Do you have trouble remembering the difference between Deathbringer the Adorable and Fluffy the Terrible?
Do you have trouble recognizing when you've written a Zero-Context Example?
Not sure if you really have a Badass Bookworm or just a guy who likes to read?
Well, this is the thread for you. We're here to help you will all the finer points of example writing. If you have any questions, we can answer them. Don't be afraid. We don't bite. We all just want to make the wiki a better place for everyone.
Useful Tips:
- Make sure that the example makes sense to both people who don't know the work AND don't know the trope.
- Wrong: The Mentor: Kevin is this to Bob in the first episode.
- Right: The Mentor: Kevin takes Bob under his wing in the first episode and teaches him the ropes of being a were-chinchilla.
- Never just put the trope title and leave it at that.
- Wrong: Badass Adorable
- Right: Badass Adorable: Xavier, the group's cute little mascot, defeats three raging elephants with both hands tied behind his back using only an uncooked spaghetti noodle.
- When is normally far less important than How.
- A character name is not an explanation.
- Wrong: Full Moon Silhouette: Diana
- Right: Full Moon Silhouette: At the end of her transformation sequence into Moon Princess Misty, Diana is shown flying across the full moon riding a rutabaga.
Other Resources:
For best results, please include why you think an example is iffy in your first post.
Also, many oft-misused tropes/topics have their own threads, such as Surprisingly Realistic Outcome (here
) and Fan-Preferred Couple (here). Tropers are better able to give feedback on examples you bring up to specific threads.
For cleaning up examples of Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard, you must use their dedicated threads: Complete Monster Cleanup, Magnificent Bastard Cleanup.
Edited by Synchronicity on Sep 18th 2023 at 11:42:55 AM
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
That definitely feels like misuse. The Groundskeeper feels like the last obstacle, but the game itself doesn't really seem to have any kind of bosses whatsoever, unless you stretch the definition of "boss."
On YMMV.Spider Man Far From Home, I removed some Harsher in Hindsight entries following the format, "This part sure felt awkward when the MCU lost Spider-Man," under what felt like the same logic that cost the Guardians of the Galaxy, Vol. 2 YMMV page an entry (written by me) stating that something from James Gunn's commentary sounded awkward after his firing. However, someone later restored the FFH Harsher in Hindsight entries. Do they deserve to stay, or not?
Edited by dsneybuf on Oct 24th 2019 at 8:39:33 AM
Lost in Space
Those are all severe misuse and should be removed. Link to this post when you make the edits. I'll make it all pretty and pink for emphasis.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
It's gone.
There is no Planet B
While Azami Mochizuki usually wears a yellow maid outfit, she serves as a ninja of the Mochizuki clan and doesn't do any maid work.
Does this count as a true subversion of the Ninja Maid trope?
True subversion? Definitely not. Subverted trope means the trope is set up and it looks like the trope is about to be used, but does not happen.
That sounds like Played Straight. Normal, basic use of the trope. That said, Ninja Maid is a trope that has the element of surprise integrated in the basic use. During her dirst appearace, she should look almost helpless in her maid uniform, but then she shows off her ninja skills.
I've asked in the past about the second RWBY entry but never got a solid answer. It's just been cross-wicked to gen:LOCK (first entry), so I'm going to see if I can get a solid position on whether 'crunch time' counts as an example of Troubled Production, given that it's been a widespread problem in the animation industry for decades. Wouldn't most animation works be experiencing this issue to one extent or another, thereby making it more a case of 'Troubling Industry Working Conditions' than Troubled Production?
The second gen:LOCK example appears to rely on employees anonymously complaining about an ex-employee (who was their boss at the time). The linked document even starts with the warning 'This is all ALLEGED.' Are employee disputes really covered by this trope? It seems like this trope would apply to almost any production company if that's the case.
The first RWBY entry looks valid to me because it's about the impact the creator's death and non-standard, out-dated software had on that season's production.
- Troubled Production:
- The show was made alongside and following RWBY Volume 6, which unfortunately led to Rooster Teeth's animation teams being subject to an intense period of crunch that became public in June 2019◊ and was confirmed by Nomad of Nowhere creator Georden Whitman. Among other things, staff were expected to work up to 80 hours every week, meaning as much as a third of gen;LOCK was effectively made for free due to unpaid overtime.
- In September 2019 following showrunner Gray Haddock announcing that he had left Rooster Teeth over the summer, several insiders spoke out anonymously about Haddock's managerial style which left a lot to be desired. Per these sources, Haddock used his position as Head of Animation to shut down several other show pitches to get his greenlit and was using Rooster Teeth resources on concept art prior to the official greenlight. Gray is also alleged to have stolen resources from Nomad of Nowhere to compensate for the budget going above expectations, while also using his position as Head of Animation to intimidate workers into not telling HR.
- The show was made alongside and following RWBY Volume 6, which unfortunately led to Rooster Teeth's animation teams being subject to an intense period of crunch that became public in June 2019
- Troubled Production:
- Volume 3 ended up having its production delayed by two months due to Monty Oum's death, preventing the first episode from being premiered at RTX 2015 as planned. Poser's antiquated software also made animation difficult; it would frequently crash and take hours to render the larger, more complex scenes of the volume. This, along with Poser requiring each new animator to be specifically trained in it, led Rooster Teeth to move to Maya starting from Volume 4. Reports indicate that the finale was only finished with hours to spare.
- Volume 6 and gen:LOCK were produced back to back, forcing the animators to go through an intense period of crunch time to get both shows done. Soon after gen:LOCK wrapped, Rooster Teeth's Glassdoor page was filled with reviews discussing the terrible working conditions, with one source claiming that as much as a third of Volume 6 was effectively made for free because of the company's refusal to pay overtime.
Edited by Wyldchyld on Oct 25th 2019 at 6:24:01 PM
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
There is no Planet B
Reposting from previous page:
- Face Death with Dignity: In contrast to the way his friends and his brother meet their ends, A. Jay's death comes off as this (mostly). While he still kicks and squirms as the woman, who fully intends on eating him, dangles him in front of her while checking him out. And he still flails about as she tosses him in the air and catches him in her mouth. But unlike his band mates he is less panicky and doesn't resort to begging her.
I think this is misuse. Do you agree?
Some arguments to delete it:
- Weasel Words / Examples Are Not Arguable: It comes off as this (mostly).
- Laconic: A doomed character accepts their death with serenity.
- From description: This is a sad, meaningful fate reserved for only the most tragic of characters. The best they can hope for is to give their end some order or meaning.
Edited by XFllo on Oct 25th 2019 at 7:26:44 PM
Yes, that looks like trope shoehorning at the very best.
There is no Planet B
Thanks for your feedback.
RE: Troubled Production I agree with you that relatively minor problems and disagreements are not noteworthy. I bet every producing most works has problems and issues.
From description: It should be noted that most works involve some degree of chaos.
If there is no edit war going on in the examples, edit it as you see fit.
edited to make the post clearer
Edited by XFllo on Oct 27th 2019 at 3:21:14 PM
he/him | Image Pickin' regular
This on YMMV.Incredibles 2 is misuse since Audience Reactions can't be played with, right?
- Overshadowed by Controversy: Downplayed, but a decent chunk of the online conversation about the movie, post-release, has centered on its unadvertised use of Epileptic Flashing Lights, which has caused serious adverse reactions in some epileptic viewers. Disney's failure to pre-emptively address the issue hasn't helped, though they eventually heeded the call and many cinemas have since posted warnings to photosensitive viewers, and the home release of the film toned down the flashing to where it's far less bright and far less likely to cause a problem.
You're correct; Audience Reactions cannot be downplayed.
Edited by dragonfire5000 on Oct 25th 2019 at 11:39:34 AM
Cat Stereotype is for stereotypes about specific breeds of cats, not cats in general, so this should be split into Cats Are Lazy. The Jinx, and Artistic License – Animal Care?
Characters.Miraculous Ladybug Kwamis:
- Cat Stereotype: Plagg is the spirit of bad luck, so he has the form of a black cat. He's also quite lazy, and loves dairy products.
The bad luck/black cat connection seems legit, less sure about the rest.
@rjd1922
That should be removed because Audience Reactions can't be downplayed and it's also a misuse of Overshadowed by Controversy because that controversy quickly died down and didn't end up overshadowing the movie.
There is no Planet B
It seems okay to me, too. Cat stereotypes is about specific breeds, but also about cat stereotypes in general.
It's most likely an example of Cats Are Lazy, too, but that would need more context (how is the cat lazy, what it does/ doesn't do, how does it avoids doing things and so on).
Lord of the Blue Star
Can Deliver Us from Evil work for an adoptive parent? In Carmen Sandiego Shadowsan is one of Carmen's parental figures and her leaving the criminal organization lead him to realize he too can reform and atone for his past sins still. Note this turn happens like 20 years after the child is born.
Edited by isoycrazy on Oct 27th 2019 at 2:52:08 PM
...
Repeating because it wasn't answered.
This example was deleted off of Characters.Jem:
- Ambiguously Jewish: "Gabor" is associated with Hungarian Jews. This is canonized in the IDW comic, where Pizzazz is explicitly Jewish.
Edit reason:
IDW is a completely separate universe where characters have different sexual orientations and racial backgrounds, among other things, so "religion" or ethnicity wouldn't carry back so easily. Given that nothing about anybody's religion is mentioned in Jem, you can't even say Pizzazz is ambiguously Jewish. Furthermore Christy Marx did mention all the main characters were given last names after people involved in holography, and while Dennis Gabor's family was Jewish, "Gabor" is the name they requested to use after they converted to Lutheranism, so... not exactly a very Jewish name.
It's still a traditionally Jewish name, so isn't she Ambiguously Jewish?
This isn't Randomly Drops, since these aren't dropped from an enemy, right?
Do we have a trope for a merchant changing inventory?
- Randomly Drops: Store inventories change daily. Gifts and trade offers from villagers are also very randomized, not to mention fossils, ore in New Leaf, etc.
Edited by Malady on Oct 28th 2019 at 9:20:20 AM
Disambig Needed: Help with those issues! tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13324299140A37493800&page=24#comment-576
Does this count as Faux Symbolism? I was thinking of adding it to YMMV.Halo.
Musician/Composer
From Trivia.The Last Jedi
- Fan Nickname: Detractors of the film have taken to calling him "Ruin Johnson."
Does this count as misuse or an attack?
He/His/Him. No matter who you are, always Be Yourself.
Lost in Space
Attack. Kill it.
Yes, that's what Faux Symbolism is for.
No, definitely not Randomly Drops. I don't think we have a trope for merchants whose inventory changes.
Edited by Fighteer on Oct 28th 2019 at 4:14:57 AM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Lost in Space
~isoycrazy - #10217: That doesn't seem to fit the definition, which is that getting pregnant/giving birth is what prompts the redemption, not events that happen after the child is grown.
~Pichu-kun - #10218: Ambiguously Jewish is about a character who fits Jewish stereotypes without being explicitly identified as such. Just having a Jewish-sounding name is not enough. If they don't act in ways or do things that imply that ethnicity, it can't count as an example.
Lord of the Blue Star
Thanks Fighteer.
...
Is Ambiguously Jewish that strict? Several examples use names. Should they be removed too?
For example..
- Regular Show
- There aren't too many Gentiles named Mordecai.
- Muscle Man's actual last name ("Sorenstein") and his dreidel-emblazoned sweater in the Christmas special are enough to make one wonder.
- Fish Hooks: Bea Goldfishberg? Also, her best friend Oscar is incredibly neurotic, and sports a "Jewfro."
- The main family on Birdz has the last name Storkowitz. They also have huge noses/beaks, which are even referenced as such more than once.
- On Hey Arnold!, Harold came off this way before it was confirmed by a Bar Mitzvah episode. Also, Eugene has the last name "Horowitz" nd Sheena can at least recognize Hebrew at a glance.
- Daria:
- Many fans think that the title character's surname, "Morgendorffer," sounds Jewish, though Word of God says that that isn't intentional. In universe, a man who had recently met Daria and her father introduced them as "Jake and Daria Mogendavid. Jake was about to correct him when Daria told him not to bother.
- The ambiguity is also true of Tiffany Blum-Deckler, who is Asian despite the double-barrel Jewish surname. (Her parents are never seen, so Fanon is that she's adopted.)
- Family Guy: In "The King Is Dead" episode of Family Guy, we learn that Diane Simmons' maiden name is Seidelman.
Found this YMMV.Untitled Goose Game:
I really don't think an NPC standing in front of a gate counts as a boss, especially not when it's possible to avoid him entirely. I didn't even know he was there when I played this game, I just immediately went through the hole in the hedge and didn't even see him.