Complete Monster Cleanup

Adding a cut to the Creature Feature guy

On the subject of cuts there is one group of villains I am kind of interested in taking a look at after checking the CSI-verse page.

• CSI: Trilogy ^note crossover between CSI: Miami, CSI: NY, and CSI: These three represent the worst that the Zetas have to offer:
  • Part 1 (CSI: Miami's "Bone Voyage"): Jimmy Burris is a pimp who tricks numerous women throughout Miami into working for him by posing as a recruiter for a model agency, where he would then have them forced into prostitution, even having sex with them himself. When one of his prisoners, Ashley Tanner, tries to escape, Burris tracked her down, planning to dismember her while she's still alive, before dumping her remains in the swamps.
  • Part 2 (CSI: NY's "Hammer Down"): Casey Steele transports the abducted women throughout the U.S., where he would harvest the women's organs by extracting them from their bodies while they are still alive and conscious, his victims dying in excruciating pain; Debbie Menzel is one such example, with Steele cutting her open to extract her liver before she dies. When he retrieves Madeleine Briggs from Jimmy Burris's liaison, Tyler Goodman, Steele murders Tyler after he served his purpose. After causing a car accident that killed a man, Steele forces an innocent bystander to drive him and his captive away from the car crash and into New York City before shooting him and leaving him to die; he would shoot at several New York cops when he makes his attempts to leave the city.
  • Part 3 (CSI's "The Lost Girls"): Dimitri Sadesky is a leader of the Zetas and is responsible for arranging for countless women to be kidnapped throughout the U.S., their organs harvested, and them forced into prostitution. In his role as a college professor, Dimitri exploits his position to lure students into sex work. He's also had them killed whenever they try to escape from their imprisonment, even killing four women himself after he is done torturing them, and he also murdered Samantha Matthews before having a butcher from Miami dismember and dispose of her corpse.

Dimitri is seems fine as he is the leader of the organization and Casey while not the leader seems to play a large enough role along with his large amount of extra cruelty that he has.

However, it's Jimmy that I am skeptical on qualifying. Most of his crimes are part of what the entire rest of the group is doing with the whole human trafficking and organ harvesting stuff, he does have one extra level of cruelty with Ashley but Dimitri does basically the same thing later. Checking the wiki page on the Zetas the group seems to have a rather large number of members, and Jimmy is only assigned two named victims in comparison to the other two, and he isn't a super important member of the gang. I did check the original EP and it didn't really get much discussion on how Jimmy stands out from his fellow Zeta members. I am not really seeing anything that makes him particularly distinct beyond being a slightly nastier-than-average goon.

Also just so they're not dwarfing the likes of Dalton who's a fucking horror show I was wondering if we'd like to consider a trim for Hugh & Ulf.

From:

• "Hard" Hugh Hammer and Ser Ulf the White, known as "The Betrayers", are "Dragonseeds", descendants of Targaryen bastards, who successfully tame dragons and are recruited into the forces of Queen Rhaenyra Targaryen. During the Battle of Tumbleton, however, they reveal their true colors: Defecting to Aegon II's side, the two attack Tumbleton with their dragons, scorching the town from end to end with their flames and killing all those caught up in the conflagration, with thousands of refugees burning or drowning in the river Mander. This eventually leads to a brutal sacking of the town, during which people were killed, women—as well as girls as young as eight and ten years old—were raped, and babies were impaled on spears. After the Fall of Tumbleton, Ulf rapes three maidens per night and feeds those who fail to please his urges to his dragon. Ulf demands the rulership of Highgarden for his service while Hugh intends to take the throne in the same way as Aegon the Conqueror—with a dragon. When one knight is so incensed he knocks Hugh's self-made crown off, Hugh has three horseshoes nailed to his head.

To:

• Sers "Hard" Hugh Hammer and Ulf (the) White, aka "The Betrayers", are dragon tamers descending from Targaryen bastards recruited by Queen Rhaenrya I Targaryen. Defecting to her rival-brother King Aegon II's side, Hugh and Ulf attack Tumbleton, scorching the town with their dragons and killing thousands in the burning and many more drowning in the river as they try to flee. Opening Tumbleton's gates to sack it, women—as well as girls as young as eight—are raped, babies impaled on spears and Ulf personally makes a point of raping three maidens per night, feeding those who fail to satisfy him to his dragon. While Ulf demands Highgarden for his services, Hugh plans to depose Aegon and take the throne himself with his dragon, nailing horseshoes to the head of one man who angrily knocks off Hugh's self-made crown.

If not that's fine but just a suggestion, feedback welcome!

Re: CSI, G anything there? Tbh that's a Monster page I'm quite happy to do a review on.

Edited by 43110 on Dec 12th 2022 at 4:10:55 AM

I am fine with trimming their writ-up.

Not familiar with the CSI, but just by reading their entries, Jimmy doesn't sound heinous enough compared to the other two, so I am leaning cut there, but I would like thoughts from other people who have watched the show.

EDIT: But honestly, if he is regularly raping the girls himself instead of just giving them to the clients, and also wanted to dismember one of them alive (Dimitri's entry mentions that he dismembered his victim after her death) that might be enough to push him and from what I have seen in G's EP, he used the exact same arguments, so I will wait for his opinions.

Edited by WatTambor on Dec 12th 2022 at 12:23:51 PM

Nice trim there 43!

Hmm if Jimmy's raping the girls and the others aren't, I'd say there's unique points there.

That is something I did consider but I am not sure if that is distinct enough. Casey harvests the organs of the girls while they are still alive, and according to G's original EP there is another member of this group called Anthoney Samuel who also abuses the women under his control.

I'll probably request the swaps tomorrow morning.

The fact that Jimmy rapes the girls himself might be enough since from what I am reading, the other guy didn't do it. Abstaining for now though.

Also another thing I forgot to say. It feels kind of weird to assign Jimmy points for personally raping the victims when a major part of the operation is selling them off to be forced into prostitution. I mean I guess that technically isn't exactly the same but it is such a small distinction.

Edited by Ordeaux26 on Dec 12th 2022 at 1:26:27 AM

I mean, raping them himself versus selling them off to someone else are indeed vastly different crimes, especially if this means that he's doing both by working for the organization that does that. If no one else in the organization is doing the raping themself I'm inclined to make it a small keep, but it would be admittedly tentative

Not sure on Jimmy.

Although the Casting Couch and Model Scam thing might give him a slight edge.

Can we change Dimitri's name pothole to Diabolical Mastermind?

Thoughts on my pothole change idea?

Edited by SkyCat32 on Dec 12th 2022 at 4:35:42 AM

I like it

Yeah when I first Ep’d Jimmy with the other Zeta baddies I wasn’t sure if he stood up out compared to Dimitri and Casey (I even said my doubts on Jimmy’s mark on the heinous standard but still included him since forcing his female captives to have sex with him and butchering one of them alive seemed unique enough). I’ll abstain on him since even I’m not sure about whether he should go or stay. Im sorry if I’m much help on this

Edited by G-Editor on Dec 11th 2022 at 11:37:22 PM

There is one thing that honestly concerns me more, Jimmy seems to only have one confirmed victim that being Ashley, he probably has a pattern implying more but him only having on confirmed victim when the fellow members have far more seems to be an issue. That is an issue we have had in the past where characters from these shows have gotten up due to vague victims counts with so much competition.

Edited by Ordeaux26 on Dec 12th 2022 at 1:36:53 AM

So I suggest this for Volsung (there might be room for improvement ofc)

Original:

• The Guardian of the Keys: Volsung of Nichor, in contrast to the many complex and sympathetic villains, is a thuggish coward and all-around scumbag. After Thorgal tried to save him, to no avail due to his own greed, Volsung is revived by the evil deity Nidhogg. Given Thorgal's form, Volsung seduces a deity in love with Thorgal, in order to sleep with her and steal her magic belt. Volsung murders Thorgal and takes over his life, attempting to ruin his enemy's good name. Volsung gleefully murders the village chief, rapes his wife, tries to kill even more people while trying to eventually rape Thorgal's own wife and murder Thorgal's baby daughter out of nothing but spite and cruelty.

Revision:

• Volsung of Nichor, in contrast to the many complex and sympathetic villains, is a thuggish coward and all-around scumbag. After participating in the tournament of Aran during which he killed a man by shooting an arrow in his back, Volsung is released from his prison by the evil deity Nidhogg. Given Thorgal's form, Volsung seduces a deity in love with Thorgal, in order to sleep with her and steal her magic belt. Granted immortality and invulnerability, Volsung murders Thorgal and takes over his life while trying to eventually rape Thorgal's wife Aaricia and threatening to murder Thorgal's baby daughter Wolfcub. Volsung then gleefully murders the Viking chief, rapes his wife and usurps power by threatening the great council with the goal of conquering the whole world. Defeated, he uses Thorgal's young son Jolan as a hostage. Years later, when a teenage Wolfcub and the dwarf Thjazi break into his and Nidhogg’s prison, Volsung suggests his cellmate to torture them both to pass the time.

Come to think of it, my Thanos Rewritte is long overdue.

• Lanfeust

Current:

• Thanos was once the most brilliant student of the city of Eckmul, but succumbed to a hunger for power and cruelty. Becoming a pirate in service to the brutal Baron Averroes, his men would attack ships, slaughter and rob those aboard and rape the women they found. When he captured Lanfeust himself, Thanos tortured him by slicing him open and cutting his eyes out. It is soon revealed that Thanos is Baron Averroes and intends to sack the city of Or-Azur, with the threat that there will soon be no virgins left in the city. When he conquers Eckmul, Thanos kills those who he thinks can oppose his rule, and forces the heroine Cixi to kill Thanos's own brother by using her magic to boil his blood in his body. Forcing the sages to serve him, Thanos threatens their families should they resist, and when hunting a vigilante opposing him, Thanos allows his pet monsters to eat a random man in the crowd as a point. When he finally faces Lanfeust for the fate of Eckmul, Thanos brags the reason he will win is because he is simply the most evil. In the second series, after joining Prince Delhu in his conspiracy, he coldly murders the only woman who ever loved him, abducts Lanfeust and Cixi's son Glin, manipulates him and drugs him with a substance that causes him murderous urges before killing Prince Delhu to become the sole ruler of the Galaxy. In Cixi of Troy, we learn that during his tyranny on Troy, he threw a pirate crew into an arena to be fed to an Hydra, allowed Duke Kraniol to experiment on captives—one of them being a child—and planned to kill all the sages to become even more powerful. He also repeatedly abused his mistress Cixi and when she got pregnant with his child, he accelerated the development of the fetus, not caring that Cixi would die in the process.

Trimmed (I also rearranged the chronological order of events) :

• Lanfeust of Troy, Lanfeust of the Stars and Cixi of Troy: Thanos, once the most brilliant student of Eckmul city, succumbed to a hunger for power and cruelty. Becoming a pirate, his men would attack ships, slaughter and rob those aboard and rape the women. When he captured Lanfeust himself, Thanos tortured him by slicing him open and cutting his eyes out. Under the guise of Baron Averroes, he intends to sack the city of Or-Azur, with no virgins left in the city. Conquering Eckmul, Thanos kills those who he thinks can oppose him, and forces Cixi to kill Thanos's own brother by using her magic to boil his blood in his body. Forcing the sages to serve him, Thanos threatens their families, and when hunting a vigilante, Thanos allows his pet monsters to eat a random bystander as a point. During his tyranny, he has a pirate crew thrown be fed to a Hydra, allows Duke Kraniol to experiment on captives and plans to kill all the sages to become even more powerful. He also repeatedly abuses Cixi and when she gets pregnant with his child, he accelerates the gestation, not caring that Cixi would die in the process. After joining Prince Delhu in his conspiracy, he coldly murders his partner Glace who loved him, abducts Lanfeust and Cixi's son Glin, drugs him with a substance that causes murderous urges before killing Prince Delhu to become the sole ruler of the Galaxy.

Again there’s room for improvement but it’s (slightly) less wordy. I insist thanos does a lot over three series and the current write up isn't even exhaustive.

Volsung is from Thorgal

Edited by Silverblade2 on Dec 20th 2022 at 2:30:55 PM

Remind me again, in which series does Volsuing appear?

Also, for Thanos...I'll play with it, but for someone who does so much the length's probably fine.

Oh, right. I was combining my French comics there

Edited by ACW on Dec 12th 2022 at 6:27:44 AM

Edited by ACW on Dec 12th 2022 at 6:27:37 AM

Regarding Ulf and Hugh's proposed entry. There are two problem.

1) They didn't open gate. It was Roger Corne, same guy whom Hugh nailed horshoe.

2) Entry somehow imply they were one leading the sack while actually they were just participants although the book says they committed worst crimes during occupation.

And i will ask. Does Craster needs two entries?

If we decide to keep both, is part about him refusing to kneel to Mance neccessary?

"Having Tumbleton's gate opened to sack it" is sufficient then. There was a lengthy debate about if their level of participation in said sacking was heinous enough I concur with the conclusion of but that's the only modification I see necessary there hegel.

I'm fine with them separate but gimme a bit and I can redo the book version if we'd like, as there are some quirks in it like that which are indicative of an early-day entry.

Edited by 43110 on Dec 12th 2022 at 7:29:24 AM

• Part 3 (CSI's "The Lost Girls"): Dimitri Sadesky is a leader of the Zetas and is responsible for arranging for countless women to be kidnapped throughout the U.S., their organs harvested, and them forced into prostitution. In his role as a college professor, Dimitri exploits his position to lure students into sex work. He's also had them killed whenever they try to escape from their imprisonment, even killing four women himself after he is done torturing them, and he also murdered Samantha Matthews before having a butcher from Miami dismember and dispose of her corpse.

Furthermore from CSI:

• Jenny Carroll shows an attempted bodycount of eight and for flourishes has manipulation and a petty motive... I don't see this standing out next to others listed like Daimler who matches that count alongside six rapes and five episodes of the "fun and games" torture he puts women through which is in one case even tried on a young girl; or Gina whose got seven attempts to molest and kill children, combined with keeping one girl locked away for years to abuse.
• Colin Clark likewise looks in pretty weak standing for a rapist. Making his victims clean the crime scene is nasty trauma but beyond the rapes—I'd argue the brutality of which is exceeded by the above two, as well as the Klinefelds and Cooley who murders each of his victims—doesn't give him much with otherwise having only a single murder and... um, trying to avoid arrest(?)

The page could honestly probably use some more pruning but these two stood out to me as ones I really don't think should be listed. Unless Colin somehow has dozens of victims (which really should be made apparent in the entry) I don't see much argument to keep either but I'm open to discussing. Trent I'm not particularly sold on either but he's at least the only one manipulating multiple people to commit murders.

Thoughts?

Also Book!Craster:

Current:

• Craster is a particularly vicious Wildling and ally of the Night's Watch (each of whom identifies him as belonging to the opposing organization) who, in his own words, kneels to no man, including Mance Rayder, King-Beyond-The-Wall. Living alone in a huge, ramshackle compound, Craster keeps a harem of women in line with brainwashing and violence, breaking their spirits until they cannot rise up against him, despite the fact that they vastly outnumber him. All of these women are his "wives"; many of them are also his daughters and granddaughters. When one of them becomes pregnant, Craster waits to see if it is a boy or a girl. If the child is female, he waits until she is old enough—eleven or twelve years old—and does his best to impregnate her. If the child is a boy, Craster leaves him in the woods as a sacrifice for the Others. Obsessed with his own hedonism, and raising the next generation of wives, Craster uses his allegiance with the Night's Watch to make sure that nobody, not even the Watch, interferes with his business.

Suggested:

• Craster is a vicious Wildling and uneasy ally of the Night's Watch. In his isolated keep in the wilderness, Craster beats and berates his harem of women into being his "wives", even marrying and raping any females born as a result, starting as young as eleven or twelve. Any male children born to his women is left as a sacrifice to the Others, Craster happy to let the eldritch monsters drag his own children away to maintain his grotesque, hedonistic life.

43: Colin has targeted 16 women. I mentioned that in the effortpost.

• "Help": Colin Clark is a respected nightclub owner who moonlights as the "Gramercy Rapist". To this end, Colin stalks women in the New York Subway system before manually gagging them and raping them, wearing a condom and forcing the victim to clean themselves and the crime scene to avoid leaving evidence, having targeted 16 women in total including an ex of the medical examiner, Dr. Sheldon Hawkes. On multiple occasions, Colin would steal a piece of his victim's jewelry, which he would give to his fiancée Mary Lowe. Having killed his most recent victim, when confronted in front of Mary by Detective Stella Bonasera, Colin attempts to play innocent before violently resisting arrest.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Dec 15th 2022 at 10:26:06 AM

Like the other trim there 43!

Also I say keep Jenny tentatively but axe Colin since I can't believe I'm saying this but he's only just a Serial Rapist with one kill.

Edit: Is Colin's count quite high for the show when in regards to Serial Rapist?

Edited by WetFlannels on Dec 12th 2022 at 1:05:34 PM

Jenny I still take issue with on just being a murderer who loses for both bodycount and nasty points to other listed CMs who also rape, torture or rape and torture their victims... stay classy, crime shows!

Ehhh... even then with Colin I take issue with how nasty many of the other rapists on the list are. This isn't just a place where typical nasty crimes will get someone listed given how the whole page is rife with sick fucks the CSIs have to deal with, especially when others target children, torture them, keep them trapped for years, kidnap couples to screw around with and play mind games, etc.

Edited by 43110 on Dec 12th 2022 at 8:08:16 AM

Is the fan she manipualtes quite young? That's my deciding factor tbh.

Also

• "All Fall Down" & "Fallen": Professor Robert "Bob" Starling, when denied tenure on account of his student and mistress Melissa Walls's faked thesis, retaliates by killing Miami-Dade University personnel he sees as having interfered with his career. Shooting one victim with a remote-controlled rifle, drowning another under a pool cover, and attempting to burn the third one alive with a compound of potassium and water as a result of the victim using fake cologne, Bob sends the Miami-Dade Police Department mocking letters anticipating that they arrive too late. In order to suppress evidence against him, Bob manipulates Melissa into releasing halon gas in an attempt to suffocate dozens of CSI lab workers, successfully having CSI Jesse Cardoza killed, subsequently sending Lt. Horatio Caine on a wild goose chase leading to a fake bomb at a local beach.

I doubt see how sending someone on a wild goose chase is notable unless it caused the deaths? Would anyone object me tweaking it?

Go for the change, the big thing keeping him is trying to gas dozens of cops!