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openDo expansions count as works? Videogame
I was looking over the Vampire Fiction section and I noticed that The Sims is absent. However, only the second and subsequent games would count and only after certain expansions are added. Do the expansions still count for the section?
openYMMV.Catherine UnfortunateImplications edit war Videogame
Hey, troper metaverse keeps deleting an Unfortunate Implications entry on the YMMV.Catherine page about some fans being unhappy with Unsettling Gender-Reveal jokes (the scene in question involves a transwoman appearing before coming out in an Alternate Timeline so they can make a joke about another character she is attracted to being unaware she is a transwoman or attracted to him, basically), despite 3 sources to said reactions being provided (per the guidelines), with a Strawman Fallacy edit reason that these are "misunderstandings" about a Transgender character no longer wanting to transition, rather than about the actual content of the entry. Entry:
- Unfortunate Implications: In one of the new endings for Full Body, Catherine goes back in time so she can place herself in Vincent's high school and the two end up dating. An unclear number of years later, at Vincent and Catherine's wedding, Erica is then seen pre-transition with Toby, who previously only became friends with the rest of the cast after Erica's transition, in order to make another joke about Erica's attraction to Toby. Outside potentially inadvertently removing Erica's identity and agency, this was mainly seen as Atlus doubling down on problematic Unsettling Gender-Reveal jokes in the story by a number of fans, especially in the trans community in both the West and Japan. It even got to the point where several people refused to buy the game or support Atlus in the future. The English voice actress for Erica, Erin Fitzgerald, explained shortly afterwards that the localization team would try to adjust the ending for the Western release. (Sources: Kotaku, Daily Dot, Dualshockers)
I'm not really sure what to do at this point because the edit reasons for removing don't seem to have anything to do with the actual entry? Honestly, if the entry should go for the sake of Rule of Cautious Editing Judgment, I understand, but feel like their strawman Misblamed and Overshadowed by Controversy should go too then.
Edited by ashlayopenEdit War going on in the YMMV page on New Horizons Videogame
Animal Crossing: New Horizons is currently in the middle of an Edit War with a user named darkblade7557. He's claiming that the dev team was harassed into its use of Gender Neutral Writing which, as of right now, there's no actual evidence of. Despite this, he keeps insistently trying to add it to the page.
Although I personally am not involved in this, given the touchy subject matter, I figured it was a good idea to bring it up here for a mod to see.
openHaving problems with a rude user Videogame
A while ago I reported that the user, Rombustier, was being unprofessional if rather rude about his editing messages, particularly towards mine. Here was the thread I had previously made on this issue.
After a while, he went dormant, so I assumed that he would have put it behind me as I had. He's returned, and it seems that out of the five or so people who edit the articles on Criminal Case.
For a few examples, on March 22nd 2020 at 1:37:31 AM, he corrected an edit where I had accidentally put a spoiler tag within a spoiler tag, which isn't a mistake I normally do at all. Rombustier decided to write "spoiler tags within spoiler tags. really?". Just today, at 6:13:05 PM, he corrected another edit of mine with "wing? where?", referring to the fact that I had misspelled "ring". Both of these happened here.
I'm worried that I might get told that I don't have a sense of humor and that I'm blind to sarcasm. Thing is, I'm not. I'm fine with humor, its just that Rombustier's rubs off on me the wrong way. I have messaged him to tone it down, but it hasn't worked. I feel that its better if I brought it here to bring attention to it, rather than end up allowing things to get out of hand.
Thanks.
open Possible Edit War on VideoGame/SonicTheHedgehog1 and VideoGame/SonicTheHedgehogCD Videogame
I would like to request an Edit Lock for the Sonic the Hedgehog and Sonic the Hedgehog CD pages. The pages are constantly getting reverted by a troper named Eagle 70 who insists on readding completely non-canon information about the games to it over and over again despite my attempts to correct it—specifically, insisting that Sonic's World (thats the official name given by Sega) is called Mobius in the main series games like it was in the old cartoons or comics, all based on a comment in an interview about Sonic the Hedgehog 2 that Yuji Naka made long ago. Sega does not consider Mobius canon to the games or any current Sonic media now, and whatever Yuji Naka may have said is irrelevant now, especially since 'another' Word of God (Takashi Lizuka, one of the original Sonic Team staff who still works with Sega to this day) has deliberately avoided giving a name to the world Sonic lives in. I have also asked Ian Flynn (who works directly with Sega now as the head writer on the IDW Sonic comics, giving him Word of God status) about this on his Twitter, and he verified that Mobius is absolutely not canon to the games. Saying Mobius is still canon to the games because of some cherrypicked comment Naka (who hasn't been involved with the Sonic franchise since 2006) made decades ago (also note that Naka does not speak english and its more than likely what he said was misinterpreted/mistranslated) is like saying Lauren Faust's Word of God is still canon to the MLP show after she left it, even though many things happened since she left that flat out contradict many of her statements. At any rate, even if he 'did' say that and mean that, it does not apply to canon anymore regardless—Sega themselves and at least two of the series biggest contributors have discredited that idea, and absolutely no other staff of the series have verified the "Mobius" concept ever being canon to the games. Also, if one reads any of the japanese (canon) backstory for Sonic, not once is the word Mobius ever spoken—only Earth is mentioned. At any rate, I strongly believe the pages should be locked (at least temporarily) to prevent any further vandalism or a potential Edit War about this trivial matter. Does this sound like a good idea?
Edited by PrinzenickopenEdit warring over the type of ending (MAJOR RE3Remake Spoilers) Videogame
So there is a disagreement over the type of ending RE 3 Remake has. It went from Downer to Bittersweet, justification being that the ending is not totally bleak. I changed it to Ray of Hope because it's still a sad ending, but it then changed back to Bittersweet.
If my understanding is correct, Bittersweet is a happy ending that isn't perfect while Ray of Hope would be a Downer Ending if it wasn't for the chance that things could get better.
Happy things
- The heroes live on to keep fighting
- The villains are dead
Sad things
- The heroes failed to save the city resulting in its destruction, along with the deaths of all its inhabitants.
- The parties responsible for all the chaos receive no comeuppance by the end of the game, and the heroes have no concrete plan for taking them down
- Jill and Carlos barely escape with their lives and end the game angry and heartbroken. The same can't be said for Brad, Mikhail and Tyrell because they all died trying to help them save the city.
The game does not end happily, tragic music plays over the nuclear blast as Jill laments about the destructiveness of humanity's greed. The sad stuff carries greater weight than the happy stuff, which is why I think Ray of Hope is a much better fit.
Thoughts?
Edited by BenbeastedopenTRS for splitting tropes? Videogame
Is it appropriate to start a TRS thread if I think a trope should be split into two separate tropes? If so, which reason should I pick, since splitting isn't one of the ones given?
The trope in question is Full Motion Video. The trope, as it is, covers two distinct topics: cutscenes that happen to be live-action in an otherwise normal game that uses graphics and animation, and Interactive Movies which exclusively use live-action sets and actors. It also talks about pre-rendered cutscenes, which is a topic that isn't even exclusive to Interactive Movies.
The description flip-flops back-and-forth to which it's talking about, and the examples are a jumbled-up mess that can't seem to decide if it's an index or a actual trope page.
Edited by PrimisopenPossible EditWar on Characters/KingdomHeartsEnemyCreatures Videogame
In January 2019, both Phoenixion and Mattman_the_Storyteller deleted tropes that suggested that Commantis is actually a Brainwashed and Crazy spirit. Both gave edit reasons that said, basically, that the game itself gave no evidence to this. In October, Aurawick added the tropes back with no edit reason.
Personally, I agree with both Phoenixion and Mattman_the_Storyteller. Looking back, there is no evidence in game for the tropes. But since the tropes were added back without a reason, is this an Edit War?
Edited by SailorTardisopenHaving difficulty using the SpoilersOff tool Videogame
Hey, I'm currently working on the subpages for the Criminal Case entry, but I can't figure out how to use the Spoilers Off tool. In particular, I can't figure out how to turn spoilers off for the Nightmare Fuel page. It's mostly using the link that confuses me. Would someone be able to help? ^^;
openOnimusha namespace Videogame
Shouldn't Franchise.Onimusha redirect to VideoGame.Onimusha instead of the other way around? Especially because I don't think there's a second medium, much less a third.
Edited by ACWopenShantae: YMMV Question Videogame
I have a generalized question regarding changes.
A user had edited out a YMMV part, citing "being attracted to 16-year-olds is not, never was, and never will be, immoral." While I readd the part citing "personal morals should not cloud a YMMV", where would I need to go if this does go into an Edit War, if it doesn't escalate a one-on-one Flame War?
I've sent the user my reasoning as to why his edit was not a good reason to alter a YMMV portion, citing that other people have their own morals with regards to the problem and that it'd not be in good graces to just use one's own morals, but to instead consider other people. Especially with regards to something as concrete as the age of consent laws, I feel you can't just throw your own morals in when something could potentially be against the law.
openMurder By Numbers Videogame
I was planning to make a page for the video game Murder By Numbers, but there's a film with the same name that has a page. Should I stick it under VisualNovel.Murder By Numbers or VisualNovel.Murder By Numbers 2020?
openSeparating Mount and Blade: Bannerlord from the Mount and Blade page Videogame
The Mount & Blade page is beyond crowded. Currently, it contains tropes for every single M&B work ever released, including Bannerlord. That's four games and a DLC in one page. Bannerlord needs to be moved to its own page as soon as possible. Anyone is up for that? I'll do it, but I don't know how to add a colon to the title.
Edited by KBZheng123openCreating a New Video Game Page Videogame
Can anyone help create a new page for an upcoming indie game? It's called "Eldest Souls" a boss rush soulslike RPG developed by Fallen Flag Studio, and it's releasing on Steam and Nintendo Switch this summer.
openOutside opinions on disagreement Videogame
Cutting off a brewing edit war at Fallout 3. I'd previously removed the Idiot Plot entry and a user added it back. Here is the entry:
- Idiot Plot: While Fallout 3 is high on the lists of many people for a myriad of reasons, the main plot generally is not one of them.
- The call to action is your dad leaving to jump start his water purifier in order to give the wasteland a source of water. The problem is that this is a non-issue for virtually everyone else living in the wasteland. Aside from everyone having been able to not die of thirst in the 200 years Dad’s device was inactive, the only people you meet in the entire game who are affected by the lack of water are two homeless people that live outside major settlements. This makes his decision seem brash and shortsighted, especially because it resulted in the deaths of many.
- Imagine if you never meet or fight any dragons in Skyrim and the only way you know they exist is because a single npc asks for health potions because of dragon attacks.
- Dad is accosted by the Enclave, who want the purifier for themselves. He decides that a device with unquestionably altruistic functions should be destroyed just so that bad people couldn’t have it. It’s the equivalent of destroying all blood transfusion research so that the Central Powers wouldn’t be able to use it.
- Granted, Eden wanted to use it to kill everyone, but Dad couldn’t have possibly known that at the time.
- You’re railroaded into helping out the residents of Little Lamplight because there is a huge door in your way and children are pointing guns at you. Your only recourse is to take a sidequest or have a perk that is literally useless anywhere else.
- What makes this an example of the trope is that the quest they send you on involves assaulting a fortified base. Forcing your way into Little Lamplight is a much less daunting task but it seems the only reason you can’t do that is because the writer said so.
- You can convince Eden to kill himself in what appears to be a Call-Back to Fallout. However, the first Fallout requires a damning amount of evidence to prove to the Master that everything he did has been to the detriment to humanity. Here, you resort to meaningless platitudes that make the President go “Oh well, may as well kill myself.”
- Prior to the DLC, you have to commit radiation-induced suicide to get the heroic ending. Nevermind that you have a handful of companions immune to radiation, even one who retrieved a Macguffin from insurmountable radiation. The DLC mitigates this but still calls you a coward for being intelligent.
- The call to action is your dad leaving to jump start his water purifier in order to give the wasteland a source of water. The problem is that this is a non-issue for virtually everyone else living in the wasteland. Aside from everyone having been able to not die of thirst in the 200 years Dad’s device was inactive, the only people you meet in the entire game who are affected by the lack of water are two homeless people that live outside major settlements. This makes his decision seem brash and shortsighted, especially because it resulted in the deaths of many.
A lot of these points are nitpicking ("no one needs water but the beggars", "the game pulls But Thou Must! at Little Lamplight") and full of natter (most of the secondary subbullets). The only thing approaching a legitimate complaint is Dad and Eden's decisions, but Dad doesn't destroy the purifier he floods its control room with radiation to keep the Enclave away from it, and the speech check with Eden is very difficult to make and the entire idea of the Speech skill is talking people into agreeing with you, so this is less a case of idiocy on Eden's part and more the developers didn't write good dialogue. And the Heroic Sacrifice ending has been retconned away so that point is moot.
Overall this is just a misuse of Idiot Plot and not applicable.
openMisuse of the Sandbox Namespace Videogame
I just saw that Sandbox.Sonic The Hedgehog Franchise exists. It doesn’t seem to serve any purpose, being redundant to Franchise.Sonic The Hedgehog, as well as collecting every trope the author sees in even one work in the franchise, which contains many entirely separate branches. Notably, only one troper, Anddrix, seems to be working on it. Is there any place for the page on the wiki?
Edited by ShinyCottonCandyopenEdit War on CTR Videogame
YMMV page for CTR Nitro Fueled
Tale On 113 added an example to Uncanny Valley. fasoman1996 removed it. compactwave added it back. Personally, I think it's a valid example, but...
openVideoGame/SonicForces actually DarkerAndEdgier? Videogame
An excerpt from the Sonic Forces trope page:
- Darker and Edgier:
- Eggman has managed to take over the world, and the first gameplay trailer shows Modern Sonic fighting robots in an utterly decimated city. Eggman's robot armies have also shifted from signature cutesy types of the past, and even the Egg Pawns that have been recurring since Sonic Heroes have been redesigned into much more stoic, artificial-looking machines with visible weaponry and Glowing Eyes of Doom.
- The Avatar seems to be carrying a gadget called a "Wispon," which effectively utilizes Wisp powers in forms like the Red Wisp as a flamethrower, heavily implying that the Resistance essentially has no choice but to resort to making powerful weapons to return the favor against Eggman's forces.
- The Story Trailer reveals Doctor Eggman is preparing to destroy Sonic and friends for good. Granted, he tried this before, but this time, he's closer to succeeding than ever before.
The first point is based on the trailer, the second is Fridge Logic/Horror, and the third isn't a strong supporter for the game's Darker and Edgier status (Dr. Eggman tries to kill Sonic and co. every game, and just because he came closer to doing so here makes the game Darker and Edgier?). As a whole, I feel that these points are just generally over-exaggerating how gritty this game actually is.
If anything, this entry should describe how the game attempts to be Darker and Edgier, but falls flat compared to a game like Sonic Adventure 2 which dealt with themes like sacrifice, loss of a loved one, and going mad with vengeance while Sonic Forces had some off-hand mentions of torture and insanity (neither of which amount to anything, and neither were present in the Japanese version), and a war that keeps getting mentioned but we never actually see the effects of other than stuff getting blown up. (Also this is just my opinion but Infinite is so badly written that it's hard to take him seriously.) At the very least, we can talk about the art style, which is definitely less colorful than previous installments.
Edited by supernintendo128
Shadoboy removed all the ZCE markup from Brawlhalla without giving more context. Requesting a revert of their latest edit, as it's quite a lot.
Edited by Crossover-Enthusiast