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Misused: Matzo Fever

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To-do list:

  • Matzo Fever was renamed to Gentile Jew-Chaser because it's a trope that is supposed to be about non-Jewish characters expressing attraction towards Jewish characters precisely because they're Jewish. Remove any on-page examples and wicks that misuse the trope more broadly than this, and move correct examples to the new name.

    Original post 
NOTE: The following thread was written by Rmctagg09. Please give credit to them.


Matzo Fever is a trope that is supposed to be about non-Jewish characters expressing attraction towards Jewish characters precisely because they're Jewish.

After doing a wick check of 50 wicks this was what I found of the most notable examples:

  • Correct Usage: 4/50 (8%)
  • ZCEs: 30%
  • Direct Misuse:
    • "Jewish Character is Considered Attractive In-Universe": 12/50 (24%)
    • "Non-Jewish character's Love Interest Happens to be Jewish": 9/50 (18%)
    • "Jewish Character Attracted to Other Jews": 5/50 (10%)

As can be seen, a good number of examples have the issue where if they aren't just straight ZCEs, they just fall under "Jewish Love Interest" or "attractive woman who happens to be Jewish", which is simply chairs, rather than Gentile characters being attracted to a Jewish person because they're Jewish.

Apart from cleaning the Zero Context Examples and misuse, I think the trope could also use a new name to better reflect what it's supposed to be used for, which should cut down on misuse.

Potential Renames: Jew Fetishizer, Gentile Jew-Chaser.

Wick check:

Matzo Fever has a good number of examples where when they aren't just straight ZCEs, just list "Love Interest or attractive woman who happens to be Jewish" rather than characters being attracted to a Jewish person because they're Jewish.

(50/50)

    open/close all folders 

    Correct usage (4/50) = 8% 

  • Characters.Trainspotting: His plans for his cut of the drug money involve settling down with a beautiful, rich Jewish princess.
  • ComicBook.Limekiller At Large: in the first issue, Marty mentions that the second item on his bucket list is to make love to a Jewish woman.
  • Creator.John Mulaney: In his act, he states that he likes to date Jewish women because they say exactly what's on their mind and encourage him to stand up for himself. True enough, he married a Jewish woman in the Catskills Mountains.
  • Creator.Robert Crumb: Frequently references his love of Jewish women in his comics.

    Zero-Context Examples (15/50) = 30% 

    Jewish Character is Attractive (12/50) = 24% 

    Love Interest Happens to be Jewish (9/50) = 18% 

    Jewish Character Attracted to Other Jews (5/50) = 10% 

    Creator page misuse (2/50) = 4% 

  • Creator.Dave Barry: Enough to marry a Jewish woman and respectfully attend her synagogue despite being an atheist.
  • Creator.James Joyce: Joyce (and Stephen Dedalus, Bloom and HCE by extension) had a bit of a fascination with the "Oriental mystique" of Jewish women. (Without mentioning Joyce it would be a straight example)

    Not An Example (2/50) = 4% 

    Unclear (1/50) = 2% 

  • Mad Men Other Characters: Lampshaded. Particularly in the first season, Mad Men acted like Jews were a distant and exotic tribe to the main cast of the show, who, while mostly conservative WASPs, were after all New Yorkers in the advertising business and probably wouldn't have been that befuddled and bedazzled by them. When SC does business with Israel's ministry of tourism, Don arranges lunch with Rachel to pick her brain, and she asks if she's the only Jew he knows in New York. (She is.)

Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 21st 2023 at 6:34:51 AM

themayorofsimpleton Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him from Elsewhere (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Abstaining
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
#1: Mar 15th 2023 at 1:46:27 PM

To-do list:

  • Matzo Fever was renamed to Gentile Jew-Chaser because it's a trope that is supposed to be about non-Jewish characters expressing attraction towards Jewish characters precisely because they're Jewish. Remove any on-page examples and wicks that misuse the trope more broadly than this, and move correct examples to the new name.

    Original post 
NOTE: The following thread was written by Rmctagg09. Please give credit to them.


Matzo Fever is a trope that is supposed to be about non-Jewish characters expressing attraction towards Jewish characters precisely because they're Jewish.

After doing a wick check of 50 wicks this was what I found of the most notable examples:

  • Correct Usage: 4/50 (8%)
  • ZCEs: 30%
  • Direct Misuse:
    • "Jewish Character is Considered Attractive In-Universe": 12/50 (24%)
    • "Non-Jewish character's Love Interest Happens to be Jewish": 9/50 (18%)
    • "Jewish Character Attracted to Other Jews": 5/50 (10%)

As can be seen, a good number of examples have the issue where if they aren't just straight ZCEs, they just fall under "Jewish Love Interest" or "attractive woman who happens to be Jewish", which is simply chairs, rather than Gentile characters being attracted to a Jewish person because they're Jewish.

Apart from cleaning the Zero Context Examples and misuse, I think the trope could also use a new name to better reflect what it's supposed to be used for, which should cut down on misuse.

Potential Renames: Jew Fetishizer, Gentile Jew-Chaser.

Wick check:

Matzo Fever has a good number of examples where when they aren't just straight ZCEs, just list "Love Interest or attractive woman who happens to be Jewish" rather than characters being attracted to a Jewish person because they're Jewish.

(50/50)

    open/close all folders 

    Correct usage (4/50) = 8% 

  • Characters.Trainspotting: His plans for his cut of the drug money involve settling down with a beautiful, rich Jewish princess.
  • ComicBook.Limekiller At Large: in the first issue, Marty mentions that the second item on his bucket list is to make love to a Jewish woman.
  • Creator.John Mulaney: In his act, he states that he likes to date Jewish women because they say exactly what's on their mind and encourage him to stand up for himself. True enough, he married a Jewish woman in the Catskills Mountains.
  • Creator.Robert Crumb: Frequently references his love of Jewish women in his comics.

    Zero-Context Examples (15/50) = 30% 

    Jewish Character is Attractive (12/50) = 24% 

    Love Interest Happens to be Jewish (9/50) = 18% 

    Jewish Character Attracted to Other Jews (5/50) = 10% 

    Creator page misuse (2/50) = 4% 

  • Creator.Dave Barry: Enough to marry a Jewish woman and respectfully attend her synagogue despite being an atheist.
  • Creator.James Joyce: Joyce (and Stephen Dedalus, Bloom and HCE by extension) had a bit of a fascination with the "Oriental mystique" of Jewish women. (Without mentioning Joyce it would be a straight example)

    Not An Example (2/50) = 4% 

    Unclear (1/50) = 2% 

  • Mad Men Other Characters: Lampshaded. Particularly in the first season, Mad Men acted like Jews were a distant and exotic tribe to the main cast of the show, who, while mostly conservative WASPs, were after all New Yorkers in the advertising business and probably wouldn't have been that befuddled and bedazzled by them. When SC does business with Israel's ministry of tourism, Don arranges lunch with Rachel to pick her brain, and she asks if she's the only Jew he knows in New York. (She is.)

Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 21st 2023 at 6:34:51 AM

TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
themayorofsimpleton Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him from Elsewhere (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Abstaining
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#3: Mar 15th 2023 at 1:48:04 PM

Paging ~Rmctagg09 to the thread. Anyway, I agree with renaming.

(Locked an accidental duplicate thread I made because one of us ninja'd the other.)

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
Yindee Just stoic wisdom. from New England Since: Jul, 2016
Just stoic wisdom.
#4: Mar 15th 2023 at 2:11:38 PM

Will there be enough examples to count? Just scaling up from the wick check as a rough estimate, 8% of the total wicks would be 14.

Vehicle-Based Characterization | Grief-Induced Split | Locker Mail
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#5: Mar 15th 2023 at 3:05:02 PM

I see a good number of on-page examples not on the wick check that would make it.

[tup] to rename (Jews Are Gorgeous To Gentiles?)

Edited by Synchronicity on Mar 15th 2023 at 5:05:36 AM

StarSword Captain of USS Bajor from somewhere in deep space Since: Sep, 2011
Captain of USS Bajor
#6: Mar 15th 2023 at 4:14:39 PM

[up]I think Gentile Jew Chaser would work better, we just need to remember to hyphenate the last two words.

Berrenta How sweet it is from Texas Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
How sweet it is
#7: Mar 15th 2023 at 4:52:52 PM

If we find that the trope has not enough wicks once all the bad examples are gone, then we will deal with that issue. For now, let's see how it stands after all is done first.

Gentile Jew-Chaser does sound like a good name.

she/her | TRS needs your help! | Contributor of Trope Report
Yindee Just stoic wisdom. from New England Since: Jul, 2016
GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#9: Mar 15th 2023 at 6:01:10 PM

[up][up]I agree that that sounds like a good name.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
MorganWick (Elder Troper)
#10: Mar 16th 2023 at 2:38:15 AM

I would suggest Gentiles Want Jews if that didn't imply the trope is more widespread than it probably is.

Snicka Since: Jun, 2011
#11: Mar 16th 2023 at 7:02:57 AM

Gentile Jew-Chaser is okay, but then it should be pointed out in the description that it's not about gentiles that chase Jews with malicious intentions (e.g nazis or other anti-semites).

badtothebaritone (Life not ruined yet) Relationship Status: Snooping as usual
#12: Mar 16th 2023 at 9:37:57 AM

I'm fine with Gentile Jew-Chaser, but if there's a problem with that, then maybe Gentile Jew Lover to make it clear it's a positive relation?

Edited by badtothebaritone on Mar 16th 2023 at 11:38:52 AM

Tabs Since: Jan, 2001
StarSword Captain of USS Bajor from somewhere in deep space Since: Sep, 2011
Captain of USS Bajor
#14: Mar 16th 2023 at 12:45:31 PM

[up]Not clear enough in my opinion: this is more about fetishizing Jews or Jews being a Gentile's "type" than about "loving" Jews.

selkies Professional Wick Checker Since: Jan, 2021 Relationship Status: Star-crossed
Professional Wick Checker
#15: Mar 16th 2023 at 2:26:13 PM

For Gentile Jew-Chaser. [tup] I don't think it's ambiguous or might cause confusion.

GastonRabbit MOD Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#17: Mar 18th 2023 at 9:52:28 AM

We already have enough votes in favor of renaming and it's been three days, so let's see what we end up going with.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
alnair20aug93 🍊orange fursona🧡 from Furrypines (Long Runner) Relationship Status: Chocolate!
🍊orange fursona🧡
#18: Mar 18th 2023 at 10:20:38 AM

Once the trope is renamed, what do we do about Shiksa Goddess?

ᜇᜎᜈ᜔ᜇᜈ᜔|I DO COMMISSIONS|ᜇᜎᜈ᜔ᜇᜈ᜔
Yindee Just stoic wisdom. from New England Since: Jul, 2016
Just stoic wisdom.
Synchronicity MOD (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#20: Mar 18th 2023 at 11:20:19 AM

As usual, nothing unless a separate check reveals that trope has its own problem/s.

Edited by Synchronicity on Mar 18th 2023 at 1:20:29 PM

GastonRabbit MOD Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#21: Mar 21st 2023 at 4:19:37 AM

Calling in favor of Gentile Jew-Chaser. I'll move the page.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#22: Mar 21st 2023 at 4:31:11 AM

OK, the page has been moved. I don't currently feel like working on the examples at the moment, but at least the move is out of the way and the indexing was carried over. I'm not sure if the description needs to be changed or not, so I left it alone for now.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
StarSword Captain of USS Bajor from somewhere in deep space Since: Sep, 2011
Captain of USS Bajor
#23: Mar 21st 2023 at 6:23:12 AM

Okay, that's weird, I tried to request a custom title to hyphenate "Jew-Chaser" but I got an error message. Could be phone-related.

Snicka Since: Jun, 2011
#24: Mar 21st 2023 at 6:43:58 AM

[up][up]As I said above, it'd be a good idea to add a sentence that "chaser" in the title means romantic pursuit rather than hostile persecution.

GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
#25: Mar 21st 2023 at 6:52:10 AM

[up][up]It's a bug with the page mover. For some reason, attempting to submit a custom title or make a redirect for a newly moved page gives the sort of errors you'd get if the page didn't exist at all. Null editing (or regular editing if you have something to add other than the custom title) before submitting a custom title fixes these errors.

[up]Sounds good.

Edit: Added the custom title and tried my hand at clarifying the word "chaser" (along with clarifying that the "chaser" isn't Jewish themselves).

Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 21st 2023 at 9:02:22 AM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

Trope Repair Shop: Matzo Fever rename
18th Mar '23 9:50:06 AM

Crown Description:

Consensus was to rename Matzo Fever due to misuse. What should its new name be?

Total posts: 34
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