Wall of Text cleanup

That's 262 words, which is over our limit for oneshot villains iirc. Bring it by the thread and we'll see what we can do

From Of Men And Titans:

• Alternative Character Interpretation: Damien's overall character and motivations were intended to be ambigious. Due to his nature as an immortal it is likely he struggles to retain a solid sense of self and has taken up various names and corresponding personas throughout his long life, making it unclear who he truly is.

He is initially seen as being a mentally troubled centuries old immortal in the body of a child, exhibitiing cruel and manipulative tendencies with seemingly no regard for anyone but himself. In Book II he commits a senseless murder on a whim but does later show a brief moment of remorse for it, seemingly unable to understand his own motive. He also saves another civillian during a city-wide attack. When he nearly lost his life against his battle with the Scarred Man but was saved at the last minute by Zeus One, Damien had commented to himself that he didn't deserve to be helped, indicating his own sense of self-loathing.

In Book III it is revealed he intentionally acts cold and vicious to avoid becoming close with others, too afraid of having his enemies kill them or the inevitable sadness of watching them age and die. His feelings towards death and eternal life are mixed, as he believes that even immortals will have to one day all die and that immortality doesn't conquer death but only delay the fates from implementing it. He also believes himself to be inherently evil, which he admits to himself after becoming blind at the end of Book III upon which he learns some humility and becomes less arrogant and eventually resolves to atone for his sins, yet also sees the futility in it since he considers his actions too horrendous to ever warrant forgiveness. He is revealed to regard his actions under a theological light and comes to pessimistically accept that he will go to Hell, as though he wishes to atone he is also unable to forgive himself and therefore cannot accept salvation.

He shows care for the Mitchell siblings not long after meeting them, helping save some of them on seperate occasions, at one point even surrendering his life and nearly dying. At the end of Book III he secretly considers the twin brothers as his friends and when Mitchell is seriously injured and rendered comatose, Damien silently breaks down in guilt from not being able to save him. Curiously however he makes no attempt to heal Mitchell like he did with Matthew, the reasoning behind this is unclear.

Later its revealed that his memories had been altered prior to his initial debut. While initially it was assumed he had regained his memories upon defecting from the Order's Sanctioned program in 2015, recent revision has added to the canon speculating that he doesn't truly regain his full memories until the end of Book III, after which his personality does noticeably change. This would indicate that the character of Damien in the previous Book II was not in fact his true self, though from certain dream segments it is made clear that by the time of Book II he was at least beginning to recall some fragmented memories from his distant past. Therefore on the assumption he did regain his full memories by Book III it would indicate that his more wrathful nature in Book II could have been a lingering result of the Sanctification process he underwent in Book II.

Even by the standards of Alternative Character Interpretations, this seems less like an example of an ACI and more like a character essay. Previously, it was even longer, but it's still too long even after being shortened.

Edited by Shadow8411 on Apr 1st 2021 at 12:05:20 PM

~Saturnina added these long-ass entries to YMMV.Friday Night Funkin:

• Alternative Character Interpretation:
  • Pico's sexuality. It doesn't help that the creators (even Pico's Tom Fulp) are Trolling Creator type. There are a great deal who liked ninjamuffin99's answer across different social platforms that Pico is exes with Boyfriend- sometimes jokingly, other times seriously. There's even a 2021 April Fools' Day update to Pico's School that eventually reveals him to be in a romantic relationship with Boyfriend. Being an April Fools update though, it reverted back to its original state the day after. The April Fools version is retained as a separate game under the name "Love Conquers All". There are also some flash creators that depict Pico having Nene as his girlfriend at in different games, or at least at some time in Pico's life. When Tom Fulp is reached through Twitter to answer about it, he replies that it'll be a thing in Pico's School 2- a game that's known for being "in development" for over 20 years. Some fans even dispute over whether this is canon to the original to the point that it's somewhat of a Broken Base topic.

• Badass Decay: Some people find Pico become this way due to Draco in Leather Pants. Broken Base Comments range from embracing this version of Pico complete with fanart and fanfiction of him being shipped with Boyfriend and wearing a maid outfit (he's even drawn being highly uncomfortable in one during an official doodle stream), to not minding either parties, to hating that Pico grew to become a "softboi" (despite him being rather generally affable to everyone who don't mean harm even in his original games). The former are usually from fans who discovered Pico through FNF while the latter are often from fans who already knew him and played Pico's School & other old Newgrounds games with him in it. And then there's a fourth group that don't like the softer depiction, but don't really go out of their way to bash newer fans. Just look at almost any comment section on Youtube with Pico in it. Downplayed regardless since he is hired as a hitman.

Badass Decay is obvious misuse since it's about what the fandom has done to the character, not the game itself (Pico in FNF is still pretty badass). I have no idea what to do with the Alternative Character Interpretation one, though.

Pico just sounds Ambiguously Bi in the first entry.

Edited by mightymewtron on Apr 4th 2021 at 2:16:03 PM

Should I put this under Ambiguously Bi or should I just add that Pico's Ambiguously Bi and retain it under Alternate Character Interpretation?

From The Last of Us Part II:

• They Wasted a Perfectly Good Plot:
  • Lev being transgender isn't used to its full potential. In the story, Lev decided to announce his true self after he was assigned the role of a wife instead of a soldier (a role he actually wanted). Even though the Seraphites do let women take part in the fight and some of them may have been wives themselves, the cult needlessly saw Lev shaving his head to look like a male soldier as an affront to their traditions and they deadname him in order to further antagonise and isolate him from them. The narrative doesn't bring up the horrifying implications of this arranged marriage, neither does the story show what type of person Lev was going to be married to. If Lev was never revealed to be transgender, then his role in the story would have been negated to basic defiance of assigned gender roles. In the game, Lev internalised his struggle and only announced his transsexuality to the Seraphites because he wanted to be a soldier, not because he wanted to escape his role as a sex slave through an arranged marriage. It could have been really interesting if the game fully explored how Lev feels trapped in his own body and show what it's like for him to live in a world as a transgender man without the means to complete his transition from female to male. Yara does mention Lev's struggle but only briefly without going into full detail about it. Lev's reveal as transexual would have had a greater impact if he ran away first and then embrace his orientation later on in the story by shaving his head. It would work better as a coming of story, as it could elaborate on his personal struggle and the life he would have been subjected to through foreshadowing and eventual exposition. It would work as a lesson about embracing who you are and a lesson on what it's like to live in constant fear of mockery and societal rejection for being who you are. As for character development, it would show Lev finally embracing his gender identity after living in fear his whole life and living with internalized oppressionnote . He would learn how healthy it is to open up to others and how he has to accept that he has to drop his personal feelings about the Seraphites for the good of his own safety and wellbeing. Instead, Lev doesn't talk about it at all and Yara only briefly talks about how she responded to him coming out by shaving his head. The game's treatment of Lev's transsexuality only appears to be surface level and the result of a quick Google search. As the game fails to explain transsexuality or show another aspect of the apocalypse that's rarely talked about. For example, Lev's response towards being deadnamed for the first time in front of Abby has been quickly pushed aside and not talked about in detail, making it appear as if the game is relying on the audience already knowing what is and isn't offensive to transsexual people. This makes Lev's transsexuality criminally underutilised in the story, a missed opportunity for positive representation, and a failed attempt at educating the public on transsexuality.

This is probably the largest Wall of Text example I have ever seen in this wiki. How can we truncate this into something more compact while keeping the main points? Or is it possible to scrap this? Note that the page is locked so we'll have to go to the Locked Pages thread to properly change it.

Geez, nearly forgot about that...

Edited by Excessive-Menace on Apr 7th 2021 at 7:28:36 AM

This is another entry that reads like a fanfic pitch (plus, if you wanna talk about "what is and isn't offensive to transsexual people," how about the dated usage of the word "transsexual"?). It sounds like a valid idea for an entry but could be cut down a lot, as it gets repetitive and bashy. I don't know the game well enough to write an entry but it could go like, "Lev brings up interesting ideas about what it's like to be transgender in a post-apocalyptic setting, especially pertaining to his cult abuse and arranged marriage, but these ideas only get briefly mentioned and not explored in depth." But like, better written than that.

Edited by mightymewtron on Apr 5th 2021 at 10:00:32 AM

Allow me to melt your brain a little, then.

In all seriousness, Mew's suggestions are good if we can figure out how best to rewrite it.

This is from a few pages back, but someone brought up the Cartoon Network entry on NetworkDecay.Unique Situations. The original was 7000+ words long, and this is what I cut it down to. Most of what I removed was either unnecessary or could be summarized by "executives fighting".

• Cartoon Network: There are a few broad schools of thought regarding CN's decay:
  • One view largely places the blame on Jamie Kellner, who was put in charge of Cartoon Network over longtime CN head Betty Cohen in 2001, around the time Time Warner merged with AOL. Under Cohen, CN was meant to appeal to a broad and diverse audience, and showcased animation from various eras throughout the medium's history. Kellner, however, subscribed to a more "conventional" programming philosophy: find a big hit, run it into the ground, and gouge advertisers for airtime during that show. This led to a lot of infighting between the Kellner and Cohen camps, with Kellner's camp eventually winning out. As such, most of the older animation was shifted to Boomerang or left the air entirely.
  • Another view holds that the decay really started some years later, in 2007. While CN was already experimenting with some live-action and quasi-live-action programming and phasing out their older original shows, the real trouble started when Stuart Snyder was given control of the company, and proceeded to do such unpopular things as run off several beloved creators, get rid of the Toonami anime block, and start "CN Real", the much-maligned block of live-action programming.
  • Another nadir of network decay came after Christina Miller replaced Snyder. Miller's approach to programming was Kellner's taken its logical extreme: "Find a hit show and spam it all over the schedule at the expense of everything else". One such anointed show during this era was Teen Titans Go!, which became virtually inescapable during this era, taking airtime from other well-established and popular shows like Adventure Time, Regular Show, and Steven Universe.

Edited by HeavyMetalHermitCrab on Apr 5th 2021 at 8:13:29 AM

Network Decay generally has some long entries on various subpages. Some of them make for really interesting reads, but some of them just skew into complaining territory and get off-topic from the point of "airing content unrelated to its original purpose."

Yeah, it's not like the informal essay (let's face it, that's what it was) was horribly written or anything, it just buried its theses in details, many of which had little to no relevance to the main idea.

I mean, we're supposed to be writing trope examples, not The Comprehensive Oral History of Certain Cartoon Network Executives and Why Fandom Thinks They're Caca-poopoo Doodyheads.

Can we cut down the Boomerang example next? It's almost 2,500 words and it goes into minutiae that isn't really relevant, like complaining about their limited commercials.

• Boomerang: Boomerang was launched with the intent of it being Cartoon Network's sister channel focusing on classic and "retro" cartoons. However, after original CN head Betty Cohen left, Boomerang was increasingly used as a dumping ground for more recent Cartoon Network shows, eventually reaching the point that Boomerang became largely indistinguishable from its parent channel — even airing reruns of then-current programming. Since then, Boomerang has been a channel in search of a reason to exist: it's been rebranded as a channel for younger viewers, it's had an on-again off-again relationship with its "classic animation channel" status, and it was even the name of a Video On Demand service. With many of the properties that launched Boomerang going to other distributors (particularly HBO Max), it seems that this will continue for some time.

I like it, but I think there could still be mentions of the newer reboots based off the older properties the channel was made for, as that's sort of tied to the network roots. As well as how it shifted from totally retro to being the place for cancelled Cartoon Cartoons and then to its modern-day kiddie channel streaming thing.

Edited by mightymewtron on Apr 6th 2021 at 3:44:24 PM

SignatureScene.Anime And Manga has over 70 moments listed for Naruto. The main page says that while a work can have multiple Signature Scenes, since different people may have a different scene they consider "signature", this still seems like an awful lot. Anyone familiar enough with Naruto to help chop down the list a little?

Or should I take this to the Naruto thread in the Anime & Manga section of the forums instead?

I've read almost all the manga. Here's my improved, shortened version. All feedback welcome, both positive and negative.

• Naruto:
  • The Leaf Village ninja fighting the Nine-Tailed Fox in the opening prologue.
  • Naruto defacing Hokage Rock with paint and graffiti.
  • Naruto sitting by himself on a swing, watching all the kids who graduated. An image the series often returns to, usually to show how far he's come.
  • Naruto discussing his aspirations over a bowl of ramen with Iruka. Notable for being the first time he states his intention of being Hokage.
  • Iruka taking a giant shuriken to the back to protect Naruto.
  • Naruto's Multi Shadow Clone Jutsu against Mizuki.
  • The Sexy Jutsu.
  • Naruto and Sasuke's Accidental Kiss.
  • When Naruto releases the Kyubi Chakra for the first time after Sasuke gets wounded by Haku.
  • Naruto yelling at Zabuza for his seeming indifference to Haku's death. So effective, it makes the latter shed tears.
  • Sasuke getting curb-stomped by Rock Lee.
  • Sasuke's first fight with a disguised Orochimaru (especially when he uses the fireball jutsu).
  • Sakura cutting her hair to escape Kin's grip.
  • Gaara vs Rock Lee.
  • Sasuke's 'fight' against Itachi.
  • Jiraiya, Tsunade, and Orochimaru simultaneously summoning their strongest allies in battle.
  • Naruto at One-Tailed mode clashing his Rasengan with Sasuke at Curse-Mark level 2 form's Chidori.
  • Gaara's fight with Deidara, and his death. He gets better.
  • Sakura and Chiyo fighting Sasori.
  • Naruto going Four-Tails., in response to Orochimaru pressing his Berserk Button.
  • Naruto and Sakura seeing Sasuke again.
  • Pain killing Jiraiya.
  • Sasuke's second fight against Itachi, and Itachi using Susanoo.
  • Naruto's dynamic entry against Pain.
  • Hinata's love confession.
  • Naruto going Eight-Tails, and the almost-unleashing of Kyuubi.
  • Pain reviving everyone he killed during his invasion.
  • Naruto's first reunion with his father, and later his only reunion with his mother.
  • Battle against the Nine-Tails and learning what really happened 16 years ago.
  • the reveal of Madara Uchiha's resurrection and the subsequent asskicking that he delivers to the shinobi alliance.
  • Naruto gaining tailed beast mode during the battle against Tobi.
  • Itachi beating Kabuto, and ending the Impure World Resurrection.
  • Tobi revealed as Obito.
  • Obito seeing Kakashi impale Rin. This event actually marks Obito's Face–Heel Turn.
  • Neji sacrificing himself to save Naruto and Hinata.
  • Hashirama vs. Madara.
  • The resurrection of the four previous hokage.
  • Might Guy using the gate of death against Madara.
  • The arrival of the Shinju and the ninja world backstory.
  • Obito becoming the Ten Tails Jinchuriki.
  • Naruto defeating Obito with The Power of Friendship.
  • Madara sealing all the Tailed Beasts within a minute, and driving both Naruto AND Sasuke to death's door.
  • The very first appearance of the Sage of Six Paths.
  • Naruto gaining the Six Paths Sage Mode while Sasuke finally obtains the Rinnegan.
  • Madara activating Infinite Tsukuyomi.
  • Sasuke declaring revolution.
  • The final battle between Naruto and Sasuke, especially in the anime.
  • Sasuke poking Sakura on the forehead before he leaves.

Can that many scenes really count as a "Signature Scene"?

I've read almost all the manga. Here's my improved, shortened version. All feedback welcome, both positive and negative.

• Naruto:
  • The Leaf Village ninja fighting the Nine-Tailed Fox in the opening prologue.
  • Naruto defacing Hokage Rock with paint and graffiti.
  • Naruto sitting by himself on a swing, watching all the kids who graduated. An image the series often returns to, usually to show how far he's come.
  • Naruto discussing his aspirations over a bowl of ramen with Iruka. Notable for being the first time he states his intention of being Hokage.
  • Iruka taking a giant shuriken to the back to protect Naruto.
  • The Sexy Jutsu.
  • Naruto and Sasuke's Accidental Kiss.
  • When Naruto releases the Kyubi Chakra for the first time after Sasuke gets wounded by Haku.
  • Naruto yelling at Zabuza for his seeming indifference to Haku's death. So effective, it makes the latter shed tears.
  • Sasuke getting curb-stomped by Rock Lee.
  • Sasuke's first fight with a disguised Orochimaru (especially when he uses the fireball jutsu).
  • Sakura cutting her hair to escape Kin's grip.
  • Gaara vs Rock Lee.
  • Sasuke's 'fight' against Itachi.
  • Jiraiya, Tsunade, and Orochimaru simultaneously summoning their strongest allies in battle.
  • Naruto at One-Tailed mode clashing his Rasengan with Sasuke at Curse-Mark level 2 form's Chidori.
  • Gaara's fight with Deidara, and his death. He gets better.
  • Sakura and Chiyo fighting Sasori.
  • Naruto going Four-Tails., in response to Orochimaru pressing his Berserk Button.
  • Naruto and Sakura seeing Sasuke again.
  • Sasuke's second fight against Itachi, and Itachi using Susanoo.
  • Naruto's dynamic entry against Pain.
  • Hinata's love confession.
  • Naruto's first reunion with his father, and later his only reunion with his mother.
  • Battle against the Nine-Tails and learning what really happened 16 years ago.
  • the reveal of Madara Uchiha's resurrection and the subsequent asskicking that he delivers to the shinobi alliance.
  • Naruto gaining tailed beast mode during the battle against Tobi.
  • Tobi revealed as Obito.
  • Obito seeing Kakashi impale Rin. This event actually marks Obito's Face–Heel Turn.
  • Neji sacrificing himself to save Naruto and Hinata.
  • Obito becoming the Ten Tails Jinchuriki.
  • Naruto defeating Obito with The Power of Friendship.
  • Madara sealing all the Tailed Beasts within a minute, and driving both Naruto AND Sasuke to death's door.
  • The very first appearance of the Sage of Six Paths.
  • Naruto gaining the Six Paths Sage Mode while Sasuke finally obtains the Rinnegan.
  • Madara activating Infinite Tsukuyomi.
  • Sasuke declaring revolution.
  • The final battle between Naruto and Sasuke, especially in the anime.
  • Sasuke poking Sakura on the forehead before he leaves.

All of those are ZCE anyway; they don't explain what makes them so special.

Edited by mightymewtron on Apr 10th 2021 at 12:51:45 PM

This was added to Tier Induced Scrappy in YMMV.Genshin Impact. It's too bloated and I would like some help trimming this down a bit.

• Out of every limited 5-star unit, Tartaglia AKA Childe, is arguably the worst of them without any constellation upgrades. This doesn't mean his damage potential isn't on par with all the other common main DPS out there, the problem was his elemental skill cooldown. Childe's gimmick is that he can change stance from a ranged DPS to a close ranged DPS, where his DPS output skyrockets....for the duration of the skill; because as soon as it ends, he might as well be literally dead in the water for nearly a full minute as his bow stance DPS output is poor in comparison. In a real-time game, that's a huge loss of DPS and energy generation for the entire team. While his cooldown can be managed by not spending too long inside his melee stance, the cooldown can still be uncomfortably long, still results in a loss of DPS, support, and energy generation; not to mention this requires some intense micromanagement. Playing Childe without Constellation 6 requires one extra DPS, in which basically means you're sacrificing a slot which you can use for another character, preferably a support and this limits the kind of possible team comps that can house a Childe. Even with full Constellation upgrade, Childe is almost similar to 4-star Razor, he cannot freely switch out to another party member during his melee stance without triggering his ultimate first to bypass the cooldown yet resulting in another loss of DPS and energy generation. Simply put, playing Childe requires both intense micromanagement, heavy investment into his artifacts, and paying extra attention to team comps, which can be a big turn off compared to other 5-star main DPS whose role is far more flexible in any team comps and far easier to use.

• Without constellation upgrades, Tartaglia/Childe is arguably the worst of the limited 5-star units. While his damage potential is on par with other DPS characters, his elemental skill cooldown lasts for nearly a full minute, leaving him with a relatively poor DPS output in the meantime. This results in a huge loss of DPS and energy generation for the entire team, and there's no really good way to mitigate this issue. As such, playing Childe without upgrades essentially requires you to add an extra DPS character to your team. This takes up a slot generally better reserved by a support character, and limits your options for building decent teams with Childe. These drawbacks make Childe a poor choice compared to other 5-star DPS who are far more flexible and far easier to use.

Edited by HeavyMetalHermitCrab on Apr 11th 2021 at 2:22:35 AM

As far as the Naruto thing goes, the definition of Signature Scene implies that there's only one per work, but in practice I can see more than one applying to something as long as Naruto.

Seventy, though? No. That's pushing it for a work of any length. I'd say more like five, tops. This is supposed to be about a defining scene in a work, not "a scene that was kinda cool."

The problem is, considering that none of those examples explains what happens or why everyone remembers it, none of them are actually valid examples. The entire thing should be deleted or commented out for being zero-context.

The way it looks to me, it seems people are confusing Signature Scene with Awesome Moments or whatever other Moments page applies.

Edited by HeavyMetalHermitCrab on Apr 11th 2021 at 4:22:44 AM

Many thanks!

I took a look at the Seasonal Rot entry on YMMV.Wheel Of Fortune... and it's like the longest YMMV entry I've ever seen.

Holy shit what a lot of complaining. The sad thing is I agree that Wheel is getting cheaper/worse as a longtime watcher myself, but we don't go to TV Tropes to complain about changes we don't like.

A lot of the stuff in that entry could probably be cut for being nothing but complaining, and I notice some natter in there as well. We don't need to list every single negative change that the series has ever received, especially not when doing so leads to a 2,864 word long entry.