Is this an example?

Would Unusually Uninteresting Sight fit WesternAnimation.Hotel Transylvania when Drac and his friends meet some modern day humans in a Horror con and nobody bats an eye over these real monsters?

That's already covered by other, more specific tropes.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

~jamaicanst01 #7872: There was a big debate about this a while back. The topic may still be around somewhere. I was arguing that the "X" in A Boy and His X should be non-sapient and non-human (or at least not human-like in intelligence and appearance), and catalyze the main character's development into maturity.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

~Gofastmike: That seems reasonable.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

Done.

Edited by Gofastmike on Mar 9th 2019 at 9:21:31 AM

This was on It.

• Unintentionally Sympathetic: Prior to the events of the book It had never experienced pain. It's not hard to argue that it had no capacity to understand why inflicting pain was wrong.

(At this rate, I might be asleep.)

Edited by MasterJoseph on Mar 10th 2019 at 1:35:18 AM

IPP Wick Check created.

In Leverage "The Miracle Job" after Nate talks with his friend, victim of the week Father Paul, in the confessional with Nate sitting on the clergy's side, the top assistant to the villain of the week, having a crisis of faith of whether following his boss is right and how if he does speak up it could take him to jail, steps into the confessional. He speaks with Nate, not giving any specific details to his crimes but asks for guidance. Nate, who once trained to be a Priest, simply tells the man he must do what is right. When the team pin the fake miracle they created, and the theft of a statue of St. Nicholas, on the villain of the week, the aide now has the courage to speak up and confess the crimes he and the villain committed.

While he didn't know Nate wasn't a real priest, his act of going to the clergy for assistance and guidance is key to his changing his ways. Would this qualify for a Heel–Faith Turn?

We also don't know if the aide became a devout Catholic after his actions.

Edited by isoycrazy on Mar 10th 2019 at 7:41:19 AM

That doesn't feel at all unintentional to me. Why would the writer put in a detail like that otherwise? Misuse, cut.

Ugh. Parsing that paragraph is like painstakingly perusing a puerile, putrescent picture. No, I don't know why I went into alliteration there.

It's very hard to tell who exactly is doing the confessing and why. But the act of confession in and of itself is not a "religious revelation" that would count as a Faith–Heel Turn. The character must have already had some form of faith to seek confession in the first place.

Edited by Fighteer on Mar 13th 2019 at 10:09:24 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

I've been pondering this entry idea for Spells, Swords, & Stealth for a while now, but I've never been able to work out if it works for Revenge Before Reason:

• In Spells, Swords, & Stealth, the dark god Kalzidar has a reputation for never letting a slight to him go unanswered. It is for this reason that Kalzidar's Evil Plan in the fourth book includes a part specifically for Thistle the gnome, paladin of rival god Grumble, in which he arranges to steal the soul of Thistle's wife, Madroria, from the gnomish afterlife. Because Thistle's one condition for becoming a paladin was to eventually be Together in Death with Madroria, and Grumble is obliged to do that no matter where she is, this endangers Thistle as well as Madroria, should he die before she's rescued. This act of revenge against a single mortal angers several powerful people. Nearly all of the other gods in general, and Thistle's and Madroria's gods in particular, a village full of Retired Badasses who might never have gotten involved except for befriending the protagonists, and, perhaps most dangerously, Thistle himself, who is prepared to pull out all the stops, including reassembling the setting's single most dangerous Artifact of Doom, to save his beloved wife.

This feels a bit too long, but not sure just yet what I can trim out without losing context. I also wondered if it might fight Revenge Myopia, but on reading that more closely it definitely doesn't so nevermind that.

Edited by sgamer82 on Mar 10th 2019 at 11:37:53 AM

Recap.My Little Pony Friendship Is Magic S 8 E 26 School Raze Part 2

• Didn't Think This Through:
  • Cozy Glow's plan, even if it had worked, would have failed eventually. Even if everything had gone off without a hitch and no one ever realized what she had done, sooner or later the adults would have shown up and replaced her, because there's no way they would leave a child in charge.

My impression is unless it's shown or discussed how it was poorly thought out, it's Fridge Logic, not this.

Characters.Friendship Is Magic The Princesses:

• A God I Am Not: Immortal, yes, and a powerful magician, but just as flawed and failable as everyone else. It might be more accurate to call her "the strongest of all ponies and an example they base their lives around," similar to a certain Emperor...

I believe this is about their stating they are not a god. God Is Flawed seems the better fit as written.

Thoughts?

Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaught on Mar 10th 2019 at 10:19:28 AM

~Fighteer Do the Transformers count as an example of the trope?

The example seems to fit. I don't know about how you'd trim it down, though.

1. Yes, the character must suffer the consequence of the flaw in their plan for it to count as an example.

2. There may be some other context going on that I'm missing, but both of those tropes require the character to, in fact, be a godlike being. A God I Am Not is when a super-powerful entity doesn't want to be described as a god, and God Is Flawed is when a super-powerful entity has human-like moral failings: prejudice, bigotry, etc. Neither of those is described in the example as written, but it's closer to God Is Flawed.

Could you be more specific? There are, at last count, seventy billion Transformers works. In most of them, the Transformers themselves are the main characters, with humans as sidekicks and/or The Watson. So no, that doesn't even come close to counting. The only works I can think of that attempt the trope are the ones where Bumblebee pretends to be Sam Witwicky's car in order to protect and guide him. Even there, it's a subversion, as Bumblebee is much smarter and more capable than the human character... that or an inversion: "An X and His Boy".

Edited by Fighteer on Mar 10th 2019 at 5:02:45 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

The examples (mostly ZCE):

Characters.Transformers Film Series Humans: A girl [Izzy] and her 3-foot-tall Autobot [Canopy] who's barely holding together.

FanFic.Transformers Alter Verse has both "A Girl and her Shapeshifting Robot Helicopter" and "A Boy and his Shapeshifting Car".

TransformersPrime.Tropes A To C: Threefold. The creators have even admitted that they wanted the humans' relationship with the robots to resemble the close dynamic seen in The Iron Giant.

Characters.Transformers Generation 1: A boy [Spike Witwicky] and his robotic best friend. And that would be Bumblebee.

Film.Transformers Film Series: One of the focal story points of the first movie, this was toned down some in ROTF since Sam couldn't take Bumblebee to college with him, and then averted in DOTM since Bumblebee wasn't able to stay with Sam anymore due to his covert ops duties.

Well, that's the problem. Most of those are zero-context. They could be expanded with more detail.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

Recap.Star Wars Resistance S 1 E 19 No Escape Part I:

• Never Say "Die": Averted. When 4D lets loose on Pyre's stormtroopers, they're not shown to be unconscious or incapacitated afterwards.

I deleted it since the the trope is about not verbally saying die. Not just not showing death. I assume this is correct?

For a possible Sailor Moon example:

• Screwed by the Lawyers: When the series first aired, veteran composer Hirooki Ogawa was shocked to realize that the opening theme song, "Moonlight Legend", was plagiarized from "Sayonara wa Dansu no Ato ni (Goodbye after the End of the Dance)", a J-Pop song written by Ogawa performed by Chieko Baisho. When he asked Aoyama Gakuin University law professor Masao Handa for his thoughts on the anime's first opening theme song, "Moonlight Legend", Handa confirmed that it was indeed plagiarized. The resulting arbitration between Ogawa and "Moonlight Legend" composer Daria Kawashima (aka Tetsuya Komoro) led to the former composer obtaining a percentage of the royalties for the rest of his life.

Thoughts?

Edited by gjjones on Mar 10th 2019 at 1:01:31 PM

He/His/Him. No matter who you are, always Be Yourself.

Yes. Besides aversions are rarely ok (=interesting enough) to trope.

Edited by XFllo on Mar 10th 2019 at 1:13:57 PM

Screwed by the Lawyers says that it leads to cancellation or limited release of a work. Royalties over a song is not even close to the intent.

Edited by Fighteer on Mar 10th 2019 at 8:28:09 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

I don't know anything about the work, but if the royalty agreement led to the work receiving a limited release (to avoid paying out), then it would still be an example, but the example text would have to actually contain this information.

This is the scenario I thought you were describing to begin with.

Trouble Cube continues to be a general-purpose forum for those who desire such a thing.

According to page 119 of the 2012 JASRAC report (the text is in Japanese, of course), it didn't mention that the songs had a limited release nor did it stop their publishers, King Records and Nippon Columbia, from releasing them. So, my Screwed by the Lawyers example wouldn't fit after all.

Edited by gjjones on Mar 10th 2019 at 1:01:57 PM

He/His/Him. No matter who you are, always Be Yourself.

Could work as a general bit of trivia, though.

Jawbreakers on sale for 99¢

Yep, that might just work for me. That's also why I posted a Suspiciously Similar Song entry about it on the YMMV page.

Thanks.

Edited by gjjones on Mar 11th 2019 at 5:33:47 AM

He/His/Him. No matter who you are, always Be Yourself.

From Trivia.Doctor Who S 27 E 2 The End Of The World:

Should this be under Common Knowledge, since Beam Me Up, Scotty!! is about lines that fans attribute to a character who never actually said the aforementioned line.

• Beam Me Up, Scotty!: The Ninth Doctor's having something of a reputation as a Useless Protagonist — mostly because aside from this episode, the two-parter of "The Empty Child" and "The Doctor Dances" is the only time the day is saved by the Doctor himself instead of Rose or a guest character — has caused some fans to incorrectly remember Jabe as the one who saves the day in this episode. While she does play a big part in helping the Doctor resolve the situation, she ends up burning to death before the Doctor actually gets to that point.

Unintentional Period Piece is supposed to be when a work is filled with dated references, and not just one detail, right?

• Unintentional Period Piece: Britney Spears' "Toxic" is 'a traditional Earth ballad'.

And would this example fit better under Deleted Scenes, since, it's, well, discussing deleted scenes.

• What Could Have Been: A number of deleted scenes from the episode are printed in The Shooting Scripts, including a more brutal death for Raffalo, extended conversations between the Doctor and Jabe and Rose and Cassandra, and a second scene in which Rose contacts Jackie as the sun rays begin to pierce through the viewing gallery.

And is this example from Doom Patrol (2019) being used correctly, since it just mentions that the show is continuing the positive reviews and reception that the show if spun-off from, not that it's more popular than said show?:

• More Popular Spin-Off: Early critical and fan reactions to Titans aside, this show has continued the trend of positive reviews that its sister show got and was greeted warmly by fans and critics alike. Seems like Mr. Nobody spoke too soon.
  RT Consensus: DC Universe finds breakout material in this iteration of Doom Patrol thanks to a fully committed cast and the writing's faith in weirdness

I've been warned about putting loads of examples without justification, but I'll reply to these as best as I can.

For Trivia.Doctor Who S 27 E 2 The End Of The World: I would change this to Common Knowledge, as Beam Me Up, Scotty! is for dialogue.

As for:

Unintentional Period Piece: Britney Spears' "Toxic" is 'a traditional Earth ballad'.

I would argue that it just about fits the trope, but would be a zero-context example. Other than that, it could date the episode to the 2000s.

On the subject of Doom Patrol (2019), maybe a trope like Broken Base could fit, but perhaps not More Popular Spin Off ?

Edited by Merseyuser1 on Mar 11th 2019 at 12:42:40 PM

Not sure about Common Knowledge (it isn't Beam Me Up, Scotty!).

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The example is not Unintentional Period Piece (it is set millions of years into the future). It is Fan of the Past, celebrating humanity's past, and they're Entertainingly Wrong in how significant the song was.

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Deleted Scenes sounds like a good idea.

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I agree that the context for Doom Patrol doesn't support More Popular Spin-Off.

Link to TRS threads in project mode here.