To-do list:
- Alluring Anglerfish was disambiguated between Fiendish Fish and Luring in Prey, so move any wicks that fit, and remove ones that don't fit another trope.
- Alluring Anglerfish: Supposed to be about anglerfish representation in media as Fiendish Fish who use their glowing lures to hunt their prey, but many pages apply it to anything that possesses a lure to lure its prey into false sense of security, no matter whenever they even remotely resemble anglerfishes or are even fish in question, and no matter whether the lure in question is a glowing anglerfish lure. (Wick check here.)
The wick check found that out of 50 examples:
- Only 16% were correct.
- 34% were misuse.
- 40% were ZCEs.
- And 10% were unclear.
There were several types of misuse:
- Characters who used lures, but who weren't anglerfish. Some weren't even fish.
- Characters who had lights that resembled anglerfish lures but weren't anglerfish and didn't use their lights as lures.
- Anglerfish exist, but there's no mention of them being scary or using their lures.
So, what should be done? Should we rename it? Should we split off some of the misuse to other tropes (obviously "anglerfish exist" is PSOC but what about the other ones?). Discuss here.
Wick check:
This is a page for the Wick Check related to the trope Alluring Anglerfish.Reasons for the check: Alluring Anglerfish is meant to be about anglerfish as Fiendish Fish, using their lures to hunt their prey. However, it's misused as any character who uses a lure, regardless of whether it resembles an anglerfish lure or if they are fish.
- WesternAnimation.Finding Nemo: Provides the unsettling page image for said trope. Terribly-written example, but I've seen the movie, and it's definitely an example.
- This Is Gonna Suck: Marlin's reaction to realizing the light he and Dory have been following in the deeps is from a ferocious Alluring Anglerfish. "Good feeling's gone..." Correct writeup, example fits.
- Wakfu.Tropes A To C: We follow such a fish at the beginning of season 1 episode 16. After eating a smaller fish attracted by the light of its lure, it ventures in the sunken ship of the heroes... and gets fried by a Noxine. Probably correct.
- MuggingTheMonster.Real Life: The Alluring Anglerfish and other predators that use the strategy attract small fish that think their lure is just a piece of food, when it's actually a giant fish. Or a matamata turtle. Real-life anglerfish luring their prey.
- Fridge.My Little Pony The Movie 2017: The sea ponies have anglerfish lights, as for what they'd be used for
... ZCE, but link leads to a correct example.
- WebAnimation.Star Star Space: There is a Bermuda Triangle IN SPACE!! with usual associations: Faulty Technology, Missing Crews and Ships and a storm. At the center there is an Alluring Anglerfish with a lure in from of a triangle. It's implied that the anglerfish is what makes the area bad.
- After the end credits of Finding Nemo, an angler fish approaches a tiny fish... which then opens its jaws wide enough to swallow the angler in one gulp. Doesn't explain it in the link, but she was an actual example.
- SeldomSeenSpecies.Animated Films: Finding Nemo featured clownfish◊, regal tangs◊, moorish idols◊, yellow tangs◊, royal grammas◊, four-striped damselfish◊, cleaner shrimp◊, makos◊ to make everything worse, an angler◊, moonfish◊, kelp gulls◊, eagle rays◊, longnose butterfly fish◊, flapjack octopi◊, and flounders◊. The sequel adds belugas◊, whale sharks, common loons◊, ocean sunfish, and Humboldt squids◊ to the mix. Again, referencing a character who applied.
- Characters.Pathfinder Dragons: A sea linnorm has a distinctive facial lure which it uses to lure sea animals to their doom; in game terms, it can cause any other creature to stand stupefied when the sea linnorm flashes it. Not an anglerfish.
- Fanfic.Playthings Series: Most ghosts do this at some point. ZCE, though clearly not an anglerfish.
- TabletopGame.Nibiru: Shocktails usually roam the power lines of Antumbra, squeezing their bodies into the clumps of cables and letting their cable-like worm of Erra symbiont hang loose. Creatures that touch the cable or try to feed from it are suddenly squeezed by the worm, and the shocktail quickly curls to sink its razor sharp teeth in the victim's neck. Not a fish.
- MaleGaze.Video Games: In-Universe example comes from Handsome Lech Dante when he meets the Rusalka and becomes very excited, getting a close eyeful of their bosoms and buttocks. However you'll notice Dante subtly doesn’t let the Rusalka actually touch him as he gets close to their bodies and dodges their playful grabs as he’s ogling them because Dante knows they’re actually the lures of a giant frog demon, but that doesn’t seem to dissuade him from having a good perv. Not a fish.
- Characters.Dont Starve: If you store a Light Bulb inside of him, Hutch will have an anglerfish-like, glowing antenna that can be used as a light source. Not an anglerfish, and not using his light as a lure.
- Downplayed with Edie in Shipwreck Showdown. Though she can illuminate the Blackout Basement levels, she doesn't attrack any other fish with her light. Not using her lure to attack.
- The male anglerfish is tiny, and attaches itself to the female anglerfish so that it can suck her blood and reproduce with her. (Unsurprisingly, the anglerfish was the winner.) Two anglerfish, but they're mating, not luring prey.
- Webcomic.Castle Swimmer: The creatures that dwell within the trench are blind monsters that look like four-armed mermaids that are twisted upside-down and use a light at the end of a staff to make illusions to lure merfolk out into the open. Not an anglerfish.
- Characters.Slightly Damned: Abyset has a glowing lure on his forehead but since demons don't hunt food and can see in complete darkness, it's likely cosmetic in nature. Neither alluring nor an anglerfish.
- SCP-5250 is written in the style of a recipe with a second person POV (with SCP-5250 as the "dish"), to protect the reader from the actual SCP-5250 (a lake that eats an individual's sense of self, using a "deer" as bait. Not a fish.
- Film.Outlander The Moorwen lures in its prey with multiple glowing spots and stripes on its skin and tail. Probably not an anglerfish.
- VideoGame.Devil May Cry 4: Bael and Dagon, two bosses fought by Nero in Mission 4 and Dante in Mission 15, respectively. They are large, toad-like demons each with two anglerfish like glowing feelers called Rusalka that they can use to lure prey or to attack defend themselves. Not anglerfish.
- VideoGame.Octogeddon: The Anglerfish tentacle continuously emits a powerful light beam which can uncloak hidden enemies. Not luring prey.
- Roleplay.Halcyon Days: An Adjuchas named Velivolus had an alluringly small looking demonic lure. When attacked, the three-pronged jaws lifted from the sand and snapped shut as an immense flying sandworm over one hundred meters long flew into the sky. Not an anglerfish.
- Recap.Triptych Continuum In Convenience: One of the dangerous plants mentioned in the story is the root angler, which keeps all it's body except a food shaped tentacle below the ground, waiting for somepony hungry to wander along. Not a fish.
- Blinded by the Light: In Shinkaigyo no Anko-san, the main character Anko is an Alluring Angler Fish whose lure can light up. She regularly cranks it up a few notches to blind annoying or threatening people, like her friend Wakasa in one of her grabby moods. Not luring prey.
- Good Lips, Evil Jaws: Possibly the reason why Ripjaws got a much-maligned redesign in between Ben 10 and Ben 10: Ultimate Alien. The backlash to this new design without his signature jaws was enough that Derrick Wyatt promised to one fan that he would be given a look more faithful to the original series in Ben 10: Omniverse. Doesn't explain how he's an anglerfish, or talk about his lure (which, being male, he shouldn't have )
- VideoGame.ARK Survival Evolved: The Angler which is large and has three bioluminescent stalks instead of one. Definitely an anglerfish, though it doesn't mention her using her lure.
- VideoGame.Gem Smashers: The boss of Poseidonia is an anglerfish. Its weak point is its lure, which your character must hit when it is the same color as them. Definitely an anglerfish, and her lure is a plot point, but it's unsaid if she uses it to lure prey.
- WMG.Ben Ten Ultimate Alien: Potholed to a character's name.
- HoYay.Video Games: Pothole to a character's name.
- Dante from Devil May Cry is fits this trope incredibly well. He constantly messes around with the demons trying to kill him, such as pretending to fall for Dagon’s Alluring Angler Fish trick by flirting with the Rusalkas, playfully sits on the flaming tail of Berial, treats the giant Cerberus like a puppy, and acts like the deadly Cavaliere Angelo is just Trish in an oversized halloween costume. The reason he acts like this, however, is because he’s just that powerful that none of these are an actual threat to him. He could easily defeat any demon that faced him, but that’s not nearly as fun for him. Not to mention that, despite using conventional weapons such as swords, gauntlets and guns, he also tends to use strange objects as weapons, including a guitar, a briefcase, a motorbike, and a cowboy hat. And these are just as powerful and useful to him as slicing them up normally. However, should the situation get serious, Dante stops toying with his enemies and becomes deadly. The only times he’s done this are at the end of Devil May Cry and Devil May Cry 3, and when facing Urizen and Vergil in Devil May Cry 5. Character using a lure, but it's unclear if they're an anglerfish.
- ComicBook.Empowered:
- A supervillain who uses his lurelight to hypnotize people.
- And his dead son, who uses it mostly to commit rape via mind-control. It never says what species the supervillains are.
- VideoGame.Mousehunt 2008: The Deep Mouse and the Angler Mouse. ZCE
- Creator.Hank Green: "The Anglerfish Song". ZCE
- Manga.Yaiba: Yakitori, one of Onimaru's Shitenno in the Onimaru's Fortress arc. It actually has a Japanese paper lantern attached to it, and he's very proud of it. Oh, and don't call him "Toadstool".... Doesn't explain why he's alluring or an anglerfish.
- DarthWiki.Ben 10 Multiverse: Potholed to a character's name.
- Characters.White Dark Life: As one would expect, she has a glowing lure stuck to the top of her head. She also has spots along her arms and other parts that light up, too. Doesn't explain how she uses the lure.
- YMMV.Insaniquarium: Pothole to a character's name.
- Literature.Under The Pendulum Sun: The "fish moon"—an Alluring Anglerfish swimming in the sky. ZCE
- NightmareFuel.The Sponge Bob Square Pants Movie: Potholed to the word "frogfish", whatever that is.
- VideoGame.Bulb Boy: Potholed to "decoy".
- WebVideo.Carmilla The Series: The true form of Lophiiformes — the light is just a lure. Not sure if it's an anglerfish.
- Webcomic.The Oatmeal: The story of the bizarre way they reproduce is found here. Doesn't explain the "alluring" or the "anglerfish".
- Characters.Dungeons: The Six-Legged monsters are part lion, part bull and have six legs. The Giant Frogs have a bit of Alluring Anglerfish in them. Doesn't explain.
- VideoGame.Shovel Night: An angler fish miniboss using Chester's chest as bait appears within Treasure Knight's stage. The chest is indeed real. You just have to defeat the miniboss first in order to free Chester so that you can buy the Throwing Anchor from him. In King of Cards, this fish instead carries a fake goal ring, which leads into the King's battle. Angler fish as a villain, doesn't mention luring prey.
- NightmareFuel.Kirby Those freaking huge Danglerfish in Deep-Dive Deep that chase after you invincibly. Unclear, though seems to be a frightening pseudo-anglerfish.
- Literature.Into The Drowning Deep: While they are compared to other animals as well, the sirens are similar in many ways to anglerfish. They live in the darkest depths of the ocean, they use a variety of methods, including bioluminescence, to lure in prey, and have Bizarre Sexual Dimorphism. Not an anglerfish, but a deliberate allusion to one.
- Characters.Clam Man: Averted. Unlike most fictional anglerfish, Bill is a totally good person. An aversion, yet the user clearly knows how the trope is defined.
- Funny.TV Tropes: Quoting a Just for Fun page.
- Recap.Adventure Time S 8 E 19 Cloudy: The cloud with the bathroom turns out to be an angler lard that tries to eat Jake. What the heck is a "lard"?
Analysis:
- Correct: 16%
- Misuse: 34%
- ZCE: 40%
- Unclear: 10%
Edited by GastonRabbit on May 10th 2023 at 12:31:06 PM
(she/her)
Pinging ~Tropers/Theriocephalus to the thread as requested.
Macron's notes
My guess for the misuse is that we may not have a trope for a monstrous thing using some sort of tempting bait (that's part of its body) to attract and snatch up prey. Something that glows in the darkness seems to be a common one among the misuse. Maybe this can be expanded.
I think expanding this to include things other than Anglerfish would work, in the same vein that Chameleon Camouflage is not exclusive to chameleons. Maybe renaming it too, so it's not confused as an "Aggressive Anglerfish" trope. Maybe Luminescent Lure?
Edited by BlackMage43 on Mar 22nd 2023 at 2:55:40 AM
Amateur Veteran
Some comments I wanted to bring up about the wick check:
Frogfish are a type of anglerfish. They are in fact mentioned in the description:
They're specifically anglerfish that live in shallow, primarily sunlit waters. Frogfish and sea toads have compact bodies and walk along the sea floor using paw-like fins, while monkfish have flat bodies and lie on the sea floor. Both kinds are often just called anglers or anglerfish in colloquial language — in fact they were the original fish to be so called, deep-sea anglers were discovered a long time later — and have non-glowing lures meant to look like worms or floating bits of meat, which they use to lure prey towards their mouths.
Going by memory of when I saw the movie way back when, the frogfish there lies buried in the sand and uses a lure shaped like an ice cream stand to attract its victims.
(Another examples of this sort is the Gobul from Monster Hunter, which looks primarily like a goosefish and lures prey by hiding underground and only leaving out its seaweed-like barbels — it had a glowing organ on a tendril, but it primarily uses that as a sort of flashbang during combat, I believe.)
I bring this up because I'm worried that you're using too narrow of a concept here. I would also like to bring up this example:
What we've got here is a sea monster that lives in the deep ocean and uses a glowing lure to attract prey towards itself. It's not a literal anglerfish, but it's very definitely interacting with this trope.
I also wonder if the more generic examples of "creature that uses some sort of bait or compulsion to draw in prey or victims" are worth preserving somewhere. My instinct is that we're dealing with Missing Supertrope Syndrome — there's also an active draft for Siren Song on the launch pad that seems to me to be another reflection of this general concept. I wonder if it might be a good idea to create a more general page for Supernatural Attraction or something of the sort... well, it would need a better name, that's too generic, but I think I'm getting the idea across.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
I'm not necessarily convinced that Luminescent Lure is the best rename, primarily because it doesn't strike me as an expansion so much as a sideways move.
- Point the first, a lot of the "anglerfish/siren monster" archetype don't use glowing lures. Some do. Some use food-shaped lures. Some use other lures shaped like attractive things. Some sing. Some smell really nice (and it occurs to me that Alluring Flowers might be another aspect of this concept). Some just plant a supernatural compulsion in their targets' minds.
- Point the second, a lot of things with glowing lures don't actually use them to lure prey. The wick check and general links have a good selection of this — some use them as light sources (Hutch from Don't Starve), some as weapons (Gobuls from Monster Hunter), some as nothing in particular beyond visual flair (Jabun from The Wind Waker).
Edited by Theriocephalus on Mar 22nd 2023 at 5:36:38 AM
I guess it's better to keep this trope at anglerfish depicted as monster sea creatures who lure prey, and split/yard the misuse into new tropes (supernatural compulsion, light as bait, etc.). I would consider the old lady frogfish tongue a correct use of this trope, so a specifically glowing lure isn't necessary. If this trope is just getting cleaned up, the description really needs to not spend half its length on the Sexual Dimorphism Fun Fact since it's immaterial to the trope and seems to be encouraging the "Anglerfish exist" misuse.
How sweet it is
Having a trope for Luminescent Lure could work.
The actual fish (if correctly used) can go to Fiendish Fish.
she/her | TRS needs your help! | Contributor of Trope Report
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
Considering all the misuse and ZCEs, maybe we should merge with Fiendish Fish for now and Yard an anglerfish subtrope if anyone wants to give this another shot (since it's in bad shape in its current state). If we rename instead, I don't think Luminescent Lure works because that sounds like a separate (albeit related) concept.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 22nd 2023 at 8:08:06 AM
Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
Yeah this trope has suffered the fate that many animal tropes have (tropeworthy and not tropeworthy) of people just taking it to mean "any time this animal shows up". I don't think the current name helps since "alluring" doesn't really give off the idea of it being menacing and the description definitely doesn't help since it kind of just describes what an angular fish is without explicitly saying what the trope is.
Given the abysmal amount of correct examples, cut the page, move valid examples to Fiendish Fish, yard the idea of "a creature inspired by angular fish that uses some kind of lure (luminescent or not) to bring in unsuspecting prey"
Based on Theriocephalus' post, it seems like the trope we might have to work with here is something like Prey Lure or Luring in Prey, about an animal species that has some means of attracting prey to them whether they even remotely resemble anglerfish or not. Whether something that broad falls under PSOC is another question. If and when that trope gets established, we can see if a subtrope of that and Fiendish Fish about anglerfish specifically can stand on its own.
Though keep "alluring" out of the title no matter what, that word makes me think of sexual attraction.
Trans Siberian Anarchestra (it/they)
Oh, I didn't know this was on the TRS queue!
On my sandbox I started a draft for a trope I intended as a subtrope of Light Is Not Good, under the title Addicted To The Light. I wasn't sure if it was a supertrope, related trope, or just redundant to Alluring Anglerfish, though (or if I was experiencing fan myopia) so I haven't done much with it. Depending on the consensus here I think it might be a good place for some of the examples.
The Revolution Will Not Be Tropeable
Lord Something, Forgetter of Cool Titles
I agree with Theriocephalus, Tropes Are Flexible and I don't think this one should be restricted only to deep-sea anglerfish.
oh hey how are you doing?
Master of Tediousness
Yeah, there are a number of other animals with lures to catch prey like alligator snapping turtles and spider-tailed horned vipers.
Edited by KZN02 on Mar 23rd 2023 at 8:50:47 AM
With a "0", not an "O".
I don't think this needs to be restricted to anglerfish either, but I think we should remember that we are discussing a trope that shows up in narrative storytelling, not what is possible in real-life.
Part of the problem is that this trope is being used to simply describe anglerfish, missing out on the whole menacing aspect. Like, from what I can understand, anglerfish were focused on because they show up frequently as a literal jumpscare in works (following the pretty light only to come face to face with a horrific and ugly mug about to eat you).
Keeping it solely focused on animals seems like we'd just be expanding this to "real life animals with lures" vs "anglerfish exist" which is just a broader version of chairs.
If we expand, it should definitely include non-animals/fantastical beings and the focus should be on the menacing / scary portrayal, not just that they exist in a work.
Edited by amathieu13 on Mar 23rd 2023 at 3:23:26 PM
I mentioned animals because I'm pretty sure we have other tropes for humans and other sapient creatures that have similar effects.
Maybe Lured To Your Doom? Or does the use of a second-person pronoun violate No New Stock Phrases?
^Do we? We have Lured into a Trap, which is for when a person gets sent to a seemingly innocuous location only for it to be a trap, and Tricked to Death, which is for when a character is tricked into doing something that ends up killing them. The former is a separate trope entirely and the latter is at best a Super-Trope.
I don't think we actually have a trope for that.note
Edited by amathieu13 on Mar 24th 2023 at 3:18:58 PM
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
I looked at the wick check again and since a decent chunk of what's listed as misuse involves things other than anglerfish, I'm now in favor of expanding the definition to include anything that lures animals in the same fashion, and renaming the trope.
As for what name to go with, I can't think of anything at the moment. (And as I mentioned in another thread, I just got out of bed.)
Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 24th 2023 at 7:20:07 AM
Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Expansion and rename, for the record.
Amateur Veteran
We have Alluring Flowers, for flowers and flower-like plants that have this sort of effect, and a TLP draft for Siren Song (split off from the TRS cleanup effort of Enthralling Siren) that covers monsters and beings that can do this sort of thing through song. Both would most likely be subtropes of a broader "animal/monster/being that can lure or attract prey towards itself" trope.
Just to restate my opinion a bit more concisely: I am of the opinion that anglerfish have enough of a presence in media that a "anglerfish/anglerfish-inspired monster that lures victims to itself", perhaps with a focus on unrealistically powerful or elaborate lures, can stand on its own. I also think that there is a clear supertrope here that we lack, and that making this supertrope should probably take priority. My preferred course of events would be to get the supertrope up and running first, and then see what we can see about the anglerfish trope.
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
In that case, if someone would make a TLP draft for such a supertrope, we can probably close this thread and revisit Alluring Anglerfish after it's launched. Emphasis on if someone would make a draft because I'm not going to do anything with this thread if it's hypothetical.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 24th 2023 at 3:10:19 AM
Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
Agree with the supertrope and then subtrope, because there is a difference between the kind of alluring that Alluring Flowers / Siren Song do versus the anglerfish kind of lure, as those work via some form of mind control, whereas the typical lure works by playing with a prey's sense of sight / visual perception.note
Edited by amathieu13 on Mar 24th 2023 at 5:20:56 AM
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
Just to clarify, I don't disagree with seeing what happens with a supertrope before doing anything with this. I just want to see a draft for the supertrope first since, as I said, I don't want to go by hypotheticals.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 24th 2023 at 8:23:05 AM
Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
She / Her
I personally think it should be expanded and maybe renamed.
Trans Siberian Anarchestra (it/they)
I'd be interested in expanding it to direct comparisons to an anglerfish, but I think there is a distinction that gets made between anglerfish and more deliberate traps where there's something eerie about something whose bait is naturally part of its body, that seems like it should imply that It Can Think but doesn't.
The Revolution Will Not Be Tropeable
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
While it's been three days, I'm not hooking a crowner because I want to give anyone who wants to draft a supertrope time to get the draft up and running, and since it's Saturday, at least some of the people who would be willing might be offline for at least most of the day.
I think I'll give the thread until maybe Wednesday to see whether anything comes out of the supertrope idea, and if the draft ends up not happening, then I suppose we could look at other options.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 25th 2023 at 8:04:13 AM
Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
Crown Description:
Alluring Anglerfish is supposed to be about anglerfish representation in media as Fiendish Fish who use their glowing lures to hunt their prey, but many pages apply it to anything that possesses a lure to lure its prey into false sense of security, no matter whenever they even remotely resemble anglerfishes or are even fish in question, and no matter whether the lure in question is a glowing anglerfish lure. The trope also attracted a lot of Zero Context Examples. What should be done with Alluring Anglerfish?
To-do list:
The wick check found that out of 50 examples:
There were several types of misuse:
So, what should be done? Should we rename it? Should we split off some of the misuse to other tropes (obviously "anglerfish exist" is PSOC but what about the other ones?). Discuss here.
Wick check:
This is a page for the Wick Check related to the trope Alluring Anglerfish.Reasons for the check: Alluring Anglerfish is meant to be about anglerfish as Fiendish Fish, using their lures to hunt their prey. However, it's misused as any character who uses a lure, regardless of whether it resembles an anglerfish lure or if they are fish.
Analysis:
Edited by GastonRabbit on May 10th 2023 at 12:31:06 PM
For every low there is a high.