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Do you have trouble remembering the difference between Deathbringer the Adorable and Fluffy the Terrible?

Do you have trouble recognizing when you've written a Zero-Context Example?

Not sure if you really have a Badass Bookworm or just a guy who likes to read?

Well, this is the thread for you. We're here to help you will all the finer points of example writing. If you have any questions, we can answer them. Don't be afraid. We don't bite. We all just want to make the wiki a better place for everyone.


Useful Tips:

  • Make sure that the example makes sense to both people who don't know the work AND don't know the trope.
    • Wrong: The Mentor: Kevin is this to Bob in the first episode.
    • Right: The Mentor: Kevin takes Bob under his wing in the first episode and teaches him the ropes of being a were-chinchilla.
  • Never just put the trope title and leave it at that.
    • Wrong: Badass Adorable
    • Right: Badass Adorable: Xavier, the group's cute little mascot, defeats three raging elephants with both hands tied behind his back using only an uncooked spaghetti noodle.
  • When is normally far less important than How.
    • Wrong: Big Bad: Of the first season.
    • Right: Big Bad: The heroes have to defeat the Mushroom Man lest the entirety of Candy Land's caramel supply be turned into fungus.
  • A character name is not an explanation.


Other Resources:


For best results, please include why you think an example is iffy in your first post.

Also, many oft-misused tropes/topics have their own threads, such as Surprisingly Realistic Outcome (here) and Fan-Preferred Couple (here). Tropers are better able to give feedback on examples you bring up to specific threads.

For cleaning up examples of Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard, you must use their dedicated threads: Complete Monster Cleanup, Magnificent Bastard Cleanup.

Edited by Synchronicity on Sep 18th 2023 at 11:42:55 AM

themayorofsimpleton Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him from Elsewhere (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Abstaining
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
#13401: Oct 22nd 2020 at 5:26:46 PM

[up] While it is being misused, Franchise Original Sin is in the process of being taken to TRS. I'd recommend adding it to the wick check sandbox being created for that purpose.

Which reminds me, I have to work on that sandbox. Probably not the place to ask this but how am I doing?

TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
Crossover-Enthusiast from an abaondoned mall (Lucky 7) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#13402: Oct 22nd 2020 at 6:23:52 PM

Is this Ascended Extra?

  • Something About: Boshi appears in the "Yoshi's Island", "World of Light", and "Yoshi's Story" episodes, despite not appearing in any of those games. In said episodes, he gets more screen time than Yoshi himself.

Jawbreakers on sale for 99¢
mightymewtron Angry babby from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Angry babby
#13403: Oct 22nd 2020 at 7:29:24 PM

Ascended Extra would be when the character ascends in their own series. If it's a character in a fanwork, it might be something like O.C. Stand-in or Ensemble Dark Horse.

[down] That's for canon adaptations, like Bartok the Magnificent. The mention of fanfiction is kind of vague because it points to O.C. Stand-in and such.

EDIT: Wait, apparently fanfic examples are listed. That's a bit confusing. I guess it does count?

Edited by mightymewtron on Oct 22nd 2020 at 10:45:15 AM

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
Crossover-Enthusiast from an abaondoned mall (Lucky 7) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#13404: Oct 22nd 2020 at 7:35:08 PM

Ascended Extra mentions "a new adaptation of a story" being included in the description, though.

Jawbreakers on sale for 99¢
Ferot_Dreadnaught Since: Mar, 2015
#13405: Oct 22nd 2020 at 8:29:53 PM

Per this Aesop cleanup, I intend to ad this to My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic S3 E13 "Magical Mystery Cure".

  • Mis-blamed: Many fans criticize the episode over the alleged Broken Aesop about not accepting a destiny you don't want only for Twilight to accept her destiny of becoming an alicorn princess despite never wanting such. But the actual Aesop, delivered extra-unsubtly through the song "A True, True Friend" is about helping friends in need and find their true selfs which Twilight did do and earn her destiny for or at worst was unrelated as opposed to contradicting it.

Is this a valid example? The ATT that said to take it hear argues otherwise as it doesn't give a specific group/individual being blamed.

wingedcatgirl I'm helping! from lurking (Holding A Herring) Relationship Status: Oh my word! I'm gay!
I'm helping!
#13406: Oct 22nd 2020 at 8:47:35 PM

Yeah, no. Mis-blamed is when people blame the wrong person, not when people cast blame over a wrong issue.

Trouble Cube continues to be a general-purpose forum for those who desire such a thing.
Dessertsunrise Since: Nov, 2013
#13407: Oct 23rd 2020 at 12:10:39 AM

Sorry, wrong topic.

Edited by Dessertsunrise on Oct 23rd 2020 at 12:51:36 PM

Dessertsunrise Since: Nov, 2013
#13408: Oct 23rd 2020 at 12:50:47 AM

Sorry, I posted that previous post in the wrong place.

Malady (Not-So-Newbie)
#13409: Oct 23rd 2020 at 8:09:12 AM

There Is Only One Bed is flexible enough for this, right?

Dungeon Keeper Ami


Does this count? It seems like Chest Insignia is for accessories and stuff, not this? Which is more Power Tattoo?

Chest Insignia:

  • In the various My Little Pony series, each pony has a symbol on their flank (known as a "cutie mark" in My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic) corresponding to their name and personality. It's where a brand would be on an actual horse, which... is actually pretty dark.
    • Especially in Generation 1, there are variations to this. Some Little Ponies have symbols over their entire torso. Others, such as the Winger Ponies, have their flank symbols matched by one on their forehead. And Sea Ponies for the most part do not have symbols at all; the few who do have a necklace as symbol.
  • My Little Pony Spin-Off lines Fairy Tails and My Pretty Mermaids also have, respectively, birds and mermaids with unique symbols. The birds have them on their chests, while the mermaids have them on their tails. The mermaids' symbols are called name designs and only visible in cold water.

Edited by Malady on Oct 23rd 2020 at 8:15:49 AM

Disambig Needed: Help with those issues! tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13324299140A37493800&page=24#comment-576
raspberryred99 pobody's nerfect Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
pobody's nerfect
#13410: Oct 23rd 2020 at 11:07:54 AM

I originally posted a thread about the misuse of King Koopa Copy in the Trope Repair Shop, then in Ask The Tropers, and I was directed here instead. Whoops.

This trope seems to be misused to describe any character who is even vaguely similar to Bowser; a lot of characters are listed simply because they are dragonlike, have some sort of Playing with Fire abilities, or are video game bosses.

    Some questionable examples from the trope page 
  • Gruntilda from Banjo-Kazooie is a rare female example. In addition to having green skin, she also shoots fireballs during the final battle of the first game. Subverted with Captain Blackeye, who was to be the Final Boss of Dream (the game that eventually became Banjo-Kazooie). In Banjo-Tooie, you can find him drowning his sorrows in Jolly Roger's Lagoon lamenting that "a bear and bird stole his glory". Gruntilda only shares her color palette(?) and fire powers with Bowser; Captain Blackeye is a Zero Context Example and the anecdote with his entry has nothing to do with the trope. Removed.
  • Junkrat and Roadhog from Overwatch could be considered Decomposite Characters of this trope. Junkrat has a similar hairstyle and Evil Eyebrows, his explosives can meet the fire criteria, and the spiky tire on his back resembles Bowser's spiky shell. Roadhog is a brute of a man with an incredibly deep voice and Stout Strength. Both are vicious criminals who smash and destroy with glee. Junkrat and Roadhog are not final bosses, reptiles, or even antagonists in Overwatch unless you're specifically playing against them. They also don't have armies of minions the way Bowser does, and the physical resemblance seems to be Square Peg Round Trope. Removed as per the post directly below this one.
  • Zavok from Sonic Lost World has huge fangs, spiky shoulders, Evil Eyebrows, and menacing claws. He's also the leader and the strongest member of the Deadly Six. However, despite being the weakest member of the group, Zazz has even more traits of this, such as his mohawk. Even his wild, brutish personality is more in line with this trope than Zavok's calm, ominous demeanor. This gets more ironic when you see both of them appear in Mario and Sonic at the Olympic Games. It sounds like these character mostly share aspects of their appearance with Bowser, and one has an attitude like him. But they don't sound like they fulfill the role that Bowser does. Cut Zazz, but not Zavok because he's included in the page image and I feel that the context would be removed for his inclusion. That's an issue that should be addressed in Image Pickin' so I won't get rid of the example unless the image is changed.
  • Galvatron becomes this in The Transformers following the movie. Having lost most of IQ points due to brain damage, he trades in Megatron's tendency towards evil plotting for raw, uncoordinated beserker rage. Brash and boisterous, he acts more the mad king than military leader. His sleek, functional look gives way to a more imposing, armored design and the Decepticons are relocated to the castle ruins of the lava planet, Chaar. In response, much of the season focuses on new threats like the Quintessons and the Autobot-Decepticon War is presented in a much more one-sided manner. This sounds more like an example of Sanity Slippage and Mad With Power, but that could be because the entry focuses on his behavior and not his appearance, role in the narrative, and whether he has any minions or rivals in the way Bowser does. cut, apparently this one is the subject of an edit war?

To do next: examine the wicks.

Edited by raspberryred99 on Oct 23rd 2020 at 3:35:20 PM

You can call me Red.
MichaelKatsuro Since: Apr, 2011
#13411: Oct 23rd 2020 at 11:30:36 AM

Cut the Overwatch guys. I've played that game, and the "Decomposite Character" thing is shoehorning like a starving shoe salesman on commission.

raspberryred99 pobody's nerfect Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
pobody's nerfect
#13412: Oct 23rd 2020 at 11:32:19 AM

I suspected as much from what I know of the game from friends and internet osmosis.

You can call me Red.
Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#13413: Oct 23rd 2020 at 11:36:55 AM

Cut all of those.

Noting that Joe Mabbon edit-warred to put Galvatron back in there. It's a ridiculous shoehorn and he readded it verbatim without explanation. Flagging that for mods.

Edited by Larkmarn on Oct 23rd 2020 at 2:38:24 PM

Found a Youtube Channel with political stances you want to share? Hop on over to this page and add them.
Anddrix Since: Oct, 2014
#13414: Oct 23rd 2020 at 12:28:25 PM

Is is me or does the following example from CompositeCharacter.Comic Books seem more like it would fit better under Adaptation Amalgamation?:

  • Amethyst, Princess of Gemworld: The 2019 series happily mixes tropes and characters from the classic series - Dark Opal as the Big Bad, Turquoise as Amy's friend - 2011 reboot - Amy's mother being in charge of House Amethyst, inter-house politics and corruption among good houses - and even the animated series, which clearly inspired Amy's new design.

And regarding this example from Tenet does sound-mixing qualify as a special effect?:

  • Special Effect Failure: The theatrical release received numerous complaints about poor sound mixing where several important pieces of dialogue were drowned out by the rest of the scene's noise.

And from the same page, is this example being used correctly as it seems to cover the "incomprehensible" aspect but not the "True Art" part?:

Berrenta MOD How sweet it is from Texas Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
How sweet it is
#13415: Oct 23rd 2020 at 12:28:57 PM

I'll suspend Joe Mabbon.

Pulling Galvatron entry.

Edited by Berrenta on Oct 23rd 2020 at 2:30:48 PM

she/her | TRS needs your help! | Contributor of Trope Report
raspberryred99 pobody's nerfect Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
pobody's nerfect
#13416: Oct 23rd 2020 at 12:37:14 PM

^^^ Cut all except for Zavon because he's part of the page image. I'm assuming that should be addressed in Image Pickin' unless he actually IS an example and the example description is just lacking in good details.

You can call me Red.
Ferot_Dreadnaught Since: Mar, 2015
#13417: Oct 23rd 2020 at 1:27:48 PM

YMMV.My Little Pony The Movie 2017

  • Fanon Discontinuity: The meh reception even from those who liked it, questionable characterizations and plot developments, seeming disregard for the show's continuity, and failing to do anything meaningful compared to the show has caused many fans to ignore the events of the movie. Despite Word of God that is was canon, fans were very surprised Season 8 of the show confirmed its canonicity by extensively referencing the movie's events. Since it glosses over the events proper, even seemingly at odds like Twilight Sparkle's Hundred Percent Adoration Rating by the hippogriffs despite her attempted theft of their pearl, and simply focuses on the end results like the hippogriffs returning to society, Tempest Shadow having pulled her Heel–Face Turn the occasional reference to Klugetown and the pirates, and the Storm King getting acknowledged in both "What Lies Beneath" and "Spring Breakdown", those inclined can pretend things happened differently. Not helping is that supplementary material relating to the movie seldom agree with each other.

I asked the MLP discussion thread, and it agreed FD is misused as it's about fans ignoring the work and any references to it (no longer the case after it was extensive referenced in the series) or mental replacing the unliked parts or pretending the series ended prior (nowhere near enough fans do this to count in this case), not just not liking it.

Before I cut it, can FD count if it was rejected for a time but became accepted later? Or is it like other YMMV tropes where if it latter events change that it's retroactively not an example (like Moral Event Horizon for a character who unexpected redeemed themselves)? It might be worth keeping in some form if the former.

Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaught on Oct 23rd 2020 at 1:28:11 AM

raspberryred99 pobody's nerfect Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
pobody's nerfect
#13418: Oct 23rd 2020 at 2:40:01 PM

King Koopa Copy wick check, part 1!

    My findings 
Wicks I didn't look at
  • Indexes, image/source/etc lists, other places that aren't going to be wicks from examples.
  • Links in sandboxes. I don't think we're supposed to mess with other people's sandboxes?
  • 9 are part of the pantheon. I will check these later.
  • 42 in character pages for works. I will check these later.
  • A few in main trope pages. I will check these later.

Wicks I fixed myself

Potential misuses

Video Games
  • Bonk: Bonk's nemesis King Drool is a massive, green, monstrous, Tyrannosaurus Rex with wings who kidnaps and brainwashes Princess Za in Bonk's Adventure. He just settles for world domination afterwards, though. In my opinion "Monster who kidnaps princesses" does not a Bowser Expy make, but if the character actually has powers or an army of minions or another strong similarity to Bowser, perhaps he counts. Never mind, he's probably a legit example.
  • Frogger: Dr. Wani, the most frequently recurring villain of the games, is a large, green, suit-wearing crocodile. In some respects he looks like a less cartoony King K. Rool, himself a King Koopa Copy. Unless he shares powers, minions, royal status, or behavior with Bowser, Dr. Wani doesn't sound like an example. The detail that he's a "suit-wearing crocodile" seems to contrast with Bowser's punk rock-style appearance, and the title Dr. makes me doubt that he's characterized as brash and uncouth the way Bowser is. Removed.
  • [[strike:Pollardos Feos Y Mazmorros: Mazmorro is a big, brutish and monstrous creature. Zero Context Example.
  • Sonic Lost World: Zavok has huge fangs, spiky shoulders, Evil Eyebrows, and menacing claws. He's also the leader and the strongest member of the Deadly Six. I kept this, because Zavok is in the King Koopa Copy page image, though I cut the part about Zazz since I cut him from the trope page.]] Removed.

Webcomics

YMMV

Updated, denoting which examples I cut.

Edited by raspberryred99 on Oct 25th 2020 at 1:34:57 PM

You can call me Red.
raspberryred99 pobody's nerfect Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
pobody's nerfect
#13419: Oct 23rd 2020 at 8:16:39 PM

King Koopa Copy Wick Check, part 2: Electric Koopaloo!

Wicks I checked

  • Character pages, except for the Pokémon ones. I'm skipping over those for now but will probably come back around to do them. I feel they're contentious but there's so many of them that they merit their own examination.
  • Pantheon. All of the issues pertained to characters I'd already cut wicks for, but I left these alone because I'm not sure how Pantheon should be handled.
  • Uses in other main trope pages. All but one of them were completely valid.

Wicks I fixed

  • On Overarching Villain, King K. Rool's name was potholed to the trope. Removed the pothole.
  • Duckworth from DuckTales (2017) was listed as this trope. Just...no. He's a hero, doesn't command an army...I'm kind of baffled by his inclusion.
  • Zapped the wicks on the character pages on which Junkrat and Roadhog are listed.

    Potential Misuses 
Character Pages
  • Citadel Of The Heart Grandis: An example not related to a video game, in that Grandis has more or less trained his Phase 2 form to more or less have very identical combat capabilities to Bowser himself, although whether or not Grandis even qualifies as a villain depends on who you ask. Much of the time, Grandis is typically an Aloof Ally at most in his more problematic situations. I don't think combat capabilities alone make a character an Expy of Bowser. Cut.
  • Exalted Spirits: As if it wasn't bad enough that he looks the part, one of Octavian's greatest enemies is called the Mushroom King. Octavian looks like a semirealistic shark-man. His role in the story doesn't sound anything like Bowser's, either. Cut.
  • Monster Hunter Fifth Generation Monsters: It's huge, ferocious, has two large horns and is lined with Spikes of Doom, has a Mighty Roar, and has a similar facial structure to Trope Codifier Bowser. The character is Nergigante, who isn't a cartoony monster nor does it command minions, hold royal status, kidnap princesses, etc. Cut.
  • OK K.O.! Let's Be Heroes: Other Villains: She seems to be an Expy of Bowser. An Evil Redhead? Check. A yellow scalie? Check. Enjoys Playing with Fire? Check. An Extreme Omnivore? Check. Large and in Charge? Can be. The character is Cosma, who I'd honestly say is RIGHT on the borderline. She doesn't kidnap princesses, isn't royalty, isn't a final boss type, and lacks minions. However, there's an episode where the heroes encounter her as a giant in space, and there's myriad references to Super Mario Galaxy, including a scene where the heroes gather up space junk which resembles star bits and give it to her. In every other episode, though, her resemblance to Bowser is totally superficial. Clarified this one since I'm a fan of the work.
  • Sonic the Hedgehog - Antagonists: Let's see. Guttural Growler voices? Check. Evil alien overload? Check. Power-hungry tyrant? Check. Have a lot of power? Check. Manipulating the protagonists? Check. Despite how they do it on different approaches. Monstrous final bosses? Check. Red and black color schemes checks? Large and in charge? Check. Yep. Even Black Doom has some similar traits to King Koopa himself, despite being slightly more cold, ruthless, villainous, intelligent and devilish. I feel like this one's a pretty easy zap unless there's something the example doesn't consider. This dude is a Black Cloak villain in appearance, so the physical resemblance at least is a stretch. Cut.
  • On Sonic the Hedgehog - Infinite, Zavok's name potholes to King Koopa Copy. I haven't been nuking examples involving that character because he's in the page image for the trope.
  • Sonic the Hedgehog - Solaris: Iblis is a reptilian monster made out of lava. He has fire powers and is very powerful, destructive and has green eyes and flame red skin. Not to mention he is evil in nature and is the final boss in Silver's story. Seems shoehorned. Cut.
  • Star Fox Comic Characters: He's a reptile named after Bowser from Super Mario Bros.. Character is named Bowsor. The description above literally notes that "Despite his name, he does not actually resemble Bowser, though he is reptilian." Hmm.

Pantheon I'm not entirely sure how to handle Pantheon because it seems to be a Just for Fun thing, so I didn't cut any of these wicks even though they all pertain to characters I cut wicks for elsewhere.

  • In Character Expies, we've literally got Zirek from Sonic Lost World as the God of Bowser Imitators. That's why there's a wick on Sonic the Hedgehog too. Man, is the discussion of this guy tethered to this trope!
  • Regarding the Koopa Troopas from Mario', on Reptiles: They tend to gravitate towards Wreck-It Ralph due to sharing similarities to their own master. It helps that Ralph's a Punch-Clock Villain. Koopa Troopas can sometimes be found as enemies in "Fix It Felix, Jr" (when the enemies from Q*Bert aren't available). See above.
  • Regarding the Boos from Mario, on Tics: Sometimes they can be found attending Bad-Anons with Wreck-It Ralph. They like him, maybe because he reminds them of Bowser. Three for three.
  • Regarding the Toads from Mario, specifically the blue and yellow Toads, on Miscellaneous Flora: Given their status of being a duo that sticks together in any sort of situation (or simply being Those Two Guys), they have gotten along with other duos such as Bulk & Skull and Timon & Pumbaa. On the other hand, both Toads (and the other Toads by extension) prefer to keep their distance from Junkrat & Roadhog, especially after hearing how these two Australian menaces had a few characteristics in common with Bowser. I cut the previous wicks I encountered for Roadhog and Junkrat because they are not an example of the trope.

Updated to denote which examples I've removed.

Edited by raspberryred99 on Oct 25th 2020 at 1:37:23 PM

You can call me Red.
nrjxll Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Not war
#13420: Oct 23rd 2020 at 8:24:44 PM

Are you actually suggesting cutting King Dedede just because he later evolved away from the trope, or are you just getting rid of the ZCE? Because if it's the former, I'm not sure I agree with that all. If something was a trope at some point and then changes it doesn't retroactively never have been that trope.

The only other I don't think I agree with is this:

Bonk: Bonk's nemesis King Drool is a massive, green, monstrous, Tyrannosaurus rex with wings who kidnaps and brainwashes Princess Za in Bonk's Adventure. He just settles for world domination afterwards, though. In my opinion "Monster who kidnaps princesses" does not a Bowser Expy make, but if the character actually has powers or an army of minions or another strong similarity to Bowser, perhaps he counts.

In addition to "monster who kidnaps princesses", this guy is also described as a reptilian king. I've never heard of "Bonk", but I'm not sure why you're automatically skeptical about him counting.

Edited by nrjxll on Oct 23rd 2020 at 10:25:15 AM

Bootlebat Since: Dec, 2012
#13421: Oct 23rd 2020 at 8:48:28 PM

Can My Rules Are Not Your Rules apply when the rules Double Standard is applied in favor of the players? For example, it's common on RP Gs for only players to be able to get critical hits but not npcs, as Health/Damage Asymmetry makes criticals a lot more dangerous to player characters in most cases (potentially being a One-Hit KO if the player is one of the squishier classes, while a critical hit on an enemy only takes 10 percent of their maximum HP instead of 5 or something like that.)

raspberryred99 pobody's nerfect Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
pobody's nerfect
#13422: Oct 23rd 2020 at 8:51:44 PM

^^ I only got rid of Dedede because it was a ZCE. Especially since he is totally an example in Kirby's Dreamland, the game being discussed in the example.

Thank you for your input on the Bonk entry! This entry was exemplary of the handful of examples I thought were borderline, so I'll definitely not cut it.

You can call me Red.
Fireblood from Denver, CO Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Singularity
#13423: Oct 23rd 2020 at 9:13:21 PM

If a character has sex with another not knowing the person is a villain whom they'd never touch otherwise, does that fit Questionable Consent?

Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.-Philip K. Dick
Malady (Not-So-Newbie)
#13424: Oct 23rd 2020 at 9:19:37 PM

[up] - You're talking about the Control Z example from the previous page.

I took this conclusion: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13543987200A54420100&page=536#comment-13394

I see you have a different take, possibly.

Disambig Needed: Help with those issues! tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13324299140A37493800&page=24#comment-576
eroock Since: Sep, 2012
#13425: Oct 24th 2020 at 3:36:20 AM

Is the monster in Frankenstein (1931) an Adaptational Dumbass or Adaptational Nonsapience? Currently, it's listed under both:

  • Adaptational Dumbass: The Creature gets hit with this hard. In the book, he reads Paradise Lost, speaks fluent French, carries guns and frames someone for murder. Here, he's a blundering, mindless brute.
  • Adaptational Nonsapience: The creature goes from being intelligent enough to learn how to read and speak on his own, as well as framing someone for murder in the book, to an almost completely mindless brute, which also makes him a more sympathetic (not to mention believable) character.

Edited by eroock on Oct 24th 2020 at 3:36:41 AM


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