During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
- Why do a cleanup?: This trope definitely exists and has a well documented history of use. That being said, it frequently gets misused to a character who meets one of the components, namely that they are smart, charming while not necessarily even being a villain, or create good plans. While these are components, there is also a certain personality required, not to mention that all of the above are required to be present for a character to be a true Magnificent Bastard. As the trope attracts interest, it unfortunately brings in a lot of misuse and I thought the best way to rectify this would be a Perpetual Cleanup Thread, as is being done and has seen success with Complete Monster.
- What makes a Magnificent Bastard: Below is a list of the individual components to make this character. Note that they must all be present, not just some, which has lead to frequent misuse:
- Must be intelligent: Goes without saying, to be a Magnificent Bastard, the character has to be smart in the first place and use their brain to work towards whatever their end goal may be;
- Must be a Bastard: While going overboard in how vile the character is can be detrimental, a key aspect is the Bastard part of the trope, whether the character is an out-and-out antagonist in the work, some manner of Villain Protagonist, or something in between, they at least have some unscrupulous qualities to qualify for this trope;
- Must not be too detestable: Again, there is a ceiling on how bad the character can be before they just become too nefarious, blocking out the Magnificent part of the trope. A genocidal racist or child-raping Sadist aren't going to make the cut;
- Think on their feet: In addition to being a Chessmaster, a Magnificent Bastard, if the character deals with situations in which their initial plan is ruined, has to be able to pull a Xanatos Speed Chess and at least come up with a competent strategy to make up for lost time, otherwise they fail for being unable to think in tough spots;
- Have charm: Even if they don't necessarily make every character they meet fall in love with them and can even be detested by others, the audience has to find an amicable social relation to the character, or they are failing to make the impact required for this trope.
- What to do if a character is listed on a page but has not been approved?: They need to be removed, all candidates need to come through the cleanup thread first. The character could well count but they need to be analyzed properly and voted on first.
- Do we list Playing With this trope?: No; as a YMMV trope, this cannot be Played With, so we only want examples that are Played Straight.
- What do I do if I want a character to be listed as a Magnificent Bastard?: The greatest success Complete Monster saw for its cleanup effort was from the invention of the effort post format, so, borrowing from that, a troper wishing to propose a Magnificent Bastard will create such a post in the following format:
- Begin by describing The work, this will help establish the setting the character is in and for the reader to understand what kind of a scenario they are in;
- Summarize The character's actions, this will provide a listing for readers to understand what they do and how it applies to this trope because charm and lack of smugness are so crucial, this is a good time to be incorporating exactly the flavor of how they operate to explain this;
- List circumstances in which the character must Think on their feet, these are times where a wrench might be thrown in their initial plan and they have to adapt on the spot or even come up with a new scheme all together, this is also a good time to explain how the villain reacts to defeat when they have to face it, a true Magnificent Bastard won't break down into tears at the thought of death, they should have known such a possibility could occur and be able to handle it with more dignity;
- The competition, similar to the Heinous Standard dealt with for a Complete Monster, this section is to deal with how successful the character is in carrying out their plans compared to other characters. While, as a villain, they probably are going to lose in the end, it is good to explain how other characters handle the same situation. There is no exceptionalism case to be made for this trope but explaining the variety helps the reader have a better understanding of the proposal.
- How do you know when the character's arc is done so they can be proposed? When their tenure as a villain or antagonist finishes. This could happen in a single Story Arc in an entire work, a single work of a franchise, or the whole series in general. We'll show lenience to Long-Runners with constantly recurring candidates or series with outstanding continuities (ex. comic books), and it's entirely possible to count in a work or two but not in general for a reason like Depending on the Writer.
- What about candidates evil because of external sources? Those Made of Evil can qualify if they show enough individuality and tactical acumen — in other words, they have the personality to fulfill the magnificence requirement. Conversely, those brainwashed, especially if they're a better person without it, may fail the individuality aspect and cannot count.
- What if they are under orders from a higher-up? Depends. If the boss created the plans down to the letter and the candidate is just following them, sounds like we should discuss the boss instead. However, if the candidate takes creative liberties with the orders, adds their own charm and flair to them, fills in holes in the orders, and/or actively deals with obstacles their boss did not talk about, the candidate shows enough individual thinking to qualify.
- What about Character Development? An MB is something a character can develop into... a nice person who plots well might become more morally gray as the work goes on and hits the "Bastard" criteria, thus making them viable. Likewise, a Smug Snake might shed their ego, become more understanding of the threat others pose and gain the personality or "Magnificent" criteria, likewise making them viable. Conversely, a character who looks like this trope might suffer from a Sanity Slippage or just get outed as not being as smart as they thought they were and become incompatible with MB.
- Can an MB be a good guy? Not in the conventional sense... it is required they have at least some dubious traits lest they fail the "Bastard" criteria. That being said, a character who pulls a Heel–Face Turn or eventually stops taking villainous actions is still fair game: as there was a point in time where they were both "Magnificent" and a "Bastard" at the same time and they've merely adapted as time goes on. Now... if such a character begins showing other issues (i.e.: becomes prone to freak outs or starts getting outwitted) then they're compromising their Magnificence and will probably be deemed a cut. What's important is stylishly operating while at least for some time being willing to take at best underhanded methods to see a job done. A Heel–Face Turn in itself isn't a disqualifier but they do have to have been "Magnificent" and a "Bastard" at the same time and afterwards can't start slipping on the former front.
- What about characters whose stories can take different routes?: When proposing a character in a form of media that has them in multiple story routes. Said character must be consistent with their characteristics in all routes. (ex.: Can't have an example who shows promise on one route yet fails in another.) The only exception is if a later installment of the series confirms the character's actions which made them worth proposing are the canon route.
- Is there a timeframe rule like with Complete Monster?: Yes, please wait two weeks until after the work has concluded before proposing a character (again, usually using the North American air date). As is the case with CM, we want to give a reasonable time frame so that everyone interested in seeing the work has done so and can participate in the discussion without having anything spoiled.
- What about groups like with Complete Monster?: This is a point of divergence between the two tropes. While CM does not allow for a single entry encompassing more than three characters lest their heinousness for crimes becomes too watered down, with MB as long as they are treated as one "unit" it is acceptable to lump all characters provided they share acts of charm and intelligence.
- Can I propose my own work's character as a Magnificent Bastard?: No, this is a YMMV subject and the creator of a content is way too biased to be able to evaluate the criteria we're looking for without a second opinion taking over. That being said, you are more than welcome to encourage someone to consume your creation and if they feel a character counts, are more than welcome to suggest them.
- My example/edit has been approved, but the example subpage is locked! How do I get it added?: The moderators do not add examples to locked example subpages in the MagnificentBastard/ namespace directly. Rather, you need to do the edit to a sandbox page that follows the format Sandbox.MagnificentBastard<Name of the example subpage> (e.g for MagnificentBastard.Fullmetal Alchemist it's Sandbox.Magnificent Bastard Fullmetal Alchemist) and on a Friday, ask in the locked pages edit requests thread for the content to be swapped in.
Thread rules
When voting a troper must specify the effort post they're voting on and cannot merely vote on "Everything I missed" as in the past it has indicated the poster didn't read the effort post and is guessing instead of analyzing.
Resolved items
In general, a character listed on this trope is considered "settled". This means they should not be challenged unless information used to list them was incorrect or information was missed in the initial discussion.
However, when re-litigating a candidate, the same rules apply for when they were originally proposed. If they do not have five or more upvotes than downvotes for approval upon a re-litigation, including votes from the initial discussion if they do not change, then they are a cut.
This especially applies to the characters listed below, who have been discussed excessively and repeated attempts to get them listed/cut may result in punitive action for bogging down the thread.
Definitely an MB
- Pokémon Mystery Dungeon: Explorers: Any sadism Darkrai displays is limited in effect thanks to the game's nature and any cowardice which can be inferred about him is Alternative Character Interpretation about his tactical retreats.
- Avatar: The Last Airbender: Azula's Villainous Breakdown is undone in the sequel comic Smoke & Shadow where she regains her composure and ends up stable and in control enough to count.
Definitely not an MB
- South Park: The show's frequent use of vulgar comedy and mean-spirited humor leaves any potential candidates devoid of the dignity or charm to qualify.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:15:22 AM
Sort of how Guma states it. If it became a consistent pattern (just like with Karmic Rape), I'd be iffy but a onetime dose of karma, that's enough for me to say there worth an EP.
Edited by jjjj2 on Jan 1st 2022 at 1:08:30 PM
You can only write so much in your forum signature. It's not fair that I want to write a piece of writing yet it will cut me off in the mid
I'll get into the question later but for now just a general comment: in 2022 can we maybe see some more self-editing so so much doesn't fall on Star and myself?
Made some adjustments on the Live Action TV Sandbox. Removed a stray Apostrophe and for Rick's entry, * Henry Danger was repeated twice
Edited by magnumtropus on Jan 1st 2022 at 10:08:51 PM
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
What exactly do you mean? Putting the posts in the drafts or sending them to edit requests? I always pothole mine and put them onto the drafts page, but I always assumed the edit requests were done weekly by you as the thread curator.
Edited by LoreDeluxe on Jan 1st 2022 at 10:09:04 AM
Think you're tough because you made it through Lord of the Rings? Real men survive The Silmarillion.
You are not the problem if that's your concern Lore also thanks!
To expand, some of the entries I'm getting uh... don't look like the poster bothered to give a second glance at some of the grammar before submitting. Just a request to make my life a little easier.
Edited by 43110 on Jan 1st 2022 at 6:18:12 PM
Professor Gigachad
By the way there is also an issue, the links in the sub-bullets in the Case Closed tree are so long that they are breaking the wicking and can't even be made into pages.
CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes
The Moron
I mean, there's really nothing that can be done about that unless someone else manages to figure out a way to shorten the titles - until then, our hands are kinda tied because of the Red Link policy
Edited by STARCRUSHER99 on Jan 1st 2022 at 1:24:21 PM
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
Lyrus, Bobo, Sushi Girl and Doug
Professor Gigachad
Couldn't we just remove them?
Actually I can find a way to shorten them.
Edited by Ordeaux26 on Jan 1st 2022 at 10:24:59 AM
CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes
The Moron
We're usually expected to red-link specific chapters/episode titles so that if a Recap page is made, the links will go blue. We do it for literally everything else, so to not do it here would be a bit odd.
Edited by STARCRUSHER99 on Jan 1st 2022 at 1:25:33 PM
Professor Gigachad
I have found a way to shorten them anyway.
- Case Closed:
- "The Moonlight Sonata Murders": Seiji Asoh is the son of Keiji Asoh, the true identity of Doctor Narumi Asai and the culprit behind the murders on Tsukikage Island. Seeking to avenge the deaths of the Asoh family, Seiji begins murdering those responsible, playing a recording of the "Moonlight Sonata" as a funeral piece for each of them. Seiji drowns Hideo Kawashima so the Japanese Police will have to examine the body on the mainland, leaving him as the only doctor on the island. Seiji then kills Tatsuji Kuroiwa, using the recording of the Sonata and his medical knowledge to create an alibi for himself. Seiji then murders Ken Nishimoto, making his death look like a suicide and writing a note saying that he's the real murderer. When his crimes are discovered, Seiji calmly burns himself to death along with his father's beloved piano, spending his last moments thanking Conan for his kindness.
- "Murder at the Ski Lodge": Akiko Yonehara is a cheerful former teacher of Ran and Sonoko who's out to deliver justice to two of her colleagues who murdered her student. Inviting all of her coworkers to a ski lodge, Akiko murders Sugiyama before everyone arrives, then fakes an attack on herself and Sonoko in order to give herself an alibi. She then strengthens her alibi by rigging Sugiyama's body to be found at a set time where everyone is in the same place. Not knowing the identity of the other murderer, Akiko invites a reporter connected to the student's death to the lodge and leaves subtle clues to her true intentions in order to cause Sugiyama's cohort, Kohei Shimoda to panic and reveal himself. Akiko then strangles Kohei with her wig to obfuscate his death and when exposed admits fully to her crimes and expresses regret that she had to hurt Sonoko to get what she wanted.
- "Mysterious Clocks": Monjiro Izubuchi was a criminal known as "The Demon" and the leader of the gang of thieves known as "The Goblins". After several years of successful criminal activity, Monjiro decided to retire and distributed his stolen goods among the gang while keeping a valuable set of diamonds for himself. Years later, Monjiro decides to give a gift to his beloved granddaughter Misao. Gifting his house to Misao when he dies, i's revealed that he set up an intricate puzzle within the house, with the ultimate prize being a watch containing the diamonds as his gift to Misao.
- "The Actor's Apartment and the Two Rooms": Kozaburo Hijikata is a famous actor who schemes to murder his cheating wife and frame Hajime Okita. Inviting Kogoro Mouri to his apartment under the pretense of teaching him how to act like a detective, Kozaburo rigs his wife's corpse to fall on an adjacent balcony so Ran and Conan will see it. In order to frame Hajime, Kozaburo makes his rooms on the fifth and sixth floors look identical so his guests think that they are on the fifth floor when they're really on the sixth. When everyone runs to get the police, Kozaburo lowers the body onto the balcony of Hajime's apartment a floor below so he will look like the killer. When accused by Conan and Kogoro, Kozaburo points out that the evidence used doesn't prove he's the killer, and Conan is only able to find the damning evidence by pure luck, with Kozaburo quietly accepting his arrest while complimenting Kogoro.
- "Murder on the North Star Express and the Unpublished Novel": Toshinori Kaetsu is a former member of Yasuji Asama's gang who initially began working for Keitaro Izumo as part of a plan to rob his store. However after his girlfriend died from a drug overdose, Kaetsu began planning to kill Asama for getting her hooked on drugs, and Izumo for being a drug dealer. Lying to Asama by telling him that Izumo wanted his store robbed to get insurance, the robbery is botched when Izumo hits the alarm, causing people to believe that he caused the robbery to look like a hero. Kaetsu then tricks the two into getting on the same train and beats Asama to death, then shoots Izumo while disguised as Asama and rigging his body to fall out of the train, making it seem as if Asama killed Izumo, then died accidentally while trying to escape. When Yukiko Kudo claims to have evidence that would expose Kaetsu he plans to kill her, being only seconds away from succeeding when he's finally caught.
Doug MacRay
Edited by AlternativeCola on Jan 2nd 2022 at 9:42:46 AM
In Film A To I, there was a typo in Kishanlal's entry - One instance of "Robert" was misspelt as "Roberty". I just corrected that
Edited by magnumtropus on Jan 2nd 2022 at 2:11:07 PM
So since I EPed Abridged!Turles last week, took a dive into Dragon Ball again and came across a possible keeper that I missed last time round. From Dragon Ball Z we have Dabura, The Dragon to Babidi for the early parts of the Majin Buu arc.
Who is Dabura and what has he done?
Dabura is the King of the Demon Realm and one of the series most blatant Satanic Archetypes (a literal Big Red Devil). At some point he was put under the control of Evil Sorceror Babidi and made into one of his minions.
Though it should be noted that Babidi's spell only ensures Dabura's loyalty, but the demon king still very much retains his independent thought processes and cunning, sometimes even expressing doubts over his master's decisions.
He is tasked with helping his master release Majin Buu, a sealed Eldritch Abomination that Babidi intends to awaken as a Living Weapon.
Despite hiding their ki, Babidi and Dabura are made aware of their presence, to which Dabura carries out his master's orders to kill all but the Saiyans and the Supreme Kai, who Babidi still needed alive. Once Babidi steps into the ship, Dabura rush attacks and kills Kibito, completely catching the heroes off guard, then uses his demonic spit on Krillin and Piccolo which turns them into stone, which gave the heroes incentive to follow Dabura straight into the ship, as killing Dabura was the only way to un-stone their friends.
The Saiyans and Supreme Kai follow into the ship just as planned. On each floor of the ship, Babidi sends out one of his champions to fight the Saiyans and convert the damage they receive into energy to recharge Buu. But soon find out they have grossly underestimated the Saiyans power, even with Dabura advising Babidi to give one of them homefield advantage proving to be futile. By the time of level 3, the villains grow concerned. So Dabura volunteers to fight them himself, being Babidi's strongest warrior by far.
Dabura enters the room with the heroes, and applauds their power for having defeated Babidi's past champions. He even offered to let the Saiyans all fight him together (having measured Goku's power previously and determined it was lower than his), but Gohan insists on fighting solo. Nonetheless, Dabura shows himself to be a gentleman and requests Babidi change the terrain to a place similar to Earth, as to not give himself any unfair advantage.
Dabura's opponent is Gohan, and proves himself to be the most difficult opponent yet, being roughly equal to Cell's powerlevel but complemented by magic. Dabura shows Gohan is shown to struggle immensely soon gets very pressured during their fight. He gets to show cunning a few times such as foiling Gohan's sneak attack, or goading Gohan into charging at him where he then uses his spit on Gohan and would have turned him to stone had it not been for Gohan's glove.
However, during the fight Dabura overhears Vegeta speaking with a haughty, impatient tone. Realizing that Vegeta is not as pure as the other Saiyans, Dabura gets an idea and departs from the fight. He then informs his boss of this finding, so that Babidi can use a spell to take control of the mind of anyone with evil in their heart, enslaving Vegeta into one his minions and turning him into Majin Vegeta. Dabura also advises Babidi to order Majin Vegeta to kill the other heroes so they cannot interfere... except it turns out Vegeta's overwhelming pride allows him to defy Babidi's orders. Vegeta declares he only desires to fight his rival Goku, which Babidi allows as it still provided them with energy for Majin Buu.
Just as planned, Goku and Vegeta's fight fills up Majin Buu's energy, enough to awaken the eldritch being from its slumber. In a desperate bid to prevent Buu from awakening, Gohan fires a massive blast at Buu's cocoon, to which Dabura snatches Babidi and gets his master out of the blast radius.
Gohan's efforts however fail, and Buu is released from the cocoon and materializes into solid form. However to everyone's surprise, Buu has the appearance of an obese blob like humanoid and the personality of an immature child. This disgusts Dabura who verbally expresses his revulsion toward Buu to Babidi, however the previously childish Buu becomes angered by this remark and pummels Dabura away with ease.
In an anime only scene, Dabura recovers from this attack and then returns to impale Buu with a spear to distract him. Then approaching Babidi, Dabura urges Babidi that Buu is too powerful to control and that it would be wise to reseal him away. However being the Smug Snake that he is, Babidi refuses to listen and disowns Dabura seeing he has outlived his usefulness, then orders Buu to kill Dabura. Dabura stands no chance, where Buu transforms him into a cookie and eats him, killing him.
Babidi and Majin Buu would go on to ravage the Earth, causing genocide on the human race. Eventually Buu would grow tired of Babidi bossing him around, eventually betraying Babidi and killing him, just as Dabura had previously warned him.
It's later revealed that Dabura got sent to the afterlife, where as a Demon King it was decided he would enjoy Hell too much. So instead he was sent to heaven as punishment. However, filler scenes show that Dabura's stay in heaven caused him to undergo a Heel–Face Turn where he repents for his sins and even comforts the heroes' wives who were killed by Buu.
Bio Summary
- Babidi and Dabura become aware of the heroes spying on their base, but pretend not to notice them until Babidi goes back inside his ship.
- Finally revealing he is aware of the heroes in hiding, Dabura quickly kills Kibito the Supreme Kai's servant, then uses his spit to turn Krillin and Piccolo into stone. All of this is to lure the Saiyans and Supreme Kai into the ship, which works handily.
- When Babidi sends champions out to fight the Saiyans, Dabura advises Babidi on giving Puipui home field advantage.
- Upon the heroes reaching level 3, Dabura as Babidi's strongest warrior, volunteers to fight the Saiyans himself
- Having measured Super Saiyan Goku's power earlier, Dabura calculates he is still far stronger, so offers to let all three of them fight him at once. Dabura however is displeased with Gohan choosing to go solo and treating the thing like a game.
- Dabura is able to give Gohan a lot of trouble, with a combination of raw power and cunning, tricking Gohan several times.
- Overhearing Vegeta being haughty and impatient, Dabura correctly guesses Vegeta is not pure of heart and comes up with the idea for Babidi to turn Vegeta into another one of his brainwashed slaves.
- After being informed by Dabura, Babidi uses a spell on Vegeta, turning him into Majin Vegeta. While Majin Vegeta is still defiant of Babidi, he does fight Goku and provides enough energy to awaken Buu.
- When the heroes try to stop Buu from awakening, Dabura whisks Babidi away from the blast radius.
- After being awakened, Dabura is disgusted by Buu's childish demeanor, angering Buu who pummels him.
- In an anime scene, Dabura realizes Buu's power and the fact Babidi cannot control him, Dabura tries to warn his master and urges him to reseal Buu.
- Babidi fails to listen and pulls a You Have Outlived Your Usefulness on Dabura, ordering Buu to kill him.
- Dabura is killed, but his warning to Babidi turn out to be true, with Buu eventually betraying and killing Babidi.
- Dabura is sent to the afterlife, where he is sent to Heaven as he would enjoy Hell too much. However his stay in Heaven causes him to pull a Heel–Face Turn where he repents for his sins.
How is he Magnificent? Competition?
In a series where most fights are dictated by powerlevels and fists, Dabura is one of the more cunning villains who makes heavy use of his mind to best his opponents. His fight with Gohan differs a bit between the manga and anime, but both show him using sneak attacks and/or tricking Gohan into letting down his guard. He was also the one who came up with the idea for Babidi to turn Vegeta into one of his brainwashed minions, turning one of their powerful enemies they had trouble with against the rest. In the anime he also realizes just how dangerous Buu is and tries to convince Babidi to reseal him, with Dabura later proven to be correct.
Personality wise, Dabura is a literal Noble Demon. He speaks like a gentleman, and give his opponents a very fair chance. Believing his power eclipsed the Saiyans, he offers to let them all fight him at once. He also ensures to pick a terrain similar to Earth, so that he doesn't have any unfair advantage when fighting Gohan.
While, Dabura displays the usual 'loves combat and beating down enemies' sadism, it's very tame by DB standards. He is purely pragmatic in those he kills and never tortures or causes his enemies any unnecessary pain.
Too much of a Bastard?
He may work underneath one of the most vile beings in the universe (Babidi is a Complete Monster), but Dabura's own visible crimes are actually among the tamest out of Dragon Ball's baddies. He kills Kibito, then turns Krillin and Piccolo to stone, both of which have the pragmatic reason to lure the Saiyans into the ship. He also tries to kill Gohan to give Buu energy, but that's the extent of it.
In the filler scene where he ends up in heaven, it's even shown he has pulled a Heel–Face Turn, indicating he is not pure evil like his heritage would suggest.
Final verdict?
Essentially Babidi's equivalent of Captain Ginyu, a CM boss with a less nasty but very cunning lackey. I think he's a keeper
Edited by Snowy66 on Jan 2nd 2022 at 5:07:30 AM
Uh also, in Fan Works, Abridged!Paragus is now listed twice, with his two entries being slightly different. Which one are we keeping?
I think I have another qualifier from Psych. I'll be suggesting more Psych qualifiers soon, But I'll need to re-watch certain episodes first.
The Show
Psych is a TV Show that ran for 8 Seasons from 2006 to 2014. It follows a hyper-observant man named Shawn Spencer who pretends to be psychic to solve cases. I already covered this show some months ago with Pierre Despereaux. The candidate this time is a one shot character from Season 6.
The Candidate
Reginald "The Mantis" Parker, who appears in the episode "The Amazing Psych-Man & Tap-Man, Issue 2", an Affectionate Parody of Superhero media.
The episode starts with Shawn and Gus chasing after 4 members of the Camino Drug Syndicate, but they end up tripping and losing the gangsters. When they get back up and resume the chase, they find the men tied up, having been apprehended by a mysterious Batman-esque vigilante who calls himself "The Mantis".
Later at the police station, Shawn deduces when and where the next deal will be, but by the time the SPBD arrive the Mantis has already taken care of it. Out of jealousy, Shawn tries to one up him by crashing in on the next drug deal while the Mantis is there. The two get in a fight, which ends with the Mantis knocking out Shawn and swapping clothes with him.
Later, the Mantis sends back Shawn's dry cleaned clothes and tells the police where the next Camino trade will be. However, when they get there, they find the Mantis with blood on his hands next to a corpse. The Mantis runs away, but Shawn realizes he isn't the killer. The duo finds the Mantis's address and learn that the Mantis' true identity is Reginald Parker, a reporter who showed up at the police station earlier in the episode. After a brief scuffle, they tell him that they know he is innocent, which causes him to stop.
He tells them that the man who died was his mole inside the Caminos, who he believes was discovered and executed. He also tells them that he's going to retire the Mantis as the police think he is a killer and there is no way he can go up against 10 gangsters at the main distribution center. However Shawn convinces him to take action. That night, the Mantis and the Psych duo arrive to stop the Caminos with police assistance. The criminals are apprehended and the Mantis mysteriously disappears.
Later, Shawn arrives at Reginald's apartment to return his dry cleaned suit, but finds it totally empty. He realizes that Reginald wasn't trying to stop the Caminos for justice, but to steal their drug money. Shawn confronts Reginald, who doesn't seem too bothered by his presence - if anything, he thanks him for his help. However, Shawn is having none of it, so they fight. Reginald flees when Juliet and Lassiter show up, but he is apprehended by Shawn, who went around back to tackle Reginald to the ground.
Magnificence
Despite only being in it for the money, he proves to be an effective vigilante, striking fear in the hearts of the Caminos. He is genuinely skilled at martial arts and is able to take on 4 syndicate members at once, and has done so on multiple occasions. He also would have gotten away with his scheme had Shawn not decided to return his suit
Bastardry
He doesn't care for justice or fighting for what is right - He is only going after the Caminos because he wants their drug money. However, when Shawn confronts him at the end of the episode, he sincerely thanks him his help (even if it was unintentional) and offers him some of the money as a thanks.
Mitigating Factors
After his inside man is killed, he considers giving up because he has no way to track the syndicate's actions, and also because he can't go up against 10 criminals at once (although that might just be common sense - never go up against 10 gangsters guys. It's a bad idea).
Edited by magnumtropus on Jan 2nd 2022 at 9:11:29 PM
I'm gonna give a no to Dabura. When Buu's awakened, not only does Dabura severely underestimate Buu's power, but suffers a massively undignified beatdown from Buu. And unlike Z's interpretation of Ginyu, Dabura never really bounces back from his mistake.
Edited by Awesomekid42 on Jan 2nd 2022 at 10:14:47 AM
Goku Black
He uh basically totally gets owned here and underestimated him painfully.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
He underestimated him at first, but afterwards he realized his mistake and tries to warn Babidi.
I thought about his death, but when you put it in the context that Buu pretty much does the same thing to the whole world, including the heroes. There wasn't really anything he could do to avoid it. He was basically a Sacrificial Lion to show the carnage that was to come.
But if that's still too much, then fair.
Edited by Snowy66 on Jan 2nd 2022 at 7:26:23 AM
Woagh
![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
to Dabura. He's a character created to undergo The Worf Effect, not this trope.
That being said, I've heard his Dragon Ball Xenoverse 2 counterpart would be worth talking about, he undergoes Adaptational Badass and everything.
NOISE IS CALLING, PICK UP PHONE
The MILF Virus
So I just finish Code Vein and enjoy it. So I got two candidates to put up, and let's start with the Big Good of the game, Gregorio Silva.
What is the setting?
Code Vein is a Souls like action adventure game made by Bandai Namco which revolves around an amnesiac protagonist who's a Revenant, essentially an undead vampire. Waking up by the side of a mysterious girl name Io, you learn the world inside the Gaol of the Red Mist is the last remnants of Earth after the Great Collapse cause by the Queen after she unleash the Lost, blood craving monsters who were many once Revenants that fell into hunger, upon the world. Picked up by Louie, you join his crew to help learn the truth of this world and solve a massive supply demand causing disruption between the Revenants and the remaining humans, Blood Beads, essential to a Revenant's survival otherwise they would rely on actual human blood to keep themselves alive which has cause friction between the two.
At the center of this issue our candidate Gregorio Silva leader of Cerberus the governing body inside the Gaol of the Red Mist, who while seemingly built up to be the Big Bad ends up becoming closer to a Big Good despite his really dire caste system place upon the survivors and why he does it much more complicated then it first seems.
Who is Gregorio Silva and what does he do?
The leader of Cerberus, the Human and Revenant government body inside the Gaol of the Red Mist, Gregorio Silva is a respected if feared man. The father of the Queen who created the Lost, Cruz Silva, Silva led the operation to stop his daughter, although the truth is way more complicated then what it seems. It turns out the Great Collapse wasn't caused by Cruz, rather it was created by the creatures called the Aragami, the primary enemies of the God Eater franchise, and the whole creation of Revenants, the Queen, and the Lost all revolves stopping them. Seeking to conduct an experiment to counter them, the survivors created the Queen and Revenant program headed by Gregorio and Juzo Mido, which revolves around experimenting on Cruz Silva, Gregorio's daughter who actually volunteered. While the experiments went well at first, Mido's personal fascination with the Aragami became the catalyst of the Queen and Lost, personally changing the experiments to cause her to go out of control in hopes of using the Aragami as part of his personal quest for evolution.
Seeing what has happened, Gregorio planned to atone for what happened to his own daughter and to stop her rampage, leading the program to create the Revenants using BOR Parasites on dead bodies to bring them to life as soldiers to fight the Queen and once they defeat her, they would cut her into different parts due to unkillable status and seal them inside different individuals labelled Successors to prevent her resurrection, although Gregorio had more underlying plans behind this. Conducting Operation Queen Slayer, Gregorio had Jack and Protagonist hunt and defeat the Queen, but when the Protagonist end up becoming emplace the Queen's Blood, Gregorio had Jack shot him down and thrown into an abyss. Knowing the Queen cannot be truly killed, Gregorio had the Queen's different part put into different individuals as Successors and then place them inside a sanctuary while ordering Jack to become the Hunter to watch over the different Successors to see if any will frenzy which if they do Jack is required to put them down.
Taking advantage of the power of the Queen, Gregorio turned himself into a Successor by taking the Queen's Brain and then hooking up himself in a chamber of blood to create the Gaol of the Red Mist to turn there small land into a safety haven from the Aragami. With a dire situation still happening inside the Gaol due to Revenants needing Blood Beads to survive and not become part of the Lost which cause conflict with the humans, Gregorio enforce a system where Revenants are to earn there keep for Blood Beads even if it means venturing into dangerous territory and subjecting the strong willed ones to the weaker Revenants, which while there's still conflict with desenter it ultimately kept some control in the safe haven until Mido began his own plans.
With Mido wanting to destroy the Red Mist to let the Aragami in for his twisted idea of evolution, Mido began invading the Successors for there parts with his ultimate plan being to kill Gregorio to stop it. While unable to directly fight him to maintain the Red Mist, he was able to hold off despite Mido's attempts and maintain himself long enough for the heroes to reach him so they could put him down when he goes frenzy himself, trusting Jack the duty of putting him down and finding a new Successor in maintaining the Red Mist which happens in the normal ending. In the best ending, because Io who is a clone of Cruz the Queen, Io was able to permanently take Gregorio's place by becoming the Weeping Tree, using her power to save Gregorio. Now freed from his burden, Gregorio then make efforts to reform his draconic government for a more open and united one between the Revenants and Humans with the help of Jack and Davis, while allowing the Protagonist and his group to journey outside the mist to face the Aragami.
Is he Magnificent?
Yes, being able to save a good portion of survivors from the Aragami and defeat the Queen, Gregorio is definitely a respectable individual even though he had to rely on some really abhorrent things to do them, but considering the dire consequences even his victims like the Protagonist understood what he was necessary.
Fixing the mistakes he made with the Queen by leading it's defeat with charismatic leadership, creating the Successor Program to prevent it's resurrection due to her immortality, and even taking advantage of said program to create the mist to create a safe haven, and even arranging a contingency plan in case he does go frenzy as a Successor by entrusting Jack, Gregorio definitely has a lot in his resume.
Too Much of a Bastard?
Gregorio may have a very tyrannical system where Revenants are treated as expandable weapons and allowed to become part of the Lost due to not receiving Blood Beads and he was more then willing to use people for his scheme turning them into Successors or soldiers, Gregorio does ultimately have his reasons due to the dire circumstances he was given and even then he tries to save as many as he can. He was also willing to let his daughter be the test subject as the Queen, but she also did volunteer and Gregorio did do his best to treat his daughter well, but unfortunately Mido's action force him to lead to her defeat and cut her into different pieces which Gregorio show reluctancy to do so.
Also there might be the conflict of Mido outsmarting Gregorio, and while he does get the better of him a few times, Gregorio is still able to takes everything Mido does with his sheer will power and manage to come up a plan of his own to stop the damage Mido might cause even though it would end with his death as the frenzied Successor of the Brain and in the best ending he does survive to help reform his tyrannical system.
Final Verdict:
I say he keeps and he's one of two I got for this game.
"Are you the devil?" "Don't compare to me to those small fry" - Mir
Silva
Okay, maybe I was getting ahead of myself with Dabura. Still felt I had to EP him to be sure. Thanks for the feedback guys
Edited by magnumtropus on Jan 2nd 2022 at 7:58:51 PM
Goku Black
Reginald and Silva
Haven’t we approved characters who rape rapists?