The Scrappy Cleanup

• Jr. Troopa: Cut
• Flurrie: She's probably the least popular partner, but I haven't seen much outright hate.
• Jojora: I can see people disliking her(?), but she still sounds too minor. Probably cut.
• Bowser's Minons: I'm not sure, but if you think it's a cut go ahead.
• Mole Hunt: Don't remember Dream Team very well, but sounds like a really forgettable minor character. Probably cut.
• Baby Mario: Now THIS is an interesting one. Most people think Baby Mario's crying is annoying and stressful, but that was the point! The question is, does that disqualify him for similar reason as hate sinks? At the very least, the excessive negativity should be toned down.
• Bowser: I think Sticker Star Bowser specifically might qualify. If you cut out all of the other tangents and make it clear that it's ONLY his Sticker Star version (and why), then I think it would work.
• Tanooki Mario and Cat Peach: Don't know.

The whole point of Baby Mario's crying is to encourage you to save him so he stops. That's not enough to qualify as The Scrappy since it's intentionally annoying.

From TheScrappy.Video Games:

* Super Smash Bros.:

** Diddy Kong managed to become this in some circles in Wii U/3DS prior to the 1.0.6 patch. Widely considered a broken character in the fourth game due to his overpowered and annoying "hoo-hah" combo (down throw to up air) and the fact that he was one of the least technical and most boring characters in competitive play, he has also been subject to criticism for his monkey noises and goofy appearance not helping matters. You'd better believe people were happy when he got nerfed. While more of a Base-Breaking Character in his debut in Brawl (Considering Meta Knight and the Ice Climbers were more broken and his high tier status came late in the scene), he still took plenty of flack for his juvenile appearance complimenting a ridiculously effective moveset. While balance patches have removed his overwhelming advantages, his previous stigma persists with some players. As one Reddit commenter put it:

There is a lot of hate given to people who play top tear [sic] characters, but when it's a little monkey squealing and gimping you with bananas your blood will begin to crystallize due to salt in your veins.

** Also, Corrin seems to have this status too, given he's the sixth Fire Emblem character in the game, which some people think there are too much already, especially fans of franchises with no representatives like Rhythm Heaven and Splatoon.

Diddy Kong should be removed since the entry is about him being broken rather than his character, and he's already listed on the series' Tier Induced Scrappy subpage. Corrin should also be removed, since her entry uses the Weasel Words, "seems to have this status too," there are fans who enjoy playing as Corrin (seen him/her on a few top favorite Smash Bros characters lists), and the entry is a bit dated since the Inklings are now playable in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate.

Should I add the character Nahyuta Sahdmadhi to the Scrappy list? While he does have his fans, they aren't nearly as many as his massive hatedom especially from people who wanted to see Klavier and Blackquill develop beyond being rivals who seek the truth. It doesn't help he shoves his religious beliefs of you being a "putrid lawyer" down your throat and while some people appreciate the return to a traditional rival, others (the hatedom) find him way too obnoxious, quoting Frozen "Let it go, and move on" having a design similar to Elsa which is why the haters call him Elsa Sahdmadhi, and his backstory with Apollo was more or less shoehorned into the plot as a last ditch effort to make him likeable. This guy isn't a Hate Sink either as he DOES get redeemed but in the game, people find it too little too late, especially the fact he tried to sentence his birth father to death for being an attorney among other things and was perfectly OK with the Big Bad killing his adopted brother and his mentor if it meant his mom and sister lived.

I'd say Nayhuta is a Base-Breaking Character, but not a Scrappy since he does have his fans and it's hard to gauge how many more detractors a character has than fans.

My only question is, where does it say in The Scrappy requirements that they can't have fans? I said most of CR (which is a huge chunk of the AA fanbase) and Game Faqs hates him, so he does have a massive hatedom.

Although I do have an idea for another AA character that does qualify, namely, Sal Manella. Literally no one likes this guy as he was made to be an otaku stereotype like Travis Touchdown, only minus any likeability or even attractiveness Travis has. Guy is a gross, overweight Fat Bastard who speaks in Leet Lingo and has no probable reason to help Dee Vasquez, not to mention drools over the then-underage Maya, giving unfortunate implications.

Also I found these on the Visual Novels page.

Ace Attorney:

Lotta Hart, a tabloid photographer with a Southern accent who appears in four cases in the series, much to the dismay of her haters. It doesn't help that whenever she appears, she takes some sort of photo of something involving the crime, and these photos are always horribly misleading.

Like Meekins below, Lotta is popular in Japan so this is a case of Amercians Hate Tingle.

Also from Apollo Justice, Zak Gramarye. Most players agree that is both a despicable human being and nonsensically and inconsistently written (at times he's written as if he and Shadi Smith aren't even the same person). Most of his fans only like him ironically, for the sheer comedic value there is in shining a light on how heartless his actions were.

(Zak being a jerk is memeworthy and if anything his "fanbase" is more than his hatedom. Cut.)

Many fans consider Mike Meekins to be the worst of the worst, due in no small part that he talks through an ear-screeching megaphone every few seconds. Thankfully, he ditched the megaphone in Ace Attorney Investigations, but many fans still hate him for being obnoxious and stupid.

(Believe it or not, I think Meekins has a sizable fanbase compared to other examples of this trope, and while he is dumb, he doesn't go overboard. And he placed like #6 or 7th on a popularity poll in Japan so this is a case of Americans Hate Tingle.)

Zinc Lablanc II, the loud obnoxious art dealer from Investigations who constantly sticks his nose into the investigation. Despised so much that players were wishing he was the murderer just so he can be arrested or totally not minding if his fall ended in with his death (and neither does any of the characters but Gumshoe).

This I could see keeping. Although, while I don't see very many people liking him, but there's no overwhelming hatred of him when the subject isn't AAI.

Also from Investigations, Calisto Yew. It's difficult to find a fan who doesn't find her annoying. Not even her cool and composed Shih-na persona makes up for her endless laughing fits at Edgeworth's expense.

Fans did like Yew as a villain so that's a cut.

"Director Hotti", the creepy "doctor" at Hotti Clinic. He's creepily obsessed with his female patients, even going so far as to steal Ini's photo and hit on a wounded Franziska. He doesn't even serve much of a purpose beyond giving you the photo in 2-2; in 2-4 he's just there to piss off Franziska and be creepy.

Given that he's a paedophile/Ephebophile and not a sympathetic one. (he's gone after Trucy and Pearl too, which this entry does not say) I say keep.

Dual Destinies's Florent L'Belle, for his Complexity Addiction and Stupid Evil, not to mention his Meaningless Villain Victory even if you lose. Unsurprisingly, most fans view him as the worst villain in the game — with some even extending that criteria to the franchise.

Aside from calling him a moron here and there, I don't see any widespread hate of Florent. Maaaaybe cut?

Most of the characters in the Berry Big Circus not named Acro, the victim, Max, Sōta Sarushiro (Simon Keyes), or Regina Berry could qualify (though the last one is more of a Base-Breaking Character due to her naivety bordering on abject stupidity), but special mention goes to Trilo/Ben and Moe who are regarded as some of the most grating characters for different reasons. Moe has hated for his Nonstandard Character Design along with the fact Phoenix gets penalized if he gets off-tangent in his testimony (not to mention the reason this happens: He simply won't stop laughing at his own stupid jokes, and the Judge's so tired of it he'll take it out on Phoenix if he hears that damn laugh one more time. The man won't stop being a terrible clown for one minute even if it means ruining the entire case). Then we get to Trilo/Ben who is the most livid and lewd witness, beats up his partner, has a crush on a 16 year old girl, treats the defense like crap, and every time you try to present evidence to him he goes into a stuttering wreck which for some people, hits a little too close to home. All in all, the entirety of Turnabout Big Top becomes one of the franchise's worst cases due to this cast of awful performers that won't drop the act even in court, no matter how much it ruins things for everyone in the courtroom and no matter how utterly unfunny their act is in the first place, and who have zero respect for the entire process and everyone involved (especially you) to begin with.

While Big Top does have plenty of haters, (I'd argue even Acro, Regina, and Max aren't safe) the only one with a sizable hatedom as a standalone character and not... y'know a group, is Trilo/Ben especially for his creepy Ephebophile status with Regina...

In Spirit of Justice, we have Bucky Whet for being an useless drunk defendant who only redeems himself at the end of Case 4, with a bizarre design (not ugly per se but just very weird for a 20 year old young man) constantly vomits in his mouth (to the point it becomes an unfunny gag) and faints, speaks extremely slurred, and gets people's names wrong particularly Athena. He's not nearly this terrible when he's sober, but that is unfortunately uncommon.

Bucky has plenty of fans last I checked, even the case villain has more haters than him. Easy cut.

Edited by Klavice on Sep 21st 2018 at 11:33:52 AM

My friend loves Nayhuta, so that was all I knew for a good while. I'd also say he's more base-breaking.

What do the Japanese think about Nahyuta? If they don't particularly hate him, then he might be a case of Americans Hate Tingle. Though I have doubts whether the vast majority of the Western fanbase actually hates him; Internet communities do not always consist of the vast majority of the fanbase, after all.

x6 Can I get an answer for the Smash Bros examples I brought up several posts back? I'm cutting them if no one has any objections.

Edited by ADrago on Sep 22nd 2018 at 8:10:21 AM

Your assessment of the SSB examples are correct, they should be cut.

From the Gundam franchise, specifically Gundam Wing, I bring two characters: Wufei and Quatre.

• Head writer Sumizawa revealed in an interview that Quatre, of all people, was rather unpopular during the show's run, with Japanese girls nicknaming him "The Space Heart Jerk".
• Wufei wasn't much liked by the American fanbase, largely for his flip flopping sides on a dime and abrasive personality. Of the five, he's usually viewed as the least interesting.

Quatre is brought up because he is actually listed in the Germans Love David Hasselhoff trope here:

• At least initially, the Japanese fans (especially the women) despised Quatre, while he's one of the more popular characters in the West.

The entries don't actually contradict each other, but shouldn't it just be contained to Germans Love David Hasselhoff instead?

As for Wufai, he is also listed as a Base-Breaking Character trope here:

• Wufei has two camps: one that seems him as a Jerkass and being seen as a Hypocrite who killed sleeping soldiers despite his honour/justice proclaimations and refusal to beat up weaker opponents. The other camp respect him more for it, for sacrificing his own personal honor for the greater good.

He is also however listed as The Scrappy on the Gundam Scrappy Page:

• Wufei, an Arrogant Kung-Fu Guy who is Flanderized in fanfiction as a misogynist bastard who only knows four words: "Justice", "Evil", "Nataku", and "ONNA!". The fact that he is a blatant Hypocrite by spouting off about honour and then killing soldiers in their sleep hardly helps his case, either.

So which one should be nixed?

Edited by RebelFalcon on Sep 22nd 2018 at 8:32:33 AM

Yeah Nahyuta is somewhat popular in Japan. Hell Turnabout Big Top, the most dreaded case in the west with a cast of characters you could classify as scrappies is actually quite popular there. Hell, I believe Acro finished in the top ten case villains. So it is a case of Americans Hate Tingle.

Actually the majority of these characters are popular in Japan with exceptions being Zak, who is a meme and Dr. Hottie/Hickfield because surprise surprise Values Dissonance is in place for Ben/Trilo, Max, and Regina. Though they still took advantage of a naive bordering on stupid Cloud Cuckoo Lander.

This was on Detective Conan: Heizo Hattori. See Never Live It Down above.

As for the Never Live It Down part: It seem Heizo Hattori's only memorable character trait is punching Heiji.

No context. Referring to another trope first isn't sufficient context, it's also not allowed.

Short version, I'm dropping by to mention I removed an entry of Captain Archer from Star Trek: Enterprise. The entry talks about his bad traits, but it completely overemphasizes them and pretends Archer has no fanbase. Archer is a clear Base-Breaking Character, (I myself find him incredibly dull) but most assuredly not Scrappy material. T'Pol, however, I'm leaving there for now.

I haven't been around for a while, and won't be around for a while more. I just thought I ought to mention the removal.

This was on the YMMV for the movie based on Howard the Duck: All three of the lead characters to some extent: Howard for his constant lame puns and the ridiculous-looking duck suit, Beverly for having no depth to her character beyond being an airhead, and Phil for trying way too hard to be the quirky comic relief.

Is "some extent" a reason to keep it?

Nope. "To some extent" is weasel words. Not only is that not grounds to keep, it is grounds to delete.

This reminds me: do we actually have any rule about Scrappies being needed to be characters hated by people who aren't haters of the work in general? Because Howard the Duck was pretty reviled in general, IIRC, which makes the entry seem pointless as well as poorly written.

Edited by nrjxll on Sep 27th 2018 at 7:48:02 AM

I think such a rule should probably exist. Otherwise, we could list Elmo, Caillou and Barney as Scrappies despite the fact their shows are for little kids and they have a Periphery Hatedom, especially amongst Millennial and Gen X parents.

Edited by Klavice on Sep 29th 2018 at 12:22:46 PM

Cutting these from Fated to Love You for failing to provide context:

• The Scrappy: Anna, to a lesser extent.
• Take That, Scrappy!: Anna gets this one when she implied that she caused Xin Yi's miscarriage of her baby in episode 12.
• The Scrappy: Se Ra, to a lesser extent.
• Take That, Scrappy!: Se Ra's mother delivers a slap for Se Ra for almost missing the flight on episode 9.

YMMV.Kirby Right Back At Ya:

• TheScrappy: Find anyone who likes Tokkori. The little bird is an annoying case of SmallNameBigEgo, took over Kirby's house the moment it was built, and would usually insult Kirby (and just about everyone else) at any opportunity. One thing detractors and fans alike agree on is that he was absolutely unneeded for this anime. Although it should be noted Tokkori was [[IntendedAudienceReaction ''meant'' to be be]] [[HateSink unlikable]].

The "was absolutely unneeded for this anime" is the only argument for being unintentionally hated. Keep or cut?

I'm going to say "cut" unless someone can give a source on said hatred that doesn't boil down to "Take my word for it."

EDIT: Also, considering the character is from an anime, I'd like to know what the Japanese reception to the character is.

Edited by dragonfire5000 on Oct 1st 2018 at 8:09:43 AM

All examples are "take my word for it", since we don't require citations.

If a character is not wanted in the work at all, then that fits the very base definition of what a Scrappy is. That's by far the most important aspect of what the trope is about. It's not a lot of context, but it's the most important part.

I'm going to say it's a keeper unless you can show it's not correct.

"unnecessary character" is a very vague and unconvincing argument.

Saying nothing more than that a misquote is "vague and unconvincing" is a very vague and unconvincing argument.

"Absolutely unneeded" clearly means it's a character people don't want in the work at all. They want the character gone. It takes a leap of imagination to imagine something other than that is a hated character.