Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him? (new crowner): ptitlel164s0xw

We have a trope about villains who have the hero at their mercy, but refuse to kill the hero right then and there, usually because if they did then the story would be over and the writers aren't having any of that. The name of that trope is Bond Villain Stupidity.

We also have a trope about villains who do decide to kill the hero, but feel the need to do so in a slow and ridiculously convoluted manner. The name of that trope is Complexity Addiction.

What then is Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him? about? It's a Stock Phrase. From the article: The exact words may differ, but the stock phrase usually refers to using a Mundane Solution instead of milking the Rule of Drama. In other words, it's about characters lampshading Bond Villain Stupidity or Complexity Addiction.

But that's not how it's being used on the wiki. Here's the first 51 wicks I found via the "Related" search.

Correct

1. Acid Pool: "One of them asks if they'll suspend them above the acid so the vapors will kill them, but he replies he'll just shoot them and get rid of their bodies in the vats."
2. Adventurers: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: Here."
3. Film.Alien: "While filming, Ridley Scott came up with the idea that Aliens have deadly acid for blood when the producer asked, "Why don't they just shoot it?""
4. WhatAnIdiot.Anime: "You'd Expect: Yumi: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him??""
5. Anti Hero For Hire: Bond Villain Stupidity: Subverted. Dr. Nefarious is so depressed that his plan didn't even require heroic intervention to foil that he decides to just shoot Shadehawk instead of using a Death Trap, as usual.
6. Archie Comics Sonic The Hedgehog: "Card-Carrying Villain: [...] Drago. When he and Razorklaw captured Sally in issue 214, the latter suggested just killing her, which led to Drago scolding him for not messing with her first and calling Razorklaw a lousy villain."
7. Cheer!: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him - "He's standing right there...""
8. Darwin's Soldiers: " Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him? - Ridgeway suggests this as a way to get past AI Zenarchis in Schrodinger's Prisoners."
9. Gaunts Ghosts: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him: In Blood Pact Eyl catches up with Gaunt and Mabbon for the last time and has them at his mercy, but starts gloating. Mabbon tells him he should have fired. His failure to do so gives Gaunt time to knock him away, following by Larks blowing his head open."
10. Freelance Astronauts: "* Why Don't They Just Shoot Him With The Cannons?: Ferr asks this about the airships in New Super Mario Bros. Wii.
11. SiN: "(Elexis' accomplice Radek lampshades this, asking why they couldn't just kill him in the first place)."
12. Monkey Island 2: "Guybrush can also ask "Why Didn't You Just Shoot Me?""
13. No, Mr. Bond, I Expect You to Dine: Scott Evil: What? Are you feeding him? Why don't you just kill him?
14. The Adventures Of Dr Mc Ninja: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: Hilariously played straight by Dr. McNinja himself here."

Does this trope even count for Heroes? Otherwise correct

1. American Kirby Is Hardcore: Mega Man 7's ending, where Mega Man contemplates ending Dr. Wily's schemes once and for all.

Incorrect

1. Alfred J Kwak: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: Subverted big time; the only reason Alfred is still alive is that Dolf really isn't good at aiming."
2. Series.Alice: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: Subverted by Dodo, who does just that. Luckily, Hatter has a Bulletproof Vest."
3. Alternate Company Equivalent: "As with many of the above examples, Majestic is more ruthlessly pragmatic in the use of his Superman-like powers— he generally just shoots them."
4. YMMV.Amazons Attack: "Okay, so Wonder Woman's mother is brainwashed. Wonder Woman can cure people who have been brainwashed by wrapping them with her magic lasso. So that means she should USE THE FLIPPING LASSO!"
5. WhatAnIdiot.Anime: "You'd Expect: He wouldn't wait for them to finish monologing and just shoot them."
6. Angel: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: Averted, the Senior Partners of Wolfram and Hart want Angel kept alive until they are ready to kill him."
7. Arbitrary Equipment Restriction: "Not that you even need them to dispose of guards, but it's still a little ridiculous when you can't simply lock on and chuck one or two knives at a running guard or just take careful aim and shoot him in the back."
8. Characters.Arc Rise Fantasia: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: A rare, heroic version of this trope. He stabs Ignacy while he's giving his Hannibal Lecture. To be fair, Alf had some very personal reasons for wanting to kill the bastard."
9. Artifact of Attraction: "Eventually, Dax has enough of Klingon posturing and shoots them both (her phaser was on stun) just to get them to shut up."
10. Artistic License – Martial Arts: "One confrontation with villain of the week starts with him showing off in a series of backflips and high-acrobatic martial arts. Then Sarah just shoots him in the knee."
11. Assassin's Creed: "Cutscene Drop: It doesn't matter if you kill your target by shooting him from afar, throwing him off a roof and/or into the instantly-fatal-to-NPCs water, or slashing him with your sword as you gallop past him on a horse, somehow Ezio always instantly ends up kneeling on the ground with the target dying in his arms. This even happens when an ally specifically tells you to just shoot him."
12. Blake's Seven: "Some fans speculate that Avon sees right through it, and his grudging admiration for just how good Vila is at it is the reason he never ''quite'' resorts to cold-blooded murder."
13. Brutal Legend: "You Fight Like a Cow: ..."Drowned Ophelia, enemy flies away: PULL!"
14. Clan Of The Cats: " Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: Dracula can only be vanquished by a Christian staking him with the true cross. Chelsea and Corrine decide to skip that and just portal his ashes into the sun, instead."
15. Didn't See That Coming: "He didn't anticipate that the heroes could fake the signal using the black box from an AWACS plane allowing Schofield to just shoot him."
16. Doctor Horribles Sing Along Blog: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: What Dr. Horrible actually tries to do to Captain Hammer, several times alone during the musical, but there's always a fatal flaw, such as the weapon malfunctioning, or him losing his nerve."
17. Doctor Who NS S4 E3 "Planet of the Ood": "Why Don't You Just Shoot Him?: As executing them could lead to an investigation, Halpen leaves Donna and the Doctor for the red-eyed Ood to find. When that fails, he decides to just shoot them anyway, but gets interrupted..."
18. Doesn't Like Guns: "This can also be an excuse for the hero to MacGyver up some Bamboo Technology rather than just shooting the bad guy."
19. Doesn't Like Guns: "Bullseye doesn't like guns because they're boring. He'd much rather kill someone with a playing card, or a shuriken, or his own poop. Which isn't to say he'll never use them. During the "Born Again" Daredevil arc, Bullseye admitted that Daredevil was "almost" his better, so he decided to subvert his principles and shot Daredevil."
20. Dragon Fable: "* Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: Pretty much the case when you consider the numerous Amplifier Artifacts that both you and the Big Bad want, you not only have more, but you could likely beat him in a jiffy. Instead, you hide them all so he wont be able to get them. This was even a quest with the Blade of Awe!"
21. Dude, Where's My Respect?: "Of course, you've got no choice but to debase yourself and comply with this humiliating request, even though you've probably gone From Nobody to Nightmare and by rights you should just kill them and take what you need."
22. EarthBound: "Sorting Algorithm of Evil: Mostly played straight, but averted at the beginning when Giygas, in a moment of being Dangerously Genre-Savvy, decides to just kill Ness and possibly Porky, who eventually destroys Giygas' mind by shutting off his Restraining Bolt before he becomes a nuisance by sending a Starman Jr. at them at the start of the game."
23. Fidelio: "Why Don't You Just Shoot Him? — Had Pizarro consulted the Evil Overlord List, in particular items 6 and 51, the story would have turned in his favor."
24. Genius The Transgression: "As one might expect, they tend to take a very...direct approach to problem-solving."
25. GoldenEye: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: This is a James Bond movie after all. However, unlike most movies in the series this one has justifications for the times it occurs."
26. Hercules The Legendary Journeys: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: The Olympians are far stronger than Hercules, but often instead rely on mooks to face him. Whenever they actually do fight him directly, he wins despite their purported power. However, the trope is subverted (at least by Season 4) in that the reason the Olympians pull their punches is because of Zeus. He granted Hercules special protection and the others know violating it means serious punishment."
27. Hype: The Time Quest: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: Averted. Barnak sends everything he's got against Hype (even though it always happens to be in manageable numbers)."
28. It's Personal: "Instead of doing what any sensible psychopath would do and simply toss a grenade in the character's window, the psychopath takes creepy photos of the character's kids, abducts the character's wife, kicks the character's dog, and above all, leaves calling cards and clues to ensure that eventually he'll get caught."
29. Jack To Mame No Ki: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: Subverted. The giant actually does just step on her."# Jin Roh The Wolf Brigade: "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?: A problem that plagues Fuse throughout the film."
30. Let's Fight Like Gentlemen: "Marty discards his gun, saying he "thought we could settle this like men". Tannen laughs and just shoots him."
31. No, Mr. Bond, I Expect You to Dine: "The villain has the hero at his mercy, surrounded by armed goons. Does he Just Shoot Him? Of course not."
32. Steampunk: "Modern architects slip into this trope when trying to adapt 19th century architecture and technology to modern life, instead of simply letting them to be razed and replaced."
33. Time Chasers: "Here's one; J.T. wants to leave Nick and Lisa on a Revolutionary War Battlefield so they'll just be 'unidentified war dead.' Why not simply take them father back to, say, the year 1000 AD and just leave them? Or shoot them, if he really wanted to."
34. Third Time's The Charm: "Sometimes this particular trope can provide good motive for Character Development but at the same time may fall into the trap of the antagonist leaving him alive for little adequately explained reason if the method of the hero's survival from the defeat isn't portrayed the right way."

Could go either way:

1. Altar the Speed: "In an episode of Titus, Titus and Erin decide to have a quickie wedding, without their families. Guess who shows up. Then they try to speed it up, before something bad happens, especially with Titus's insane mother, and her abusive husband there. Guess what happens."
2. Mad World: "Dude, Where's My Respect?: Averted. Jack's in-universe fanbase is the main reason the higher ups can't take the Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him approach."

That's 34 definitely incorrect wicks. 34 / 51 = 66.67% of the wicks in my sample were incorrect. Tropers seem to be linking to the article to refer to any scene whatsoever that makes them ask "Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him?" themselves—regardless of whether Bond Villain Stupidity or Complexity Addiction is in play.

Something needs to be done.

Complexity Addiction found in: 45 articles, excluding discussions.

This title has brought 102 people to the wiki from non-search engine links since 20th FEB '09.

Bond Villain Stupidity found in: 203 articles, excluding discussions.

This title has brought 661 people to the wiki from non-search engine links since 20th FEB '09.

Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him? found in: 1180 articles, excluding discussions.

This title has brought 12,630 people to the wiki from non-search engine links since 20th FEB '09.

I say just fold Complexity Addiction and Bond Villain Stupidity into Why Don't You Just Shoot Him?. That's how its being used, and its much healthier.

edited 15th Jun '11 2:16:28 PM by Discar

I despise uses of this for troper Fridge Logic and I say that they should be removed and curated to stay gone. There's nothing wrong with the trope, except its overuse as an Audience Reaction.

There is a problem in its similarity to Complexity Addiction and Bond Villain Stupidity, but it functions adequately as a Sub-Trope to both of those.

edited 15th Jun '11 2:37:30 PM by Fighteer

The tropes themselves are fine, but I suspect that the quotability that gives Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him? its high inbound and wick count is actively contributing to its misuse.

My inclination is to rename the trope, and keep Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him? as a redirect to either Bond Villain Stupidity or Complexity Addiction, since that's what the troper reaction wicks think it means anyway.

Meta's solution sounds like a good one, but what else do we name a stock phrase if we can't use the phrase itself because its too quotable?

Yes, this is a problem with all Stock Phrases.

Frankly, I think this, as a Stock Phrase, is juuuust at the line of not being worthy of the status. I think it should just called out as a lampshading within the main trope itself.

Murderous Solution Suggestion?

Good, but I think Mundane Solution Suggestion is closer to the point of the trope.

It's not restricted to when murdering is the proposed solution? Man, I've been using it wrong.

edited 16th Jun '11 2:37:23 AM by Deboss

Yeah, it's not restricted to shooting by any means. Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him? involves three main components.

• A mundane solution to a problem is available.
• A character chooses instead to use an overly elaborate or risky solution.
• A different character points out the availability of the mundane solution.

Whether or not the first character listens is not strictly part of the trope, but typically they don't. When they do just shoot him, it's often played as a subversion.

Okay then. Mundane is better than Murderous in that case. So, Mundane Solution Suggestion y/n?

Again, Why Don't You Just Shoot Him? has huge use and inbounds. At the very least, it should be a supertrope to the other three (the suggestion, Bond Villain Stupidity, and Complexity Addiction). The Trope Namer involves all three, so you can see where the confusion came from.

edited 16th Jun '11 4:23:27 PM by Discar

I agree with Discar.

That could work.

It's actually a Sub-Trope, in my opinion.

It's a sub-trope now, but the idea would be to do a Trope Transplant in order to use the name, which has better inbounds then either of its parent tropes, as a super-trope and rename what currently uses the name to something else.

So should we get a crowner going?

Crowner made and hooked.

Bump for more votes.

If we do make it a supertrope, we'll need to strip all the examples and wicks and move them to the appropriate subtropes. Do we have any volunteers?

Also, I'm not a fan of Mundane Solution Suggestion as a name. I don't think it sounds good.

edited 21st Jun '11 6:22:16 PM by troacctid

"Make it a supertrope" seems to be way in the lead at the moment. 9+, 1-. All other options are negative.

I'll make an alt-titles crowner after this one is finished.

Make it a supertrope won the page action crowner.

I've created and attached an alt-title crowner to find new titles for The Trope Currently Known As Why Don't Ya Just Shoot Him.

BUNP. Because we need more votes or a better name option.

Added Stating The Simpler Solution as a name suggestion.