Inspired by this thread
, I've noticed that this wiki doesn't have a dedicated cleanup thread for negativity.
As we all know, Complaining About Shows You Don't Like, Creator Bashing and other negativity isn't desired on the wiki, except in a few selected areas like reviews and several Darth Wiki pages (and even then, with limitations). And yet, it's one of the most common sins wiki contributors can make.
So, if you find a page, TLP or discussion whose content seems like a straight-up insult or any other bitching - including complainy soapboxing -, you might ask here for help with removing said content.
The sandbox for this project is located at Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining.
Edited by MacronNotes on Apr 27th 2022 at 5:36:47 AM
Yeah, I would cut that whole entry.
AAE is under repair for a reason, and it's supposed to apply to "audience heard the ending was bad, so are put off watching the work in question."
Except in this case that would maybe, at best, only apply to the 7th Doctor's adventures, but nothing in the entry suggests audiences aren't watching, it just suggests binging the entirety of the 80s Who might go badly for some people.
❀ Mint, Nuts, and Waffle ❀
I cleaned up Heil Honey I'm Home!'s pages a few months ago. Now I'm in the early stage to clean up Norm of the North's pages, because the sandbox says the complaining's really bad, and I'm wondering what could be done to Quotes.Norm Of The North. The whole page consists of reviews from Caustic Critics criticizing and ranting the film. Should it be kept, or should I put it on the Cut List?
Edited by callmeamuffin on Mar 5th 2022 at 6:23:54 AM
Come play Character Uplift Game!
Burn with with Fire. BURN.
Discord: Waido X 255#1372 If you cant contact me on TV Tropes do it here.
Big Catch, Sparkle Edition
Punt it to the cut list.
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
❀ Mint, Nuts, and Waffle ❀
I was thinking the same thing too. It's now on the Cut List.
EDIT: And Quotes.Norm Of The North is cut! Now I begin my cleanup.
Edited by callmeamuffin on Mar 4th 2022 at 7:36:05 PM
Come play Character Uplift Game!
Goku Black
@ Doctor Who: It isn't even an example of audience alienating ending as the actual final episode of classic Who "Survival" and the last season as awohle are actually rather well received.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Lord Something, Forgetter of Cool Titles
The caption at the UsefulNotes.Portugal page image calls the country "you know, that other Iberian country", what do you think? I think it is a bit offensive, as if the whole site was on the perspective of people with little knowledge of Portugal (unless it is some inside joke I didn't get).
Edited by good-morning on Mar 4th 2022 at 2:51:58 PM
oh hey how are you doing?
HoMM Fan
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
I'd keep it, it's in light jest and generally, I'd say a typical person, when they think of Iberia, thinks of Spain before Portugal.
I'm not trying to insinuate anything about Portugal itself, but Spain is definitely dominant as far as Western pop culture and "common knowledge" go.
"Grandmaster Combat, son!"
The Mask Does Not Laugh
Thought about this from YMMV.Pokemon Ultra Sun And Ultra Moon earlier:
- Goddamned Boss: Dulse or Soliera, depending on the version the player got, is a surprisingly annoying Wake-Up Call Boss. The Furfrou they bring is surprisingly fast and tanky thanks to Fur Coat, so if you thought you could cheese this fight with the event Rockruff, then think again, since said Rockruff won’t be able to do much against it. It also has a fetish for spamming Sand Attack as well as Attack-lowering moves. To top it all off, it carries Headbutt, which seems to flinch 80% of the time for the A.I. On the rare occasion that you do land a hit, you won’t be able to do jack shit to this annoying poodle. Have fun!
We maybe just need to remove the last two sentences.
TroubledProduction.Rooster Teeth seems to milk Troubled Production, resulting in extensive and long entries, and entries that are given multiple bullet points when they probably should be just one or two entries stripped of word cruft. A discussion on RWBY trivia flagged the existence of this page back in August, and I observed then that it needed a Complaining clean-up, and the RWBY section was outdated as the Trivia.RWBY had been through clean-up a few times over the years for TP. It doesn't look like the page has been cleaned, however.
Since RWBY has been cleaned in the past, I replaced that section with the entries from the Trivia.RWBY page (some had been through Is This An Example? years ago). What I've replaced is as follows:
Edit reason for the below changes: The RWBY trivia page was cleaned up ages ago with help from the Complaining thread and Is This An Example thread? Bringing this into line. The crunchtime issue was removed by the Is This An Example? thread from both Gen Lock and RWBY because it's such an awful problem right across the industry. It would need to be a different kind of trope to accommodate how widespread it is (see edit reason November 2019 on the RWBY trivia page).
- RWBY has had a long and storied development cycle over the years, with almost every new volume having behind the scenes issues plaguing it:
- Volume 1 was made on a near-literal shoestring budget, not helped by the show being written near week-to-week. A carried-over writing process from Monty Oum's days on Red vs Blue (where portions of the script would be left deliberately blank for Monty to go hog wild with combat sequences) led to disparities where the story and actions wouldn't match up (one instance has Ruby and Jaune note that a head-to-head fight with several Grimm would be too dangerous so running is the better option, only for the teams to then have an extended fight sequence where the teams effortlessly defeat the monsters). Despite bringing them in to balance his ideas and write the scripts, Oum's writing partners, Miles Luna and Kerry Shawcross, had barely any experience writing a professional production themselves, with focus given in worldbuilding segments to the wrong parts of the lore or focusing on characters the audience wasn't fond of (especially Jaune). Monty's proclivities towards crazy action also led to him adding scenes behind Miles and Kerry's backs, including accidentally spoiling the robotic nature of Penny Polendina due to having her engage in a fight scene in Volume 1's finale. Monty would also admit in a 2013 panel in Sydney that none of the animation in the series was even rendered due to how long that process can take, and that all of the first two seasons were made on playblasts, which could be made faster but meant all lighting and shadows had to be baked into the scenes by hand.
- Volume 2 had an overall much smoother production as the team began to settle into their niches, but Monty's insertion of elements he found cool over what was practical for the story again reared its head. Reports indicate that Monty went renegade and added a scene in the finale between Yang and her mother Raven, only for said scene to never be referenced again and retconned when Yang mentions having never seen Raven in-person in later seasons. He also pushed for an extended school prom arc purely because of his love for dancing. Additionally, rigging complications involving the characters Sun and Neptune led to hasty revisions for a fight scene early in the season, leading to an awkward rewrite where Blake needs her own partner's Semblance explained to her.
- While Volume 3 seemed to be gearing up for a smooth production, tragedy would strike in 2015 with the sudden and unexpected death of Monty in February. Without him, many of the problems emblematic to his preferred animation software, Poser, became more of an issue for the team due to its antiquated nature, making it a royal pain to work around. Poser would be an active hinderance for the production of Volume 3, as the team rushed to meet deadlines (some reports have implied at least one episode was only finished with literal hours to spare before it had to release). Various sets had to be chopped into segments or else the framerate would dip into the single digits, and without Monty's skillset with the software, the animation for the fight scenes began to take a dip. Monty's apprentice, Shane Newville, would write a testimony about working on the season, painting himself and others as victims of a ruthless corporate environment that only cared about finishing the series in terms of being fiscally profitable Explanation While reports indicate that Monty was already planning on abandoning Poser, his death would push forward plans to move to a more friendly software in Autodesk Maya.
- Volume 4 was the first season made on Maya, and while it led to an overall boost in quality of character models and settings, Monty's loss was felt in the sharp decline in combat animation, with the new fights lacking many of the trademarks that made his fights stand out in the older seasons. The script-writing process in the wake of Monty's death underwent revisions due to not being able to write by the seat of the crew's pants anymore, but scripts were only finalized well after the premiere date and the decision to split Team RWBY across the world came at the cost of the story's pacing. Several episodes were further delayed due to needing more time to finalize, leading to the series using World of Remnant mini-episodes as a way to buy the crew desperately needed time.
- Volume 5 unfortunately was met with a string of behind-the-scenes decisions that had ruinous effects on the season at large. The decision was made to do three pre-release character shorts focusing on Weiss, Blake and Yang to hype the season proper, but two of these shorts involved extensive fight scenes that ate into the budget of the season and the time needed to make it. The crew also ambitiously decided to go for a fourteen episode season, a feat that hadn't been done yet in the show. The script-writing was particularly rough in Volume 5, with Miles and Kerry admitting on the commentary that large chunks had to be completely scrapped and re-drafted due to simply not having enough time to do everything. This especially hurt the character arc of protagonist Ruby Rose, as a planned encounter with someone who also had her Silver Eyes power and would mentor her in them was pushed back to Volume 6. Exploration of the city of Mistral was also nearly entirely cut, leading to elements such as its criminal underworld needing to be covered posthumously after Team RWBY had already left the city, and Ruby herself spending over two thirds of the season in a house. To make matters worse, soon before Volume 5's release, co-director Gray Haddock left Miles and Kerry high and dry by leaving to go begin pre-production on his own series, gen:LOCK. Without giving Kerry time to find and appoint a new co-director, he was forced to handle the entire rest of the production on his own, leading to the scripts only finalizing several days after the season began airing. Choices made throughout the pre-production had harsh consequences on the season itself, with it being sharply criticised for shoddy pacing and weak combat animation due to the team being forced to rush out several fights (released storyboards show the Battle of Haven episodes, which aired in January 2018, were still in the storyboard phase in December 2017, indicating an impossibly tight turnabout). The end result was a disaster of a season which immediately became an Old Shame for Rooster Teeth and saw RWBY's popularity plummet.
- Volume 6 seemed to have a smoother production after the debacles that hampered Volume 5, with a new co-director to replace Gray being brought in quickly (editor Connor Pickens) and the team taking the criticisms from the prior season to heart when making Volume 6. This marked the first season where Miles and Kerry finished the scripts ahead of the season's premiere, and Volume 6 was widely seen as a return to form for RWBY's quality after the slump of Volumes 4 and 5. However, in the time after the season aired, reports broke in July 2019 about a horribly toxic work environment at Rooster Teeth which had gradually worsened through the 2010s. Alongside gen:LOCK, Volume 6 saw the crew pushed to breaking point, logging in 80-hour work weeks for large chunks of the production and receiving no overtime due to Texas labour laws. One source on the employer review site Glassdoor estimated that almost a third of Volume 6 was effectively made for free due to not paying the staff for overtime. The company was criticised for a toxic 'bro culture' that permeated the management and led to apathetic responses whenever staff would ask if the crunch time would be lessened.
- Rooster Teeth moved to resolve many of the long-standing issues soon after the story broke, with Gray stepping down as head of the animation department and two co-heads being assigned by the end of the year. Several crew have said the working conditions have generally improved going into Volume 7 and onwards, though Volume 8 suffered a delay to November 2020 thanks to the Covid-19 pandemic requiring Rooster Teeth to have all staff working from home. This also lead to a longer holiday hiatus as the team is still adjusting. Volume 8 would suffer further complications, this time related to Texas' weather conditions (which caused a power crisis) that resulted in the tenth episode being delayed. And come 2021, Volume 9 was announced to be delayed until 2022, once again due to the COVID-19 pandemic forcing Rooster Teeth's staff to work at home.
- Volume 1 was made on a near-literal shoestring budget, not helped by the show being written near week-to-week. A carried-over writing process from Monty Oum's days on Red vs Blue (where portions of the script would be left deliberately blank for Monty to go hog wild with combat sequences) led to disparities where the story and actions wouldn't match up (one instance has Ruby and Jaune note that a head-to-head fight with several Grimm would be too dangerous so running is the better option, only for the teams to then have an extended fight sequence where the teams effortlessly defeat the monsters). Despite bringing them in to balance his ideas and write the scripts, Oum's writing partners, Miles Luna and Kerry Shawcross, had barely any experience writing a professional production themselves, with focus given in worldbuilding segments to the wrong parts of the lore or focusing on characters the audience wasn't fond of (especially Jaune). Monty's proclivities towards crazy action also led to him adding scenes behind Miles and Kerry's backs, including accidentally spoiling the robotic nature of Penny Polendina due to having her engage in a fight scene in Volume 1's finale. Monty would also admit in a 2013 panel in Sydney
- RWBY:
- Volume 3 had a two-month delay after Monty Oum Died During Production, preventing the first episode from being premiered at RTX 2015 as planned. Since he was the team's expert in the outdated Poser software the show had used up to that point, CRWBY struggled to finish episodes on time (the final chapter was only submitted with hours to spare). Volume 3 was considered a success, but it was the last volume to use Poser. Beginning with the next volume, the more mainstream Maya was used.
- Volume 5 suffered from severe constraints. CRWBY created three character shorts meant to hype the volume, which ate into the budget; on top of that, Rooster Teeth's animation resources were diverted into the first season of gen:LOCK, which also took out Gray Haddock from returning as co-director. The script-writing was particularly rough, with lots of content being pushed to the next volume. The volume's second half was finished with hours to spare before release. A combination of staff and fan dissatisfaction led to the Production Posse rethinking their approach for future volumes.
- CRWBY attempted to avoid any hassles during the COVID-19 Pandemic by taking a seven-week mid-season break to complete the second half of Volume 8. It seemed to pay off, only for an episode to be delayed for a week due to weather-related power shortages in Texas. Production was hampered enough that the final chapter was finished the week before release. The release of Volume 8's official soundtrack was later delayed by a family emergency.
I've removed the following entry from the Gen:LOCK section as part of the RWBY one because it was the part of the 2019 clean-up in the Is This An Example? thread.
- Several months after the season wrapped, additional news came out about the production of the series through Glassdoor that were later confirmed by several ex-employees and staffers, saying that production was in general a rough time for the crew. Crunch culture became predominant (even after the season was cut from twelve episodes to eight) with most of the animation staff having to work 80-hour weeks with unpaid overtime, resulting in a third of the season being effectively made for free. Multiple workers were brought in on unpaid 90-day temp contracts with the promise of a full-paying job upon completion, but were all unceremoniously let go instead. Gray stepped down as Head of Animation soon after the news broke, and later admitted to having left Rooster Teeth entirely. Working on gen:LOCK embittered many of the company's animators, with rumors suggesting that they would have refused to work on a second season after the poor treatment they got the first time around.
- Several months after the season wrapped, additional news
What's left on the page that needs looking at is this. I've added what I think should happen in bold:
- Red Vs Blue seems complicated due to the Limited Animation of Machinima, but usually goes well, apart from some hiccups:
- "usually goes well, apart from some hiccups" already sets up this section to have Examples Are Not Arguable issues, and probably needs to be removed.
- Season 3 had its moments, mostly for the stretch between Episodes 41-43, as they decided to get the chapters in consecutive days to take advantage of the release of Halo 2 (in Burnie Burns' words, "I got four hours of sleep in three days. After Episode 43 came out, I actually fell asleep in mid-sentence while talking to someone. They thought I died."). Burnie also had to rewrite over and over, twice filling a Cosmic Deadline (the characters going to the future - i.e. Halo 2 - in Episode 43 and the season ending in the nineteenth chapter), and another time because what he intended for the Milestone Celebration on Episode 50 was so much that the events were spread to three installments.
- This seems like a valid entry to me.
- The show suffered from serious disagreements among the production team over where the story should go following the end of the Chorus arc in Season 13. They ultimately weren't able to come to any kind of consensus by the time they had to start production on Season 14, and decided to buy more time by making that season an anthology of various stories from the fringes of the show's setting, plus some pure joke one-offs, much to the frustration of the fans who had to wait another year to find out what happened after the agonizing cliffhanger ending of Season 13. Season 14 also served as an informal audition regarding who would pick up the series (Joe Nicolosi, of "The Brick Gulch Chronicles", was chosen).
- The pothole is telling us this needs to be a Creative Differences entry. The entry is also misleading by acting like the story got bogged down in the middle of a cliffhanger because of creative differences. The reality is that this was the final episode of a three-season story arc (Seasons 11-13). The episode was even called "The End", and had a Bolivian Army Ending. The main character makes a Heroic Sacrifice to buy the team enough time for the rest of the gang to rescue them; we don't get to see it because the hero's pre-mortem speech (to the audience, not the team) is about how the hero makes the sacrifice and never gets to see the outcome of their sacrifice. The episode therefore ends as the hero dies so that the audience shares the hero's inability to see the impact of his sacrifice. The Creative Differences are therefore about what kind of new story tell now that the current one is over. This sounds like it needs to be put under Creative Differences and rewritten to make it clear that it's about the writers not knowing what story to tell next now that the old one has finished.
- Season 15, where Nicolosi started, had the natural stresses of switching to a new showrunner and getting used to working with Halo 5: Guardians in machinima. One episode had to be reshot three times because the lighting often made the Reds and Blues' colors look completely off.
- This can be combined with the Season 17 entry.
- Season 17, Singularity, was this for one co-director, Austin Clark, because basically all Halo games were used, including ones he wasn't familiar with. A recreation of a Halo 4 battle had Clark taking eight hours to do just three scenes.
- So, the next story arc after the Bolivian Army Ending above was Seasons 15-17. These two entries are basically just saying that show had some new leadership who needed time to adapt to engines they weren't familiar with, and were forced to do so on the go, resulting in reshots and things taking longer than normal.
- Season 18, Zero, had a long production, as showrunner Torrian Crawford noted that by the time it premiered everyone had been working on it for a year (not helped by how the COVID-19 Pandemic forced the crew to work from home), and right before the season would premiere, on October 19, voice actor Ryan Haywood, left Rooster Teeth amid a nude leak scandal which snowballed into accusations that Ryan had been having virtual affairs with young fans. Zero was delayed to November, with Haywood's role completely redubbed. By the following year, as Zero had not been well-received and some took to expressing it the wrong way, Torrian revealed that he and his crew were the only ones interested and even then, his pitch suffered Executive Meddling which resulted in the storyline fans didn't like (and apparently the original cast didn't like the script, hence most were written out). One animator elaborated more on the unfavorable conditions.
- This caused ructions, so there's some ROCEJ needed here. All it needs to say is that it had a long production, complicated by the pandemic, that was fraught with scandals, Executive Meddling, cast backing out and minimal production staff. All of which resulted in a product that was poorly received by the fans.
- Making gen:LOCK, as mentioned above, was not a pleasant experience for the crew. The commentrary track has several frank discussions between the higher-ups on the animation team about how rough the production cycle could be for the show:
- As this sets up, it's really one entry that has been stretched out into multiple bullet points, some of which don't seem to fit TP.
- Behind the scenes, despite backing from outside parties, gen:LOCK quickly began to go over-budget due to Gray's exacting demands on the staff and several high profile actors doing voice work for the shownote . This led to several staff members later mentioning that Gray internally sabotaged Nomad of Nowhere, another show greenlit around the same time as gen:LOCK. Gray allegedly slashed Nomad's budget and rushed it into a pre-production state while refusing to appoint Georden Whitman (the man who pitched Nomad) to a director position, giving him no power within the show and forcing him to work the normal hours of intense crunch. Georden would eventually leave Rooster Teeth, embittered by the events that occurred.
- This can be simply written as the producer being unreasonable, a bad boss and sabotaging other shows resulting in a toxic working environment. The rest of the bullet points below can just be rolled into this.
- The nanosmoke effect in general was a pain to work with. The composition and R&D teams had to effectively remake it for each individual use due to settings it was used in and due to having multiple different states, models and modes. Episodes where nanosmoke didn't need to be animated were generally far easier for the crew to work on.
- Is this troubled production? Or is it an animation challenge that needs another trope? If it is TP, it might be valid as a separate entry to the above.
- Several design choices, such as having the final versions of the Holon suits appear in the opening, meant that they had to be made far ahead of when they were intended to be modelled in the production pipeline (RWBY specifically does the animation for its openings near the airdate of the season premiere so it has as much resources pre-made to avoid this where possible).
- This doesn't seem like TP at all. This just sounds like sound pipeline management — identifying issues and when things need to have been designed by ahead of time, so that deadlines can be met and any schedule or pipeline shifts can be accommodated.
- Episode 6 was a rough experience for the crew. Video post supervisor Zane Rutledge acutely remembered the stress and anxiety he and the team went through making sure the episode landed, given it was an extensive and heavy collection of fight scenes. The episode's extended flashback sequence included a particularly strenuous one-take shot that proved too much for many of the composition team's computers. Only one person (Kim Newman) had a rig powerful enough to run the entire scene while working on it.
- This sounds like it can be rolled into the nanosmoke entry as just being the ambitions of the animation requirement resulting in a number of challenges (such as the nanosmoke, fight sequences and one-take shots).
- The end result was that gen:LOCK was an Acclaimed Flop as despite good reviews, the Rooster Teeth First requirement to watch it locked the show behind a paywall and kept prospective customers out, with the show seeing a brief spike in popularity due to airing on [adult swim]'s Toonami block. A weak marketing campaign led to the series dropping like a stone in search metrics after the first season finished airing, and it's only thanks to Warner Bros. taking over management duties that a second season exists at all which is being aired exclusively on HBO Max for a three month period.
- This can just be rolled into the toxic environment entry as the conclusion to that entry, cutting down on word cruft in the process.
Edited by Wyldchyld on Mar 4th 2022 at 8:00:58 PM
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
Found this in the description in VideoGame.Dragon Ball Z Sagas:
Generally considered to be one of the worst Dragon Ball Z games ever, Dragon Ball Z: Sagas is a linear beat 'em up, and a very bad one at that, touted as a sandbox game that not only disappointed the general gaming community at large, but also the Dragon Ball community when it was released back in 2005, Sagas is a game that never caught on as a series, and is the only Dragon Ball game ever released on the original Xbox. The game covers from the beginning of Z at the Saiyan Saga to the end of the Cell Games and has an extremely difficult learning curve.
Thomas fans needed! Come join me in the the show's cleanup thread!
Looks like Purple Eyed Guma already rewrote that.
Edit: The description of VideoGame.Captain Novolin includes these parts:
Widely considered one of the greatest Edutainment Games ever released on the SNES, Captain Novolin tells the heartwarming story of an Inspirationally Disadvantaged superhero, whose superpower is the fact that he happens to have diabetes. No, he doesn't fight diabetes, and his superpower doesn't involve giving other people diabetes; his superpower is having diabetes. As such, for him every day of his life is an epic struggle against his illness — you must fight against evil alien invaders who have taken the form of malicious junk foods, all the while making sure to eat regularly and keep your blood sugar levels consistent (and check you feet for sores and blisters).
In case you couldn't tell from the above paragraph, the game was intended to help children learn about diabetes, but failed spectacularly at the job, and almost managed to seem as if it was mocking those who had the disease instead. (Why would diabetic kids need to be reminded of their illness? Aren't video games meant to be an escape from reality?) The game was endorsed by Novo Nordisk, manufacturers of the Novolin brand of insulin, from which the game takes its name. The game's publishers, Raya Systems, also released other educational games with similar themes, such as Packy and Marlon, a game starring two elephants with juvenile diabetes.
Edited by KUnlimited on Mar 5th 2022 at 6:59:12 PM
Avatar by Butterscotch Arts. Used under license.
Otaku
Cut the bolded parts and rewrite the description to be less insulting what to say.
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
Re: Audience-Alienating Ending being misused to mean "bad ending" instead of "ending that turns viewers away":
Audience-Alienating Ending still has an active TRS thread, which led to it being renamed from Ending Aversion after the latter name caused misuse. I don't know if any work has been done on the on-page examples, but I moved the page without doing any example cleanup (I just fixed the atrocious soft split the page used to have by changing the page to have only one folder per medium), since I figured getting the move out of the way first and letting the thread handle cleanup would be easier (since moving Main/ pages is a mod task, and I didn't want the process of moving the page to stall like the one for the similarly named Audience-Alienating Era).
Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 5th 2022 at 8:00:22 AM
Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
I tried to remove as much complaining as I could. If there's anything I missed, please say so.
YMMV.My Little Pony Equestria Girls
- Uncertain Audience: The sub-franchise seems to be aiming at an older demographic than its parent show, with its high school setting, satire about modern culture and technology, and stronger emphasis on sci-fi thriller-style plotting over Slice of Life sitcom shenanigans. However, the writing has not matured to match it; the plots often run on thin contrivances, handwaves about "Equestrian magic", and implausible coincidences anybody older than a grade schooler can immediately pick apart, robbing the attempts at more grown-up dramatics and thematics of any weight.
I believe this is misuse as Uncertain Audience requires the portion of audiences the "not matured" writing was meant to appeal to/be a non-issue for would/could also be offput by the more mature setting. As is it seems more complaining about the writing quality than conflicting target audiences.
I asked here and got the impression Franchise Original Sin is the better fit as this is about an issue present in prior works than seemingly aiming for two conflicting audiences. Thoughts?
As written the gist of the example is "The writing is stupid, the plotting is stupid and the people who like this are stupid".
I'd just cut the example, it's naught but bashing.
I didn't choose the troping life, the troping life chose me
Redmess
Not entirely, I think the part about being aimed at older audiences is true, that can stay.
Optimism is a duty.
It can stay, but under a different trope. "Targeting X demographic but did a bad job" is not Uncertain Audience, as it is targeting a certain audience as opposed to conflicting ones.
Unless it can be explained how the other half of the audience, the one who'd liked/wouldn't mind the immature writing would possibly be offput by the parts meant to appeal to more mature audiences, I'm moving to Franchise Original Sin as a better fit.
Redmess
Oh, I agree with that. The audience is not uncertain at all for both series.
Optimism is a duty.
The issue is that children generally don't worry about school dances, segregation into cliques, or obsessing over social media. That's junior/high school stuff. Yet junior/high schoolers typically want to feel like adults, so they watch melodramas like Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Charmed that don't talk down to them. They are not usually into things about the magic of friendship making all the cliques get along, which is something that appeals to kids. So we have a show which is ostensibly aimed at junior/high schoolers, yet uses sloppy, unsatisfying storytelling to offer solutions that appeal to kids to real junior/high school issues.
That sounds exactly like the page quote for Uncertain Audience to me.
There's also a tweet by the director Ishii Rudell saying he wanted to do more mature stories, but Hasbro shot him down:
"It wouldn’t be radically different... but I’d like to tackle more emotional and mature themes. We’re dealing with teenagers after all... and I’ve got one of them, a 16 year old. It’s unrealistic to avoid topics like death, sex, drugs, bullying, and mental health."
-https://twitter.com/ishiH3Art/status/1017679083772174336
Edited by WarriorsGate on Mar 7th 2022 at 2:31:39 AM
Angry babby
This is not the only show to have teenage protagonists but aim the show at elementary schoolers. Braceface and Total Drama come to mind... but I will admit that both of them are less sanitized than Equestria Girls.
On the other hand, EG isn't much less sanitized than Disney Channel sitcoms starring teenagers. Just cuz a show stars teens doesn't mean it's for teens. Older Than the Demographic is a thing!
I do some cleanup and then I enjoy shows you probably think are cringe.
Accumulating Filibuster Counters
The image caption for The Watch is currently this:
"Inspired by characters created by Sir Terry Pratchett"
And while, as a fan of Sir Terry's work myself, I have a very long list of complaints about the adaptation, I feel that this might be a little needlessly snarky for the wiki? Especially given that the caption is one of the first things you see.
Edited by Azorius24 on Mar 7th 2022 at 11:08:04 AM
"The only thing which is certain, is that something will happen".
LMAO, what a passive-aggressive ending to an already bad entry.
Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness