Is this an example?

DesignatedHero.Western Animation:

• Rose Quartz from Steven Universe at worse comes of as someone with good intentions that had bad outcomes but she's much worse when you think about it she started a whole war (granted it was for gems freedoms) but it caused the shattering and/or corruption of gems from both sides, she kept Lapiz in a mirror without ever freeing her or/and attempting to see if she if she was good, she poofed and bubbled Bismith for her Breaking Point Strategy Idea (granted it really was a horrible one) but she never attempts to convince her out of it and lies to her friends about what happened instead of you know telling them the truth of what happened (because they do accept it) but they only find out about because Steven told them about it, it's also a strong possibility that she killed Pink Diamond who was also revealed to be an Off-Color by the way(and if she didn't that means she lied to all her friends because they think she did it) and she gives birth to Steven which causes her to give up her form to do (essentially dieing) which she knew and went through with it anyways without really thinking how this could impact (her disappearing) her fellow gems, Greg (her lover) and her son Steven, it causes severe trauma for all of them even more so for Steven because without her he doesn't have a mother (the crystal gem fill in for her for that) but it still leaves him with some horrible mother-issues and a impossible legacy to live up to.
  • The Crystal Gems themselves, they held a lot of stuff from Steven that mentally affected him like (the possibility) Rose shattered Pink Diamond, Pearl was a servant, Garnet being a fusion, the kindergarten and what the monsters they were fighting throughout season one really were (corrupted gems) and it's heavily impaled that they were never planning on telling him any of this (they were going to tell him the thing about Garnet though, he just found out before they were planing on doing it), they like Rose kept Lapis in the mirror without ever trying to see if she's good or not and treat her like she's the bad guy when she attacks them out of anger for doing that and got pissed off at Peridot throughout Season two because she made some mistakes she only made because she didn't know any better.
  • Lapis herself she steals the earth's ocean (granted she only wanted it so she could use it to escape the planet but still) attacks the crystal gems and Steven (HER FRIEND!!) when they try to stop her, in a later episode when Jasper has the crystal gems cornered and asks her to fuse with her she does it and uses the nearby ocean to drag them both to the bottom of the sea instead of I don't know USEING THE NEAR BY OCEAN TO POOF HER WITHOUT FUSING OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, it's also heavily implied that she horribly mentally abused Jasper while they were fused, treated Peridot horribly for keeping her captured even thou she was just doing her job, fault no remorse for trying to drown Connie when she confronts her about it and Left Peridot (grated she wanted to stay) and fled to outer space.

The first two I believe are deliberately flawed and Lapis was a villain at the time. Cut?

First, I am always inherently suspicious of any YMMV that gets as long as that.

Second, the first line of Designated Hero reads "A Designated Hero is a character in a story who, despite being presented as heroic, is actually a Jerkass at best and an arguable villain at worst"

Lapis is out, I think, since she's never portrayed as heroic.

Deconstructing Rose Quartz's status as a hero of everyone is a huge part of the series

I question the Crystal Gems one, since the crux of the issue seems to be their holding information from Steven, at least some of which was due to his young age. They've Shay been shown to not always get and to worry about how they handle Steven's growth and education.

So regarding the "Meta" examples in SHAZAM! (2019)'s Funny Moments page that I brought up on previous page. Should they be cut, left alone or what...?

There's a lot of Funny pages with "Meta" moments out there, and I'm not sure it's really troping real life anyway. Dunno if that's an argument for keeping them or an argument for a broader cleanup, though.

God that Rose Quartz entry isnt only wrong but lacks any sort of punctuation!

YMMV.The Legend Of Korra Turf Wars is attracting a lot of edits regarding character portrayals and the subject of same-sex relationships I think should wait until the final issue release to see if it's addressed. (Broken Base requires six months since the work releases, but do individual issues count or must it wait until the story arc concludes? Unintentionally Unsympathetic, the character in question acknowledges their mistake in one of those instances, so I think we should see how it's play by the ending before judging.) Thoughts?

Edited by kensou on Jul 8th 2018 at 10:02:44 AM

Are the following examples being used correctly?:

From Fantastic Four (2005):

• Vindicated by History: A very minor case. When the 2015 reboot was released, the evisceration it got from critics led to some looking back on this film (and to a lesser extent, the sequel) with kinder eyes. It's not regarded as good by those people, but it's regarded as being a much better adaptation by comparison, which really speaks more of how bad the 2015 film was than of any good the 2005 and 2007 films had.
• The Woobie:
  • The Thing. Even the most savage of critics loved Michael Chiklis's performance as Marvel's most loveable Tragic Monster. Jessica Alba said that Michael Chiklis was so damn good at pulling this off that she just wanted to hug him between takes because he looked so sad.
  • Plus, who didn't want to give Sue a hug after seeing the look on her face when her first wedding is crashed? Well, some of you would probably want to do more than hug her, but still.

From Batman (Rebirth):

• Ass Pull: Bane's plan to destroy Batman's happiness. While doing so might seem plausible, it takes a lot of liberties as well as suggesting that Bane also somehow bent time and space when it comes to both the Flashpoint Batman and Booster Gold and did so without getting Dr. Manhattan's attention just to make Batman happy so Bane could take it away.

~Ferot_Dreadnaught: I agree that it seems too early to claim Broken Base, and I also agree that Unintentionally Unsympathetic only counts if it's not called out in the story. That said, you haven't posted the actual text of the examples (unless I missed it from earlier), so it's hard to judge.

~Anddrix:

• Vindicated by History: I'm not sure that "wasn't as bad as later attempts at the same IP" counts as this trope, even in a downplayed sense. Also, audience reactions cannot be played with.
• The Woobie: I can't argue with the reactions discussed in those examples. The first looks valid, while the second comes across as creepy and should be cut on that basis.
• Ass Pull: Aside from being fully spoiler tagged, which is a rules violation, the example fails to establish how or why it's an Ass Pull.

~hegelvonaxel 5783: I'd say those would be Continuity Snarl, not Plot Hole since while they affect the background and lore, they don't really affect the plot itself.

From YMMV.Sister Claire

• Continuity Lock-Out: While the main comic moves along a snail's pace, the bulk of character and story development happen in side stories of the better paced Missing Moments. So as the events of the two series begin to intertwine more and more, it's beginning to become necessary to be reading the side stories to fully understand the events of the comic.
• Overshadowed by Controversy: Many more people first heard of Yamino from the infamous "DerpyGate" scandal, which lead to a lot of demonization of both her and this comic from angry MLP Fan Dumb. Even now, when someone mentions Yamino, the first thing that tends to come to mind is DerpyGate rather than anything else she's done since.

Edited by Twiddler on Jul 9th 2018 at 10:33:09 AM

Are the following examples from Batman (Rebirth) being used correctly?:

• Character Rerailment: Bane is depicted as both cunning (manipulating Batman into shooing away the Robins) and as an absolute powerhouse, beating down Batman in a Curb-Stomp Battle.
• Memetic Mutation:
  • "Kite Man. Hell yeah." This one scene turned Kite Man into an Ensemble Dark Horse.
  • "Bat. Cat. Bat. Cat. Bat. Cat." Used to mock some of the repetitive dialogue, as well as the pet names Batman and Catwoman use to address each other.
  • Batburger, the obviously-in-bad-taste restaurant chain.
  • "Knightfall of the Heart" or "Knightfall 2: Emotional Boogaloo", in reference to Bane wanting to emotionally break Batman, and doing so by manipulating an unwitting Catwoman.
• Protection from Editors: The first editor ended up replaced by another one after disagreement with Tom King over which artist should draw Batman proposing to Catwoman.

And from the same page do these examples have enough context?:

• Awesome Art:
  • Mikel Janin's art is thoroughly praised, particularly his layouts.
  • Mitch Gerads' brief stint was also highly praised, with his art being considered incredibly versatile in how it switches between dark noir and romantic tones.

~Twiddler: Those tropes aren't being used incorrectly, as far as I can tell from the descriptions. Whether they're accurate is not something I can offer an opinion on.

~Anddrix:

• Character Rerailment: Impossible to tell without context. At what point was the character derailed that they could be re-railed?
• Memetic Mutation: None of those examples, save perhaps the second, adequately explains what has mutated about the meme in question.
• Protection from Editors: This appears to be misuse, as it does not explain how editorial standards are being waived or ignored.
• Awesome Art: By the standards of the examples on the article, those are fine. However, Awesome Art is a Sugar Wiki trope and should ideally go on its own subpages, not the main YMMV subpage.

Reading the edit history in Pokémon: I Choose You! i noted that the following example was added in a hidden marking:

• Composite Character: Of himself throughout the main anime series.

The edit reason was "'Composite Character needs some time for me think through. But his M21 design is no doubt of cross between his Black & White and Sun & Moon design. Not to mention that Ash's Adaptational Intelligence likely came from the later series such as DP and XY."

Considering that all the main anime series belong to the same continuity, is this an actual example?

You can't be a Composite Character of yourself, that's ridiculous.

@Fighteer: These are the Unintentionally Unsympathetic entries I asked about earlier:

• The writer appears to have been trying to create sympathy for Asami and Korra by showing their uncertainty and anxiety about their friends' reactions to their new relationship. This is not entirely unsuccessful in itself, but in Korra's case at least her troubledness also tends to shade over into callous insensitivity to others, and even reckless irresponsibility at times. This doesn't sit well with fans, who feels that it effectively undoes her Character Development from the latter seasons of the show, and reverts her back to her old characterization from Season One.
  • While one may fairly suppose that she is under significant emotional pressure at this time, Korra accusing Tonraq of being narrow-minded and storming out of the house when he advises her to be careful about outing herself as bisexual nonetheless serves to make her look like a bit of a jerk. Especially since he personally had no problem with it, and was overjoyed to hear that she and Asami were together. Korra eventually realizes his point, but still doesn't even appear to consider explaining or apologizing while they're still on the same side of the portal. The fact that this is put off until Part 3 adds to this and another example of the franchise's habit of Doylism.
  • In part 2, she goes into outright Smug Super territory when she walks into a public meeting with the displaced persons and angrily demands that President Raiko remove the military detachment he sent to secure the spirit portal after the literal pitched battles there in the previous issue. Then, when Raiko's aide Wenyan points out the impropriety of the way she acts, she casually metalbends a steel gag around his mouth, leaving him frantically tearing at it as he seemingly can't breathe. While all of this could be forgiven due to Korra's genuine fear of another spirit crisis happening, there's no evidence that points to a brewing spirit crisis as a result of Raiko's actions, so Korra's response to them can come off as a serious overreaction on her part.
• An extremely minor example, but Bolin and Jinora can become this after telling Lin and Tenzin about Korra and Asami's relationship without the couple's (apparent) consent. While it isn't out of character for them to make that mistake (Jinora is, for all her maturity, a fourteen-year-old, and Bolin has an established habit of talking without thinking first), the fact that it's never addressed makes it feel less like the characters being Innocently Insensitive, and more a case of the writer not thinking things through.

While not outright wrong to my knowledge, I think we should wait until the story end in case it addresses this, as the second point suggest some awareness.

The last one I think definitely should be cut since it doesn't suggest they were supposed to be sympathetic. Can a "extremely minor" example count, since that's a Downplayed Trope any YMMV can't be played with?

I've also brought it to the Unintentionally Unsympathetic cleanup.

Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaught on Jul 9th 2018 at 6:03:05 AM

Limbo of the Lost:

• Verbal Tic:
  • One of the designers has an odd habit of peppering his writing with mad laughter ("HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA"), and this sometimes shows up in the game's subtitled dialogue - but not in the voice acting.
  • Steve Bovis, the creative director of the game, seems to have a... bizarre understanding of how capitalization works: instead of just capitalizing the first letter of a word, he has the habit of capitalizing the entire word. This shows up in the subtitles every now and then, and can also be seen in forum posts made by him that are floating around the Internet.

Is this troping real life? I can't decide, since it does concern the game's subtitles as well as its creators.

Also, while I'm here, what should be done about this line on the same page's description?

• Due to its absolutely massive amount of plagiarism, the game's been pulled off store shelves. It's still available in pirated form, though - while we at TV Tropes don't encourage it, you can sweep the Web and find a copy, if you absolutely have to experience its legendary badness. Considering that most of the content was already pirated anyway, it'll probably even count as poetic justice.

~Ferot_Dreadnaught: I can't help but feel that Unintentionally Unsympathetic is being misapplied in those examples. Here's the definition: "When a character's supposed insecurities or embarrassing quirks are supposed to inspire sympathy, but fail to impress the audience because they're mishandled or plain written badly. It can be made even worse if they have to learn a lesson. Without being at least somewhat invested in the characters, the audience might have passed the point of caring when the character finally comes around."

How is any of that related to Korra's "insecurities or embarrassing quirks"? Are we supposed to be sympathetic for her in these situations? Same with the third example: there is no indication that the audience is intended to feel sympathy for these characters' emotional hardships.

Also, Unintentionally Unsympathetic is an audience reaction and cannot be "downplayed" or Played With in any other fashion.

~Yinyang107: If the "tic" in question appears in written or spoken dialog in the story, then it is tropable, regardless of where it comes from. The paragraph about piracy is irrelevant to the function of the work article and may be seen as condoning or encouraging piracy, so should be removed.

Are the following examples from Pacific Rim: Uprising being used correctly?:

• Arc Fatigue: Of the Four Lines, All Waiting variety: it's generally considered by both detractors and defenders that Uprising has too many subplots stuffed into its screentime. To compare, the first film focused mainly on the characters learning to work out their personal troubles and function as teams of pilots, as well as the PPDC struggling to keep up against increasingly powerful Kaijus. However, aside from these two basic premises, which include the revamping of the latter with Fusion Dance in Uprising, the sequel runs with the additional plots of a younger character trying to cope with her new life in the pilot cadet school, a seemingly evil MegaCorp building rival Jaegers and leading mysterious attacks, and even an inner human conspiration in favor of the Precursors. It can be safely said that this film carries enough material and ideas to produce more than one installment or even a full-fledged TV series, which takes a revealing new light when one remembers director Steven S. DeKnight had only worked in TV series before having his film debut with Uprising.

• Ass Pull: As awesome as the brutal Mega Kaiju is, Newt's contingency plan for the Jaegers overwhelming whatever Kaiju came through really does come out of nowhere. Sure, it's explained that the Big Bad can allocate resources here and there, but there is zero hint of them anywhere or how exactly they work.

• Critical Research Failure: According to John Boyega, he wanted Gipsy Avenger to have two swords since Gipsy Danger had only one... even though Gipsy Danger did have two blades, but one was bitten off by Raiju before it could be used. Boyega may have been mixing up the two Gipsys subconsciously since unlike Danger, Avenger really only has one sword. Initially.

From Film.Ant-Man And The Wasp:

• Happy Ending Override: The film ends on an incredibly delightful note, with Scott and Hope spending time with Cassie, Luis and his buddies receiving a tremendous business opportunity, and Hank and Janet planning a happy life together in a house by the beach, all set to the tune of "Come On, Get Happy". Then The Stinger shows Hope, Hank, and Janet being snapped out of existence by Thanos while Scott finds himself trapped in the Quantum Realm.

Happy Ending Override is for when the sequel negates its predecessor's happy ending, but this entry is about this movie's own Stinger negating the happy ending. Can Happy Ending Override apply to The Stinger?

I kinda feel inclined to support a moratorium on all ending-related tropes that involve Infinity War until Avengers 4 comes out, because, well... there by definition isn't really an ending yet.

I'll replace with Yank the Dog's Chain, which seems the better trope.

I assume And There Was Much Rejoicing only applies to celebrated deaths, just celebration is misuse right? I've seen enough example of this that I would appreciate clarity on this.

If a bank account with two holders is set so neither holder can withdraw from it without the other's approval, is it an example of Two-Keyed Lock?

I would say yes.

Since the 'key' aspect of the trope is "It takes 2 people working together to unlock something", I would say it absolutely fits.