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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Bullman "Cool. Coolcoolcool." Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
#287476: Nov 5th 2021 at 11:38:34 AM

Yes to Bob.

ACW: That was my idea to have it just on the Disney page. I also still think it's a good idea.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#287477: Nov 5th 2021 at 11:40:10 AM

Anyone count in Last Night in Soho?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#287478: Nov 5th 2021 at 11:47:29 AM

Don't we still have a week for that?

EDIT: Also, for Mission Impossible, are more coming soon, or should I include the tree with this week's group?

Edited by ACW on Nov 5th 2021 at 2:48:26 PM

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#287479: Nov 5th 2021 at 11:50:42 AM

Huh weird.

It says its due now.

Are the dates wrong ?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Powermaster201 The Emperor of Evil! Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
The Emperor of Evil!
#287480: Nov 5th 2021 at 11:51:04 AM

Also, I think I got a cut someone I did a long time ago. And that is Mister Moloch from Project G.e.e.K.e.R.

Now... When I did him I was confident he kept, but looking back I think I made a mistake.

For starters, he's waaayyy too comedic with too many moments of being played as a joke being the butt of many slapsticks and humor. For starters, his monotone voice is played with comedy, especially there's two instances where he gets an asskicking and he screams in pain in the most monotone and calm way possible, and one episode shows he owns a store where women use his hair style and shades to resemble him. And then there's his defeat, another thing played for laughs which happens in every single episode as a running gag.

Even his threat of genocide of all dinosaurs is just that, an empty threat which even the heroes didn't take seriously and as soon as he says this he gets defeated seconds later with zero gravitas to his threat, and we never know if he carried this out in the dark future. Even some his worse acts from the final episode, that's just fridge horror on my part. We don't see those Reprogramming Camps he sends people to, we never see them, that's purely offscreen, nor do we know what happens to those locked in his trophy room beyond being displays and looking sad. We don't know the full extent of his nightmarish dystopia other than bodyswapping Geeker's body and turning his friend into a old senile man.

Yeah, I'm no longer confident in him keeping, at least GKR 23 was more of a keeper and was much more serious than him.

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#287481: Nov 5th 2021 at 11:52:23 AM

[up][up] It was released October 29th.

G-Editor Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#287482: Nov 5th 2021 at 11:54:14 AM

[tup] to Bob, Abdul al-Hazrad and Emiliano Marquez

Okay switching [tdown] to Imperious and cut Moloch

Edited by G-Editor on Nov 5th 2021 at 9:06:54 AM

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom from NYPD (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#287483: Nov 5th 2021 at 11:56:01 AM

Yes to Bob.

Cut Moloch (Good catch, Power. Tone is sometimes difficult to gauge for me too, trust me.).

Edited by SkyCat32 on Nov 5th 2021 at 3:00:37 PM

Feels good, don't it?
nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#287484: Nov 5th 2021 at 12:17:01 PM

I guess cut Moloch

Edited by nwotyzal on Nov 5th 2021 at 12:18:28 PM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#287485: Nov 5th 2021 at 12:20:34 PM

Cut Moloch

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
YobabyColin Since: Apr, 2021 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
MasterJoseph Frolaytia X Qwenthur of Heavy Object from Not telling. Since: Mar, 2018
Bullman "Cool. Coolcoolcool." Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
G-Editor Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#287489: Nov 5th 2021 at 12:44:49 PM

Alright time to get my write-up done

  • To Your Eternity: Hayase is a vile Control Freak, who first dominated the country Ninannah by having them hand over their children for Hayase to feed them to the bear god, Oniguma, under false pretenses that they are necessary sacrifices. When Parona and Fushi rescue March from being sacrificed, Hayase imprisons the trio and would later kill March when they try to escape; Hayase would then re-capture Parona, before tortures Parona, peeling her face off and decapitating her. Becoming obsessed with dominating the immortal Fushi, Hayase slaughters countless fighters in Jananda before defeating Fushi, and form The Guardians with their true purpose being to keep Fushi imprisoned as Hayase's Sex Slave where she attempts to rape him, while killing any who disobey her. Hayase would then capture Tonari and threatens to burn her alive unless Fushi submits to her and later goads Fushi to kill her so that she can curse the immortal. When Fushi abandons her, Hayase rapes a fisherman who rescued her before passing her obsession with Fushi down to her descendants to ensure that she will always haunt the immortal.

Funny I did back to back CM and MB candidates both voiced by Kira Buckland.

[down] Kuon Ichinose

Edited by G-Editor on Nov 4th 2021 at 10:24:02 PM

ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#287490: Nov 5th 2021 at 1:22:49 PM

Who was the Buckland MB?

Cut Moloch.

Here's the pending:

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Ordeaux26 Professor Gigachad from Canada Since: May, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#287492: Nov 5th 2021 at 1:49:59 PM

[tup] Abdul, Marquez, Reporter and Bob

Switching to [tdown] Imperious

Cut Moloch

CaptainPinkiePie from Equestria with love Since: Mar, 2019 Relationship Status: Brony
#287493: Nov 5th 2021 at 1:55:54 PM

Cut Moloch. At least GKR 23 still counts.

Captain Pinkie Pie! Nah, just Pinkie Pie.
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#287495: Nov 5th 2021 at 2:02:02 PM

Taika Waititi adapting The Incal for the big screen

Seems interesting. Anyone want to snag it ?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
TheJesterLord3732 Since: Oct, 2021 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
#287497: Nov 5th 2021 at 2:28:06 PM

[tup] to Phanes, Morana and Ruamoko, Judge Zeller, John Gallant and Chelsea, Abdul al-Hazrad, General Emiliano Marquez and Bob.

BloodRedKnight Since: Nov, 2019
#287498: Nov 5th 2021 at 2:39:41 PM

I want to add John Milton from Scream 3, the corrupt Hollywood executive who raped Maureen Prescott to give her a role, and slept with Angelina too and showed no remorse for it and only pretended to to save his own life.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#287499: Nov 5th 2021 at 2:41:00 PM

He's been downvoted multiple times.

Sawkman Since: Apr, 2018
#287500: Nov 5th 2021 at 2:49:15 PM

It's about time to talk about Maya and the Three and I think I found a keeper.

What's the work?

Maya and the Three is a fantastic animated limited series created for Netflix by Jorge GutiƩrrez and Sandra Equihua. In the kingdom of Teca, 15-year-old Princess Maya Teca journeys to assemble three warriors who are prophesized to aid her in defeating the vengeful gods who threaten to destroy humanity. Said gods are lead by the subject of this EP, Lord Mictlan.

Who is Lord Mictlan? What has he done?

Played by the great Alfred Molina, Lord Mictlan is the show's main villain and god of war. 15 years prior, when presented with the newborn Maya, the result of an affair between his wife, Lady Micte, and a mortal, King Teca, Mictlan initially intends to kill the baby Maya straight away, only relenting when Micte convinces him that sacrificing her when she's 15 would immensely increase his power. He agrees, taking pleasure in the pain that taking Maya away from her people would bring, but not before forbidding Micte from ever being apart of Maya's life. There's also heavy implication that he specifically wants Maya dead out of resentment towards Micte's affair.

Come present day, he sends one of his servants, Zatz, to alert the Teca of his intentions to sacrifice Maya; intending on King Teca and his army attempting to stop him. He then effortlessly slaughters the entire army, including Maya's older brothers, with King Teca being the sole survivor. He then sends Zatz, along with Acat, goddess of tattoos fails to retrieve Maya. When Acat returns empty-handed while refusing to reveal the location of the defected Zatz, Mictlan kills her by ripping out her heart, devouring it to increase his power.

He then sends several other gods to bring Maya to him, many of whom either serve Mictlan out of fear or intend to betray and overthrow him. He also punishes Vucub, god of jungle animals, for his mercy towards one of the heroes, Chimi, by having his eyes plucked out.

When Maya, the three warriors of prophecy, and Zatz confront him in the underworld, Mictlan murders another one of his underlings, Camazotz, god of bats, when he attempts to defy him. Mictlan then uses his powers to brainwash Maya's companions into attacking her, but not before gleefully revealing that he killed her brothers in a similar manner. Nearly sacrificing Maya, he's only thwarted by Micte's intervention, and later, one of the heroes, Picchu, who dies giving his friends time to escape from Mictlan.

Come the final battle, as he leads one last attack on Teca with his gods and an army of the dead, Micte pleads for Mictlan to stop his attack. Betrayed, Mictlan, despite claiming to love her, quickly flies into a rage and fights her with the intent of killing his wife. When the tides start to turn again Mictlan, he kills and consumes the hearts of the remaining gods that were loyal to him for a last minute power-up; transforming into a giant two-headed dragon. He then proceeds to wreak havoc and kills Zatz and Micte. All of this culminating in Maya killing the mad god at the cost of her own life.

Heinousness?

Lord Mictlan is a nasty piece of work, especially for a cartoon that's rated TV-Y7. He takes joy in the suffering of mortals and has no qualms with wiping them out; with his only motivators being a lust for power and petty spite towards humanity; lacking any of the redeeming or humorous traits that the other antagonists have. That's not even getting into the guy's body count. In the second episode alone he kills an entire army. By the show's end, he's killed several of the main heroes, including Maya herself via a mutual kill. He also has several on-screen kills that are, while not bloody, have him ripping out their hearts and eating them. Yikes.

Mitigating factors?

Now initially, it does seem like Mictlan genuinely loves Micte, even claiming to forgive her for cheating. However, this is very much a situation similar to Ego and Dr. Emilia, where a CM willingly abandons whatever care they had for a love one with little remorse in service to their selfish plans. In this case, he doesn't care about his wife's plea to spare Maya and humanity, willingly continuing his attack on Teca, having no difficultly fighting and eventually killing Micte. The show doesn't portray Mictlan with the slightest bit of sympathy here, with him completely tossing away whatever sincerity there was in their relationship. There's also no indication that he lost his sapience when entering his One-Winged Angel form, and if it did, then there are still zero signs that he didn't fully intend to kill Micte prior to that. He also claims that he'll honor the sacrifice of his loyal subordinates, but he shows zero remorse for killing them and breaks out into an evil laugh immediately after their deaths, so it's safe to say that he wasn't being sincere.

Final thoughts?

Despite his relationship with Micte somewhat complicates things, if Ego or Dr. Emilia can get approved, I say he keeps.

Edited by Sawkman on Nov 5th 2021 at 5:54:14 AM


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