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    Original post 
Note: This thread was proposed by Synchronicity.

I was initially concerned with Has Two Mommies being the People Sit on Chairs "has gay parents". According to Has Two Mommies And A Wick Check, it's not actually misused. The usage is much in line with the description's "two same-sex people who can reasonably claim to be a parent raising a child":

The two may be lovers, who have now become a family through adoption, a helpful donor, or through the wonders of magic or science, with added likelihood of Patchwork Kids if the latter. The two may be close siblings (but not that close) or the best of friends, with one of them wishing to help out their single parent buddy. The two may be in that very fine line between the previous two examples, giving much Ship Tease and Ho Yay to the delight of their fans.

Whatever the reason, it's all the same: A family unit that cheerfully ignores the traditional view of a family requiring a father and mother, by having two (or more!) parents, parental figures, or Parental Substitutes of the same sex.

However, my issue is not with the usage (note how there's no misuse folder). It's with the scope, which I think is much too broad to be meaningful. Examples of "two mommies" from the wick check include:

Further, most of the usage (almost 50%) is "has gay parents", which is People Sit on Chairs. I think this is due to the sentence-friendly name ("Alice Has Two Mommies"), ignoring the unconventional family requirement. It is certainly not as common as "has straight parents" and was once much more notable in fiction than it is now (as the Malcolm in the Middle Values Resonance example cheerfully explains) but much like Bi The Way and tropes like it, is not tropeworthy by itself. In addition, being a gay couple with a kid isn't a guarantee that it's unconventional within the story, since we have Non-Heteronormative Society and settings where Homosexual Reproduction is the norm.

The linked Trope Talk discussions suggested a rename to something like Unconventional Family Structure and a tightening to focus on that. Since then, I realized that the existing trope Platonic Co-Parenting is actually broader than I thought it was, it's just not restrained to same-sex coparents:

Platonic Co-Parenting is simply about two or more people raising a child together, without romantic entanglements. It's quite common for this sort of family to also to be a blended family; Charlie helps Alice raise her son Bob, and she helps raise his daughter Danielle. It's also possible for none of the parties to be biologically related; perhaps Charlie and Alice found Bob abandoned when he was an infant, and decided to take him in. Either way, there's often a message about how a Family of Choice is just as important and real as one dictated by blood, if not more so.

so I think that could actually subsume most of the "family unit raised by non-romantically-involved parent figures" usage. Most of the others could be moved to Non-Heteronormative Society, Two-Donor Clone, or Homosexual Reproduction, with any other subtropes (e.g. a clash between foster and biological parents) saved for TLP.

Wick check:

Spun off from the LGBT tropes thread

A wick check to see if Has Two Mommies is really just the chairsy "has gay parents".


    Clearly says parents are/were a same-sex couple (24/50) 
Note: Includes assumptions and invocations. I also put shipping-related material here, since that's implicitly using the trope romantically.

  1. AscendedMeme.Anime And Manga: In the third season of Kyo Kara Maoh, Greta names her pet bearbee Yuuram, after her adoptive daddies. It's the fandom's Portmanteau Couple Name for Yuuri and Wolfram.
  2. Characters.After The Jungle Series: She's the (adopted) daughter of a same-sex male couple.
  3. Characters.Brandon Rogers: His biological mother is Kathlene and was raised by her and his other mom Darlene.
  4. Characters.Dangerously Chloe: Offhandedly mentions her "moms," which may be a part of why she is so insistent on identifying as a lesbian. Characterization
  5. Characters.Hololive Minor Characters (Bodyguard Crush entry): Initially remarks that she's Just Friends with Madam Hoshiette, whom she often employs as a bodyguard, but leans towards this this when she suggests that she marries her gen-mate to give the chat two mommies, even calling Hoshiette "my beloved"...
  6. Film.Chaos Walking 2021: Gender-inverted: After his mother died when he was a baby, Todd was raised by two men, Ben and Cillian (who are a couple), and regards them both as his fathers.
  7. Characters.Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha Fate Testarossa: She also co-adopts Vivio alongside Nanoha, and the three are shown to be living happily together as the Takamachi family.
  8. Characters.The Dummys Dummy: She was adopted by a nice lesbian couple after her grandfather died.
  9. Film.Harold And Kumar Go To White Castle (Black Is Bigger in Bed entry):
    Tarik: Look at me. I'm fat, black, can't dance, and I have two gay fathers. People have been messin' with me my whole life.
  10. Film.Princess Cyd: Ridley, who is being raised by his mother and stepmother, her wife. He was born to his mother's previous marriage with his father, before she came out as a lesbian.
  11. Film.Sleepaway Camp: Angela's dad's boyfriend didn't get custody after the accident. Seems like there's additional significance to a custody argument, but the example doesn't elaborate.
  12. Main.Adaptational Sexuality (The Babysitters Club 2020 entry): Charlotte Johanssen has a mother and father in the books, making them a heterosexual married couple. In the Netflix series, Charlotte Has Two Mommies, making the original Dr. Johanssen at least no longer straight.
  13. Main.Incest Subtext: The Touhou Project doujin At Chirei portrays the main characters as a family, with sisters Satori and Koishi as the parents and Orin and Okuu as the children. Koishi closing her third eye and going to explore the surface is treated very much like a divorce, with the confused children caught in between, and twice Yuugi comforts a distraught Satori with what sounds very similar to relationship advice.
  14. Main.Some Of My Best Friends Are X (Modern Family example): An episode has Lily believe she is gay, operating under the same logic that the child of Italian parents is Italian. Mitchell told her she isn't, right as a lesbian couple walks by.
    Mitchell: Oh please, we have tons of lesbian friends.
    Cameron: Odd that you would reference our friends, and not us.
  15. Main.Values Resonance (Malcolm in the Middle entry): In one episode, Hal casually mentions that one of the family's cousins has two dads, which nobody seems to regard as unusual or noteworthy, besides Reese who says that their house must be a "dude's paradise". Additionally, Francis' classmate and friend Eric is shown to have two dads which is also treated as unremarkable. The show was broadcast at the Turn of the Millennium, when gay marriage/adoption was illegal in many states and queer people were considered Acceptable Targets in most pop culture.
  16. MistakenForGay.Live Action TV: In another episode, when Robin is trying to sell Barney's apartment, Ted and Marshall come in together (to pretend to be prospective buyers to drum up interest) with baby Marvin. One of the women looking at the apartment misinterprets and assumes he's their son. Couple assumption
  17. OneTrueThreesome.Western Animation (Steven Universe entry): Naturally there's lots of Garnet/Pearl/Amethyst, aka Steven's three mothers. Fics set when Rose was still alive usually adds her to the tangle as well. They even have a Fan Nickname of "Polygems".
  18. Series.The Mighty Ducks Game Changers: Nick mentions during the team's introductions to each other that he has two moms. Sure enough, Sherry and Paula show up to the Hockey Mom skills competition.
  19. Series.Under The Dome: A pair of lesbian mothers were driving their daughter to a "summer camp" when the dome hit. As of episode 7, Norrie has only one Mommy. Then Carolyn died in season 3, episode 8.
  20. ShipToShipCombat.Video Games (Soul Series entry): Taki and her best friend Chie even become maternal figures to her apprentice Natsu, one of the playable fighters in V, suggesting a Has Two Mommies kind of dynamic. Since this is about shipping I am assuming this refers to lesbians
  21. VideoGame.Kitty Powers Matchmaker: This is the best possible ending for a couple after you've matched them, even for same-gender couples.
  22. Webcomic.Split Screen: Jan and her sister were raised by their mother and her lesbian lover. It's the latter's funeral that brings Jan back home.
  23. WebVideo.Dan And Phil GAMES: Has Two Mommies: Gender-inversion. Dan and Phil decide that Amanda from their Dream Daddy playthrough grew up with two dads, although one of them is dead.
  24. YMMV.Jo Jos Bizarre Adventure Battle Tendency: Depicting the Pillar Men as a family, with Wamuu and Santana as Kars and Esidisi's adopted sons

    "Parents" refers to two people of the same sex who are/were not a couple (8/50) 
Includes foster families/biological families
  1. Anime.Mobile Suit Gundam Iron Blooded Orphans: Akatsuki, the son of Mikazuki and Atra, is peacefully raised by the latter and Kudelia in the epilogue. That of course is, because his father died before the child was born.
  2. Characters.Son Of The Sannin Konohagakure: He considers himself to have three parents: Zabuza and his foster parents Hayate and Yūgao.
  3. Characters.The Dragon And The Butterfly Saga: By the end of the first fic, Hiccup has since excepted both his birth-parents (Stoick and Valka) and the parents from his Family of Choice (Agustin and Julieta).
    Manny: That's your mom, right? I thought Tia Juli was your mom?
    Hiccup: You can have more than one mom or dad!
  4. HoYay.Pretty Cure: Mirai and Riko are raising a baby fairy, Haa-chan together as of episode 5. Later episodes would lampshade this... Assuming this isn't misuse of Ho Yay, then it's not romantic.
  5. Lost.Tropes F To J: A heterosexual example, after the end Aaron ends up with both Kate and Claire raising him. It's implied neither loved again due to their true loves dying years before they did.
  6. VideoGame.Danganronpa Another Episode Ultra Despair Girls (Abusive Parents entry): The reason that Toko Has Two Mommies is explained as two women who raised Toko each believed that Toko was the other's child, and wanted nothing to do with her. Toko even comments that they used to lock Toko in a closet as punishment for minor things.
  7. VideoGame.Power Pro Kun Pocket 14: Hero 14 is raised by three Glasses Clan brothers. Yamada is a hard-working Henpecked Husband, Oda is a Cool Uncle who teaches Hero 14 how to fight and Yuda acts like a house-keeping "mom" who pushes the other two around because of his Baseball acomplishments.
  8. UsefulNotes.Qing Dynasty: Originally a concubine to the late Emperor Xianfeng, Cixi stayed in power as regent for 48 years, originally in non-romantic union with fellow Empress C'ian.

    Homosexual reproduction or artificial life from 2+ people of the same sex, may or may not be a couple (7/50) 
  1. Characters.Negima Ala Alba: Hakase and Chao worked together to build Chachamaru with a little support from Evangeline on the power source. The former two are considered her parents and the latter her master.
  2. Characters.Resident Evil Umbrella Corporation: Biologically, her parents are Veronica Ashford and the unnamed surrogate woman whose egg was fertilized with Veronica's DNA.
  3. Characters.Pokemon Friendlocke: Turns out to be the case at the end of Season 2, much to his own surprise.
  4. Fanfic.Eyes On Me: Sapphire finds herself pregnant in Chapter 6 of the first fanfic. She later gives birth to her and Ruby's daughter Garnet. Combined with Homosexual Reproduction.
  5. Literature.A Tale Of: It's revealed that Circe has three mothers. Her sisters created her using a spell.
  6. Main.Related In The Adaptation (Lyrical Nanoha entry): Vivio is implied to be Nanoha and Fate's biological daughter instead of being adopted.
  7. WMG.Tangled: Alternately, Flynn is Miguel and Tulio’s son. The gods of El Dorado used their godly magic to give Tulio and Miguel a kid. After all Eugene means ‘good birth’, what’s a better birth than being created by gods?

    Examples with more than one of the above (2/50) 
  1. Characters.Once Upon A Time Main Characters: To the extent that the war between Regina and Emma sometimes feels like a custody battle. As of Season 3, it appears that they've finally come to terms with this trope; they refer to Henry as "our son". Eventually, he has three: Emma, Regina and the serum-created Evil Queen, and two daddies: biological (and deceased) father Neal/Baelfire and stepfather Killian Jones/Captain Hook. Lots of people who can claim the term 'parent': biological, foster, step, clone of foster?
  2. VideoGame.The Sims: The Sims has no formal relationships, so any adult in a household with a child was considered that child's parent by the game engine. This led to situations where children could end up being raised by parents, step-parents, parents' roommates, two couples at once, and so on - all the while happily regarding them all indiscriminately as his or her parents.
    • The Curious brothers in The Sims 2 seem to be preparing to raise Pascal's alien baby between the three of them.
    • The Single Moms and Single Dads households (from The Sims 3 and PC and Console versions, respectively) feature same-sex friends who are single parents, share a house and appear to be raising their children together in (initially, at least) platonic relationships.
    • Linn Valstrom from The Sims 3: Aurora Skies DLC is being raised by her adoptive Dad and his male friend - who, incidentally, are heavily implied to be a couple, although their starting relationship values just have them as Best Friends Forever.
    • Dylan and Audrey Shears from The Sims 3: Roaring Heights DLC are a same-sex couple who have had a biological son together thanks to "advances in science" (possibly referring to the Engineer A Baby interaction that is available to any couple - including same-sex ones - in the Future world of Oasis Landing).
    • This trope can be invoked by the player in any Sims game except The Sims Medieval, where same-sex couples are unable to have children, though they are free to marry.
      • It's technically still possible even then, but requires a bit of forward planning as you'd have to marry an opposite-sex spouse, have the desired number of children, divorce or kill off said spouse and marry the same-sex partner of your choosing, who would then be recognised as the child's step-parent.
      • Also, if a same-sex couple adopts a child via phone, the child is not their biological child (and can look totally different), but the relationship recognizes that they are the child's parents, with no qualifiers such as "adoptive-parents". All of the above...

    Just says "parents" or "daughter of" without clarifying the exact relation (4/50) 
More fantastical examples I put here
  1. Manga.Chirality: Rachel as the daughter of Shiori and Carol in the sequel.
  2. Characters.Cleopatra In Space: Akila, her mothers, and other Vevosonians (the series' take on Fish People) have fins or gills in place of ears.
  3. VideoGame.Interesting NP Cs: Fuki, daughter of Nord Feldi (her biological mother) and Argonian Vukeera.
  4. YMMV.Luz Clawthorne (Hilarious in Hindsight) entry: "Chapter 2: Won't Get Away" reveals Boscha Has Two Mommies and later one of them (Nicole) is shown to have been a potionist in her youth. "Them's the Breaks, Kid" shows two girls in the potion track sporting traits related to Boscha.

    ZCE/Other (5/50) 

  1. Characters.Deadly Mistakes: And they're happily shacked up in the afterlife. Well, an afterlife.
  2. Characters.The Emiya Clan: Saber/Arturia and Rin, jokingly.
  3. Fanfic.Leaf X Night: Flopkit, Petalkit, Darkkit, and Breezekit.
  4. Fanfic.Ruby Rose Of Class 1 A: While out on the Bakugo rescue mission, Kirishima mentions to Ruby about how his aunts would be also be worried about him if they knew what he was doing.Word of God confirms that both his aunts are lesbians. Doesn't say he was raised by them
  5. OnlyTheCreatorDoesItRight.Film (The Bourne Series entry): Zig-Zagged with My Real Daddy, as one may argue that the Bourne series has two daddies with directors Doug Liman and Paul Greengrass. With The Bourne Identity, Liman gave the film a unique style, but it was Greengrass who would flesh it out in its sequels The Bourne Supremacy and The Bourne Ultimatum, with Liman still involved as executive producer, garnering even greater acclaim. But when Greengrass turned down the offer to direct The Bourne Legacy, Matt Damon left with him, saying he wouldn't do any more movies without him, and Liman left too. This is part of why Legacy hasn't been as well-received as its predecessors. Though it should be noted that Tony Gilroy wrote all four films (and directed Legacy). Damon and Greengrass finally reunited to make Jason Bourne, which received mixed reviews, as well. Not even sure what to do with this one

Edited by GastonRabbit on May 11th 2023 at 2:05:49 PM

StarSword Captain of USS Bajor from somewhere in deep space Since: Sep, 2011
Captain of USS Bajor
#26: May 10th 2023 at 2:00:19 PM

[up][up]Thirding.

EDIT: Went ahead and added it myself.

Edited by StarSword on May 10th 2023 at 5:02:04 AM

HoloMew151 Space Gal from From Deep, Deep Space Since: Jun, 2021 Relationship Status: Tweaking my holographic boyfriend
Space Gal
#27: May 11th 2023 at 5:32:14 AM

Question - would Platonic Co-Parenting cover cases where the child is raised by a woman and their sister?

Edited by HoloMew151 on May 11th 2023 at 1:32:31 PM

mightymewtron Angry babby from New New York Since: Oct, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Angry babby
#28: May 11th 2023 at 11:10:14 AM

I'm wondering if the angst that comes from having same sex parents, or even any other unconventional family structure, could cover some instances where the family dynamic is plot relevant. I've seen a few examples where the child deals with bullying. Sort of like Gayngst by proxy?

I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
Amonimus the Retromancer from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle
the Retromancer
#29: May 11th 2023 at 11:12:05 AM

[up] Well that sounds like neither of the tropes in the disambig, so perhaps that's something for the yard.

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
GastonRabbit MOD Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#30: May 11th 2023 at 12:05:04 PM

Pinned the to-do list because I neglected to do that after adding it to the opening post (the to-do list was already there; I just neglected to pin it).

Edit: Archived the wick check and cut the sandbox as well.

Edited by GastonRabbit on May 11th 2023 at 2:08:48 PM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Tabs Since: Jan, 2001
#32: May 16th 2023 at 7:52:10 PM

Suggestion for rephrasing this?

  • Comments: Harry is the most awesome boyfriend ever, spoiling Kurt at every opportunity in spite of the latter's protests. Teddy is the most adorable child ever (and at times, it appears that he's the Shipper on Deck pushing them closer together!). A Has Two Mommies scenario soon emerges, and his interactions with Kurt are precious beyond words.

E: All righty, changed to below suggestion

Edited by Tabs on May 19th 2023 at 12:14:58 PM

MacronNotes (she/her) (Captain) Relationship Status: Less than three
(she/her)
#33: May 17th 2023 at 8:47:59 AM

switch Has Two Mommies with "They now parent Teddy together"?

Kinda hard to phrase since I don't know the work.

Edited by MacronNotes on May 17th 2023 at 11:50:29 AM

Macron's notes
GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#34: May 17th 2023 at 3:11:49 PM

[up]I think everything before the comma in that sentence could be replaced with your suggested text.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
good-morning Lord Something, Forgetter of Cool Titles from Brazil Since: Nov, 2021
Lord Something, Forgetter of Cool Titles
#35: May 19th 2023 at 4:47:48 PM

Should Honorary Uncle also be included in the disambiguation, for cases where a character helps a parent in the creation and education of a child, but isn't a Parental Substitute?

oh hey how are you doing?
Tabs Since: Jan, 2001
GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#37: May 20th 2023 at 4:34:17 AM

I added it. Might need to be looked at in case I made any mistakes.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#39: Jun 8th 2023 at 6:47:14 AM

Done, so locking up.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
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