Is this an example?

That's a shoehorn. They're Anthropomorphic Food.

That's what I thought, just wanted a second opinion. Deleting it, then.

@Master Hero

The Dork Age example should be commented out due to being a Zero-Context Example.

And regarding Hilarious in Hindsight... "Person dies" is explicitly not allowed for a Harsher in Hindsight or "Funny Aneurysm" Moment since, eventually, everyone dies. Unless their death actually ties into the work in some way (like, say, Manson was killed by a falling Superman statue), then just "person dies after he was at one point alive!" is misuse.

And I'd say that covers Hilarious in Hindsight for the same reason.

As I've said frequently, and have yet to be corrected on, the in Hindsight tropes require more than "this thing happened (guys were alive when this remark was made) then this other thing happened (guys are now dead)"

There needs to be some kind of direct connection between the two events.

Edited by sgamer82 on Apr 10th 2019 at 7:33:54 AM

From Fate/Grand Order Never Live It Down.

Nero - While she can be fairly adorkable and the writing has gone to show her as Giftedly Bad, as a result of the Arc Fatigue incurred by the Septem Singularity and the endless Character Shilling, she still leaves a bad taste in a lot of players mouths, not helped by similar complaints carrying over from Fate/EXTRA.

The way its written looks more like a Base-Breaking Character then describing what being live down.

Should it be deleted or re written?

Yes, that does look like Base-Breaking Character. Also, I made the corrections to the YMMV page of Superman: Grounded.

From YMMV.BTS for Fandom Berserk Button

Korean boyband from a small company, there are layers upon layers of prejudice that fans constantly have to correct, such as:

• Any assumptions based on Girl-Show Ghetto: that they're only popular because of their looks, that their work has no depth whatsoever, or that their fanbase is made exclusively of teenage girls and fans of One Direction who jumped ship during their hiatus, when there are fans of all ages, genders and music tastes.
• Saying that they're puppets exploited by their company and that they have no creative input in their content.
• Accusing them of having gone through plastic surgery (or worse, being surgery "addicts") solely based on the fact that they're Korean and/or rumors created by antis. Some fans have counter-proof in the form of pictures of the members as children/teenagers in hand, just in case.
• Accusing them of plagiarizing other groups based on old superficial comparisons between things like clothes, concept images, one lyric taken from a Twitter account (that was done unintentionally and was quickly apologized for), and hair, especially if the thing they're accused of plagiarizing actually came out after the fact or is only similar for reasons beyond the members or the company's control.
  • Similarly, accusing them and the company of sajaegi or chart manipulation through self-buying based on accusations from other fandoms in 2015-2016, which had to be disproven in court.
• Saying that they're racists/misogynists based on stuff from 2013-2014. See Never Live It Down below.

Looks like fan getting mad at accusation then anything factually wrong.

Assuming that the example text is actually true, the bit about plagiarizing works that hadn't existed yet is a good example of "fanbase gets mad when people say thing that isn't true". The surgery thing and the fanbase-demographics thing would also qualify, provided there's some way to actually confirm that the claims are false.

How disproportionate does the response have to be to count as Fandom Berserk Button and not just, like, "getting predictably angry"?

Edited by wingedcatgirl on Apr 10th 2019 at 2:54:55 AM

I was going to add this to DC Extended Universe but is this correct usage of the trope?:

• Non-Serial Movie: The upcoming DC Dark Elseworlds in 2019 are a separate canon to the Extended Universe, and an Alternate Continuity, but they're all self-contained movies, therefore they fit an example of this trope. They are non-canon to the DCEU, but all self-contained installments.

How to cut down the wordiness is my problem here.

That trope is for a non canon movie to a series. The DCEU is entirely made up of movies so it does not fit.

Hi, I would like to ask for advice regarding what qualifies as an example of What the Hell, Hero?. Recently, I added an example on SHAZAM! (2019) page regarding one character calling out the hero for causing property damage and almost a loss of life because of his reckless display of power, but others deleted it and said it does not qualify as an example because as the definition on this page provided, an example needs to be " exclusively about scenes where the hero is called on his morally ambiguous or directly evil actions by characters in the story." The tropers who deleted it feel that the example I added failed the 'morally ambiguous' part.

My gripe is this: what qualifies as an example of this trope is unclear when going by the trope name at first glance. I mean, when you see a trope named "What the Hell, Hero?", you would expect an example given in a story in which someone calling out a hero for any action that caused harm would qualify, morally ambiguous or not, right? In this story, the hero's actions directly caused harm to others and his friend rightfully calling him out on it, even if it was not his intention. His mistake could've caused serious injury or death if he didn't manage to reverse the situation. Also, why is the definition of the trope only limited to actions that are morally ambiguous or outright evil only in the first place, when any action committed by a hero could be called out by their friends if they find such action unheroic?

So, to sum up, I personally think there should be a more clear definition regarding the trope, or at least a trope name repair, to address the misinterpretation of the trope, because like I mentioned above, the trope name itself doesn't really provide a clear definition. At the moment, it seems like any situation in which someone calls out the hero for whatever reasons would qualify as an example from seeing the trope name alone, and personally, I think that's the crux of the problem.

Or alternatively, is there or should there be a separate trope that specifically addresses such example directly? Like someone calling out a hero for their mistakes for whatever reasons such as reckless behaviors or unintentional actions. And there could be a subtrope would be a trope which has the original definition that the action being called out is truly morally ambiguous or straight-up evil. I think this could lessen new tropers being misled by the trope name and adding the wrong examples.

I'm sorry in advance if my post came off as too direct or confusing. English is not my first language but I'll try my best following the rules here.

ValuesDissonance.Web Media seems to mainly consist of Deliberate Values Dissonance to me. For example:

• Gunnerkrigg Court: Stated in comic by one of the characters as being one of the (if not the) major reasons why the Court and the Woods do not currently get along.
• Due to the vast differences between human and troll society in Homestuck, there's bound to be some in-universe dissonance. For example, when John tells Karkat that he's not a homosexual when Karkat hints at a possible future kismesis (a type of troll romance based on mutual hate), Karkat has no idea what the word 'homosexual' means. After John explains it, Karkat is shocked that humans even have a word for it, where as it's a complete non-issue for trolls, considering how they reproduce.
• The mostly-defunct blog Gaijin Smash derives most of its comedy from the Values Dissonance that the writer (an American) experiences while living in Japan.
• In The Hazards of Love the denizens of Bright World seem to be friendly enough, but won't hesitate to treat humans as property/pets or even consume them.

- Agreed.

A clean up of Values Dissonance feels necessary, to me.

Edited by Malady on Apr 12th 2019 at 7:50:12 AM

On Final Fantasy IX:

Cult Classic: IX did not sell well as either of the other Fifth Generation games, but, like Final Fantasy VI, has a highly dedicated fanbase that considers it the series' high point. It also has the highest rating of all Final Fantasies on Metacritic.

According to Wikipedia, it's the fifteenth best selling game for the PSX, beating franchises like Resident Evil and Spyro's best selling games. Does that really qualify as a Cult Classic?

Edited by DefiantKitsune on Apr 12th 2019 at 7:57:00 AM

Yeah, no. That's not even close to what a Cult Classic is.

From two Recap.Asterix pages:

• Foreshadowing:
  • When the oil is accidentally spilled into the ocean a sea bird gets the entire fluid sprayed upon him. He then shouts back: "Oh no! Don't tell me you're starting already!", referencing the oil tanker spills in the 20th century (and beyond) - more specifically, the Amoco Cadiz one in 1978, as the narration even mentions "the first oil spill in Brittany".
  • The fights between Sumerians, Assyrians, Hittites and Medes reference the conflicts in the Middle East today.

Shout-Out:

• After ending up up in the Roman equivalent of Venice, Asterix remarks that the houses are sinking. A local corrects him; it’s actually the lagoon’s rising since climate is no longer what it used to be.

All of these are references to real life events, which are not part of the comic's narrative. Is there another trope for them?

There are tropes for referencing real-life events that are external to or in the future of the work. For example, It Will Never Catch On, Beethoven Was an Alien Spy. Look among those. It's definitely not Shout-Out or Foreshadowing, though.

Does Lady Not-Appearing-in-This-Game have to be female and used for fanservice, or can it be used for any character that appears on the cover/in advertising and not in the media (such as the page image on Wolverine Publicity)? I question the JWittz Pokémon GO example, especially since he never appeared in official ads for the game.

While I plan to create a potential Sakura Wars 3: Is Paris Burning? article, here's an example that I might intend to add:

• Mood Whiplash: In the promotional video, Ogami arrives in Paris and fights in his spiricle armor in Paris. By the end of the video, however, Paris is suddenly engulfed in flames and Notre Dame Cathedral's bells toll at the same time. In the final scene, Sakura can only yell Ogami's name.

Also, I'm thinking about adding an example to Sakura Wars: The Movie:

• Gilligan Cut:
  Tanuma: If I may be permitted to, I would like to make a request. Actually, this is a very simple matter.
  (cut to Orihime in Yoneda's office)
  Orihime: A command of a Japhkiel unit?!

Any thoughts?

Edited by gjjones on Apr 12th 2019 at 8:19:56 AM

Gilligan Cut requires more context than just the quote.

Edited by Crossover-Enthusiast on Apr 12th 2019 at 8:27:02 AM

Here's the example again, this time with context:

• Gilligan Cut: Tanuma discusses with representatives of the Flower Division, the Imperial Army, the Elders' Institute and Douglas-Stewart about a proposal regarding the Japhkiels.
  Tanuma: If I may be permitted to, I would like to make a request. Actually, this is a very simple matter.
  [cuts to Orihime discussing with Yoneda]
  Orihime: A command of a Japhkiel unit?!

Edited by gjjones on Apr 12th 2019 at 8:39:30 AM

That's not really a Gilligan cut so much as it is just a cut.

Ah, I see.

Anyway, in the announcement trailer for Sakura Wars: The Movie, there are some scenes where Ratchet Altair and Orihime Soletta are fighting the demons at the Great Imperial Theater.

For Orihime's scene, would that count as an example of Never Trust a Trailer, and for Ratchet's scene, would that also count as an example of Trailers Always Spoil?

Edited by gjjones on Apr 12th 2019 at 11:58:29 AM

• Unskilled, but Strong: She doesn't really fit into the Saber class well and essentially is using Imperial Privilege to make her fit as much as can be done. This means she isn't all that strong, but thanks to Imperial Privilege, she doesn't need to be, as it allows her to match the abilities and skill needed to fight like a proper Saber would.

Doesn't the example makes it more Weak, but Skilled?