

I don't like the name bc it implies a gender neutral sexy sweater which isn't what the coined term stands for, but if we won't change the definition/gendered aspect then good.

Trope Repair Shop: Sweater Girl
9th Jul '23 4:58:36 AM

Crown Description:

Consensus was to rename Sweater Girl because it suffers from excessive misuse and ZCEs for people who don't recognize the pre-existing term and stereotype used off-site, mistaking it for any girl who wears a sweater or girls who always wear sweaters due to a Limited Wardrobe. What should the trope's new name be?

Total posts: 39
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