Old Magnificent Bastard thread
Welcome to the Magnificent Bastard proposal thread! This is the thread where new Magnificent Bastard examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here
Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.
Here is how the process works:
- If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential mitigating features will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.
- After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".
- Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the MB subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!
Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:
- To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!
- No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
- Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
- Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
- Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.
- Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").
- If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.
- If a work is already reserved by another user, please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!
- Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite MB" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest for that.
- Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.
- If you are suspended from other parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
- For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
- If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.
- Please keep all discussions "in-house".
- What other wikis use for MB equivalents is irrelevant here.
- Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
- Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.
If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:
What is the work?
This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.
Who is the candidate and what have they done?
This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, their goals and methodology, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some characters, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.
How are they Magnificent?
This is the point where you highlight the character's brilliance. How to they convey their intelligence and charm to the audience? What makes them stand out among the crowd? What are their goals and how do they go about accomplishing them? This part welcomes a lot of creative thinking — not everyone has to be a Machiavellian Diabolical Mastermind to be worth considering here! This is also the time to showcase how the character can think on their feet if it's necessary.
How are they a Bastard? How are they not too bad?
What kinds of moral lines is this character willing to cross for the sake of their goal? Are they willing to let innocents die? Start wars? Commit crimes? The character has to show some kind of unscrupulousness in order to count as a "Bastard". Notably, this character does not necessarily have to be the villain, and an Anti-Hero can cross the line if they're immoral enough, but they have to be immoral somehow.
This is also the section where you then state your case for why they're not too bad. Perhaps their good intentions help mitigate their crimes. Perhaps others are shown to be much worse than them. Perhaps they're prone to Pet the Dog moments or are even fighting on behalf of loved ones. Whatever the case, there are certain lines that an MB can't cross, but as long as their villainy is reasonable for their goal, they can be considered.
Final verdict?
This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.
And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!
Edited by Twiddler on Jan 17th 2024 at 5:40:56 AM
Lies and Violence!
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Cyrus and the Joker.
Next for Young Justice!
Who is Cassandra Savage?
Daughter of the immortal Vandal Savage, leader of the Light. Cassandra is a fanatic soldier for her father's cause, willing to follow him to the ends of the earth—even accepting his murder of her older, dementia-suffering sister as a benevolent act of mercy. Cassandra has a few appearances throughout season 3, where she gets up to things like personally piloting the Death Star-esque War World to help Savage fend off an invasion from Starro, or training with the League of Shadows and staging a False Flag Operation on behalf of Lex and one of his unnecessarily complicated schemes. However, it's season 4 where she really gets the chance to shine.
Noticing that one of the Shadows's newest recruits, Onyx, is having doubts about their actions, Cassandra formulates a plan to use her to hack into the Justice League's databases. Meeting with the current sensei of the Shadows, Lady Shiva, Cassandra allows Onyx to eavesdrop on the pair planning for Cassandra to pretend to defect to the heroes. This is all that Onyx needs to begin her own defection, quickly tracking down the heroine Artemis to warn her about Cassandra's plot... by rashly following her to her house, breaking one of the unofficial rules between heroes and villains. Cassandra follows soon after, claiming to have turned on her father after he killed her sister—even magically glamouring herself with scars and a missing arm as evidence of their falling out, injuries which she had previously tricked Onyx into thinking she gained in a failed recruitment bid to Killer Croc.
Now this all sounds convoluted, but the Light has tried to plant moles in the Justice League before. If Cassandra just went to them claiming to be reformed, they'd never believe her. However, Onyx's little stunt ensures that she isn't exactly a trustworthy source herself, and Cassandra makes it worse by accusing her of only being here to poison her defection on Vandal's orders. Now they have two defectors, each claiming the other is a fake, and that makes it much harder for the League to work out what's what. Is one of them lying? Are they both lying? Are they both telling the truth, and have been tricked into mistrusting each other by the Light?
The heroes decide to take both to a safehouse and interrogate them... where they're promptly attacked by more Shadows. In the confusion, Cassandra releases a small swarm of infiltrators—nanodrones that can discreetly hack into anything—from her own flesh, which steal as much data from the League's computers as they can before returning to Cassandra's body. Meanwhile, Lady Shiva teleports in to kidnap her daughter—herself a Shadow-defector-turned-hero, Cassandra Cain / Orphan (aka the best Batgirl)—and threatens to kill her if Artemis doesn't bring Cassandra Savage to the Shadows' base.
None of this clears up anything about which of the two defectors is being genuine; just because the Shadows are after Cassandra doesn't mean this isn't a convoluted plot. And. Well. They're not wrong. So Onyx comes along with Artemis and Cassandra as they try to sneak into the Shadows' base to free Orphan. Onyx eventually gets tired of putting up with Cassandra and holds her at swordpoint... only for Cassandra to reveal she still has two hands and disarms her, while releasing the infiltrator swarm to return to their main computer hub thing—due to their organic components that allow them to hide in Cassandra's skin, the infiltrators can't stay active for long, so this was all a convoluted gambit to get Cassandra back to the base so the stolen data can be processed... with an A-list hero, a traitor to the Shadows, and Shiva's daughter in tow. So even when Oracle, monitoring them through a camouflaged drone, disables the infiltrators before they can deliver the data? The Shadows still have them surrounded by that point, it's a net win.
Fighting ensues, until one of the Shadows—the Shade, whose life had previously been saved by Artemis' sister—turns on Shiva and teleports the heroes away.
Mitigating factors?
Cassandra is great for what small a role she has. She proves to be just as intelligent and good at setting up overly-complicated schemes that accomplish twelve things at once as her father, and though she ultimately fails due to a few key outside factors, it nonetheless remains a stand-out play that came terribly close to succeeding. It helps she's paired with Shiva, who is a much less controlled, much more detestable hair-trigger psychopath who can't help but scream and rage when Orphan escapes. Cassandra stands out far more in comparison, merely calmly reporting back to Vandal and spending the rest of the season continuing to silently see to his needs.
There is a moment where, as part of her "defection," Cassandra derides Vandal for taking her from her mortal family and making her into a puppet for his "cult of personality"... only for the reveal of her true colors to have her express gratitude for saving her from mundanity and elevating her to greatness. So... if she was indoctrinated or something, it's set in deep. But there's no indication it's to any disqualifying levels, and she's self-aware enough to incorporate it into her facade, so I'd say it's fine.
for Cassandra Savage.
Yes to Cassandra.
- Dram is a dark elf assassin loyal to rising conqueror Tiber Septim tasked with aiding Governor Richton and the Imperials in securing their conquest over the Redguards of Hammerfell. When Prince A'tor led a fleet against the Empire, Dram assassinated the Prince with a poisoned arrow while the Imperials' allied dragon distracted the fleet. Dram soon set his eyes on the pirates of the Restless League acting as rebels and overwhelms and captures the hero Cyrus when he comes to find his sister. As Cyrus escapes to aid the Restless League, Dram nearly kills him in an ambush and allows him to escape so he can track him and find the Restless League headquarters. Dram is on the verge of ending the rebels with an advanced airship until Cyrus comes to kill Richton, and he nearly ambushes and kills Cyrus a final time before a sword possessed by A'tor cleaves him in half.
Goku Black
savage
Cassandra
Not the Eye
Cassandra
Like father, like daugther
Jogo
Cassandra
Edit± ![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
Dr. Ratio
Edited by jlvs200s on Jan 27th 2024 at 5:15:14 PM
"Stand proud, Sukuna, you are strong." | He/Him
Having been going through quests in the most recent Best Mobile Game winner, I figured this was worth a shot.
What is the work?
Honkai: Star Rail is a turn-based gacha game with an ongoing story. Its protagonist, the amnesiac Trailblazer, joins a space crew riding a train called the Astral Express, travelling from world to world to help solve numerous crises that plague those worlds.
Who is Dr. Ratio? What does he do?
Dr. Veritas Ratio is a member of the Intelligentsia Guild, a faction dedicated to the acquisition and spreading of knowledge. A brutally honest genius, he earnestly believes that knowledge and creativity should be shared among all, essentially describing himself as a doctor who treats ignorance and stupidity. He is the Arc Hero of the Crown of the Mundane and Divine quest.
He makes his first appearance at the end of the When the Stars of Ingenuity Shine half of the quest, engrossed in a chess game against himself, and reveals he already knows who the Trailblazer is and why they are there; in order to help Ruan Mei take care of the mess she made with her experiments. He knows what Ruan Mei is really hiding; a clone of an Emanator of Propagation, and he decides to let the Trailblazer deal with it, telling them to go down the elevator to witness it while planning to intervene in the event that the Trailblazer can't deal with it. Once the Emanator clone is defeated, Ratio leaves, noting that the threat has been neutralised. Thus ends his role in the first half of the quest.
He plays a much greater role in the second half, Mundane Troubles. Confronting the Trailblazer alongside Asta and the Genius Society's Screwllum when they wake up after being dazed, he interrogates them on what's happened to Herta's puppet, since it has been attacked, and they were the last one to interact with it before the event. He encourages them first to refresh their memory before he begins the questioning, acting like an Inspector Javert due to his tendency to doubt and work with a negative hypothesis. "When one is immersed in academic research, skepticism comes far more naturally than belief". Through his questioning, he learns that the Trailblazer was called by Herta to help investigate a strange Curio, and through their investigation, learned about a case of researchers disappearing in spontaneous combustions.
After the interrogation, the Trailblazer receives a video from a group chat they are in; a declaration of war against the station from the Annihilation Gang, a group who worships the Destruction and are led by Duke Inferno, real name Ifrit. Dr. Ratio harkens back to the spontaneous combustions and deduces that Ifrit was behind those, and isn't going to stop now. Thus, at Asta's request, Ratio and the Trailblazer go off to investigate.
They first go to Arlan, who Ratio asks for a list of the missing researchers and their details. Once Arlan hands it over, Ratio then gives it to the Trailblazer, telling them to forward the information to a friend of theirs who knows about Station gossip. They speak to one such person, Pamela, and while waiting for updates, Ratio tells Arlan to guide him to the one who knows most about Curios. Arlan reveals that that would be Adler, but Adler has disappeared as well. He was last seen at the master control zone with a fellow researcher, Wen Shiling.
Questioning Wen Shiling reveals her to be aware of Adler's disappearance and deeply upset about it. She talks about how he researched spontaneous combustion over the course of the past few days, always muttering the word "phrase" to himself. After this, Pamela updates the Trailblazer, stating that the disappeared researchers have one common link; they have all posted prominently against management on the dark web. After the Trailblazer shares this result with Dr. Ratio, he puts away the booklet he was looking through and takes them back to Asta and Screwllum.
Upon returning, they discuss the results, and from it, Ratio concludes that from the report of Adler muttering the word "phrase", and the booklet he was reading, which details the Phase Flame - a flame that phases between dimensions, that Adler was researching the Phase Flame, and was in fact muttering the word "phase" instead. He also determines that this flame must have been the Curio that Herta was looking for, and that Duke Inferno must have spawned from it. He also deduces that rather than outright phasing between dimensions, Duke Inferno must have teleported people away. He concludes that Ifrit causing so many consecutive disappearances created the perfect environment to sow unrest, before sending out his announcement. Combining that with the likely outcome of someone realising the similarities between the disappeared people, and it becomes clear as day that his objective from the get-go was to bring chaos, and Ratio believes there is one more step he wishes to take. Right on cue, Asta herself spontaneously combusts, teleporting away like others before her. Ratio concludes that the flame must still be in the station somewhere, and they'll be able to bring everyone back if they find it. So, he and the Trailblazer set off.
They manage to neutralise the threat, saving everyone who was teleported away and seeming to end the quest. However, there is a scene at the end where Ratio and Screwllum talk in private, the latter catching the former as he collects a piece of Phase Flame. And here, it is revealed that Screwllum has caught onto a crucial piece of knowledge - that Ratio himself knew everything all along - Duke Inferno's plot didn't physically hurt any of the researchers, which makes no sense with his character unless a third party came in to save them, which he believes to have been Ratio. And he comes clean. Having managed to catch a spark of Phase Flame, he personally intervened in Duke Inferno's teleportations to make sure they were all teleported somewhere in the station, instead of being left floating in space to die. Ratio then challenges Screwllum to determine why he did this, and Screwllum posits that Ratio intended to save everyone's lives, while also observing from the shadows, and remained secretive as a challenge to see if anyone could catch on. Ratio admits that he's mostly right, save for one thing, and explains his worldview. He believes foolishness and ignorance to be a disease that is very difficult to cure, and that fools can only pick themselves up in cases when there is nobody else to help them. Believing the Station to be full of such fools, he wanted to help quell their blind worship of geniuses, hence allowing the researchers to go missing and hoping that in their disarray, everyone else would be able to come to an answer.
Is he Magnificent?
Dr. Ratio's personality is worth discussing here, as while he can be described as an arrogant jerk, it's in a way that I personally don't think is preventing. While he is a little haughty, he isn't really a gloater, and Insufferable Genius isn't really an appropriate description, since he is more focused on criticising and correcting foolishness in others than proving his own intellect. He isn't a Smug Snake, either, as none of his ego is without merit, and the fan consensus on him is overwhelmingly that it works to the benefit of his character. He is a Stern Teacher who works to cure the disease of ignorance in each of his students, and his classes apparently have a whopping completion rate of 3%, and is harsh on those who don't meet his standards, but this harshness is born from frustration and a genuine desire to help you reach those standards. He isn't malicious at all - just objective, with very high standards. Aside from that, his Comically Serious tendencies make him endearing - he plays chess with himself, likes to wear a plaster head over his face to avoid having to look at idiots (and to think without interference from any of his five senses), fights by whacking enemies with a stone book and chucking chalks at them, and summons statues of himself in flamboyant poses, all without the slightest hint of irony.
His intelligence is without question. He shows excellent deductive reasoning throughout his quest, being the one making most of the important connections, dispenses a few good bits of wisdom, and successfully intercepts Duke Inferno's plan to cause chaos, while taking advantage of said chaos to teach everyone a lesson. And nobody except Screwllum even suspected he was involved, either.
Is he a Bastard? Too much?
Dr. Ratio isn't an outright villain, so right off the bat, he isn't too much of a Bastard; especially considering nothing he does is particularly heinous or cruel in its own right. But he's not completely innocent, either. He doesn't do much, but he's one hell of an enabler. He successfully intercepted the Annihilation Gang's attack, but he didn't stop it outright; the most he did to actually protect the members of the Herta Space Station was making sure Ifrit's attempt to teleport everyone failed, even if attempting to stop it outright was an option. In doing this, he knowingly played a role in sowing discontent and panic among the station. But, as detailed under his folder, he's a Well-Intentioned Extremist to the very end, and let all this happen as a learning opportunity; he wanted the researchers to stop blindly worshipping the Genius Society, since he believed that them doing so was hampering their own ability to learn and grow, which, as an Intelligentsia devotee, he would naturally want to quell. When Screwllum confronts him at the end, he notes that "Helping the weak hints at the merciful instinct of a medical doctor, but maintaining a cool, detached observation reveals the strictness of a scholar" and concludes that he is more like a medical doctor than a scholar, showing he was genuinely trying to help in his own way.
What's the competition like?
Only really challenged by Screwllum, himself an established genius, as Screwllum is the only person who caught on to Ratio's actions. But even so, Screwllum didn't share the knowledge until after the event, and he managed to hide the truth from everybody else. Combined with his outplaying Duke Inferno, and it's plain to see that Ratio's status isn't really threatened by anyone else.
Final Verdict?
Ten points.
Edited by Iceaura39 on Jan 27th 2024 at 4:14:42 PM
It is I, the narrator, categorising addict and writer of books you haven't read.
to the MB in a silly waifu gacha. Can't wait to see how the CM discussion for this game turns out lel (and yes I know people want to put what I read is Phantaliya as CM last year but it went to dead air)
Speaking of waifu gachas. Is anyone more familiar with Blue Archive able to tell me if Black Suit actually counts?
Never heard of it but thanks for reminding
Edited by Mr-ex777 on Jan 28th 2024 at 4:26:12 AM
Showtime!
Ex, I think you've been told to stop calling things "silly waifu gatcha games" all the time. Not only is it badge of honour shit, it's not even true for Honkai and Genshin
To Dr Ratio and Cassandra
Cassandra, Ratio
Goku Black
Dr. Ratio
Cassandra.
for Dr. Ratio.
A Girl, Just One of Many Kinds
- Die Hard: Theo is the charismatic hacker for Hans Gruber during their robbery of the Nakatomi Tower. Introduced wise cracking and witty, Theo immediately hacks into the tower’s system and shuts everything down, trapping everyone inside as Hans holds everyone hostage, and Theo makes work hacking into the vault and drilling through the remaining keys with precision and patience. Once the police gets involved and attempts to storm the tower, Theo watches through the cameras and organizes the group’s attacks to repel their advances. After the FBI shuts down the power and unwittingly opens the vault, Theo wastes no time emptying it out and comes close to getting away with the money, being the only one of Hans’ entourage to survive.
A Girl, Just One of Many Kinds
Okay and now I’ve been looking through potential candidates from a YouTube animated channel and I think I found several ones that could potentially count (and maybe some who count on Complete Monster, we’ll see). So let’s get into it.
What’s The Work?
Mashed is a United Kingdom YouTube channel focused on animation parodies (or other stories otherwise) based on video games such as Super Mario, Sonic, Zelda ect ect.
One of these candidates YOSHZILLA! a super Mario animation where Mario discovers an awful secrete about his beloved Yoshi. Now let’s get to our candidate.
Who is Toad? What Does He Do?
In this animation, Toad is portrayed as a Shady Conspirator who’s friendly disposition hides a harsh truth over Yoshi. Mario, after defeating Bowser for the week, meets with Toad in front of Yoshi’s stable and Toad assures Mario that Yoshi, like always is gonna sleep and have as much food and comfy pillows as possible.
However, when Mario comes back to the stable to get his keys back, he discovers Toad about to murder Yoshi (with a fucker heater no less, lol). Mario is horrified and demands answers as Toad’s cheerfulness subsides into a subdued seriousness as he finally explains. As it’s revealed, the first Yoshi that Mario brought home turns out to grow into a monstrous man (or toad eating) eating beast whenever it eats and grows up, and it one day grew into a size of a T-Rex and started terrorizing the town. Toad managed to trap the Yoshzilla and kept it underground under the stable, and proceeded to use the eggs it laid for replacement Yoshi’s every single day, having the Yoshi go on adventures with Mario and at the end of the day, Yoshi is killed by Toad in order to stop it from growing up and being savage before replacing it again for the next adventure.
Toad shows the Yoshzilla to Mario to prove the claim and Mario is again, horrified, but insists that he can tame the monster. Toad only tells him to look closer, and Mario discovers and equally horrific truth: The Yoshzilla eats her own babies. Mario is horrified and is left broken by the revelation, and promptly euthanizes the new Yoshi, and leaves to sleep while claiming that there will be changes around, while Toad says that he’s sorry this ended up this way.
However, at night, when Mario is laying in bed, Toad appears in his room and promptly kills him. It them cuts to Toad, in a bunker surrounded by clones of Mario, and Toad promptly ends the short film by shooting the camera.
Is he Magnificent?
I’d say so. This version of Toad hides his entire operation by Mario with a cheerful mask as its revealed he trapped the Yoshzilla and has secretly killed and replaced each of the Yoshi’s every night under Mario’s nose, and if the ending is anything to go by, if Mario does end up discovering what happens, Toad simply kills him and replaces him with a clone to protect the Mushroom kingdom.
Is He A Bastard?
I’d say so. Dude is a completely shady guy who kills the Yoshi’s every night to replace them and by the end, murders Mario when he becomes a depressed mess after finding out and replaces him with clone, presumably have been doing this for a while. Despite this, Toad is clearly a Anti-Villain, with his actions simply in service to the Mushroom Kingdom and protecting it from threats, showing no hostility nor sadisticness towards any actions.
Verdict?
Edited by MermaidEyes15 on Jan 28th 2024 at 3:43:48 PM
Keep Fighting. Keep Loving.
A Child from the Stars
Jogo
Toad
Edit: Misko
Edited by jlvs200s on Jan 28th 2024 at 8:07:58 PM
"Stand proud, Sukuna, you are strong." | He/Him
The Salesman’s Stolen Mask
to Cassandra and Toad.
Here’s an interesting one.
What's the Work?
The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild and The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom are the latest installments in Nintendo's The Legend of Zelda franchise.
They follow Link, a Hylian swordsman who awakens after a 100-year slumber to find the kingdom of Hyrule devastated by a catastrophe known as the Great Calamity. Link sets out on an adventure to recover his lost memories, find Princess Zelda, and defeat the monstrous Calamity Ganon.
But this ain’t about them, because the candidate today is actually a minor character who not only never appears physically, but can be only be learned about through side quests and additional lore.
Who Are They/What Have They Done?
Misko the Great Bandit was a notorious thief from Hyrule's past. According to legend, they caused problems all over the kingdom during their exploits. Yet, in the process, they inexplicably managed to find and/or steal all sorts of valuable treasures. They proceeded to scatter them all across Hyrule, hiding them in obscure spots and leaving behind tricky riddles and hints for future adventurers to find.
Link first learns of Misko in Breath of the Wild, when he encounters a pair of wannabe treasure hunters struggling with one of Misko's riddles:
”The little twin steps over the little river. My cave rests above that river's source.”
Link realizes that the “little twin” in question is actually the Little Twin Bridge near the Dueling Peaks, which stretches over a river. Following the river upstream, Link finds a cave behind a waterfall containing Misko’s treasure: a bunch of chests containing valuable gems like opals, rubies, and sapphires. These gems were probably stolen, but Link doesn’t care about that.
In Tears of the Kingdom, it’s revealed that Misko had a particular eye for fashion, with many adventurers and fashionistas unearthing their clues and attempting to find their treasures. Among these valuable clothes are the Set of Awakening (I have no idea when, where, or how they got their hands on that) and Tingle's outfit. The most in-depth quest, however, involves tracking down the legendary Fierce Deity set from Misko's Cave of Chests. The hints go as follows:
“Don the form of the Fierce Deity, and return to this place. There are three keys you will need.
- Beneath the bedchamber of Akkala's red-crowned citadel.
- In the skull's left eye.
- In an old stump in Hyrule Field.”
If Link follows the hints correctly, he’ll find the locations of the Fierce Deity Trousers and Armor, along with the Fierce Deity Mask itself. By returning to the cave while wearing the full set, a wall will slide open, revealing Misko’s ultimate prize: the Fierce Deity Sword. Hell yeah.
Are They Magnificent?
The interesting thing about Misko is that we never actually see or meet them. They’re likely long dead by the time these games take place, either from old age or as a victim of the Great Calamity. That being said, we do get a pretty clear read on their personality from the hints they leave, showing that they’re exceptionally intelligent and well-traveled, having explored practically every inch of Hyrule and claimed some of the most powerful and valuable items in the series.
Likewise, the fact that they even left hints and offered a way for future adventurers to find their spoils indicates a clear sense of honor, operating on Only Smart People May Pass logic puzzles to test the knowledge of treasure hunters. As far as we know, they were also never caught and all of their thefts seemed to have gone off without a hitch.
Also, their Cave of Chests shows that they have some funny Troll tendencies, as they loaded the cave with dozens of treasure chests that each contain a single rupee, with the chest containing the hint hidden somewhere among them as a needle-in-a-haystack prank.
Are They a Bastard? Too much?
Yeah. Again, we never actually see them commit any crimes, but the legends surrounding them indicate that they were a pretty notorious thief who is noted to be “infamous” for all the problems they caused during their life, and the treasures are all but outright stated to be spoils from their various thieving exploits.
That being said, while theft is wrong, it’s absolutely nothing compared to the general standards of the franchise, especially since this game in particular has the most monstrous and genocidal version of Ganondorf to date.
Verdict?
I think . Misko is a One-Eyed Willy type character who proves their brilliance from beyond the grave by leaving behind stolen treasures hidden through tricky riddles.
Edited by Remnant43 on Jan 30th 2024 at 2:03:26 PM
Balls idk
A Girl, Just One of Many Kinds
Yes to Misko!
Bump
Edited by MermaidEyes15 on Jan 28th 2024 at 5:34:35 AM
Keep Fighting. Keep Loving.
My proposal is King Ghidorah from Godzilla Neo.
History:
An ancient three-headed Draconic Abomination created by the Garoga, a race of insectoid aliens, to enforce their The Social Darwinist ideology. King Ghidorah's purpose is to act as a sort of Reset Button. He wipes the planet clean of life. Any life that survives is therefore stronger and better than its predecessor lifeforms. However, to call him a servant of the Garoga is inaccurate. Ghidorah serves none but himself. One day, he stumbles across an Insignificant Little Blue Planet called Earth 65 million years ago. He immediately starts killing off all life on the planet, only to be challenged and narrowly beaten by the Earth's Guardian, Gigamoth, precursor to Mothra and Battra. After which It's Personal. He first returns to Earth in 1965, in the Monster Zero War, where he aligns himself with the Xiliens. It's noted that the Xiliens couldn't actually control him, he was there of his own accord to settle his score, only to be defeated by Godzilla, Mothra, and the Earth's Kaiju. Following the injuries he sustained in this conflict, King Ghidorah concluded that he would need more power to take on Earth's defenders. And so he orchestrates a decades-long scheme. He finds the perfect pawn to set things in motion, the human-xilien hybrid son of Astronaut Glenn and Miss Namikawa. The boy was a powerful budding telepath, but severely unstable. King Ghidorah used his own psychic abilities to interact with the boy as a little voice in his head. A friend he could trust. Over the course of decades, Ghidorah subtly influences the boy's thoughts and actions, while enhancing his psychic abilities and augmenting them with his own. Eventually, under his guidance, the boy leaves Planet X entirely and settles on what he thought was a particularly large asteroid in the Asteroid Belt, but turned out to be the remains of a destroyed planet. The inhabitants of this asteroid, the Kilaaks, proved to be quite useful, as the boy's own intelligence proved to be an asset to upgrading their rudimentary technology into a powerful invasion force, thereby gaining their reverence. This, along with King Ghidorah's voice feeding his ambition, caused him to develop a God complex. The boy, now calling himself the Regulator, mustered his new army and marched on the Earth, the voice in his head now louder than ever before. The Regulator's Sanity Slippage finally reaches its Ax-Crazy zenith when he injects himself with a serum made from King Ghidorah's DNA to transform himself into Monster X.
The newly-made Monster X proved to be extremely powerful, managing to fight even the newly-resurrected Undead Abomination Ghost Godzilla to a draw. Now with the Earth subjugated and his new weapon tested on the field, Ghidorah finally makes his appearance. His first act is to psychically restrain and kill Monster X, taking his power.
The newly-christened Kaiser Ghidorah proves to be a One-Man Army even by Kaiju standards. With the combined strength of the Earth Defenders pitted against him being hopelessly one-sided in his favor. He's only defeated by the Heroic Sacrifice of Zilla Taking the Bullet for Godzilla, distracting him long enough for Godzilla, Mothra, and the EDF to unleash a final Desperation Attack that seemingly kills both Godzilla and Kaiser Ghidorah. Thus ends Operation: Final War...
... but not King Ghidorah! His maimed corpse is later found in a crater in Mongolia, his wings shredded beyond repair and his middle head missing, but still Not Quite Dead, and he still has enough psychic power left for one more plan. Using his power to play on the Earth Union leaders' Greed and fear, an initiative is started to Rebuild Him and use him as a weapon against the enemies of humanity, namely the Earth Defenders. Thus Mecha-King Ghidorah was born.
The cyborg's enhanced capabilities prove to be more than a match for the weakened Earth Defenders. And for the most part, humanity has been cheering him on as he slaughters the Earth's mightiest heroes. Only at the destruction of King Caesar did the people have a Heel Realization, but by this point, it's too little, too late. With the Earth Defenders dead, Mothra and Battra missing, and Godzilla nearly dead, King Ghidorah has won. Came Back Strong doesn't begin to describe it.
Following Operation: Destroy All Monsters, Mecha-King Ghidorah remained in orbit for months. Him and his pilot Emi Kano unresponsive to all outside hails. Until he detects a new calamity, his old enemy Godzilla has been reborn as Super Godzilla. Realizing the stakes, he chooses to forgo subtlety. Where he once used More than Mind Control on both the Regulator and Emi, he now uses outright Demonic Possession to take control of Emi and fly back to Earth for the Final Battle.
He initially challenges Super Godzilla one-on-one to try and finish off his Arch-Enemy once and for all, but soon realizes that his foe Took a Level in Badass to the extreme, as he's now able to fight Ghidorah on equal footing alone. After retreating, he soon learns that his old masters, the Garoga, have created a new monster to replace him. This new entity, known as Bagan, was currently locked in combat with Super Godzilla and the reborn Gigamoth. Having realized that no matter how hard he tried, or what new Evil Plan he has up his sleeve, Failure Is the Only Option when trying to destroy this Insignificant Little Blue Planet, he chooses to join the fray for one Last Dance, only this time, rather than make a move on Godzilla, he turns his weaponry on Bagan. Using his Capture Cables to restrain and stun Bagan, he weakens the beast long enough for Super Godzilla to use his most powerful Atomic Blast to atomize them both. And in a rare moment of compassion, he ejects Emi from the cockpit, saving her life. So ends the tale of King Ghidorah.
Is he Magnificent?
This incarnation of King Ghidorah repeatedly shows himself to be extremely intelligent as well as powerful, with his Chessmaster abilities on full display in Operation: Final War. And as Destroy All Monsters shows, he's also capable of highly effective Xanatos Speed Chess, having come back from his absolute lowest point to his absolute highest with nothing but subtle manipulation. And there are very few mitigating factors to speak of that I can find. Yes, he's capable of unimaginable cruelty by virtue of being an Omnicidal Maniac (though, that doesn't necessarily disqualify characters on its own, as Damien Darhk proves), but it never impedes him or crosses into Stupid Evil or Smug Snake territory. And as his Pet the Dog moment towards Emi shows, he's not entirely bereft of compassion, either.
Should note, he manages a The Bad Guy Wins in Destroy All Monsters. Yes, it's rendered a Pyrrhic Victory by factors he couldn't possibly control or anticipate, but for a substantial amount of time, King Ghidorah wins.
Is he a Bastard?
He is definitely a Bastard. As he doesn't lack for the destructiveness, cruelty or (initially, at least) Omnicidal Mania of his canon counterparts. And there's also his Corruption of The Regulator. However, he never crosses into Stupid Evil or wasteful cruelty. And he eventually even manages to pull a Heel–Face Turn and later Heroic Sacrifice by the end of his arc.
Final verdict, ladies and gentlemen?
So, thoughts? Does Neo!Ghidorah count as a MB or does he fail? I personally think he counts.
Edited by Arkhan-the-Black on Feb 28th 2024 at 7:01:55 PM
Misko
Here is the Rouge Writeup along with the new structure fir the IDW section
- Sonic the Hedgehog (IDW)
- Metal Sonic, having underwent upgrades during the events of Sonic Forces, discovers that the Eggman Empire has been defeated and that Eggman himself has gone missing. Shapeshifting into Eggman and ruling the empire in his place, Metal Sonic leads coordinated attacks across the world while searching for Eggman to have him regain his place as ruler of the Empire. After discovering that Knuckles is on the surface from his observations of Sonic, Metal Sonic takes over the unprotected Angel Island and obtains the Master Emerald, ensuring that he'll be able to negate Sonic's Super form if he tries to use it. Even when defeated, the mercy of the heroes allows Metal Sonic to find the amnesiac Eggman and succesfully restore his memories leading Eggman to return to his old ways. After the events of the Metal Virus, Metal Sonic single-handedy buys time for Eggman to escape by lying in wait and critically injuring Gemerl when the latter is about to apprehend Eggman. Proving to be as cunning as he was during Sonic Heroes while maintaining his loyalty to the doctor, Metal Sonic shows why Eggman views him as his greatest creation.
- Rouge the Bat, an affable and cunning spy Rouge is the first to discover the location of an amnesiac Eggman and to prevent Shadow from killing him or causing a scene she anonymously tips off Team Chaotix where Eggman is predicting that the Chaotix would call Sonic in and that Sonic would be able to talk down Shadow for her. She played a pivotal role during the Metal Virus incident leading evacuation of Sunset Citi and infiltrating the Face Ship abs warning Sonic and friends of the Deadly Six’s takeover. Using Orbot and Cubot as agents she located all the Chaos Emerald L’s across the world held by the Zeti. Allowing her teammates to launch a counterattack. Taking advantage of the chaos she managed to steal the last emerald powering the Faceship, destroying it as a means to spread the virus. As part of her personal heists Rouge is able to come out in top even against rivals and heroes taking advantage of Rumble and Tumble’s superstition and Tangles naivety to successfully claim her treasure. Just as capable as her game counterpart Rouge is a skilled, yet untrustworthy ally for Sonic and friends.
Edited by YorkobeShounen on Jan 28th 2024 at 2:53:14 AM
A Child from the Stars
Showtime!
to Misko and Ghidorah
Oh right, been a couple days so it's time for Echo (2024) discussion, which is smooth and easy: Kingpin has a pretty rough outing here but ends the series in a decent-ish spot and is obviously gearing up for his grandest scheme yet, so I'd say he's fine to stay but with a heavy emphasis on watching him. Echo herself probably hits this trope but I've no interest in actually proposing her so, up to anyone else if they feel she counts + wants to discuss her lol
Also reserving the upcoming Shogun series now that it's a month out.
Edited by Ravok on Jan 26th 2024 at 4:55:03 AM
Tonight I dine on monkey soup.