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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#139526: Dec 11th 2018 at 12:46:53 PM

@acw: I asked Lighty to rewrite Gurail as he's famlair with that show. He said he'd try so add it to his pending list.

Basco looks fine to me. It has everything important. Though Holy shit is that over potholed.

Edited by miraculous on Dec 11th 2018 at 12:52:24 PM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#139527: Dec 11th 2018 at 12:52:59 PM

And added to his list. Yeah, I gotta de-pothole that. Gimme a few minutes.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#139528: Dec 11th 2018 at 1:06:02 PM

And here are the de-potholed Sentai ones:

  • Great Professor Bias has corrupted three geniuses before the show began, turning them into his students. He has them massacre the remaining geniuses at Academia. After kicking out Goh Omura and attempting to kill him, Bias recruits the aliens Guildos and Butchy. When Guildos tries to prove his superiority through Guild-zuno, it is revealed that both aliens are actually robots built by Bias to make the humans try harder, which he coldly tells Butchy to his face after Guildos's death. After Butchy is convinced to defect, Bias blows him up. Goh later realizes that Bias only wants his students for their brains, one of which will be used for the Giga Brain Wave, which will turn all humanity into Bias's slaves and make Bias immortal. After Yusuke saves the world from the Giga Brain Wave, Bias is reverted to a child who shifts his goals from conquest to destruction and mocks Megumi's kindness when she offers it, before finally rejecting redemption.
  • Grand Witch Grandiene is the Evil Matriarch of the Saima Family and the ultimate form of all the minus energy in the universe. After Dark King Salamandes's death, Grandiene takes matters into her own hands and used the evil energies gathered by him and his siblings to complete her revival. Then, in a cruel and cold act, Grandiene sends her own son Beast Baron Cobolda to his death to accomplish her goals; revealing to Dark King Zylpheeza that she never really cared for the well-being of her children. After the destruction of her physical body, she possesses Zylpheeza and revives Salamandes as a soulless Destruction God in a final attempt to wipe out humanity. As fitting of the family theme in GoGoFive, Grandiene stands for everything the Tatsumi family bond isn't.
  • Agent Abrella is a ruthless Arms Dealer who sells weapons to criminals so as to continue galaxy-destroying wars, regardless of how many lives are taken. Seven galaxies have been destroyed due to Abrella's hideous actions, with him having the blood of billions on his hands. Abrella is motivated by both his desire to increase his wealth as well as simply for fun, and treats all crime as a business opportunity and helps with the destruction of cities, selling slaves, pawning stolen merchandise, or filming obscenity. After the Dekarangers defeat most of his criminal clientele, Abrella loses it and goes on a city-wide destruction spree, planning to wipe both them as well as the Earth out and plunge the Galaxy into violent lawlessness and disorder to ensure his warmongering can continue.
  • Sujigarano Akumaro shows that a villain can take a show to even darker levels even if it was already fairly dark to begin with. The Gedoushu at large wanted to create enough anguish to cause the Sanzu River to rise high enough to flood the world of the living, thus enabling their incursion thereof. Akumaro, on the other hand, wanted to open a portal to Hell because he wanted to enjoy absolute human suffering—even though said opening would destroy both the human world and the Sanzu River. He also made Fuwa Juzo's sword from Juzo's dead parents, whom he murdered himself. His monstrosity extends to even the Ayakashi who serve under him; they seem specifically made to cause as much suffering as possible in order to further his goal, which was to use the suffering of people as a wedge into one of six precise points along a line, at the center of which was a portal to Hell.
  • Buredoran/Brajira of the Messiah is a fallen Gosei Angel seeking to destroy and rebuild the world because he deems it corrupt. In the distant past he murdered his allies to become more powerful, after which he escapes into the future, where he manipulates an alien army into invading Earth and unseals monsters born of pollution he himself sealed away to do his dirty work. After his memory is erased and he is enslaved by Robogog, he develops a relationship with Metal Alice. Together, they restore his memory and destroy Robogog. As thanks, Brajira murders a wounded Metal Alice. Brainwashing Gosei Knight, Brajira tries to enact his plan by using massive drills to destroy the world. When fatally wounded, he decides to just destroy the planet anyway, even though he can't make a new one. While claiming the world is corrupt, his attitude and omnicidal tendencies expose his noble motives as hollow, and prove him to be just a madman with a god complex.
  • Basco ta Jolokia represents Selfish Evil, and is far worse than his boss and his replacement/dad. He betrayed the Red Pirates, leaving Aka Red to his apparent demise and Marvelous alone, while stealing several of their gathered treasures under the pretense that "you have to sacrifice something to get something else", which means that if he wants something, he sacrifices anything to get it, and isn't above blackmail; hurting children; blowing up schools—and the students; and betraying allies, including his supposed Morality Pet Sally, for anything he wants. He does all this with a cheery smile, and is usually cheery and jovial, but when he is the main focus, the situation gets even worse than when Space Empire Zangyack is the main focus.

Edited by ACW on Dec 11th 2018 at 4:22:23 AM

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#139529: Dec 11th 2018 at 1:09:46 PM

Could you remove the spoilers at least for the main page. The other entries have huge stuff like the revealation of a secret badguy or even major character deaths unspoiled. So im not sure why tgese should be spoiled.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
TheMadCr0w Gentle Laborer from Insignificant Little Blue Planet Since: Aug, 2015 Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
Gentle Laborer
#139532: Dec 11th 2018 at 1:32:02 PM

[tup] Mudou

  • War Crimes: Lieutenant Brcko personifies the brutality of the Chetniks. A greedy and xenophobic Blood Knight employed by a JNA captain, Brcko gleefully participates in the massacre of civilians. Capturing one of the foreign peace protesters, Brcko tortures and executes him while on the radio so his friends could hear his death. After a heroic Muslim rebel kills one of his men, Brcko stops his execution just to fight with a "Muslim shit" to death himself. Frustated by the lack of payment, Brcko promises to eliminate his superior and beats a Chetnik fighter for arguing that they can get paid on their own without having to suffer casualties, threatening to kill his own men if they confront him again.

Edited by TheMadCr0w on Dec 11th 2018 at 7:37:58 AM

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#139533: Dec 11th 2018 at 1:38:33 PM

Nice Abrella's rewrite mir! [tup][tup][tup][tup]

Speaking of Sentai, lets just say that I handle Shadam later and give some final judgements.

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#139534: Dec 11th 2018 at 1:43:02 PM

Oh right yeah your in charge of making the final decision on him. Oh well task your time. No rush

Btw I've watched Shuriken Sentai Ninninger and I'm pretty sure the Big Bad doesn't qualify. He doesn't have any redeeming qualities but he's pretty generic. Like maybe I'm wrong and he counts but he didn't really leave an impression of anything that was bad enoigh.

Edited by miraculous on Dec 11th 2018 at 2:09:57 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#139535: Dec 11th 2018 at 1:48:23 PM

Btw, cant wait to see the Guirail rewrite... Dude needs one and I'll be patient about it.

Speaking of Sentai... Have to admit that someone impersonate my account and propose Sandaaru in other website and got banned due to the shit she pulls in Fire Emblem wiki (Yep... Got impersonated by Witch Of The Absolute alright).

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#139536: Dec 11th 2018 at 2:29:21 PM

Oh hey how about this quote from Rassilion.

"And so it came to pass, on Christmas day, that the human race did cease to exist. But even then, the Master had no concept of his greater role in events, for this was far more than humanity's end. This day was the day the whole of creation would change forever. This was the day... the Time Lords return. FOR GALLIFREY! FOR VICTORY! FOR THE END OF TIME ITSELF!"
Rassilion, Doctor Who End Of Time

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Mew1996 Since: Dec, 2018 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
#139537: Dec 11th 2018 at 3:01:36 PM

I have a worthy candidate for placement in My Little Pony Fan Works.

Amadeus Blueblood is the Overarching Villain of The Assassination of Twilight Sparkle and one of it's most vile. A powerful Canterlot noble, he was at first glance just some Jerkass who treated ponies of lesser status, especially the guards and servants, like trash. Beneath that however he's a heartless Chessmaster who's involved in all sorts of shady dealings, including bribes, blackmail and outright Assessinations. Manipulating his own son who he's heavily implied to have corrupted into becoming what he is at the time of the story, he has him assassinate Twilight Sparkle, blackmails Gallant Heart with his beloved brother's life, and has the entire conspirancy, including his son, brutally killed to cover his tracks. After the princess punishes his clan for his assossiation with his son, he poisons his own wife, possibly the only person he respects, not loves, respects so he can escape to Unicornia with his daughter, Majesty, who he drives down the path of evil, just like he did with her brother, until he succumbs to Tantabus induced madness. All this done remorselessly in the name of a highly hipocrytical concept of "Unity" and Greater Good for Equestria. Loathed by everyone who knows his true nature, in and out of universe, his POV chapter is defined best by comenter Sinigamisparda "Ladies and gentlemen, the mind of a sociopath."

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#139538: Dec 11th 2018 at 3:06:38 PM

Seems like a keeper, but mind giving us a more concrete proposal?

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#139539: Dec 11th 2018 at 3:11:23 PM

Hi welcome to the thread. Sounds like a good keeper but well need an effort post first.

An effort post is a quick summary of the setting, the charcaters deeds, the heinous standard and any Freudian Excuse or mitigating factors.

Here's a good example of an effort-post to give you an idea on what you need to do.

Edited by miraculous on Dec 11th 2018 at 3:13:42 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#139542: Dec 11th 2018 at 3:21:32 PM

Also, that entry's SEVERELY over-potholed, but I can take care of that if/when the character gets approved.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#139543: Dec 11th 2018 at 3:26:25 PM

  • Commander Guirail's defining features are his sadism and his love for underhanded tactics. A brutal, savage fighter who relishes the pain of his victims, Guirail's only loyalty is to himself, as he repeatedly demonstrates, not hesitating to catch his own enemies in the crossover to gain an advantage, particularly his ally Yugande: After "tricking" him to work together for the common cause, Guirail makes him take full brunt of damage when the chips are down against him. Guirail also tricks his own allies into being subjected to horrible experiments while being unconcerned about collateral damage. His most defining crime, however, is his kidnapping children just to use them as human shields to seize his advantage. Even his own allies are revolted by how far Guirail is willing to go and are more than happy to set him up to his own end.

ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#139544: Dec 11th 2018 at 3:32:44 PM

Ah, MUCH better. I'll work on the potholes tomorrow, then submit that and the other Sentai de-potholings Thursday.

Also, yes to the Rassilon quote. Funny that, Whoniverse is the next page to be de-potholed. The Torchwood, Big Finish, and Class are fine, as are The Master entries, but the other stuff...yeah, that'll take some work.

EDIT: Fuck it, I got it done now:

  • Commander Guirail's defining features are his sadism and his love for underhanded tactics. A brutal, savage fighter who relishes the pain of his victims, Guirail's only loyalty is to himself, as he repeatedly demonstrates, not hesitating to catch his own enemies in the crossover to gain an advantage, particularly his ally Yugande: After "tricking" him to work together for the common cause, Guirail makes him take full brunt of damage when the chips are down against him. Guirail also tricks his own allies into being subjected to horrible experiments while being unconcerned about collateral damage. His most defining crime, however, is his kidnapping children just to use them as human shields to seize his advantage. Even his own allies are revolted by how far Guirail is willing to go and are more than happy to set him up to his own end.

I REALLY wanted to get Even Evil Has Standards in there somewhere, but don't think it's better than any of the ones I currently have.

Edited by ACW on Dec 11th 2018 at 6:38:30 AM

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
11111001011 Since: Dec, 2018
#139545: Dec 11th 2018 at 3:40:34 PM

Here's something I'm on the fence about.

  • Shinichiro Josaki is a vicious bully obsessed with being the strongest Digimon tamer in the world. As the spoiled heir to Josaki Industries, Shinichiro uses his resources to create the powerful Deathmon, and forces children to use their pet-like Digimon to duel him under threat of physical violence. After invariably defeating the children's Digimon, Shinichiro gleefully destroys their Digimon just to torment them before moving on to his next victim. Shinichiro always studies up on his coming opponents so as to learn past traumas or fears and use those to further torture them for his own entertainment, notably trying to burn Kentarou's Digimon alive after learning that Ken once had a pet dog who died in a fire. Shinichiro was the first Digimon villain ever created, and stands out as one of its most petty and cruel.

This sounds more like a bully than an actual villain. Also, that Kick the Dog looks more like a Sinkhole.

TheMadCr0w Gentle Laborer from Insignificant Little Blue Planet Since: Aug, 2015 Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
Gentle Laborer
#139546: Dec 11th 2018 at 3:42:46 PM

So killing Digimon is typical behavior to you?

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#139547: Dec 11th 2018 at 3:48:57 PM

[up] And psychologically tormenting their trainers, apparently?

ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#139548: Dec 11th 2018 at 3:48:57 PM

Ah, I remember that one; Ravok proposed him. He has VERY few resources, but Ravok said he basically mind rapes his victims, plus the Digimon have at least a Pokemon-level sentience. Maybe not as bad as Kurata, but far fewer resources.

EDIT: Big Bad is probably a better trope though.

Edited by ACW on Dec 11th 2018 at 6:49:41 AM

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
11111001011 Since: Dec, 2018
#139549: Dec 11th 2018 at 3:49:06 PM

Not exactly, but it happens pretty frequently in the franchise.

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#139550: Dec 11th 2018 at 3:51:40 PM

Resources would be in play there. He's nowhere near the likes of any of the Digimon listed among other things, but he does enough with what he's working with.


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