Misused: No Except Yes

It's not an isolated case.

https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/relatedsearch.php?term=Main/YesExceptNo

I'm not sure what to do with the last two wicks. I can't tell if they apply to this trope, another, or if it's just troper natter...

Both wicks taken care of. Both looked like misuse. Managed to get a better-fitting trope for the Overwatch character sheet one; the Nebraska! one I couldn't determine which trope fits it better, so I removed it.

The old trope name is No, Except Yes, and the new name is Distinction Without a Difference. Already listed on the forum thread, but not on the Renamed Tropes page.

Wicks still have hundreds to go.

edited 19th Nov '16 6:31:48 AM by Berrenta

I think the quote might cause some confusion. It starts off correctly, but then veers into By "No", I Mean "Yes".

I think you're right, Duck. It's a lovely quote, right up to the last three words, which is pure By "No", I Mean "Yes". Pity. If it ended at "decrees" it would be the perfect page quote.

I don't suppose we can just ...truncate it?

"What you don’t know is that we've decided to make the Saxxy’s a lot more like an illegal underground martial-arts bloodsport. That’s right: This year there are no rules. There are, however, a whole bunch of brutal laws, traditions, commandments, and decrees... ."

edited 19th Nov '16 8:31:57 AM by Madrugada

I've added this to the Renamed Tropes page, and put By "No", I Mean "Yes" vs Distinction Without a Difference on both the Canonical List of Subtle Trope Distinctions and Laconical List of Subtle Trope Distinctions. Someone else want to check those entries to be sure they're correct and clear, please?

Found out that the trope went through a rename before; it was "This is Pest Control" before it was "No Except Yes". Merged the entries.

Truncating the quote works for me.

The distinction entries are clear, just had a bit wrong formatting and grammar, unless it's a regional variant I'm not familiar with.

edited 19th Nov '16 3:04:12 PM by AnotherDuck

Nope. Just me fat-fingering on the Canonical and forgetting the right markup on Laconical. . :P Thanks.

edited 19th Nov '16 3:25:23 PM by Madrugada

Wicks remaining 735

600 to go. Must've done 50 or more today.

edited 24th Dec '16 8:28:21 AM by Gosicrystal

500 remaining.

And another hundred down!

Can someone take a look at Overwhelming Exception, in particular de "in its most extreme form"? The wick that was originally after that was No, Except Yes, and I changed it to Distinction Without a Difference back in December... But I think it makes much more sense that Overwhelming Exception's original writer mistook No, Except Yes with By "No", I Mean "Yes". Is it good as it is right now?

Yes, it's correct now.

Update on wicks: We now have less than 50 to go.

Yeah, I migrated quite a bit of them. Speaking of which, I have collected the remaining borderline/ambiguous examples on this list, and I'd like you guys to tell me which are genuine examples and which aren't. It's 43 of them, and I have put my thoughts in small font at the end of some examples.

• Jupiter Ascending: Balem's "I CREATE LIFE!!! ...And I destroy it" line is in response to Jupiter's Armor-Piercing Question of what his mother taught him was necessary to rule: "Like killing people?".
• Katawa Shoujo:
  Kenji: That blind broad is up to no good. I can feel it in my spleen, man. Her presence is like a dark shadow that's in the way of my great vision! As expected of blind people.
  Hisao: What. *beat* Wait a second, aren't you-
  Kenji: "Only legally."
• Last Week Tonight with John Oliver: Just two days after he ran the FIFA II episode talking about the arrests in the FIFA scandal, the universally hated president of FIFA Sepp Blatter RESIGNED. Oliver at the time, due to the unlikelihood of Blatter leaving office, mockingly asked FIFA sponsors in the previous episode to pull support in order to pressure Blatter by saying he'd wear a truly ridiculous pair of Adidas shoes, take a bite out of everything in the Dollar Menu at McDonald's, and even drink a Bud Light Lime. Despite the fact that there was no indication of any of those companies pulling sponsorship or that Blatter resigning was because of them, Oliver proved he was a man of his word and did ALL THREE; special mention goes to the Bud Light Lime segment: while he said he'd claim it was delicious, he never said about anything he'd say before drinking it.
• M*A*S*H S1 E18: Dear Dad...Again: This is how Henry replies to Radar asking if his performance at his test so far is a problem. It's also how he reveals he knows Radar's cheating.
  Henry: No, no. No. No, your answers are right. You just memorised them in the wrong order.
• Mother 3, under Mis-blamed: Nintendo often gets railed at by fans for not releasing this game in America and the rest of the world. Except the game is a landmine of licensing issues, from the direct AC-DC parody to riffs from popular shows. Additionally, it was released near the end of the Advance's lifespan, and sales in Japan were somewhat lackluster.^note  This game was released in 2006. The Nintendo DS was released in 2004, and by 2006 had already established itself on the international markets, with stores beginning to phase out Game Boy Advance titles as early as late 2005. Not to mention the fact that EarthBound itself was a commercial failure at the time, which likely soured any attempt made. This doesn't stop the fans though, including one memorable instance where Yahtzee himself claimed it would sell better than Mario Kart.
• Mother 3: During the Mushroom Samba trip, when looking in one of the mailboxes, this text pops up:
  "There's nothing inside... except for hundreds of rat corpses." I think the distinction here is important enough to not be an example of the trope.
• Neverwinter Nights 2, under Unlucky Childhood Friend: It's implied if you're a woman by at least one character that Bevil has a crush on you, especially if you chose the Flirt background. If you ask him about it, he gets flustered and winds up saying something to the tune of No, Except Yes. Nothing comes of it, but there it is.
• Power Rangers in Space S1E1: From Out of Nowhere: Part 1 and Power Rangers in Space, under Antagonist in Mourning: Prior to their fight, when Rita hears that Divatox destroyed the Turbo Rangers, she reacts this way even asking Zedd if it was true.
  Rita: Is that true? Did she really destroy the Power Rangers?
  Zedd: Well... it is the universal gossip.
• Puyo Puyo: He's not exactly Klug, even if his posture when he's laughing or pointing is exactly the same.
• RebelTaxi: The extremely drawn-out, and not entirely sincere, Shout-Out he gives to the person who mailed him the DVD.
  "Thhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhank you?"
• Rebuild of Evangelion: As Fuyutsuki shuts down each of the SEELE monoliths in 3.0, a brief flash of a brain shines in black and white, indicating that the monoliths may be their actual person.
• Red vs. Blue: Yes, it takes place in Blood Gulch. But there may be a reason it looks different, other than because of the new engine used. So it takes place in Blood Gulch... but in a different Blood Gulch.
• Robotics;Notes: You are led to believe that the killer of the entire staff of Gunvarrel was actually crazy enough to begin with but the others involved were not. It turns out later on that the creators were the ones who were actually crazy because they were brainwashed and the person who killed them involuntarily got free of said brainwashing, but this came after the revelation that Gunvarrel was supposed to make everyone crazy.
• Rocky and Bullwinkle: From the "Mr. Know-it-all" segment "How to Catch a Bee":
  Bullwinkle: But if you're in Death Valley, the task becomes a little tougher, but not surmountable. I'm assuming it's By "No", I Mean "Yes" because he first implies that it's surmountable and then says that it isn't?
• Safehold: After Duchairn overthrows Clyntahn, the Grand Vicar refuses to abolish the Punishment of Schueler, as it is explicitly mentioned in the Writ. However, to prevent the abuses that took place in the war, where one man could unilaterally subject people to the Punishment on his own authority without any hope of appeal, he sets up rules that have to be followed in order to sentence someone to the Punishment, which are so stringent that it's unlikely that the Punishment will ever be used again.
• Scooby-Doo! and KISS: Rock and Roll Mystery: One of the Kiss Members states that only once has Chikara's prediction been wrong, as she claimed one of their records would get to Gold. It went to platinum. ^note It has to pass Gold to be a Platinum Record
• Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri, under Deadly Euphemism: War has become something of a taboo among the Unity factions. So how do they get past the "never again" clause? By declaring "vendettas".
• Smogon: The best way to describe the old Ubers tier. It was considered a banlist first, meaning that no Pokémon can be banned from it and little effort is made to balance it out. While it functioned similarly to the other tiers because there are enough Pokémon for it to do so, it is blatantly overcentralized around the biggest Game Breakers in the franchise and the tournaments for it only exist because of Rule of Fun. While things can get banned from Ubers (which is essentially a full-game ban), they have to be so ridiculously abusive, unreasonably difficult to counter, and just plain brain-dead as to make leaving them unbanned toxic to the entire game.
  The role has shifted to the Anything Goes tier, with the conversion of Ubers to a standard tier and Mega Rayquaza being banned from Ubers^note though Mega Gengar very nearly wound up there first, and there have been calls for Primal Groudon to go there as well.
• Son of the Black Sword: Thera points out to Ashok that his borrowed clothes have bloodstains because:
  Thera: A Protector accused our last barge captain of smuggling and stabbed him through the heart.
  Ashok: Was he guilty?
  Thera:: Yes, but that's beside the point.
• South Park S 7 E 2 Krazy Kripples: Reeve's wants to be referred to as Chris instead of Christopher. Is this Insistent Terminology? They Call Me MISTER Tibbs!?
• Star Trek Online - Foundry - “Honor of _” Series, under Shameful Strip: Part of (unseen) Ferasan exiles' punishment. Individuals are left with nothing but their bodies alive and unharmed. Averted in practice, but still part of the punishment for exiling entire clans. They are left their clothes but it is only to reinforce what they are losing. Within a year or two most clans are naked (no way to obtain replacement cloth) and feral, the deterioration of clothes resembling the dissolution of the Clan's civility. The fact this ''didn't'' happen to the Shiassi was a warning sign to the Patriarchy.
• Star Trek Voyager S 1 E 1 "Caretaker": When Tuvok admits to Chakotay that he's Janeway's spy:
  Chakotay: Were you going to deliver us into their waiting hands, Vulcan?
  Tuvok: My mission was to accumulate information on Maquis activities... and then deliver you into their "waiting hands". That is correct. Is this By "No", I Mean "Yes" or not even that?
• Star Trek Voyager S 4 E 6 The Raven: Seven says that creativity and imagination aren't necessary. Janeway agrees, but says they're important to one's life.
• Straight Outta Compton: Jerry Heller maintained the scene where Eazy-E was beaten up by Suge Knight's goons was inaccurate... mostly because they didn't beat him up since they would have [[killed]] [[him if he didn't sign over Dre's contract]].
• Supernatural S 05 E 03 Free To Be You And Me: Cas does this multiple times throughout the episode.
  [looking at Raphael's catatonic vessel]
  Dean: So, this is what I'm looking at if Michael jumps my bones?
  Castiel: No, not at all. Michael is much more powerful. It will be far worse for you.
  [later, talking about trapping Raphael]
  Dean: You keep saying we're gonna trap this guy. Isn't that kinda like trapping a hurricane with a butterfly net?
  Castiel: No, it's harder.
• Sword Art Online Abridged: Kirito enjoys cruelly creative Yes Except No's. For instance, telling Asuna he'll give her the rare coat if she just sends him a trade request (but she'd told him she doesn't know how to open the menu). Or saying he'll share his super-rare food with Tiffany — he can just join them at Asuna's house (he knows Tiffany can't stand being around Asuna).
• The Ben Chatham Adventures: Ben Chatham: Gay, drunk archaeologist and former companion of the Tenth Doctor. Member of Operation Delta, which is basically UNIT but not as good.
• The Big Bang Theory: Sheldon appears on NPR to explain magnetic monopoles, while Kripke fills his office with helium. Later on, Sheldon is sulking in his bed while Leonard tries to plant an idea of revenge.
  Leonard: Are you really admitting defeat?
  Sheldon: I never admit defeat.
  Leonard: Good.
  Sheldon: However, on a completely unrelated topic, I am never getting out of this bed again.
• The Coroner Doth Protest Too Much:
  Odo: Five operatives were killed yesterday?
  Informant: Killed? No! Three died from natural causes. The other two perished in accidents. I think there is an important distinction between murder and non-murder. At best, it could be that the informant is outright lying, but that's another trope entirely.
• The Frollo Show: In episode 5, when Mephiles tries to guess if Madoka is 14 years old or not.
  Marco Antonio Regil: ¿Cómo es la respuesta? (What's your final answer?)
  Mephiles: The answer is yes... and no. This one I know isn't an example of DWAD, but what would it be instead? By "No", I Mean "Yes"? Memphiles is saying both things at the same time...
• The Greening Wars, under Killer Rabbit: Towns near the glow have posters warning about these.
  Hatchet: Relax, mermaid. Poster exaggerates to scare stupid tourists. Carnivorous rabbit prefers insects. Now giant rats, THEY eat hand. I think this one might be Bait-and-Switch Comment.
• The Hunt for Red October, under The Mutiny: Inverted, Lampshaded, and glibly noted to be academic. An American officer calls it a mutiny, only to be told that "mutiny" is when the crew rises against officers. When the officers try to steal their ship, the correct term is "barratry". Doesn't mean that the Kremlin's not going to be furious someone stole their Super Prototype boat.
• The Last Spartan: At the beginning of Chapter 42, the author announces that the Chief will finally meet Shepard... sort of. It turns out he meant The Chief contacts an ODST Lieutenant named Mark Vanderloo, who's named after the Dutch underwear model on whom Male!Shepard's default appearance is based. He does allude to some of Shepard's more memetically famous attributes as well.
• The Mysterious Mr. Enter, under Take That!: His crossover review of "Truth or Square".
  Mr. Enter: Wikipedia calls it a movie. And this is why we don't use Wikipedia to make our reviews.
  PIEGUYRULZ: Hey! Wikipedia is a wealth of information, and lies. Mostly lies. Is this By "No", I Mean "Yes"? Not sure if "A and B. Well, B." is a variation.
• The Princess And The Frog:
  Mr. La Bouff: All right now, princess, you're gettin' that dress, but that's it. No more Mr. Pushover. Now who wants a puppy?
• The Princess Diaries: When Olivia comes home with a bloody nose and says she wants to live with Mia and Phillipe, her aunt says, "That's not what you want . . . to grow up to be some snobby, rich princess?"
  Olivia: No! Of course not! I don't want to live with you because all you cared about when I walked in was getting the stain out of your stupid carpet. ''They'' cared about what happened to me. That's why I want to go live with them.
• The West Wing S 01 E 21 Lies Damn Lies And Statistics: Played with:
  Ambassador Cochran: Mr. President. Clearly this young man, who works for you, has told you something about our past, and I’d like to say here and now...
  President Bartlet: It doesn't have anything to do with... Oh, wait a second. You two have a past?
  Charlie: Sir?
  President Bartlet: You mocked my finely-honed sense!
• The Wicker Man: "Now you can wrap it up any way you like, but you are about to commit murder."
• The Wire: Police Commanders, under Politically Incorrect Villain: Despite Norman's lack of amusement, Rawls words it beautifully to Carcetti.
  I'm no more racist than you are, Mr. Mayor.
• Tropes M to R: Or rather, Yes, Except No. Ashes of Victory says that Sphinxian koi actually do look like Terran koi, "allowing for the absence of scales, the extra fins, and the horizontal flukes of the tail". I think this one might be Overwhelming Exception, if I'm understanding the example correctly (haven't seen the work).
• Tropes M to T: All the time. Frequently literal variations, such as a bacon cheeseburger with no bacon, but not a cheeseburger which becomes the same bacon cheeseburger upon adding, you guessed that, bacon. Frequently a Pyrrhic Victory for the customer as well, as the typical customer's "cashier is always trying to cheat me" attitude makes them blind to the above logic and they insist on paying for the more expensive thing without including the ingredients that make it more expensive.
  • Subverted in this example.
  • Another subversion: An iced coffee without the coffee is not milk and ice, but milk, ice, and tea.
• Tsubasa Abridged: Yuuko explaining how the group's wishes are "the same". Syaoran... doesn't quite get it.
• Undertale Against Humanity: Mettaton plays with this when he plays "Climaxing at Asriel's funeral". First he embraces the card's meaning, then says that it means reaching the climax of a performance. When asked if he was performing at Asriel's funeral, he responds with "Performing sexual acts, yes!".
• Utawarerumono: Karura wants a sword, but breaks any that she wields. Hakuoro hands her a club and she throws it aside. They then order a custom-made sword specifically for her such that it would not break, dull or bend and end up with a massive sword that has no real blade and can't even be picked up by a single person. Karura lifts it up easily and swings it around... but that's still just a club, when you get down to it.
• Valkyrie Profile, under Narm Charm: On the other hand, Grey's ICICLE DISASTER! The fanbase has found amusement in reciting the game's quotes, in similar manner to Star Fox 64.
• X-Men: First Class: Emma Frost interrupts the CIA Director and Stryker Sr. when they're discussing the possibility of a war. She prefers not to use that term; it implies that both sides have an equal chance of winning. Could this be "Blackmail" Is Such an Ugly Word or the supertrope Insistent Terminology?
• Yamara: The Frinn don't usually give straight answers to anything.
  Yamara (of the Headpiece of Frinn): But tell me - is it dangerous to handle?
  Frinn #1: Not at all.
  Frinn #2: It is an honor.
  Frinn #3: Define "dangerous".

edited 10th Feb '17 12:14:25 PM by Gosicrystal

• Jupiter Ascending: Balem's "I CREATE LIFE!!! ...And I destroy it" line is in response to Jupiter's Armor-Piercing Question of what his mother taught him was necessary to rule: "Like killing people?".

Neither

• Katawa Shoujo:
  Kenji: That blind broad is up to no good. I can feel it in my spleen, man. Her presence is like a dark shadow that's in the way of my great vision! As expected of blind people.
  Hisao: What. *beat* Wait a second, aren't you-
  Kenji: "Only legally."

Neither Legally blind means their vision is impaired beyond a certain set threshold. I'm "legally blind" without my glasses, but I'm far from actually blind.

• Last Week Tonight with John Oliver: Just two days after he ran the FIFA II episode talking about the arrests in the FIFA scandal, the universally hated president of FIFA Sepp Blatter RESIGNED. Oliver at the time, due to the unlikelihood of Blatter leaving office, mockingly asked FIFA sponsors in the previous episode to pull support in order to pressure Blatter by saying he'd wear a truly ridiculous pair of Adidas shoes, take a bite out of everything in the Dollar Menu at McDonald's, and even drink a Bud Light Lime. Despite the fact that there was no indication of any of those companies pulling sponsorship or that Blatter resigning was because of them, Oliver proved he was a man of his word and did ALL THREE; special mention goes to the Bud Light Lime segment: while he said he'd claim it was delicious, he never said about anything he'd say before drinking it.

Neither

• M*A*S*H S1 E18: Dear Dad...Again: This is how Henry replies to Radar asking if his performance at his test so far is a problem. It's also how he reveals he knows Radar's cheating.
  Henry: No, no. No. No, your answers are right. You just memorised them in the wrong order.

I assume the question Radar asked was something along the lines of "Are my answers wrong?" If that's the case, Henry's answer is Distinction Without a Difference. It that isn't the way Radar framed the question, it's neither.

• Mother 3, under Mis-blamed: Nintendo often gets railed at by fans for not releasing this game in America and the rest of the world. Except the game is a landmine of licensing issues, from the direct AC-DC parody to riffs from popular shows. Additionally, it was released near the end of the Advance's lifespan, and sales in Japan were somewhat lackluster.^note  This game was released in 2006. The Nintendo DS was released in 2004, and by 2006 had already established itself on the international markets, with stores beginning to phase out Game Boy Advance titles as early as late 2005. Not to mention the fact that EarthBound itself was a commercial failure at the time, which likely soured any attempt made. This doesn't stop the fans though, including one memorable instance where Yahtzee himself claimed it would sell better than Mario Kart.

No. BNIMY in this case would be "they're blamed for not releasing it in America, but they did. The fact that there a good reasons that they didn't doesn't change that they didn't.

• Mother 3: During the Mushroom Samba trip, when looking in one of the mailboxes, this text pops up:
  "There's nothing inside... except for hundreds of rat corpses."

• Neverwinter Nights 2, under Unlucky Childhood Friend: It's implied if you're a woman by at least one character that Bevil has a crush on you, especially if you chose the Flirt background. If you ask him about it, he gets flustered and winds up saying something to the tune of No, Except Yes. Nothing comes of it, but there it is.

BNIMY

• Power Rangers in Space S1E1: From Out of Nowhere: Part 1 and Power Rangers in Space, under Antagonist in Mourning: Prior to their fight, when Rita hears that Divatox destroyed the Turbo Rangers, she reacts this way even asking Zedd if it was true.
  Rita: Is that true? Did she really destroy the Power Rangers?
  Zedd: Well... it is the universal gossip.

Neither. He doesn't deny it first then backpedal, nor does he use a different word for the same thing. He evades answering.

• Puyo Puyo: He's not exactly Klug, even if his posture when he's laughing or pointing is exactly the same.

Neither.

• RebelTaxi: The extremely drawn-out, and not entirely sincere, Shout-Out he gives to the person who mailed him the DVD.
  "Thhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhank you?"

Neither.

• Rebuild of Evangelion: As Fuyutsuki shuts down each of the SEELE monoliths in 3.0, a brief flash of a brain shines in black and white, indicating that the monoliths may be their actual person.

Neither.

• Red vs. Blue: Yes, it takes place in Blood Gulch. But there may be a reason it looks different, other than because of the new engine used. So it takes place in Blood Gulch... but in a different Blood Gulch.

BNIMY

• Robotics;Notes: You are led to believe that the killer of the entire staff of Gunvarrel was actually crazy enough to begin with but the others involved were not. It turns out later on that the creators were the ones who were actually crazy because they were brainwashed and the person who killed them involuntarily got free of said brainwashing, but this came after the revelation that Gunvarrel was supposed to make everyone crazy.

I'm not sure I followed that, but I think Neither

edited 10th Feb '17 1:57:40 PM by Madrugada

Madrugada, it seems like when you say No, Except Yes you mean By "No", I Mean "Yes". When I ask if all 43 examples are examples of this trope, I mean of Distinction Without a Difference.

Courtesy reminder, because I myself get the two mixed when evaluating:

Then again, if you weren't mistaking them, disregard.

edited 10th Feb '17 12:58:21 PM by Gosicrystal

• Rocky and Bullwinkle: From the "Mr. Know-it-all" segment "How to Catch a Bee":
  Bullwinkle: But if you're in Death Valley, the task becomes a little tougher, but not surmountable.

I'm assuming it's By "No", I Mean "Yes" because he first implies that it's surmountable and then says that it isn't? If that quote is accurate, it would be BNIMY —he says it's one thing, then says it's the opposite. I'll dig out my DV Ds and check to see if the quote is accurate.

• Safehold: After Duchairn overthrows Clyntahn, the Grand Vicar refuses to abolish the Punishment of Schueler, as it is explicitly mentioned in the Writ. However, to prevent the abuses that took place in the war, where one man could unilaterally subject people to the Punishment on his own authority without any hope of appeal, he sets up rules that have to be followed in order to sentence someone to the Punishment, which are so stringent that it's unlikely that the Punishment will ever be used again.

Neither

• Scooby-Doo! and KISS: Rock and Roll Mystery: One of the Kiss Members states that only once has Chikara's prediction been wrong, as she claimed one of their records would get to Gold. It went to platinum. ^note It has to pass Gold to be a Platinum Record

''Errgh. Shoehorn, I think. A pedant could argue that she was wrong, I suppose."

• Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri, under Deadly Euphemism: War has become something of a taboo among the Unity factions. So how do they get past the "never again" clause? By declaring "vendettas".

Distinction Without a Difference

• Smogon: The best way to describe the old Ubers tier. It was considered a banlist first, meaning that no Pokémon can be banned from it and little effort is made to balance it out. While it functioned similarly to the other tiers because there are enough Pokémon for it to do so, it is blatantly overcentralized around the biggest Game Breakers in the franchise and the tournaments for it only exist because of Rule of Fun. While things can get banned from Ubers (which is essentially a full-game ban), they have to be so ridiculously abusive, unreasonably difficult to counter, and just plain brain-dead as to make leaving them unbanned toxic to the entire game.
  The role has shifted to the Anything Goes tier, with the conversion of Ubers to a standard tier and Mega Rayquaza being banned from Ubers^note though Mega Gengar very nearly wound up there first, and there have been calls for Primal Groudon to go there as well.

What!?! My head hurts reading that. I have no idea

• Son of the Black Sword: Thera points out to Ashok that his borrowed clothes have bloodstains because:
  Thera: A Protector accused our last barge captain of smuggling and stabbed him through the heart.
  Ashok: Was he guilty?
  Thera:: Yes, but that's beside the point.

Neither.

• South Park S 7 E 2 Krazy Kripples: Reeve's wants to be referred to as Chris instead of Christopher.

Is this Insistent Terminology? They Call Me MISTER Tibbs!? One or the other of those, yes. Not sure which one right now.. I think probably Insistent Terminology.

• Star Trek Online - Foundry - “Honor of _” Series, under Shameful Strip: Part of (unseen) Ferasan exiles' punishment. Individuals are left with nothing but their bodies alive and unharmed. Averted in practice, but still part of the punishment for exiling entire clans. They are left their clothes but it is only to reinforce what they are losing. Within a year or two most clans are naked (no way to obtain replacement cloth) and feral, the deterioration of clothes resembling the dissolution of the Clan's civility. The fact this ''didn't'' happen to the Shiassi was a warning sign to the Patriarchy.

''No. Neither.]]

• Star Trek Voyager S 1 E 1 "Caretaker": When Tuvok admits to Chakotay that he's Janeway's spy:
  Chakotay: Were you going to deliver us into their waiting hands, Vulcan?
  Tuvok: My mission was to accumulate information on Maquis activities... and then deliver you into their "waiting hands". That is correct.

Is this By "No", I Mean "Yes" or not even that? Neither. He doesn't say "No...well, yes" or "not 'A', but 'a' ". He expands on the question but answers it flat out.

• Star Trek Voyager S 4 E 6 The Raven: Seven says that creativity and imagination aren't necessary. Janeway agrees, but says they're important to one's life.

Neither. Necessary and important are not the same thing, or even functionally the same.

• Straight Outta Compton: Jerry Heller maintained the scene where Eazy-E was beaten up by Suge Knight's goons was inaccurate... mostly because they didn't beat him up since they would have [[killed]] [[him if he didn't sign over Dre's contract]].

If I'm understanding this, his beef with the accuracy of the beating scene is that they wouldn't have simply beaten him, they would have killed him?. If that's the case, it's Neither. There's no backpedalling for BNIMY, and beating and killing is a significant difference, so not Distinction Without a Difference.

• Supernatural S 05 E 03 Free To Be You And Me: Cas does this multiple times throughout the episode.
  [looking at Raphael's catatonic vessel]
  Dean: So, this is what I'm looking at if Michael jumps my bones?
  Castiel: No, not at all. Michael is much more powerful. It will be far worse for you.
  [later, talking about trapping Raphael]
  Dean: You keep saying we're gonna trap this guy. Isn't that kinda like trapping a hurricane with a butterfly net?
  Castiel: No, it's harder.

Neither example is either trope.

• Sword Art Online Abridged: Kirito enjoys cruelly creative Yes Except No's. For instance, telling Asuna he'll give her the rare coat if she just sends him a trade request (but she'd told him she doesn't know how to open the menu). Or saying he'll share his super-rare food with Tiffany — he can just join them at Asuna's house (he knows Tiffany can't stand being around Asuna).

No. Not at all. Sadistic Choice, perhaps, or something else along those lines. Maybe a Catch-22 Dilemma for the first example.

• The Ben Chatham Adventures: Ben Chatham: Gay, drunk archaeologist and former companion of the Tenth Doctor. Member of Operation Delta, which is basically UNIT but not as good.

Neither. Not as written, at least.

• The Big Bang Theory: Sheldon appears on NPR to explain magnetic monopoles, while Kripke fills his office with helium. Later on, Sheldon is sulking in his bed while Leonard tries to plant an idea of revenge.
  Leonard: Are you really admitting defeat?
  Sheldon: I never admit defeat.
  Leonard: Good.
  Sheldon: However, on a completely unrelated topic, I am never getting out of this bed again.

Distinction Without a Difference: I never admit defeat. I am, however, giving up."

• The Coroner Doth Protest Too Much:
  Odo: Five operatives were killed yesterday?
  Informant: Killed? No! Three died from natural causes. The other two perished in accidents.

I think there is an important distinction between murder and non-murder. At best, it could be that the informant is outright lying, but that's another trope entirely. Fully agree. The distinction is major.

• The Frollo Show: In episode 5, when Mephiles tries to guess if Madoka is 14 years old or not.
  Marco Antonio Regil: ¿Cómo es la respuesta? (What's your final answer?)
  Mephiles: The answer is yes... and no.

This one I know isn't an example of DWAD, but what would it be instead? By "No", I Mean "Yes"? Memphiles is saying both things at the same time... That's a Mathematician's Answer.

• The Greening Wars, under Killer Rabbit: Towns near the glow have warning about these.
  Hatchet: Relax, mermaid. Poster exaggerates to scare stupid tourists. Carnivorous rabbit prefers insects. Now giant rats, THEY eat hand.

I think this one might be Bait-and-Switch Comment. Agree with you.

• The Hunt for Red October, under The Mutiny: Inverted, Lampshaded, and glibly noted to be academic. An American officer calls it a mutiny, only to be told that "mutiny" is when the crew rises against officers. When the officers try to steal their ship, the correct term is "barratry". Doesn't mean that the Kremlin's not going to be furious someone stole their Super Prototype boat.

Nope. Not No, Except Yes. Probably another one, but I'm not sure what we have for " a distinction that most people wouldn't care about but which can be very important to a specialized group." ... ah. "You Keep Using That Word"

• The Last Spartan: At the beginning of Chapter 42, the author announces that the Chief will finally meet Shepard... sort of. It turns out he meant The Chief contacts an ODST Lieutenant named Mark Vanderloo, who's named after the Dutch underwear model on whom Male!Shepard's default appearance is based. He does allude to some of Shepard's more memetically famous attributes as well.

No. Neither.

• The Mysterious Mr. Enter, under Take That!: His crossover review of "Truth or Square".
  Mr. Enter: Wikipedia calls it a movie. And this is why we don't use Wikipedia to make our reviews.
  PIEGUYRULZ: Hey! Wikipedia is a wealth of information, and lies. Mostly lies.

Is this By "No", I Mean "Yes"? Not sure if "A and B. Well, B." is a variation. No. Not an example. "A and B. Mostly B." doesn't deny that some A exists as well.

• The Princess And The Frog:
  Mr. La Bouff: All right now, princess, you're gettin' that dress, but that's it. No more Mr. Pushover. Now who wants a puppy?

Hmmmm. Could be, but needs a bit more context. Was she asking for just the dress? for the dress and a puppy? for a whole list of things, including the dress? Personally, I'd remove it to the discussion page as "insufficient information as written".

• The Princess Diaries: When Olivia comes home with a bloody nose and says she wants to live with Mia and Phillipe, her aunt says, "That's not what you want . . . to grow up to be some snobby, rich princess?"
  Olivia: No! Of course not! I don't want to live with you because all you cared about when I walked in was getting the stain out of your stupid carpet. ''They'' cared about what happened to me. That's why I want to go live with them.

No. Neither. There's no backpedalling from No, to yes for BYIMN, and no use of two different names for the same thing, for DWAD.

• The West Wing S 01 E 21 Lies Damn Lies And Statistics: Played with:
  Ambassador Cochran: Mr. President. Clearly this young man, who works for you, has told you something about our past, and I’d like to say here and now...
  President Bartlet: It doesn't have anything to do with... Oh, wait a second. You two have a past?
  Charlie: Sir?
  President Bartlet: You mocked my finely-honed sense!

Insufficient information; how is it being played with? I'm not seeing it. I'd cut it, myself.

• The Wicker Man: "Now you can wrap it up any way you like, but you are about to commit murder."

No.

• The Wire: Police Commanders, under Politically Incorrect Villain: Despite Norman's lack of amusement, Rawls words it beautifully to Carcetti.
  I'm no more racist than you are, Mr. Mayor.

No. No backpedaling.

• Tropes M to R: Or rather, Yes, Except No. Ashes of Victory says that Sphinxian koi actually do look like Terran koi, "allowing for the absence of scales, the extra fins, and the horizontal flukes of the tail".

I think this one might be Overwhelming Exception, if I'm understanding the example correctly (haven't seen the work). Agree. It's also a Dissimile.

• Tropes M to T: All the time. Frequently literal variations, such as a bacon cheeseburger with no bacon, but not a cheeseburger which becomes the same bacon cheeseburger upon adding, you guessed that, bacon. Frequently a Pyrrhic Victory for the customer as well, as the typical customer's "cashier is always trying to cheat me" attitude makes them blind to the above logic and they insist on paying for the more expensive thing without including the ingredients that make it more expensive.

DWAD. " I don't want a cheeseburger, I want a bacon-cheeseburger with no bacon."

• Tsubasa Abridged: Yuuko explaining how the group's wishes are "the same". Syaoran... doesn't quite get it.

Insufficient context.

• Undertale Against Humanity: Mettaton plays with this when he plays "Climaxing at Asriel's funeral". First he embraces the card's meaning, then says that it means reaching the climax of a performance. When asked if he was performing at Asriel's funeral, he responds with "Performing sexual acts, yes!".

No. Like the Star Trek one, he's adding information, not denying something then admitting it.

• Utawarerumono: Karura wants a sword, but breaks any that she wields. Hakuoro hands her a club and she throws it aside. They then order a custom-made sword specifically for her such that it would not break, dull or bend and end up with a massive sword that has no real blade and can't even be picked up by a single person. Karura lifts it up easily and swings it around... but that's still just a club, when you get down to it.

DWAD. "It's not a club, it's a sword with no separate blade and no edge, and made from a huge chunk of stuff".

• Valkyrie Profile, under Narm Charm: On the other hand, Grey's ICICLE DISASTER! The fanbase has found amusement in reciting the game's quotes, in similar manner to Star Fox 64.

No, sinkhole and natter, from the looks of it. It appears that this is an attempt to make this entry tie in with the one above it (I'm guessing "Narm")?

• X-Men: First Class: Emma Frost interrupts the CIA Director and Stryker Sr. when they're discussing the possibility of a war. She prefers not to use that term; it implies that both sides have an equal chance of winning.

Could this be "Blackmail" Is Such an Ugly Word or the supertrope Insistent Terminology? Yes, could be either one.

• Yamara: The Frinn don't usually give straight answers to anything.
  Yamara (of the Headpiece of Frinn): But tell me - is it dangerous to handle?
  Frinn #1: Not at all.
  Frinn #2: It is an honor.
  Frinn #3: Define "dangerous".

No, Neither DWADD or BYIMN.

edited 10th Feb '17 2:05:06 PM by Madrugada

Thank you for clarifying. I went back and edited.

Just delete the Smogon example. A dedicated cleanup for that page is on my never get done do-to list.

edited 24th Feb '17 1:52:42 PM by Karxrida

I told nicktoonhero to double-check their edits on [1], because they put "No" Means "Yes". They replaced it with Distinction Without a Difference. The back-and-forth seems more similar to By "No", I Mean "Yes", right? Like in the M*A*S*H episode "To Market, To Market"?