Discussion GameBreaker / FireEmblemHeroes

I'd be expecting someone or something in the future, possibly this year, that is going to be immune to the end action effect and start of combat damage, kind of like how [Schism] was made to counter [Triangle Attack], [Dual Strike] and [Pathfinder] way after they're introduced, but yeah, Valentine Duo Lyon & Eirika for the best lockdown unit in the game, most likely forcing players to think about their formations while they have their Duo Skill ready and running certain units if they don't want their fastest unit to end their turn in SD, especially backed with a dancer, in AR, their lockdown ability is both a great asset on Offense and absolute hell on Defense, not to mention that the amount of HP they remove before even attacking if they initiate is absurd. The only way to counter that status effect is with the Odd/Even Recovery skills and Safy's Repair. They certainly count as Gamebreaker.

For Valentine Myrrh, She trades Null-C Disrupt and Supreme Heaven for [Warp Bubble] to herself and either support partner or ally with the highest Def and Dragon Wall over Winter Duo Male & Female Byleth, but she is still a great Far Save unit. She is comparable to Brave Female Corrin, so as long as Corrin is a Gamebreaker then Myrrh is one as well.

Valentine Ephraim is basically a stronger version of his Winter variant, and is comparable to Ninja Zelgius, so I say he counts.

I haven't actually seen any NY Seidr in any of my AR matches, though it sounds like she'd definitely be super annoying to deal with. Igrene is a super mega nuke (although if the Ao E damage reduction status becomes more readily available, that may hinder her), and Altina feels like she can kind of do it all, being a powerhouse on either phase. Null C-Disrupt would also be very good on her for that reason.

Rearmed Reinhardt feels very specialized, kind of the same way Alcryst and his Arcane Darkbow was. Good on cavalry and fliers, but I can't really imagine it's something too many infantry (who usually have prfs anyway) or armours (all four of 'em, with one even having a prf already) can put to good use. The Rearmed and Attuned change is nice though, that's worth a mention in the Rearmed section.

And Emblem Marth... yeah, Jesus. I think he sets the shining gold standard for godswords now. Not only for being able to attack three times, not caring about Guard, tearing through opposing Damage Reduction while getting a good amount of it himself, and also a ton of stats, but also giving -1 Special to any unit is just insane. I can imagine we'd probably need an Emblem Heroes section once we get a few more, if they're anything like Emblem Marth is. Funnily enough, that would mean Marth would have three versions of himself on ths page, and all grouped together once he's added, because the other two Marths also make great use of his Engage mechanic. Legendary Marth's Shining Emblem becomes easier to activate, and Brave Marth can actually forgo Shining Emblem for a one charge No Quarter for DR pierce and then his weapon provides Vantage, then he can run something like Null C-Disrupt so that nothing can deny his counterattack (ie, his Vantage attack).

Would Emblem Marth's Engage mechanic be mentioned in other entries if applicable, or should it just be for general mentions at the end of his own entry? Like,

• Emblem Marth, who is a godsword that can [his many capabilities go here, he can do this, he can do that]. When Engaging with Marth, he can turn any weapon into a -1 Special weapon, and for weapons that already have -1 Special, they get to enjoy the benefit of even faster Specials. Such examples can include [whatever the examples are].

I think that it should be mentioned at the end of his entry since nearly the entire roster can benefit from engaging with him, with me not even able to name any exceptions on the top of my head that don't benefit at all from the -1 max cooldown. Like for example, I though Ninja Duo Lyn & Florina don't benefit from this, but Lethality becomes a 2 cooldown special for them, and any Infantry Godmelee (just using this for Sword, Lance and Axe) that runs Vital Astra can run Godlike Reflexes instead for 1 cooldown instead of 2. Ninja Duo Sanaki & Micaiah? They can run still Iceberg instead of Moonbow. Someone from a Bridal Catria/Winter Cordelia ball? They can still run any other higher cooldown special and still be just as dangerous. Both variants of Nerthuz? Lower cooldown means a 3 cooldown Galeforce can trigger more reliably despite the foe having Tempo effects, and it just goes on for me.

When more Emblem Heroes come out and their engage effects are just as broken as Emblem Marth's Effect, then we can go into more detail on who benefits from the effects the most when we make a separate section for them. Like for example, let's say that a potential Emblem Micaiah's engage effect has it neutralize all [Penalty] effects and maybe heal 10 HP to all allies after either using an Assist skill or after a special triggers during combat, then the best users for the former conditions are Dancers and Restore and movement assist Staff units and for the latter Godmelee and Save units.

It's been a while since the last discussion, but let's talk about the 2023 Winter units first:

• Winter Yunaka not needing Lethality to basically nullify DR while getting Wind Claude's absurd DR is absolutely nuts, and can run Disarm Trap as well as to basically get a free engagement on a foe in AR.
• Winter Edelgard being a Galeforce machine (helped with her charging special before her first attack not specifying that it has to be a special that triggers during combat), while setting up a lot of [Divine Vein (Flame)] makes her the best player phase armor, but her debuff's conditions prevent her from being the best Save armor in the game.
• Winter Dimitri has many things over Summer Dimitri, with the main one Summer Dimitri has over Winter Dimitri is the brave attack, but that's negligible compared to what he gains instead, bringing a mix of both Summer and Legendary Dimitri's gimmicks.
• Winter Duo Male & Female Byleths is absurd to the point of being the best Far Save unit in the game, and that's saying something. Their kit is basically a better version of Ascended Fjorm's one, as well as having better Scowl and mixing Sublime Heaven with Armored Beacon/Floe. The only point against them is the very lackluster Spd, but the absurd bulk they have makes up for it instead.

Speaking of Claude, he has an inheritable weapon (though one that gives special reduction before the user's first attack, especially if either the user is a Cavalry unit or the foe has a [Penalty] effect, making instant Deadeyes possible), and his kit implies he's a fast Bow Armor like Winter Ignatz before him. His Wind variant is a handful enough so having another powerful Claude released in a short window would upset players, to say the least.

I would say all four of them would count, but Winter Yunaka and Dimitri would most likely fit under the Player-Phase Mounted Powerhouses at the very least.

All of that is well, but since the last time we did a major update, we got some new toy to play with, so some discussion on who to add will be here (beside the winter units):

Finally, some thought I've had since the last update on the page: Ratatoskr introduces [Divine Vein (Green)] that basically prevent warping into and from those spaces and inflicts Guard during combat on foes that are in there, but Divine Veins as a whole is still up in the air, while Ratatoskr is great with her kit, but she's not gamebreaking, and with the later release Arcane Weapons, Arcane Eijudnir just seems undertuned in comparison, where a unit with offensive Tempo and Null Follow-Up basically nullifies 3/4 of the weapon's effect, and those effect are becoming more common.

Gonna agree with most of those picks. Kvasir having DR on both of the opponent's first hits makes her deceptively tanky, so if you don't have any way of starting the battle with DR piercing or outspeeding her then you're likely gonna lose that matchup. I think Ninja Zelgius might be a general folder addition (alongside Edelgard and Dimitri, since Dimitri's wrath does also extend to the enemy phase too with his Vantage), although Zelgius can Save better than Edelgard can. Both do seem like they're suited to not just being Save armours but just dual phase monsters. I summoned for Zelgius and gave him Special Spiral 4, and now that we have the Special Fighter Seal, that's a pretty busted combination.

Agreed with adding Gullveig (compared to Brave, trading flight and Canto 1 for even MORE actions), Ninja Sanaki (also incredibly absurd), and the two new Arcane weapons, while also disqualifying Arcane Eljudnir since it's a very tame weapon now, especially considering how many times they've rerun it.

It's Ginungagap that I'm a bit unsure on, and same with Ratatoskr. Both very powerful and have great niches for what they do (Ginungagap can basically just insta kill and delete a unit, but Scowl effects can ruin her and Winter Byleth can hard stop that) and Ratatoskr's Divine Vein Green is helpful, and she's generally strong, but I also don't think either are too game breaking.

And maybe Rearmed Lucina for support? Since she can inflict huge debuffs against groups of foes for free, inflicting [Sabotage] with her Spd/Def Snag 4 skill, granting [Treachery] to herself and an ally, basically giving you huge damage and big stat swings on command.

But yeah, these new Winter units are insane, I think this might be the most ridiculous banner we've had yet in terms of power scaling. As someone who loves Claude in general, the lack of prf for Winter Claude is a bit lame, but on the other hand, Wind Claude is still a menace, and Winter Claude can still precharge Deadeye, so for a free bow that's still something. And now Edelgard and Dimitri also get to be dual phase Primed nightmares to face alongside Wind Claude.

I agree with all but one of the changes, but there are some additions, alterations and removals I'd like to add as well:

For the other two under Debatable: Ninja Duo Lyn & Florina and Ninja Duo Female Corrin & Elise I could argue still have their place outside of Aether Raids. Legendary Male Byleth however has been overtaken by both Special Spiral 4 and Guidance 4/Soaring Guidance, even though both of them have limitations, so I support removing him: he's just a DR-exploiting-Dragon/Beast killer now.

We'll go over the CYL7 and refines for the CYL5 later, but we'll start by cleaning up. Looks like we have to use the Sandbox again. Here is the link: [1]

Alright, I think I went and applied most of the changes I brought up, and I've got no qualms with what you've got to add other than removing Brave Claude, so basically, whatever's left on the To Add list now, so you should probably go and write those in there.

I also don't know if some units (including Teatime Ayra like you suggest) should go in their respective folders or under Mounted Powerhouses, since such units are very player phase focused, like Ayra herself, as well as Spring Karla, or maybe the Mounted Powerhouses section should just be scrapped, but that's up to you to decide.

And finally, I removed the "+5 to all stats" on every Arcane weapon because they kind of all come with that now, with Lif's sword being the sole exception. I'll revert that if we ever somehow do get another weapon that does -6/-6 instead.

The Mounted Powerhouses can be extended again to include Tea Party Harmonized Ayra, Spring Harmonized Karla, Summer Dimitri, Brave Eirika and Legendary Nanna, but let's redefined it as Player-Phase Mounted Powerhouses, since that's their sole focus.

All of the additions are done, but before we finalize it, let's get on the [CYL] discussion (and terrain effects).

Brave Male Robin and Brave Eirika's Refine is already added, so there's no need to talk about them.

Brave Soren I can see being added not just because of his dual phase brave attack under certain circumstance, but his [Assign Decoy] status effect on either his support partner or ally with the highest Def that the both of do not trigger [Savior] them is a big one for him, as that status effect alone bypasses the one [Savior] per team in Summoner Duels, AR Chaos Season, and Seer's Snare.

Brave Female Corrin provides a lot of defensive support with her providing [Divine Vein: Stone], while also being a great Save unit. The only thing really holding her back is that she doesn't have Null C-Disrupt or immunity against armor effectiveness, not helped if the enemy also have Flared Sparrow to overwrite [Divine Vein: Stone], but she can give [Divine Vein: Stone] to an ally's space instead, such as Summer Fjorm or Legendary Seliph. Overall, something to watch out for, but not worthy of an entry yet.

Brave Gullveig I can also see being added, as while Flared Sparrow can be given to Flying and Cavalry units, she is one of the few ranged units that can get an Extra Turn (and one not assigned to a special at that), so she can exploit it to the fullest, helped with her Atk/Spd Oath 4 and [Charge] on her or Soaring Guidance on an ally.

Brave Marth just needs an update to his entry, but in the long run I see him falling off as he needs setup and [Null Panic] support to make him consistently work, gets shut down against Yune, and he has to face competition against other Godswords.

Brave Gatekeeper is now a good durable support unit and nothing else. The healing and additional buff to allies is good, but in the end he's not worth running over many other support units.

Brave Marianne is now a competent battler that is also a pseudo-dancer that can consistently trigger her Requiem Dance, and she already bypasses the one dancer per team requirement, while her "danced" allies can bypass the [Gravity] effect with [Charge] or Guidance 4/Soaring Guidance from another ally, so I can see her being added.

Terrain effects I say we hold off until we get more and see the whole picture with them, as currently we have 2 terrain effects, and one of them is limited behind a specific hero.

Alright let's see, get ready to see me write DR a lot.

Agreed with Soren, because being able to turn any unit into a Save unit is incredible support, even though you do have to do a Def check for it. The buffs are also pretty nice to have, and it does let you get past the one Save unit limitation in some modes. That alone should make Soren timeless, because you just have to build your high Def unit to take on melee threats, which well, they should be able to anyway.

I have Corrin, and she's strong. She does have a lot of DR herself, while also not really needing a Special for offense thanks to her Counter Roar adding damage. Like, she has Armoured Floe but it's not like she's got the highest Res (it's still good though), so I think that's really just there for defensive purposes. She can also just heal herself after combat thanks to Counter Roar. I've also been checkmated by her because of that, for the same reasons I struggle against a Rearmed Grima sometimes. Great unit, but I'm also not sure if she's worthy of an add since she does still have weaknesses.

Gullveig gets a lot of DR to help her exchange blows, and she gets an Extra Turn also basically for free, which is already unheard of for most units (basically most units not named Edelgard), but now it's on a ranged unit. I thought she was simply good at first, but that there are more sources of getting past the 1 Mov restriction like with Charge (which also now just became available from a free unit in Arion) means she can really hit and run, and then leave a terrain of flame to deter opposing ranged units from chasing you down. I think she's worth an add for that.

Marth I already updated to his refine effects, even if it ultimately wasn't too flashy, nulling Guard, getting more DR and more stats, I think that's pretty good. I think how long he'll last will depend on how many Dull or Panic effects get added to the game, or if any [Neutralize Penalty] and [Null Panic] become more easily available for him. But I think he should stay for now.

Gatekeeper is good, the ability to have units heal from long range is nice. But like... that's it. Aside from his Def based DR, he doesn't really have anything to help him in combat. It's kind of like they could've focused on either pure support (add a few more support effects from long range) or focused on combat (give him a follow-up attack, true damage in addition to the true defense), and they just kinda tried to do both and it ended up being a little middling. A fine unit, but nothing game breaking.

Marianne was the real winner of that batch, getting everything she needed. True damage, DR piercing, more DR for herself on player phase, and some on enemy phase now, gets -1 Special, and she can null Guard. I've even seen some people just forgo Requiem Dance and just make her a regular mage, but that she has options is pretty nice. Plus Mag Null Follow I believe would stack with the DR piercing the same way some people run that on Brammimond. Worth an add, I think.

And yeah, we should wait for at least a few more Terrains before considering adding more.

Good thing I can look up removed stuff as some are legendaries waiting for a refine/remix (likely why some were slow to remove entries).

I take it high power/spd "brave weapon" units aren't worthy of being here?

Strong & Fast Brave weapon users I think needs a little more than just "hit hard twice or four times" to count as a gamebreaker, as they need to have a lot of Atk, Spd, instantly charged Special and/or Damage Reduction piercing, as while many units can die to a double attack (especially if they're targeted on their lower defensive stat), many tanky units have a lot of DR and bulk, and units that can consistently smash through Save tanks and God-melee weapons with ease are few and far between.

Take for example both Summer Shezes. Both of them are Lightning Bruisers and their weapons have 11 Might and give them +5 Spd, double attacks on both phases, [Canto (Rem. +1)] and true damage based on 20% of their Spd. Summer Male Shez is a Lance Flier FTP unit and is a popular build thanks to his Surfer's Spade and being comparable to his female counterpart, but he needs some great skills such as Atk/Spd Prime 4, Aerial Maneuvers, Gambit 4, Guidance 4/Soaring Guidance and the Rein Snap and Tier 4 Oath skills to reach his peak. Meanwhile Female Summer Shez is a more rare Sword Cavalry with fewer options, but the best ones are Gambit 4 and the Alarm skills, although her base kit is great enough. Both of them don't have access to DR piercing yet, but Summer Female Shez has one thing over Summer Male Shez: Swift Slice. Not only does it give her +8 to all her stats, but if she initiates combat she gets effective damage against all weapon types (not movement types) if she is over a certain Spd threshold against certain unit and weapon type combinations. That alone makes her a consideration as a gamebreaker as being able to deal effective damage as long as she is faster than her foe, especially against non-Infantry units, makes her a great brave attacking wallbreaker.^note the main reason that I didn't consider her one is because half-I forgot and half-she needs some sort of DR piercing to be viable, and the latter is sort of fixed with Gambit 4 Summer Shez meanwhile needs those great skills and sometimes support from allies to work, which is more merit to those skills and allies than just his weapon.

Contrast with Legendary Female Shez. Despite not having the 20% Spd damage boost and Canto, not only does she has the same Swift Slice, but she is a ranged attacker and has plenty of DR piercing options with Lethality, Special Spiral 4, Phys. Null Follow and Spd/Def Tempo 4. Add some support options from other allies and you got someone that can take down even the toughest tanks with a brave attack, and because of all of that she's has an entry the main page.

I think she's a good support unit, but the only strange thing is that her supportive Scowl effect is based on her own Res. I think the idea is that allies without as much Res can take advantage of such an effect, but there are also a good amount of units that can outdo Veyle herself in Res (usually dragons, like the two Adult Tikis we got in the past year or so), so it feels like it should've been an either or condition. Though flavour wise she would be the one protecting her allies in that sense.

Being able to provide Resonance Blades and Shields, as well as that Scowl effect, that's worth an add for support though. Blue Feud doesn't seem to be that common as far I've seen, and there is also no Embla in Anima to stop her from supporting her allies.

Attuned Peony I would agree would be worth an add mainly as a Support unit, with Orders, Canto 1 and Dodge status effects as well as +4 Atk/Res and +6 Spd/Def to 1 ally being great, especially to a Atk/Spd Prime user, and Atk Oath Echo being great on a unit that needs to dance an ally (only behind Wings of Mercy and Charge), while also being a great combat unit as well with some changes to her kit.

Attuned Triandra I would also agree would be worth an add, with not only the massive debuff potential with -5 Atk/Spd/Def/Res, Guard and Sabotage from dancing, massive Spd/Def debuffs and chip damage to foes not running Feud simply from her presence, while also being a great combat unit, especially if she has Flared Sparrow, and that's not even going into multiple copies of her. The only thing that falls short is her Death Blow Echo, but at the same time, you can give her Atk Oath Echo to give her the extra Atk and warp movement.

Speaking of Attuned Skills, I would hold back until we get more, although there are some theory cases that some would be great, such as Lull Spd Echo inflicting -4 Spd and additional debuffs based on the amount of [Bonus] effects on the foe, Null Follow Echo neutralizing any effects that deny any of the user's follow-up attack and removing a quarter of the foe's DR, or Fury Echo granting +2 Atk/Spd/Def/Res but inflicts 4 damage to the user after combat. In the meantime, the only one worth mentioning is Atk Oath Echo, with the Orders status being the main factor.

Finally, about the Arc. Caliburnus Arcane weapon, the +5 Atk/Spd/Def/Res, guaranteed follow-up attack, +1 special buildup and Lull Atk/Res if the user is at 25% HP or above at the start of combat is a generalist Arcane tome that is comparable to Arcane Euphoria, where anyone with a high Atk can use it, although units with high Res as well would benefit best from it. The Inheritance options from Rearmed Sonya on the other hand is limited, where Escape Route 4 is limiting if focused on, and Atk/Res Ploy 3 doesn't have Still Water 3/4 to further boost the user's Res. Units that can use Arc. Caliburnus best and Rearmed Sonya inheritance and in the 3/4 star and Grail pool is Bastian, Regular Orochi, Ricken, Luthier and Limstella. I think it's worth an add.

So, I found out the hard way that Attuned Triandra cannot equip both Atk Oath Echo from Attuned Peony and Harrowing Dream, so that is one point less against her, but she is still a great support unit nonetheless.

I could see Divine Veins having their own dedicated section, especially with Flared Sparrow being inheritable.

Sorry for the late reply, but we'll need to clean-up some of the entries on the main page before we get into the CYL7 units and Terrain effects.

I've used him in a few AR Friend Mock Battles, and he wins against the likes of Summer Duo Shamir & Catherine, Medeus, Brave and Valentine Duo Chrom and Bridal Catria quad balls (granted, he was supported by Legendary Male Robin, Regular Peony and Regular Mila). The only unit that I saw so far that defeats him consistently is fellow Earth Legendary Nanna. Heck, he can even counter the new Sabotage-like effects of checking if either him or an ally within 2 spaces of him have any field stat debuffs by having the effects of his unique refine for his Virtuous Tyrfing go 3 range instead of 2. I've haven't tested him thoroughly, but his performance I've seen so far makes him one of the greatest enemy phasers in the game, up there with high ranked Save Armor and Brave Dimitri, even if he has a few counters like Fatal Smoke, DR-ignoring Desperation and Deflect Melee. The lack of Canto is a bit of a weakness as well since he has great player phase as well, but with a potential Atk/Def or Def/Res Alarm being released later (and Flame Harmonized Tana & Peony's Kindling Taiko), Canto (1) would be the best he can get without overwriting his best skills, but with Canto Control sometimes being around, 1 movement is what he's going to do anyway. With the biggest Rescued from the Scrappy Heap in Heroes I'd say he counts.

Tea Party Lysithea I feel like is a high tier Player Phase flying ranged unit like Yune post-Remix, but I feel like it wasn't a high bar to pass to begin with since with Cavalry and Infantry player phasing have gotten stronger at a faster pace than fliers and Armor units became great enemy phasers thanks to Savior, flier balls fell out of favor and Bridal Catria and Winter Cordelia balls rose in its place. Don't get me wrong, she still great, but the lack of a DR-ignoring option for her currently hinders her.

Speaking of Desperation, Tea Party Harmonized Ayra & Mercedes getting free Time's Pulse 3, consecutive Supreme Astra with Flow Desperation and Canto (Dist. +1; Max 4) makes them one of the best Hit-and-Runners out there (granted, they have no DR-ignoring skills and can lose to Scowl effects), while also being one of the best buffer and anti-debuffers with their Harmonized skill with the right setup.

Finally, with Seliph father's Tea Party variant, while his Knightly Manner grants him true damage and Whateversweep against all but bows and daggers and Chivalric Aura has Time's Pulse 3 built into it and can increase the Atk and movement of himself and allies after combat even if he was defeated, I'm having trouble parsing if he should either be a Red Unit entry or a Support one, as while he fully fits the latter, the guaranteed follow-up, true damage and Whateversweep from his weapon, while great for a ranged cavalry, is otherwise on par with other great weapons out there, so for me he feels around par among the other units released beforehand this year as a combative game breaker.

I'm basically just back to talk about L!Seliph lmao. Yeah I've done a tone of testing with a max invest one and basically the only things that have consistently been an issue have been the Shezs with Swift Strikes, brave attacks with some kind of pierce (pre charge for magic, partial can work for non magic), despo quads, and Catria/Cordelia balls although they're less consistent as they kind of depend on who's being run although Cordelia herself can put a good dent in him. Ao E also can deal with him although Gotoh also makes that answerable and it still needs upwards of 70 attack to put him into kill range especially for mages. Despo quads are a pretty big issue for him though so Hardy Bearing really seems like his best Seal right now

The units sound pretty good to me, especially Gerik who kinda went from zero to hero with his refine. That level of support is pretty great, and the global range means he just has to sit back and be healthy, while also being able to put up a fight if he has to.

I'm not sure about the Arcane weapons though. They're good, but they feel too specialized, unless we're to judge them based on their capabilities rather than what kinda units can get 'em. Since, I think the entries mention what sort of units can take advantage of the weapon and what skills they can get at the same time.

Like, Alcryst gets Tempo in his B skill and a stat swing, essentially having Moonbow built in. Any other infantry archer would just have to use Spd/Def Tempo, and other class types can't really bypass Guard so easily, so they'll have to miss out on something. It's telling how PM1 didn't even have a section for armoured archers for his Alcryst video. And then Arcane Nihility can only be inherited by like, a dozen units at most, so that's even more specialization, to the point where it may as well be an entry about Eitr herself (who I think is strong, but otherwise quite standard, since NFU and DR are just typical effects nowadays).

I'm fine with the Arcane weapons not being added. Alcryst is broader in terms of inheritance with his Deadeye, Flash Sparrow and Def/Res Smoke 3, compared to Eitr who is too specialized with Melee Cavalry with Alarm Atk/Spd and fast Beasts with Beast Sense 3/4, but both of them have their weapons catered to them with their exclusive skills as well and thus is specialized compared to the generalist nature of some of the other Arcane weapons.

Some counterarguments about the above:

Seiðr's Future-Focused has the potential to lockdown one or even more units and her weapon grants a status effect to herself and all allies near her, but she more fits into Difficult, but Awesome, as trying to line up to an enemy you want to target with lower Res while also avoiding all the other enemies at the same time is difficult enough, even with the aid of Still Water 4 and Chill Atk/Res 3 and potentially the Phantom Res Seal, and doubly so since it only works on odd-numbered turns and terrain can make that difficult to do it safely, especially in Aether Raids and Summoner Duels.

Legendary Hinoka is a great debuffers against non-flying units and provides great support for all ally with +1 special buildup and granting fliers [Charge] (especially flying Dancers) with her Rallying Cry, and has effective damage against flying and armored foes, true damage, Flow and prevents counterattacks if she is faster or has color advantage with her Fujin-Raijin Yumi, she doesn't have another thing that makes her ridiculous like Tempo or a brave attack like her Pirate version, as well as her performance with Wings of Mercy 4 can be duplicated by someone else, such as Yuri (either one) and Thief Duo Nina & Kagero. Overall, she great, but not enough to be gamebreaking.

Bolt Tower (O) is really great if it activates. However, it is realistically going to work on Anima Season, as Dark Season has Medeus and his [En Garde] protecting him from outside damage, the activation on turn 3 means that you have to lure and setup to maximize its potential on turn 3 before their Healing Tower (D) undoes the damage, and even then it's not going to work if it gets destroyed by either the Catapult (D) or Regular Duma's Upheaval(+). It's more of a Difficult, but Awesome structure than a gamebreaking one.

Yeah, she's a really good support that can also be a great nuker if the situation needs it, helped with her Mag. Null Follow halving non-special Damage Reduction. She's worth an add as a Support at least.

Personally speaking, I usually use Heidr as a nuker. But yeah, she's absolutely cracked. Fomortiis folds like wet paper to her. I love using her.

As someone who has a merged Ascended Mareeta I'm going to be biased and say she's still very good, because with Time's Pulse 4 Mareeta can have GLR precharged and keep it charged ^note -1 from weapon, -1 from Time's Pulse 4, then after combat, either 1. she retaliates, brings it down from 2 -> 1, then her sword gives her an extra charge after, or 2. she can't recharge GLR for some reason because of Guard, no problem, even if it's at 2 charge, that's its max count so Time's Pulse 4 kicks in to provide that charge, and then her weapon provides the extra charge. For what it's also worth, Mareeta can still Galeforce pretty well too.

Unfortunately, it does seem like Fir otherwise has her beat in terms of like, everything else. Time's Pulse 4 built in (which I just realized after writing all this... is that Fir can just inherit Time's Pulse 4 herself and do everything I just mentioned for Mareeta, damnit), Damage Reduction is already covered, basically getting Velocity with that and the null Guard effect, higher stats, and a greater stat swing with the Spd/Def debuffs.

A lot of the godswords we got in just the past few months feel... very much the same. -1 Special, +5 to all stats, a billion Spd, and either some form of Special charging, Null Follow Up, Damage Reduction, the works. I know Damage Reduction tanks already cover them, but maybe these Special charging godswords should all just go under the same type of unit.

Maybe Special Spamming Dodge Tanks would be a good fit for them? Since Mareeta, Fir, Felix, and even Fallen Byleth all do this.

Yeah, Special Spamming Dodge Tanks would be a good fit for them. Outside of those four, I know that Flame Lyn also fits the criteria as well (she did introduce Godlike Reflexes after all), while also being a great combat/support unit as well with her Firelight Lance granting -1 special cooldown to herself and all allies within 4 spaces of her after combat.

How does this sound?

• Special Spamming Dodge Tanks are a different type of Damage Reduction tank. Units like Ascended Mareeta, Ascended Fir, and Felix, these units are very fast infantry that rely on their Spd to mitigate damage, and coming with a whole host of effects that help give them an edge in battle, whether it's more Damage Reduction, Null Follow-Up to ensure that Spd can't be manipulated, or Tempo to bypass Guard. These units often come with some way of pre-charging a Special, either through their weapon or through Time's Pulse 4, whether it's Vital Astra (for more damage and built in Damage Reduction) or Godlike Reflexes (for more Damage Reduction, but requiring an extra charge), and some ability to maintain that charge after combat.
  • Fallen F Byleth gets a special mention for her Divine's Pulse, which [blah blah blah the rest of her capabilities go here]

I tried to keep it pretty general, since they all do rely on some form of Damage Reduction. I do think that Mareeta's swordmaster throne has been challenged, and anything she can do, the other units listed can also do pretty well too. Not that Mareeta is outclassed or anything, I still think she's still very powerful, just that she has a lot of competition now, and thanks to Time's Pulse 4, Godlike Reflexes, and the other swordmaster units, they all really do play mostly the same... which makes Byleth kind of an exception, because her Special is offensive, but can't be pierced by Deadeye, and she focuses on Vantage-ing to get the jump on foes and keep her Damage Reduction up.

Yeah, that's good enough.

I think Duo Askr and Khadein Linde are great support, the former for being a non season-locked Askr with his party wide Time's Pulse, and a Duo button to further charge any skills, while Linde can just give NFU and the unhindered Mov status basically for free. Arcane Qiang is basically combining the effects of the sword (omnibreaker) and axe (Special accel, albeit only after either the user or foe moved) which is a good, general purpose lance for most lance units.

I'm not sure about Alear being game breaking, even though she seems a bit ridiculous statwise. The Atk and Spd swing she can get seems immense, and has Damage Reduction on her weapon, the new and improved Close Call 4, and Spd Smoke 4, but aside from granting [Charge], that kinda seems to be it, just huge DR. She'd still need to acquire stuff like Tempo and Null Follow-Up by running the respective B skill and Seal, but as I write this I realize that the DR being in her weapon actually means she can just run something else in her B slot at the cost of some of that DR anyway.

I think the big thing about Alear is that A: she's practically impossible to double with Null-Follow Up, what with being in the second highest speed bracket in the game (46 base), and combined with the enormous DR she can stack, (to be clear, she can stack up to 84% DR with the combined DR from Spd Smoke 4, Close Call 4 and Libération), this makes it very difficult to even chip Alear with highly damaging attacks unless you've got some way of bypassing DR.
B: Between Libération cutting enemies' Def by 12, and Atk/Spd Ideal boosting her own Atk by 5, she's more than capable of dealing damage, too...
And lastly and most importantly, C: This is all a part of Alear's base kit, with zero investment required. This means she definitely warrants consideration. To that end, she could be considered similar to Lucia. While Alear cannot lock down specials in the same way Lucia can, Alear stacks even more DR than Lucia does (not to mention does so more consistently through her higher speed), basically mandating DR-piercing in order to fight her (and even then, it's tricky since Alear does plenty of damage herself and basically always doubles unless she's fighting another unit in a similar speed bracket) And if she really needs more DR and damage, she can use Vital Astra even better than Lucia can due to, again, her higher speed (to say nothing about the fact that this cranks Alear's already incredible DR capabilities up to new heights).

The highest DR that characters averaged prior was 40% on units like Brave Chrom and Fallen Edelgard, Alear's maximum DR with just her base kit (which she will almost always get) is 84%, over double that.

Female Alear deserves the gamebreaker slot. The Null Follow-Up seal makes her a monster to deal with. The Time's Pulse 4 from Fallen Female Byleth will now be available on the regular summoning pool, there's a huge chance that she'll make a good use of Vital Astra or Godlike Reflexes from getting an extra regular Felix to receive a further damage reduction on combat.

Like the Godswords, there is competition on who is the best Far Save unit in the game. However, Bridal Harmonized Adult Tiki & Young Tiki is basically a mix of Halloween Duo Duma & Mila and Brave Adult Tiki, and they are Colorless, so they have advantages over both of them. The only real differences is that Halloween Duma & Mila's Ghostly Lanterns negates the foe's guaranteed follow-up attacks and Brave Tiki has access to the Finish skills, but otherwise Bridal Harmonized Adult Tiki & Young Tiki are worth an add.

No complaints from me for any of these, it's just, jeez, all of this came out within just the last few months. Stat swings get higher, fast units reach up to 50 Spd at base, literally every unit gets entire skillsets in their weapons and even prf skills... it's a lot. I'm already dreading having to fight Fallen F Byleth because F Alear already gives me a ton of trouble.

Remember in the past what I said about whatever made Caineghis a Game-Breaker before he his refine, Fallen Edelgard blew him out of the water? Fomortiis pretty much blew him out of the water post-refine, and that's before we know the stats, so yeah, besides the AOE Damage Reduction with his refine (which Gotoh can actually provide to Fomortiis), the Lion King doesn't catch a break, so sadly I would cut Caineghis and add Fomortiis.

Having just finished their Mythic Hero Battle, yeah, I'm inclined to agree. Since we're now dealing with AOE DR supplied by an outside source, Fomortiis does literally everything Caineghis does but better unless you're getting into hyper-specific builds, and Fomortiis and Gotoh debuting on the same banner with the same color means they'll be paired together quite a bit.

I would also not be averse to adding Gotoh too, because his kit is equally cracked. Anti-Counter, post-combat healing, Super Lull Atk/Res, a passive Def/Res+6 battery for himself and allies, and the aforementioned AOE DR are all built into his weapon. His PRF A also grants Auto Follow-Up and inflicts Atk/Res-10 if being initiated on or fighting a ranged enemy, neuters their second attack by 80% if hit consecutively, and inflicts Forced Desperation (a la Brave Ike's refine) to make sure that 80% happens. His kit is rounded out by Guard 4 and Joint Dist. Guard rounding out his bulk, of which he already has a fuckton in his base stats. He might actually be even more of a tank than Fomortiis!

I'm seriously glad I invested in Special Spiral 4 fodder, and I heavily suggest y'all do the same the next time it comes around, because these fatasses aren't going anywhere anytime soon.

I say Gotoh gets a spot in support at least for being a hard counter to Ao E antics but yeah you'll want DR pierce.

Lucia and Legendary Male Robin were added to the page without discussion. I don't suppose anyone here would argue against their listing though since, yeah, they are pretty cracked?

e: This was meant to be a new thread, whoops.

I've seen Vantage Sweeping builds rarely, but when they do pop up it usually ends with 1 or more dead units for me. Ninja Camilla I know has counters, such as Deflect Magic and Firesweep and Hardy Bearing-like effects, but players actually running those is actually rare and as a result catches players off guard. With the addition of Nifl and her Ice Domain and especially Ymir and her Everliving Domain, however, Ninja Camilla can even countering the latter units since they usually need a 1-shot to stop her. She could be worth an add, but my main concern is the counters for her are common enough in the meta-game such as Brave Hector, Ascended Idunn and Arval.

Right, I actually forgot about Deflect Magic, hell, Ninja Corrin was basically the reason why it became so prevalent in the first place. I've found that Ninja Camilla can enemy phase even those Far Save tanks because their respective Specials only work when you try to player phase 'em, but some do also still run Deflect Magic. Arval is also a giant pain with their huge Res (which they grant to their allies), Guard, and weapon triangle advantage for some reason.

Phantom speed comes in real handy in such match ups.

While Shez is very strong, I actually don't think she's truly game breaking. The Spd check versus human infantry units is quite steep, even if she does have a lot of Spd to work with, some of the fastest units around are already speedy infantry anyway. Infantry Beasts and Dragons are probably at her mercy though, same with the other class types, although those other classes can at least equip the appropriate Shield skills. She also doesn't get that effective damage on the enemy phase, although at the very least she actually can have an enemy phase since her weapon works on both phases. The literally free debuff neutralization (straight up without any condition) and the Special accel is nice though.

Her Swift Slice actually states that it deals effective damage against "all weapon types", not "all movement types", so things like Iote's Shield and Dew Dragonstone won't protect against her effective damage, but things like Sothis' personal breaths and Garon's Breath of Blight will.

In that case, then damn, it probably is pretty hard to avoid her effective damage. Then yeah, I would say she qualifies, and it's also probably rather ironic (or fitting, I haven't actually played her game, I just know Shez and Byleth are enemies or something) that Sothis can avoid her effective damage.

She really does have tons of B slot options because of her weapon being the way it is, like Spiral 4 as you mentioned, Tempo to ensure her Specials fire off, Desperation for quadruple strikes, Vantage or Spd Preempt to give her an enemy phase, or her own innate Seal Spd 4 to help her meet the Spd checks.

1I've been thinking as much. I'm also sure Takumi is nowhere near that scary, and Kagero...

Frankly, I think the only ones that fit are Hector, Reinhardt (and maybe the Brave weapons), Bridal Cordelia (and even she's a "maybe"), the dancers, and possibly the -blade tomes. The others are more like "strong, but not THAT strong".

Horse Emblem seems pretty up there, too. The Brave versions of Ike and maybe Lyn and Roy also seem like they might get to stay once they've had their experience in the meta.

My impressions of 'Game Breaker' is 'something that impacts the very way you play the game'. All teams pack something to deal with Hector and/or Reinhardt. Dancers and blades are common finds on any Arena team outside maybe the whales (who use armours and dragons for high BST), and Dancers cut the difficulty of GH Bs and other such challenges in half. Units like Effie and Kagero...

Yeah, this is a total mess. I say we keep only Reinhardt, Hector, Bridelia, Takumi (as a note about how he used to be before Inheritance), bladetomes, dancers, and Horse/Flier Emblem. The Brave units should be allowed to settle in the meta before they're included (remember when Quadsuna was going to be meta-defining?). The rest of these range from units that are just more useful than the norm to complete nonsense (how is the entire umbrella of movement skills gamebreaking?) Maybe also the Death Blow/Brave weapon combo.

Ryoma should stay.

If we're keeping Reinhardt and Hector, both of whom are very dangerous in their own right, Ryoma should remain as well. He's the pinnacle of sword users after all, and even if most sword users have fallen out of favour for blues, Ryoma still remains as a pretty prominent threat.

Source: I hover around Tier 18 to Tier 20 and I still see Ryoma pretty often, just as often as I see Reinhardt and Hector.

That also being said, I really do think Brave Lyn is a Game-Breaker if Bridal Cordelia is being kept.

She's basically Bridal Cordelia on a horse, with 2 less Atk, but with a unique weapon that gives her 3 more Spd. And full cavalry teams, or Horse Emblem, is quite a powerful type of team. She could also run the Brave Bow+ or Firesweep Bow+ just as well as if not better than Bridal Cordelia. In other words, she could be seen as a physical, colourless Reinhardt.

That said... the Arena season only did just start, so maybe we should give it a bit to see how well she'd fare, alongside the other Brave units.

Ryoma is just a very good sword. He's not unique or meta-defining in the slightest. People don't build teams around Ryoma, they slot him to make sure they have a Hector killer. You shouldn't have added him back on your own without getting any agreement, since that's courting an edit war.

Also pretty sure the best course with Brave Lyn and the rest of the CYL units is to just wait a bit and see where the meta is in two weeks, because there's been plenty of times where a unit who was expected to be game-changing didn't end up making that big of a splash.

Ryoma's been removed.

Some entry that could have made it imo:

Skills and Mechanics - "Breath Skill": This is definitely one of the most broken skill in the game and really a huge chunk of the reason why Distant Counter weapon is still relevant(otherwise you would just run Slayer DC) and many players attributed this to the half of why Dragons are broken. I guess descriptions would center around their ability to cheat out special damage, and its combo with Dragon and Armor(its alvailable on Infantry, but its not too broken there far as i know partyly because most DC infantry is underwhelming atm, and they started to branch out towards Killer Spam)

H!Jakob: He's honestly way better B Cordelia, for example, his primary mobility flaw can be fixed by Armored Boots and they essentially shares offensive specs(35 ATK, Bold Fighter guaranteed doubles). I know some entry here is outdated and retained for documentation purpose(e.g. Bike isn't really all that broken now) but Jakob is still considered one of the few OP unit atm

Also thoughts on Wrath vs Special Spiral, in case of Wrath as an entry? Both of them are basically "enchances special by 2 Tier" skill but im not sure how they compares. Wrath is basically one of those ability that got a huge amount of uses mainly on Killer Infantry builds though(since Armors tend to prefer the Fighter skills) outside the first 2 Hector since they can dish out silly amount of damage with Berserk Armads

Notably on Hector(s) Special Spiral Ignis... 3 CD -> 2 CD Wrath -> Special Spiral have the same damage-range as Wrath Bonfire, with Wrath advantage being its ability to give the damage bonus on first combat

Salvage Blow as sub-entry on healer?: Most Healer build is usually Pain/Gravity + double Salvage Blow right? The idea is you always take Dazzling and then run Salvage Blow which allows almost every healer to do shenanigans.

Also we're basically bound to make entry for Flying Healer soon due to having the best form of mobility. All one of them(Flying Healer advantage over Horse is the existence of Dancer Flier, notably most have Hone Flier built in)

Edit: Whoops

Edit: Also whoops.

I think Veronica is a good mounted powerhouse kind of unit, basically gets Flow and Tempo, counterattack denial, and at the very least, should get two attacks in before the foe can retaliate, so she should be able to fire off Enclosure pretty easily. Embla on the other hand I can see being a good support unit, ironically enough, since she's able to disable her foes from getting any support themselves. Good combatant, and essentially has full Null Follow-Up between her weapon and B skill, Guard, and also Tempo, but I think her main draw is being able to stop Save skills which is just huge, considering how many teams rely on it. Since it activates at the start of the turn it feels like it's hard to avoid unless they make a seasonal Elimine or another False Start user, or just standing outside of Embla's range, but then you run into the problem where say, two Emblas could cover an entire map.

Also, I did a write up on Arcane weapons a little down below, added it, then removed it when I saw that you also did write ups about it. Then I couldn't post anything for a while for... reasons. I kept my write up more general (since we now know for sure they are all -1 Special at least, and usually +5 to all stats), whereas yours lists specific units. Which one should we go with? And we should probably bring up Arcane Eclipse too, with Rearmed Ophelia. Arcane Eclipse is a red tome with the standard effects (-1 Special, +5 all stats), has Quickened Pulse built in, a guaranteed follow-up attack, and I believe you can also neutralize any penalties to Atk, so the intent is to turn any red mage into a Special spammer with Special Spiral, especially with Ophelia's new Special Spiral 4 which does +5 damage and ignores non special Damage Reduction.

Arcane Eclipse by itself pretty much focuses on nuking the enemy with a strong special on the first battle, but it also gets hard-countered by Brave Adult Tiki, Ascended Young Tiki and Halloween Duma & Mila's weapons inflicting +1 special cooldown before the foe's first attack. Otherwise, turning many strong mages, especially slow ones, into walking nukes like Regular Lysithea is nothing to sneeze at, especially if the unit can somehow also inherit Special Spiral 4 and Atk/Res Finish 4.

I would go with the more generalist route of the entries since going into details is going to add bloat to the entry, and that was a major problem in the Tier Induced Scrappy page when I was adding entries there.

Agreed with everything, I think this is actually the tamest Ninja banner yet, not that these units are weak, but Ninja Lyn and Ninja Corrin were just so game breakingly strong. Laegjarn will be strong but not being colourless like Lynja and not having the mobility of Corrin probably hurts her a bit in that regard.

For Yune, she basically gets a huge debuff range now doesn't she? Since it's a Spectrum Chill and Panic that splashes onto nearby foes, and she doesn't even need to met any checks, she simply has to exist. That huge range also feels very chaotic and thematically fitting. Then if she needs to fight, I've seen some pretty impressive stuff, since as you said she's not invulnerable (Deadeye and Lethality will pierce through that DR easily) but without such abilities and without Null Follow-Up she might actually hurt a bit.

As for the Arcane weapons I think they'll probably get their own section under skills and mechanics since these Rearmed Heroes aren't just great for their weapons, but their ability to pass on all sorts of skills, and with an extra copy, they can do it all again.

Yune's refine effects also count panic stat-debuffs, meaning while difficult, it's possible to have 100% reduction and some crazy true damage.

Both remixed units are support units with some bite at least.

With the Rearmed Ganglot and More banner, Ganglot, while she doesn't bring a Secret Art, makes up for it with premium skills, with Distant Stance, Quick Riposte 4 and Joint Dist. Guard. A lot of slow enemy phase units would really like the Distant Stance and Quick Riposte 4 alongside Arcane Downfall, while Lightning Bruisers would just go with the Distant Stance and Arcane Downfall.

I think I'm ready for a write-up with the Arcane weapons now under the Skills and Mechanics folder.

Edit: Did a write up here, but I wasn't sure on the direction I made the entries:

Uh, shoot, I wrote something up and added it and didn't realize you already had a write up. I took it down and we should probably go with yours, but I'm gonna post mine anyway if you wanted to see:

• Arcane Weapons, introduced with Rearmed Heroes in late 2022, are powerful weapons that have -1 Special, and up to a few different effects to give the unit an edge in battle. These weapons can be inherited from a Rearmed Hero to any other unit that's applicable ^* Arcane Grima can only be inherited by dragons for instance, and if you inherit an Arcane weapon onto a new unit, that unit can't equip it and any unique skills they have at the same time, and the Rearmed Hero will not disappear, letting you keep them to still play around with. If you summon for another copy of the Rearmed Hero, you can also inherit from the first copy (using up the Arcane inheritance), then merge to the new copy, and then the new copy will be able to inherit to another unit, letting you transfer over the weapon again and up to three rare skills.
  • Arcane Éljúðnir, granted from Rearmed Lif, is a Sword that inflicts -6 Atk/Def on the foe, grants the user a follow-up attack, and lets the user deny the opponent's follow-up attack. This turns any sword wielder into an Omnibreaker tank. Slow units get to take advantage of their bulk, while faster units can use the free follow-up attack as a pseudo Null Follow-Up, either way, freeing up the B slot for something else.
  • Arcane Grima, from, well, Rearmed F Grima, is a Breath that grants +5 to all stats, allows the user to make a guaranteed follow-up attack, deal damage equal to 15% of the user's Atk, and it restores 7 HP to the user after combat. It's a pretty general purpose Breath for most dragons, with a straightforward damage boost, follow-up, and healing for good measure, giving your unit better self sustain. With the follow-up in the weapon, dragons get their B slot also freed up for the various dragon exclusive skills to use at their disposal.
  • Arcane Downfall, inherited from Ganglot, is an Axe that grants +5 to all stats, denies the foe from a follow-up attack, grants the user Special accel per both their attacks and their foe's, similarly to Special Fighter, and it restores 7 HP to the user per hit during combat. This is a pretty defensive axe in nature, protecting you from being doubled, while also restoring HP to keep your tanky axe unit topped off. It's not too bad offensively either however, as the Special accel and -1 Special means that your units can retaliate back with something like Bonfire or Iceberg, or it can help you charge Galeforce pretty quickly.

Halloween Duo Duma & Mila I can see being added because of the reasons you listed. Halloween Female Corrin however I don't see dethroning her Legendary variant yet (although her placement now is becoming more questionable with every new dragons released, especially with the release of the Dist. Counter (D) Sacred Seal), since Legendary Female Corrin is Colorless over Halloween Female Corrin, but she is still worth an addition.

I'm a bit unsure about Ninian precisely for those reasons in the latter half of that, like, you have to time that Extra Turn so that you can make the most of it because otherwise you're waiting three turns to take advantage of it again. I think if you were able to decide when you want to give her that Extra Turn (to say, refresh, take care of a troublesome opponent, then retreat), it'd be better, but the point about dealing with Damage Reduction are unfortunately points against her too.

So I'm a maybe, although she is a good support unit at least, and being a dragon, she can equip stuff like Goad or Ward Dragons to support other dragons, the Def and Res debuff directly benefits dragons since they can hit either defensive stat, and she can be fielded alongside beasts and still let 'em transform. As a combatant she's got good, even niche and anti meta effects (considering say, Ascended Idunn and Brave Hector who can't retaliate against her), but she probably doesn't pack as much of a punch as she should.

I feel like Deirdre's once per map Miracle is a bit of a detriment towards her because that'd only work once, whereas other Miracle effects can at least work multiple times if the user can stay healthy enough. I'm also not sure if the Atk and Res swing, while quite substantial, would be enough to save her from being a Squishy Wizard.

Julia on the other hand, I can see being a good mage Dodge Tank. Julia's Damage Reduction should be more consistent because she's putting her Res to good use, she ignores her debuffs and her foe's buffs so that's taken out of the equation (and can really impair foes that rely on such effects), and she inflicts -5 to all stats on the foe for an even greater stat swing. Close Counter against dragons is just the icing on top, because it all basically means she can enemy phase dragons or other mages, or she can player phase nuke things out of orbit while keeping herself safe with Light and Dark II and the damage reduction.

So I'd say no to Deirdre but yes to Julia under the Dodge Tank section personally.

As for Rearmed Lif that now begs the question, should Rearmed Heroes be added by their own merits first, then mention how useful their inheritable weapons are? Should there just be a section for Rearmed Heroes and just mention their inheritable weapons and good inheritors? Or should they just go under any existing sections like say, Lif's sword in particular would turn any sword wielder into an Omnibreaker tank. This would depend a bit more on when we get more Rearmed Heroes into the game of course, but I'm wondering how this should be handled.

For Rearmed Heroes, it depends on how impactful the Rearmed Hero themself is. Currently with Rearmed Lif, he's not going to dethrone the best Sword Cavaliers due to Deadly Balance not being a great mixed-phase skill, no Canto on both his personal weapon (for obvious reasons with inheritance) and Deadly Balance (it was first released before Canto was a thing), needs assistance to make Atk/Def Clash 4 work, and he get shut down by some meta units that have Null Follow-Up and Tempo-like effects, but on the otherhand Arcane Eljudnir is a fantastic skill for inheritance as it at least ups the tiers of Sword units that had not much going for them.

In my opinion, let's put them into a separate folder that details the jist of their abilities and gimmicks, put a part on how impactful they will be, and list the best user of their Arcane weapons below. For now, let's hold off on adding them until another Rearmed Hero comes out and see how impactful that unit and their Arcane weapon is.

Since we're taking recent refines some, Caineghis got a rather strong one. 70% Damage reduction on Aoe Specials and follow up strikes, guaranteed follow-up attack, enemy att/def -5 in combat, and a boost to att/def/res based on 25% of the enemy's attack (up to 10). This makes him quite a tank while opening up his B slot for other fighter skills. Not to mention make him nice candite for a save skill.

One point against Caineghis is the transformation requirement (which is not much of a drawback with teambuilding in mind), but otherwise he's now able to compete with Fallen Edelgard as a (Colorless) Beast Armor, whereas before the refine Fallen Edelgard was pretty much the better option in a lot of ways. I say he's worth an add.

So two things to add to the page now: Legendary Julia under Dodge Tanks (which should be renamed to Damage Reduction Tanks to broaden the definition), and Caineghis under the Colorless units Folder. Are we in agreement?

Shouldn't Caineghis be under the Save Tank section? I agree that he's worth an add though, transformation condition aside he's got some really powerful effects, and can indeed stand on his own when compared to Fallen Edelgard. His own Damage Reduction on the first hit makes him kinda similar to Idunn in a way.

Other than that I agree with both, and I also rewrote the Dodge Tank section to be more general instead. I think I wanted to classify it as [Dodge] because that's what it's called ingame, but [Dodge] ingame also specifically refers to Spd based Damage Reduction, of which Brave Dimitri and now Legendary Julia do not use.

Caineghis has good Mixed-phase potential with the guaranteed follow-up and penalty infliction with his unique refine, but then again the refined based effect is more Enemy-phase orientated, especially with the AOE damage reduction. Yeah, he belongs in Save Tank section.

I think Byleth and Lysithea are maybes, they're essentially both mage nukes and Byleth is pretty unique with her Vantage effect, but that also means she's very susceptible to Hardy Bearing. Actually that kind of applies to Lysithea as well. Although I think Lysithea probably has the higher damage potential, and her 1 HP chip damage can potentially open up Ardent Sacrifice and Reciprocal Aid strategies in Aether Raids.

Chrom and Seliph absolutely yes, I've used both enough now and they've both since very proven themselves to be powerful and they both have incredible, unique effects. Chrom being able to take his ally's status effects and get even stronger has been a lot of fun, and he's just gonna age better as the game goes on and we get more status effects available. Seliph on the other hand, while a prime mounted powerhouse, could also potentially be very fun with double Mystic Boost (or Flow Refresh, even if the anti follow-up denial is a bit redundant with his C skill) because his Miracle effect is based on 25% of his HP. He has 40 HP at base and two Mystic Boosts would heal for 12 HP, making him almost invincible, although getting either skill as the B skill is pretty rare. Worth an add to mounted powerhouses though at least since that does fit his playstyle best.

Claude and Dimitri also yes. Claude basically has everything he needs: more stats, the offense based parts of Null Follow-Up and Tempo, and Damage Reduction for good measure. Sounds like a good mounted powerhouse but I think he's versatile enough to function as a tank as well, especially when paired with Close Counter and either Atk or Spd Smoke 4. I've even used him that way, and he can also kind of emulate his Legendary version despite not having Fallen Star, but instead he almost always gets to stay topped off with his healing and his ability to counteract Fatal Smoke now. Meanwhile Dimitri's Damage Reduction is kind of insane, I've seen him withstand attacks that he normally has no business living, and as of right now effects that pierce through his true defense (ie the same as Askr, who is already on the Sandbox page, and Spring Maria) are pretty rare. I think the only thing that holds Dimitri back a bit is his lack of -1 Special but I think the rest of his effects make up for it.

Edit: never mind.

She's already under the "Omnibreaker tanks" archetype under the Types of units. If you mean by an individual entry, while she can shut down units that rely on instant specials like Time's Pulse/2 cooldown special with -1 max cooldown, she unfortunately has a few common counters that can take her down without even using specials and ignore her follow-up manipulation effects and sometimes her Damage Reduction as well, such as Brave and Legendary Marth, Legendary Nanna, and Ascended Mareeta.

Yeah... I feel you there, that's why I haven't really partaken in any discussion in the past long while because it really feels like every few weeks there's some super duper busted unit with a billion effects.

I think we should probably wait for Choose Your Legends (and the Choose Your Legends 4 refines) this year before discussing things some more though, since I have a feeling both groups will also set the standard for super units from there on out.

That said, there is one unit that does deserve mention: Duo Chrom is a complete menace in any mode, is incredibly powerful, and his To Change Fate! and Special charging effect will always be helpful. I feel like he's the one unit that most people would probably agree would make the cut owing to both his power, his support, and his viability in most if not all modes. I think he's probably one of if not the most powerful unit we've had this year so far.

I've just been busy with work and writing up entries (being the only one) takes some time.

I can safely say L!.Alm's remix/refine gave him renewed relevance as a tank buster. His refine has an easy +10 to Att/Spd (5 by attacking or having an ally within two spaces and 5 from having more than 25 percent HP). The latter condition is tied to an anti-guard effect. If the enemy is physical and their speed +5 is lower than his speed, they can't counter.

Lunar Flash II has a Deadeye effect while having a cooldown of 2. The other new skill is Times Pulse 3, which added will drop the cooldown to one. This sets up a flow of attacks that has the first attack trigger the defensive special while the second special attack strikes them full force. And skills that add to both Att and Spd can make him better.

Since CYL 6 has been released, let's get this discussion going:

Alongside some additions, there are some units and unit types here that do not stand the tests of time, while some need some moving as well. Let's leave the CYL 6 and CYL 4 refines out first to clean up the page.

In short here's my opinion on what needs to be changed and reasoning:

I think Brave Roy/Eliwood should get a rewrite rather than a removal. It's true that Galeforce Cavs are more common now, but Steady Impact and (Player Phase-only) Special Fighter are still two very strong effects to have baked into a weapon, especially on a class that doesn't normally have them. And while I can't speak for B!Roy, Eliwood having a Resplendent version keeps his statline strong (though this depends on if pay-to-win options are legally classifiable as game breakers).

That aside, I have no issues with any other of jayscribble's judgments. I was going to suggest Ymir for Support, but aside from preventing oneshots, her Miracle effect and her capacity as a unit are both shockingly balanced. I was also expecting the need to (somewhat begrudgingly) slate Phina for removal, but a high-Atk Dancer with a dual-eff Vantage weapon is still proving to be a timeless combo.

I was thinking Types of Units should be expanded to include, well, the various types of units that people use nowadays.

Optimized Save tanks could all go under one category because they all have the same job of being a Save tank, but it's their capabilities that make them strong. Brave Hector and Ascended Idunn can both boast their lack of armour weakness, Robin, Rhea, and Fjorm have some form of Damage Reduction and healing, with the latter even having Null C-Disrupt. It'd be stuff like the Edelgards that would remain in the general folders because they can do more than Save tank, they can Galeforce like no other.

Same would go for the godsword archetype, your Legendary Dimitri and Fallen Ike and the like. Powerful, speedy infantry with Damage Reduction but they're usually held back by the lack of innate Null Follow Up, which is probably the most important part for any godsword. Brave Marth does have that, but he's sort of held back by the fact that it's buff dependent (which stuff like Panic or Dull can disrupt). That'd be why Ascended Mareeta (who I believe is currently one of the greatest ones) would still remain in the general folders because she has huge Damage Reduction, but with Null Follow Up in her weapon, and a very easy activation of just existing (ie 25% HP), and her precharge and Special Spiral effect, she almost always has Vital Astra's effect active, but the precharging can also help with Galeforce.

Then the cavs (and some fliers) are a bit trickier, because we've gotten some really, really good ones in the past while, including Brave Chrom and Brave Seliph. We could have a general "units with built in Canto" section, but there's also a lot of those too, and some of them can be devastatingly powerful. Having a section just for Canto itself and some units who can really do this is probably best, or maybe some kind of "mounted units with Canto and/or some form of Null Follow Up" built in? Since that applies to Brave Seliph, Legendary Xander, Legendary Nanna, and so on. Units like these all have some form of getting past follow up denial, which is the most important part for offensive Null Follow Up users.

Basically, I feel like we've seen the same few archetypes of premium units over the past like, year or two. If you're a tank, you're most likely an armour with Save. If you're a speedy infantry, you most likely have Damage Reduction and maybe something else, Null Follow Up if you're lucky. If you're a mounted unit, you probably have Canto and some method of getting past follow up denial, and you're most likely a Lightning Bruiser or a Glass Cannon of some kind. It all sort of starts to blend together. Under the Types of Units folder would be examples of such units. Let's see if I remember post formatting. Something like:

• Save Tanks. [blah blah blah, description of Save skills and what they do]
  • Ascended Idunn and Brave Hector, because blah blah blah lack of armour weakness
  • Fallen Rhea and Valentine's Robin because Damage Reduction and healing
  • Ascended Fjorm because Null C-Disrupt, Damage Reduction, and healing, blah blah blah

• Dodge Tanks. [blah blah blah description of the Spd based Dodge skills and a few units that stand out with their capabilities]
  • Legendary Dimitri because Atrocity and whatever

• Mounted powerhouses. [blah blah blah description of mounted units that either have Canto built in, half of or full Null Follow up, or other skills that are accessible on a unit type that normally can't get it]
  • Brave Seliph, because Miracle, 4 Mov, so on and so on

With more details, obviously, but stuff like that.

If there are any units that I feel like at the very least set the standard for their role or class and deserve to be in the general folders, right now, it's Ascended Mareeta, Duo Chrom, and Duo Thorr at the very least, owing to their unique effects, capabilities, and usefulness in any mode. I'm sure another super swordmaster will eventually take Ascended Mareeta's place, but I think she stands at the top as of right now, while Duo Chrom and Duo Thorr are unlike anything we've seen and have proven themselves (with Chrom's Special charging Assist and power and Grand Strategy, while Thorr can remove buffs and also kind of Ao E spam, but also support with Worldbreaker and her weapon's Exposure and Stall effects).

tl;dr: I would consolidate the Types of Units section to try and encapsulate the few archetypes of strong units we've got, and the units in the regular folders are ones that can break the mold, set the standard for their type, are unique in their capabilities, and/or are just that damn good in any mode. I believe Ascended Mareeta, Duo Chrom, and Duo Thorr to be such units.

Putting up archetypes of units would be a good start since it will create less clutter as well as future proof for units that fit the mold while those who stand out or just not fits in the archetypes will have their own entries, so let's go with your suggestion.

• Save Tanks. The Save skill, introduced on the Valentine's 2021 banner, allows an armoured unit to take the place of an ally whenever they're under attack. Far Save lets the unit protect their allies from ranged attacks, while Near Save does the same but for melee attacks. Ever since then, armoured units have mostly shifted into this role, protecting the team from harm. While any armoured unit can be built up to be a Save tank, the following units go above and beyond in what they can do, often having multiple effects that let them stand up to just about anything and everything:
• Dodge Tanks. Dodge refers to the Spd based Damage Reduction skills like Spurn or Close Call, and these are usually locked to infantry units, although some units of other class types either have this built into their weapon, or can acquire the effect with Spd Smoke 4. Some units and skills also check different stats, like Res. These units are usually very fast, and but usually don't have the greatest defenses (unless they're Res based), but the Dodge effect helps keep them safe while their weapons often give them many other effects to play with to take on their opponents. The following units are some notable examples that perform very well against many foes:
• Mounted powerhouses. These usually refer to cavalry or flying units that are meant to be player phase monsters, often having Canto for Hit-and-Run Tactics, some Flow or Null Follow-Up effect that lets them get past follow-up denial, other effects that their class type normally can't acquire like easy Special acceleration or some kind of Damage Reduction, and so on. These units have some combination of the aforementioned, usually built into their weapon, sometimes a unique B skill. The following units are often able to ride up to their opponents without fear and go to town:

How does that sound for the archetype descriptions so far? Dodge Tanks could also refer to dragons with high Res and Dragon Wall (or unique versions) so I made sure to include that too.

All of them sound good, but I also have another suggestion:

• Units that have high mobility and Extra Turns to themselves. These usually refer to units that have have high mobility and can get Extra Turns with their skills, usually Galeforce with special acceleration, without the aid of Dancers or Duo/Harmonized Skills, since they can take down one extra enemy and/or perform Hit-and-Run Tactics, but with the aid of Dancers and Duo/Harmonized Skills they have the potential to perform a Total Party Kill. The following units are notable examples that are able to do this feat:

This is meant to umbrella units like Regular Tibarn due to being a Flying Beast, any strong Cavalry units because of mobility, Legendary, Brave and Valentine Chrom because of To Change Fate! and A Fate Changed! shenanigans, and Summer Harmonized Edelgard & Altina because of their Raging Storm and Assault Troops. Thoughts?

The thing is, I feel like the Chroms (or at least Duo Chrom) and the Edelgards, while they fall under that category, are capable of much more than that. Brave Edelgard for instance, while not having Raging Storm, still has excellent mobility and can Galeforce like no other, while Duo Chrom's Extra Turn is also supportive in nature. Yet both are also still capable of Save tanking and nuking respectively.

However, I realize that that criteria you wrote perfectly describes the Duo Ninjas, Lyn and Corrin. Both have great mobility, both have a Duo skill that grants them an Extra Turn, and both are also either used for Hit-and-Run Tactics or are usually used as part of a Galeforce chain thanks to Fury stacking and Wings of Mercy allies.

Medeus' "bubble" is very useful for enabling high Fury builds and ignoring bolt towers, another point in his favor.

I put Yuri in support as he needs some work to have offensive power compared to his bag of tricks. Sure he can pick off soft targets, but Ash and other tanky units would just laugh.

I don't think Brave Alm deserves to be gamebreaking (high tier TIS sure) due to recoil and no DC.

Likewise for A.Fjorm as she won't hold up well against red melee or powerful ranged brave magic. And that's not getting into things that can disable or interfere with her special cycles.

Hatari Karla's true damage also kicks in on Ao E specials, which is what makes her stand out.

I can see Ymir being under support as drive miracle is a powerful thing

I've been meaning to add Winter/Harmonic Lysteria (Lyst + Canto + Easy Easy Brave effect

Another archetype I thought of:

• Omnibreaker Tanks. These are units who have abilities that can both allow them to get a free follow up attack while also denying the opponent's folow up attack.

More details would be added after that but such examples would include Medeus, Halloween Rhea, Brave Tiki, and probably a few others. Actually those are the only ones that come to mind, but we could see more of that as the game goes on.

Since we're nearing the release of CYL 4 refines, I think it's time to actually put things into motion and not just put suggestions up. I've made a Sandbox here and already started with it with everyone's suggestion in mind, so when we're all satisfied with how things are laid out we can put those changes to the main page.

Once we finish updating everything there, then we can go on with the CYL 6 units and CYL 4 refines.

I went and overhauled the Skills and Mechanics section (it really seemed to drag on for a bit), and added a few of the archetypes under Types of Units. I kind of just listed a few names and then left that part blank for now, then I moved Eliwood/Brave Roy and Pirate Tibarn under the mounted powerhouses, while also trying to condense their entries as much as I could. I also went and added Ascended Mareeta. Still a work in progress, but at least it's something for now.

Tempted to suggest L.Caeda for being a counter to Glass cannon Cavs as very few have much in the way of defense.

There are thing going for and against her.

For her she has Canto 2, Cavalry and Armor effectiveness, steals bonuses from her foe, default Close Salvo, anti-follow-up prevention, and Vantage when either after she enters combat or the foe is a Cav or Armor unit.

Against her there a good amount of tanky units currently in the game that can initiate on her and survive a hit, even Cav units, she will fold against strong Bow units that have Windsweep-like effects, even the now-outdated Brave Lyn, and Save unit are generally the better option for those who can counterattack at range and tank against hits.

If she has at least one more thing going for her then she could be added, but at the moment her kit has one thing going for her with a few random things added, sometimes not enough to make her stand head above shoulders against other fliers, especially with Brave Female Byleth doing a more consistent version of Caeda's gimmick.

I think she has potental as she ombines true damage and constant desperation. Only catch is her inability to deal with certain few tanks (coughBHectorcough) due to being unable to prevent their counterattack.

L.Caeda is a hard counter.

That'd require some time to really see how well it actually works. It doesn't help that sources of them aren't exactly common.

Well Stance and Reversal should be fine to add in since they're just strict upgrades. Pressure, Storm, and Salvo are a bit more hit or miss since they have recoil though

I’m on the fence tbh because yeah her physical bulk is absolutely insane and flat damage reductions means you can’t deal with her using true damage, but she also has a terrible health pool and comparatively underwhelming res and while her player phase is kind of absurd, Flow Flight being player phase only kind of makes her enemy phase lacking in comparison

Said damage reduction doesn't apply to Ao E attacks. L.Lilina seem a nigh hard counter

Definitely agree with Yuri. While he had potential in AR-O, summoner duels really made him shine and made it clear how strong he was

Kind of eh on the others aside from maybe Ash. All are good but not game breaking imo, but with Ash, mythic with super guidance is really strong and new infantry beast effect also makes her a solid combat unit if necessary. Volke is real strong on paper but haven’t seen enough of him in practice to really judge

Duo Chrom and Elimine are also worth an add imo. Duo Chrom for being L!Chrom but with more instant Deadeye potential and auto follow up with his absurd attack and Elimine for being better Flayn and False Start just shutting down an absurd amount of things

Yuri I can agree with, since Canto 2, +1 movement and Foul Play makes him a great mobility support unit that no other unit can achieve to the same degree, as well as having great options to make him unpredictable, especially in Summoner Duels. I say he counts.

Ash (and Summer Tana with her refined Fruit of Idunn) also allows great mobility, but trades allies going far for bypassing walls, while also having the bulk the auto follow-ups if she is needed in combat. I also say she counts (and maybe Summer Tana as well mostly as a Support unit, with Flier mobility and all).

Duo Chrom I have to agree to be worth adding in. Setting up Deadeye every turn, and decreasing special charges for other allies as well is nothing to scoff at, and his Armor effectiveness on his Bow makes him a great unit against units like Ascended Fjorm and Fallen Edelgard.

Elimine I also have to agree to being worth adding as well as a Support unit, since False Start shuts down many things before the foe can even move, and not even Odd/Even Recovery can help them, as well having +4 Def/Res on top of the 30% damage reduction makes her one of the best support units in the game. The only thing that can really shut her down is C Feud, Inpenetrable Dark and similar effects, but that's few and far between.

Astrid, Volke and Ascended Laegjarn I can see potential, but nothing really gamebreaking, since Astrid and her ally gets shut down by Isolation and her target ally gets shut down by Stall as well, Volke needs to have Lethality to go off to be effective, but taking a counterattack from a foe first is what is holding him back, especially from Fallen Edelgard, and Ascended Laegjarn needs buffs to work and therefore needs setup, but otherwise has good potential if she's running Windsweep, but has to lose Canto in the process.

Alright, I'll go and look up some other candidates, though one'd be Harmonic Lysithea. Typical statline (high attack/spd), but mounted. Her weapon gives her Att/Spd+6, special cooldown acceleration (thus 1cd moonbow), and depending on the speed advantage, desperation (9 or less) or Brave (10 or more). A slot is swift sparrow 3 which gives even more Att/Spd, B is A/R Far Trace 3, and C is C Feud 3 (not as notable, but helpful against certain colorless units, be it Falynn or F.Edelgard). The Harmonic effect may be icing on the cake. On top of the "harmonic blades" effect, They and all units from their series (which has a great number of strong units each) get +6 Att and bonus doubler. Under ideal conditions, they'd have 71 att and 53 spd and with the harmonic effect, 87 Att and at least 57 Speed. She'd paste most units that can come close to her speed and for slower tankier foes? 4 Attacks with two of them being moonbows when one normal and a moonbow would certainly kill most.

Also Duo Chrom really synergizes with unity effects (trigger them and the effect stacks with them) and has given rise to triple unity builds with F.Ike and L.Marth (post refine).

Harmonic Lysithea as well as Duo Corrin are probably worth adds just on the basis of essentially being Reinhardt but fast/Olwen but with an attack stat.

Winter Harmonic Lysithea and Ninja Duo Corrin I can agree to be worth an add. Too bad about Spring Severa's Gullinkambi's Egg needing someone to attack first during the same turn to double attack making her lag behind those two in terms of consistency, not to mention that she has a lower default Atk stat than those two.

As far as actual performance goes, do want to see stats, but he’ll probably be a more optimized Y!Merric which will be solid by default. Can’t do pair up math atm, but Sublime Heaven does 34 damage which puts his in combat attack at 68 and since weapon and combat boosts are both at 14, that puts his pair up base attack at 40 meaning his actual attack is in the high 30s

Even with there being a speed check though, drive NFU is honestly an auto add to support though

Also he basically directly counters at least one version of all the house leaders and Seiros which is incredible

The thing is he and all his allies can also run Wind/Watersweep to prevent counterattacks while also making sure that they can get possible follow-up attacks. At the very least, he's an add as a Support unit, but with instant Sublime Heaven thanks to Time's Pulse at the start of his turn, he's worth an add just as a unit in general.

Off note, but he was made not only to counter Fallen Edelgard, but also all forms of Edelgard, Dimitri and Claude with his Professorial Text, Sublime Heaven, and Time's Pulse, assuming he has very high Spd.

Stats are out, with Legendary Male Byleth having 40 HP, 39 Atk, 41 Spd, 25 Def, and 21 Res. A very good offensive statline, but weak on the defenses, especially on Res. At the very least, he can act like a Green Regular Lysithea, but anyone surviving his Sublime Heaven and can counterattack would take him down easily.

I think he might be worth an add for the Support folder then, if only because drive Null Follow-Up is that powerful. He himself is a great combatant but I feel like he'd mostly be fielded to be counterplay to the more devastating units right now (mostly Fallen Edelgard), which is something a good support unit would be able to do, like how one could field Phina or festival Micaiah for both refreshing purposes and armour busting.

His defense is much better than it appears for his speed since it’s like 40 or 42 depending on if Ideal is fully activated, but also he can Windsweep NFU so I guess that doesn’t matter THAT much. In any case as a combatant, don’t think it’s significant enough to warrant a dedicated non support entry and should just join the group under NFU

Support folder certainly, but definitely not a general-purpose game breaker. Int Sys seems to think Lyleth would've been much meaner than he actually is, given that his Legendary Hero Battle is really easy. I've already seen several runs of Fallen Edelgard (the unit he's supposed to counter) soloing his Abyssal map just by not letting him hit back.

The NFU support, on the other hand, is amazing. It cannot be stressed enough how bad NFU is as a B Skill simply because it locks a unit out of B Skills that they need more. Having NFU without meddling with the weapon or the B slot is incredible, especially with how many units that deny/guarantee follow-ups nowadays.

There is the fact that humans use characters better than the AI, the real hurdle in such battles is not overextending yourself in attacking. But yeah compared to F.Edelgard (whose presence can bork a voting gauntlet run if you lack a counter character), an AI-L.Byleth isn't that bad.

If Legendary Male Byleth is considered a game breaker, I think it's fair to say that the recent female variant also qualifies due to her unconditional Drive Null Guard.

Eh I'm on the fence. I mean he's really good especially considering he's a grail unit, but aside from availability, he doesn't really bring anything else unique to the table and omnitanking hasn't been quite as effective in the recent meta along. That said, the fact that he actually has availability compared to anyone else that can do Dodge/NFU is a huge ass boon

Yeah I’m willing to agree. Basically gets a free +20 to all stats that can’t be panicked, speed based Firesweep, and omni breaker which is essentially NFU with his statline.

I’d also say Ninja Corrin and H!Leif are worth additions personally as long as Rein and L!Leif are here since Ninja Corrin is just fast Green Reinhardt that also has true damage while H!Leif is his legendary self but fast in exchange for no Dual Phase or Impact if running Brave or Ninja bow or free Miracle if using his prf

I can see both having potential, though on the L.Marth matter, hilarity with sticking bonus doubler (the skill, Astrid who'll also boost his movement via her bow's effects on Rally skills) can happen.

I'm honestly kind of iffy on giving her a specific mention outside of the Save section. She does have clear advantages to the other Far Save units with her having built in Null C, an actual speed stat, and being nigh impossible to one shot with Ice Mirror active, but she also has her own issues like being more susceptible to brave effects, Pulse Smoke/Melancholy/special charge denial, and basically all her bulk being from her special in comparison to B!Hector/Henriette having actual bulk.

You just forgot Legendary Micaiah: Radiant Queen, a colorless tome legendary hero of August 2021. Her stats without Fury 4 are 33 HP/42 Atk/31 Spd/19 Def/41 Res with the BST of 171. Her weapon, New Dawn, grants her Atk+3 and it has effective damage against Armored and Cavalry Units similar to her previous alts. If unit initiates combat or if unit is within 2 spaces of an ally, grants Atk/Res+6 during combat and unit makes a guaranteed follow-up attack. If unit's HP ≤ 50% and unit initiates combat, unit can make a follow-up attack before foe can counterattack, similar to Desperation that comes well with her A skill. Her A skill Fury 4, grants her +4 on all four stats in exchange of losing 8 HP whenever she attacks or gets attacked by an enemy. She has an exclusive skill, Prescience, an exclusive skill that inflicts Atk/Res-5 on foe during combat. If unit initiates combat or if foe's Range = 2, reduces damage from foe's first attack by 30%. And Joint Distant Guard, a fourth tier upgrade of Distant Guard that grants Def/Res+4 to allies within 2 spaces during combat against bow, dagger, magic, or staff foes. If unit is within 2 spaces of an ally and foe uses bow, dagger, magic, or staff, grants Def/Res+4 to unit during combat. Finally, her exclusive Assist skill, Maiden's Solace, where it converts penalties on target into bonuses and then neutralizes any 【Penalty】 that remains. Restores HP to target = unit's current HP-1. Reduces unit's HP by amount restored, an upgraded Sacrifice and Harsh Command+. I guess she'll be a perfect fit for a gamebreaker for support purposes.

By default, Marth straight up dethrones Mareeta (and by extension maybe Ryoma) just by stats alone and also having a stronger damaging special and realistically it’s only Ayra, F!Ike, and Kris/Shannan who aren’t completely stuck under his shadow in regards to the mixed phased dualist fast sword role just due to Null Guard and innate unity/immunity to debuffs so he’s adding in place of Mareeta at least by that alone. He does have a glaring panic weakness but he’s still doing what Mareeta can do but better

Eirika I’m also willing to agree with just for how insane her wall breaking abilities are and how devastating her special procs are

As far as ones I definitely agree with, V!Ike, Sothis, Surtr, W!Sothis, Y!Palla, Bladetomes, Emblem Teams (except MAYBE armor because Save Balling), and Bonus Doubler can go.

Kaden/L!Eliwood is slightly iffier with Ashera mitigating the risk, but yeah probably also removable

I'd still say Mila is worth keeping since Isolation still screws with a lot and still messes up turn 1 engages and not like she was here because of any actual combat potential to begin with

I guess part if the issue here is just how different AR meta gets compared to the rest of the game though since the prevalence of Sigurd + Pathfinder/Turn 1 engages makes A LOT no longer viable while most of this stuff will still handle a lot of non AR content no problem

Yeah, Nott cavlines becoming a Tier 0 strategy have done some weird things to AR-O, no dispute there. Probably best not to overcorrect in case some heavy-handed patch comes down in the future on that.

It also occurs to me that L!Alm is a little questionable too, since he's a pure combat archer without cool niches like Y!Innes / L!Claude, and the likes of Ullr are probably better for combat.

Oh look a heavy handed patch of sorts lol

I feel like the combination of this and what appears to be a hero fest featuring Saves and Flayn is reason enough to hold off on the ones that I didn’t fully agree with since I can definitely see a shift towards Save/Armor ball defs in the future and someone like L!Alm for instance will definitely shine more there especially with Flash support

Honestly not really feeling it with Nifl. She seems solid but not gamebreaking and she's kind of just a Kempf that's trading kill power and better ability to run Wind/Watersweep for Pain chipping.

Her unique class is honestly... kind of bad beyond Po L imo just because she's a player phase cav, but also being a dragon robs her of some tools (Galeforce) while none of the dragon exclusive B slots really are going to be great on her with how frail she is even with the damage reduction stacking.

Charlotte is very much a wait for stats type unit

My only issue with Nifl's unique skill is that it's for the first combat, whereas someone like Flayn not only provides healing but is basically permanently active.

This banner overall, Nifl and Charlotte included, just seems pretty tame. Those two are good and I think they'll be strong, and it's finally nice to see Charlotte's regular version in the game after four whole damn years, but I'm also not feeling it with these units.

Stats:

Nifl: 39/38/40/27/23

Charlotte: 48/43/41/25/18

Nyx: 36/42/40/19/28

Orochi: 40/40/24/24/37

Benny: 48/35/23/44/34

Arete: 41/36/27/20/34

Ehh even with how insane those offenses are on Charlotte, I feel like just raw damage isn't enough compared to how the god swords all have some other ability like built in NFU, damage reduction, debuff negation, etc

Yeah don't think anyone really qualifies this time.

Also yay! Benny doesn't have lower BST and jesus christ his defenses are insane for a demote

Also wow Arete is very underwhelming

Something to note about Nyx: when they say her PRF factors in damage reduction from any source, this includes Miracle. There's a twitter video going around where a Lv.1 Nyx Miracle-tanks an Ophelia's Dragon Fang, then counterattacks for 353 damage. ( https://fxtwitter.com/Darktendo_55/status/1417111280889049088?s=19 )

Also, there seems to be a misconception with Nifl: the Damage Reduction from Domain of Ice happens in the first attack of every combat, not just the first round of combat in general (like Armored Wall) or only if the enemy doubles (like Courtly Candle). Unless the enemy is doubling, then Domain of Ice is for all intents and purposes a superior version of Caduceus Staff.

Yeah, Miracle Nyx is pretty absurd, but still unsure tbh just because she’s such a glass cannon and pre charging Miracle even to 4 still takes a lot of skill slots

Karla I’d say no to outside of the general NFU entry. She doesn’t get the same flexibility as the others do since she only is getting atk/spd and gets no other defensive boosts and I think she’ll shine most as a Sweep Nuker since she can stack true damage well and can work from full health which will definitely be good but I don’t think itmd be game breaking on it’s own

L!Ryoma I’d argue as being on the same level as Mareeta now with his only real downside being that he doesn’t get CD reduction (without B!Lucina now anyways) in comparison to her especially since he gets unconditional true damage so I’d probably say have both Mareeta and L!Ryoma or neither

Eirika I think is a better fit just for support. Her needing a duo skill at a point when higher tier AR is full of people running Hinderance makes her own performance so iffy to me since she’ll lack consistency which I think it gonna be the biggest thing here

Ike stays because no one can effectively replicate his unity stacking niche (closest is Dagr who doesn’t have innate DC)

Ayra I’m willing to add since got her refine is kind of stacked. She doesn’t have full dodge+NFU but it’s honestly enough and her weapon letting her effectively have gen 4 bst BEFORE the +4 to everything is kind nuts when combined with her Regnal being unstoppable and her anti special manipulation not being tied to anything

tl;dr: Ike stays, only general NFU entry for Karla if at all, Support folder for Eirika, either both Mareeta and L!Ryoma or neither, Ayra sure

I think the main issue I have with Catria is that it really is Difficult, but Awesome because having to initiate with two allies near you is pretty tough, even if the [Orders] buff helps. Having the [Orders] buff period is a pretty nice support effect though, even if [Triangle Attack] would be harder to pull off. That Harmonic skill is kind of nuts though. Ironically, the young Whitewings can't take advantage of said Harmonic skill, although they have their own method of getting the guaranteed quadruple strike.

The two space Orders buff is nice though and granting [Triangle Attack] to also help out is great but I think it does veer into Difficult, but Awesome territory so I'm a maybe for Catria.

After some rest and thinking about it, yeah, they head into Difficult, but Awesome territory, which on average they can take down one enemy down with ease, but gets less practical trying to take down more. Of course, the same thinking made me realize that they can be horrifying on the enemy team, as they have the potential to do this on one of your units (without the Harmonized Skill in mind). Their potential to high-roll that against you is there, especially with the right setup, and that's not even getting into how they benefit in Pawns of Loki.

Yeah I think it’s a difficult but awesome thing. Definitely some very strong potential, but making full use of it be tricky in like AR and probably not gonna be that worth it over other Wo M comps. The def potential is also there but also not sure how scary it’ll be just because B!Ike has always been a thing and has always been great against f

Oh also L!Ryoma probably worth an add due to his refine and Bushido II just making him flying Mareeta.

I feel like if players want to give her the Galeforce build, they at least the option to give her Bold Fighter. Edit: I didn't read that her weapon has the Wary Fighter effect, meaning that she and her foe cannot perform a follow-up attack, meaning that Bold Fighter is not going to work, but the +1 special buildup on her Armored Wall evens that out for Galeforce. But yeah, if Caineghis was at one point a Game-Breaker due to him being a Colorless Armored Beast, then she dethrones him on that count.

There's also Fallen Dimitri we should consider as well, as he has Vengeful Lance, which gives him +3 Atk and +6 Atk/Spd during combat and he deals damage equal 50% of the difference of his Atk to his foe's Def if his Atk is higher and he cannot perform a follow-up attack, if he is not adjacent to an ally, and Murderous Lion, where he gains [Canto: (Rem. +1)], and he is not adjacent to an ally he inflicts -3 Spd/Def on the foe and he denies the foe's counterattack, on top of having Glimmer, Atk/Spd Solo 4, and Odd Tempest, giving him something over his Legendary and Brave variants.

Poor Caineghis, all the guy gets is +4 to all stats on enemy phase and that's it, meanwhile Edelgard rolls in with an entire arsenal and a unique B skill.

Also yeah, Dimitri seems pretty busted too. At first I didn't quite understand what his kit was about but I misread his B skill and didn't realize that he denies counterattacks, in addition to giving him Canto. What confused me was his weapon, where he only gets the damage boost if he can't follow up, but I then realize what it's about. He either initiates against you, outspeeds you, denies your counterattack, and doubles you, or if he can't outspeed you or his follow up his denied, then he just gets a big damage boost instead. I feel like this is their way of getting past the lack of Null Follow Up since he'll want to keep his B skill.

Also also, I feel like Edelgard would probably kick Fallen Tiki off the page. Distant Counter and dragon slaying is nice but her stats feel pretty middling these days and her unique skill only grants her +4 to all stats. She gets Special Fighter, but Edelgard gets Special Fighter, after combat healing, and Damage Reduction. The only thing Tiki would really have over her is the dragon slaying, but I feel like that probably wouldn't be too huge of a deal.

At least Caineghis has his fairly salvageable speed stat but also oof. Kind of regret giving him my Far Save fodder now but also more determined to make him work out of spite. In any case want to wait for stats, but Edelgard’s probably an add regardless tbh

Didn’t initially see that Murderous Lion had Dazzling effect or that Vengeful Lance was based on him not being able to follow up (though it denied follow ups), but yeah that’s a pretty scary solo unit that will actually be able to make use of it under AI unlike Shamir and Shinon. Want to wait on offenses but also it’s Dimitri and they’re gonna be stupid good

Yeah, no arguments against adding Final Bossgard on my end either. As horrendously broken as she is, this was inevitable since there seems to be quite some attention-to-detail on how her kit works compared to her source game.

• In-built Distant Counter (she had map-wide attacks)
• Can move twice (she could attack twice)
• Massive bulk for the first hit she takes (invoking the Demonic Beast health bars)

The only glaring inaccuracy I see is that she can be fielded with Dragons (i.e. Seiros, funnily enough) and Beasts without penalty — aside from losing Armored Stride, but that skill is easily replaced with something far worse like A/R Far Save.

As for Dimitri... I'm on the fence about him. I think he might lean a little too hard on the "smash into something hard and run away" gimmick, which is getting gradually harder to do with all of the Damage Reduction skills we've been getting, Gustav and Final Bossgard being powerful and recent examples.

Stats: Fallen Dimitri: 40/42/40/38/17

Fallen Male Morgan: 38/37/17/35/38

Fallen Female Morgan: 40/39/17/41/35

Fallen Edelgard: 45/42/14/44/39

So all are pretty minmaxed unsurprisingly. Dimitri has an effective 77/56 and 83/62 with Atk/Spd Solo Seal which is really good although still honestly on the fence about him compared to his Legendary self

Also Orson is a lance cav apparently. 43/38/28/36/23 with Bereft Lance (5★); Ignis (4★); Vantage 3 (4★); Rouse Atk/Def 3 (5★)

Bereft Lance: Grants Def+3. Grants Atk/Def+X during combat. (Calculates X based on number of allies within 2 spaces of unit: 0 allies grants +6; 1 ally grants +4; 2 allies grants +2; ≥3 allies grants +0.) If the number of allies within 2 spaces is ≤ 1, neutralizes foe's bonuses (from skills like Fortify, Rally, etc.) during combat.

So worse F!Corrin weapon or Flowing Lance. Big oof, but honestly, kind of what Orson deserves

Good news for those fearing that Fallen Dimitri and Fallen Edelgard will be a pain to go against: the both of them are tagged so that they will not show up randomly in modes such as Tempest Trials and Rival Domains.

I feel like his capabilities make him more than worthy to be added under regular red units, especially since he'd want to keep his prf Special for that +1 Mov and +1 Mov for his allies. Because damn, Legendary Sigurd looks pretty fun. He gets DR basically where it's needed, as it'll help him exchange blows, it'll help him take ranged hits, and if you want to get past it you have to like, initiate against him at melee range I think, but then you run into a problem when he's so far away, can chase you with his 4 Mov, and his allies are nearby. Even then, he looks to have real high Def too. And being able to give that +1 Mov to his allies, which doesn't seem to exclude ranged cavs, good lord, is also dangerous. He -can- still Galeforce too if he really wanted to, since he has -1 Special and a free follow up, but I think his unique Special is just too good to pass up.

Holy-Knight Aura alone is worth a support add, but he needs to start activate it, but luckily for him his Hallowed Tyrfing is also pretty great, alongside a Mighty Glacier statline. I'd say he's worth an add.

Something worth pointing out: most skills that grant extra movement to allied units, like L!Azura's Gray Waves and Annette's Crusher, have a very obvious blurb in their descriptions stating that certain types of units (usually cavalry or ranged cavalry) are exempt from getting the buff.

Holy-Knight Aura does not have this blurb. Enjoy movement-boosted Reinhardts and Legendary Lilinas!

Unrelatedly, Fatal Smoke seems like a strange choice for a C Skill. I suppose he could clown on heal-tanks this way, but it doesn't really synergize with his kit all that well? Feels like they just wanted it on there so it wasn't seasonal-locked anymore.

e: Nevermind, he has Atk/Def Catch, and Fatal Smoke fulfills its debuff condition.

Yup, the FEH channel showed L!Leif getting to take advantage of it so it buffs everyone.

It’s kind of crazy how pushed Holy-Knight Aura is considering it’s 2CD. It only loses 5% of the scaling to Dragonic Aura’s 30% while giving a very nice attack buff on top of an unrestricted movement buff and an unconditional movement buff for Sigurd.

Does suffer from worse scaling due to being attack based, but that’s a pretty fair trade for the buffs it gives and Rally Traps definitely seem a hell of a lot scarier than they already were

From their Duo Skill alone, they're worth as least as a support unit for a Game-Breaker. However, with their 40 HP, 36 Atk, 43 Spd, 30 Def, and 28 Res, they're worth an add overall.

Young L'Arachel has the potential to be a support Game-Breaker as well, since her Staff of Rausten inflicts the [Counter Disrupt] status effect to the closest foe within 5 spaces of her at the start of her turn, meaning that with the right setup you can take out the frontline tank with ease, but the only problem I'm seeing with this is the Save Skills still activating from Armor units behind them.

Definitely am for a support add since giving anyone Dodge (so glad we have an actual name for it now) multiple times a map is good and now there is potential for Fallen Ike to pull off NFU+Dodge which is scary. They themselves also seem really solid and while the can’t always have damage reduction + NFU like Ayra, Mareeta, and L!Dimitri can, the potential for every hit being a mini Aether is pretty solid since Guard/Pulse effects won’t necessarily impact their sustain or damage so it’s not like they’re going to be super reliant on their duo skill, but also the level of sustain they can get definitely can be hit or miss

L’arachel is a bit iffier to me because that’s a huge range and Flash effect messes up a lot of strats, but it’s also ultimately less disruptive than Flash/Kempf/Rhajat tbh while Null C is already fairly common as a countermeasure to cav lines and Far Save makes it useless while Dazzling Flash does almost the same thing but hits multiple units if with less power since and having to choose between Wrathful and Trace

Young Innes has something that sort of cancels out that [Dodge] effect. He has Bow of Frelia, where it give him -1 special cooldown, and if the foe is at 25% HP or above, it gives him +6 Atk/Spd during combat, and +7 damage and ignore non-Special Damage Reduction skills when he activates his damage specials during combat (excluding the AOE specials). He also has Glimmer, Swift Sparrow 2, and Distant Guard.

Basically, his Bow has the Deadeye effect. Now if only his Regular variant had this...

Also, yeah with L'Arachel being kinda iffy. I was on with the fact that she can nullify the counterattack of one foe, which should be enough to break through enemy defenses, especially in AR, while Kempt, Rhajat, and Candlelight/Flash can basically do that for the entire enemy team with the right setup, but get countered by Null C-Disrupt.

Yeah I'm definitely in favor of a Pent add. Being able to instant Glimmer/Moonbow/Ruptured without IP support is strong as is allowing any Infantry mage running Time's Pulse to do so as well. Bladetome users, Arvis, and Saias definitely will have a lot of fun with Pent support while he also makes Pulse Tying much harder

Just for reference, non infantry units with slaying tomes: Spring Severa, Summer Byleth, L!Lilina, and Plegian Katarina. No one that really needs a Pulse, but still something to note

Also, poor poor Ced. Every update they just keep kicking him down further

Anyways Rein Bow is cool and Ideals seem pretty good under player control since both are very controllable conditions unlike Catches, Erk has nice fodder but really wish he came with an Owl tome since it's only on Katarina and Canas, and Farina has an interesting weapon but only seems remotely worth it if you already plan to +10 her and stat balling + dull probably isn't enough with how good Seteth and Cordelia are and the various pseudo-brave prfs in lance flier pool

Pent's tome is pretty nice; figures that the Mage General would help out mages. Some mages are incredibly powerful and being able to help Pulse units like Legendary Lilina or Duo Alfonse (the latter to bypass stuff like Hindrance in Aether Raids) is a good effect. I feel like if he's added it'd be for support though, because as a combatant himself all he has is his precharged Glimmer and some Atk and Spd. It is good, but I feel like other green mages have stronger combat capabilities like Celica's Res piercing, Null Follow Up, and Desperation, and Thrasir's big stat swings and Desperation.

Yeah, as a combatant, he can’t compare to the quartet of Celica, Thrasir, NFU Lewyn, and Y!Merric, but allowing stuff like L!Lilina to run higher damage AO Es or let Duo Lif easily proc a Glimmer or Bonfire makes him at least worth a support add

Stats are out:

Farina has 39/36/38/30/30.

Louise has 41/37/42/16/36.

Erk has 45/35/39/19/27.

Pent has 40/38/39/19/30.

Sonia's stats are 40/35/24/32/35, and she has Blarserpent+, Glacies, Fortress Def/Res 2, and Threaten Atk/Res 2.

I have to agree to add Pent as a support unit though, since while 38 Atk is nothing to sneeze at, there are better units that want a double Time's Pulse to be great right off the bat.

Whoops, guess I'll post here.

I think Myrrh and Nah are very powerful, and in a few ways, they actually seem like a flying Legendary Corrin. Their weapons are similar if not identical, and both have Damage Reduction. Three of their especially nonsense effects are for one turn but that one turn might be all you need.

Yeah one turn is all you sometimes need to change the battle in your favor, sometimes even win it. The only real weakness is that they cannot have Null C-Disrupt, but that goes for many other units. The comparison to Legendary Female Corrin is a good comparison I didn't think of, since they're going to be a ball of stats. I'm willing so say Yes for them, since them and Legendary Corrin can be interchangeable, while they're also basically Power Creeping Fallen Female Robin by a huge margin.

Spring Saleh has Springy Axe+, which has the same effect as Springy Bow+/Lance+, Reciprocal Aid, HP/Res 2, and Rouse Atk/Res 3. The Rouse skill is something, but otherwise not much to be desired.

Edit: Stats are out:

Spring Severa has 39 HP, 37 Atk, 40 Spd, 24 Def, and 17 Res. In terms of offenses, she's better than Sacred Memories Eirika.

Spring Inigo has 40 HP and Spd, 38 Atk, 22 Def, and 27 Res. He basically Power Creeps New Year Fjorm.

Spring Minerva has 41 HP, 36 Atk, 38 Spd, 35 Def, and 18 Res. She basically Power Creeps New Year Laegjarn and Summer Cordelia.

Spring Saleh has 41 HP, 37 Atk, 36 Spd, 26 Def, and 28 Res. He's just Plegian Male Kris with -1 Spd and -5 Def for +6 Res.

Spring Myrrh and Nah can be both gamebreaker and on high tier in Tier Induced Scrappy due to their Damage Reduction on their weapon similar to Spurn/Close Call/Repel/Dragon Wall, Slaying effect on their weapon and Null Follow-Up/Bold Fighter-esque effect on their B Skill.

Honestly I can't even remember at this point, but Fallen Ike's strength has increased over time as more debuffs became easier to come by and his weapon's effect became a thing with Unity skills, which can even stack with his weapon for a gigantic stat swing.

Also I don't even think Larcei was agreed upon to be added but she got added anyway; I believe the consensus was that she was good but Mareeta's Null Follow Up outdid Larcei's like, I think she had a Dull all effect.

That said I think if we get another swordmaster on the level of Mareeta and Ike with enough nonsense effects then I wonder if we should just have like, a swordmaster section under types of units.

Yeah, I probably wouldn’t agreed with a Larcei add tbh. While Dull All is nice, Lulls, Aversa, and Panic have made visible buffs rare with the latter also disabling them while full Debuff nullification is so strong with how many debuff punishing units there are on def not to mention a more generous enemy phase condition for Shannan/M!Kris while Ayra now being the third unit with Null Special Manipulation and a bit of damage reduction makes her much more consistent as a unit while also having NFU be as viable as damage reduction on a +10 one

I was also expecting Wind, but perhaps you could say that he's more down to earth when compared to Edelgard and Dimitri.

While Fallen Star's unique capabilities (and giant Damage Reduction, in reference to its ability in his home game) are great it didn't occur to me that he could use Windsweep or Watersweep pretty well thanks to his weapon's built in Null Follow Up. Failnaught's absolutely no nonsense but it's an incredible effect, and I have a feeling that trying to fight him head on will be completely obnoxious thanks to his Fallen Star. I'd also be in favour of adding him.

Gonna give my usual wait for stats statement, but also weapons having built in NFU is always strong and it’s Claude so he’ll probably have absolutely ridiculous speed. 80% reduction for either just initiating or it being first combat is just absurd on someone who will probably be very fast and has NFU for almost nothing and your options for enemy phasing him are basically dual/enemy phase brave weapon or damage reduction piercing. His enemy phase without Fallen Star will be pretty unimpressive, but Claude will probably be fast enough that he doesn’t need Impacts to stop follow ups when initiating meaning he can just focus on raw offense and even if he’s not, Impacts are an option while having access Deadeye means that he also has a lot of potential killing power in addition to extremely safe initiation

Oh also do we maybe want to add Saves? More so Far save because it’s ability to completely shut down ranged based teams like cav lines is pretty crazy

The Save skills I would say is worth an add. Save with matching skills to shut down either close or ranged attacks is huge, despite the strict limitations, and some of the combinations of units and these skills offer the best mixed phase potential to a team.

Stats are out and he has 41 HP and Spd, 37 Atk, 23 Def, and 24 Res. Basically, nearly the same as his Brave version.

Someone calculated her stats to be around 40/42/16/39/39.

Yeah, she's up there as one of the best mixed-phase units, especially if she inherits Distant Counter and has Quick Riposte as her Sacred Seal, and what makes her extra annoying in Aether Raids is that she can boost mythic heroes on her side just by staying alive, which includes Thrasir. Of course, she's weak to Null Follow-Up but with her naturally high Res to activate her Dragon Wall as well as her great defenses, even then she's going to be tough to take down without dragon effective units.

I'm more leaning towards a Yes, mainly because of her mixed phase potential as well as a great support unit for other Mythic Heroes, especially in Aether Raids.

Her weapon is simultaneously no nonsense, just straight up skewing things in her favour, giving her the right stats where she needs it and follow up manipulation, but also complete nonsense for those same reasons. Her base kit alone means she's dangerous on either phase, since she's denying follow ups on either phase, and a simple Distant Counter inherit may be all she needs. Dragon Wall is just icing on the cake, and I can imagine her being a pain to deal with. The only thing is that she is still a dragon but I feel like if she's super min maxed and her Dragon's Wall on her side she may even be able to stand strong even against effective damage. Also Null Follow Up will be a pain but even then you'll have to cut through Dragon's Wall and her likely very high defenses.

I'm also in favour of adding her, she's got some really good effects and I'd imagine she'll be tough to deal with even despite her weaknesses.

I almost forgot: she has the new Mythic effect of adding an extra unit on your team, which in this case is the Anima Mythic defense team, which means that there is no downside of running her on your Mythic defense teams if you summon her. Granted, the 7th unit will do nothing until one of their allies is gone, but said unit can be either a non-healing support unit or a strong enemy phase unit.

So yeah, I'm in favor or adding her, as well as her being a Tier Induced Scrappy because of everything about her as a great mixed-phase unit, as well as having to face against 7 units in Astra/Anima season in AR is not going to be fun, especially if you foddered off your only Reginn (who also has a bad matchup against Seiros if you run her).

Well, seems that Naga finally has some value again outside of her bonus weeks. Based on the 39/39 defense prediction, Divine Fang boosted Reginn running Atk/Spd Solo seal barely did 40 damage (including the special proc) to a Nowi simulating her with Cadecus filling in for Dragon Wall which is a lower amount of damage reduction than Dragon Wall would generally have against Seiros so she at least stops Reginn no problem.

Dragon Wall will make her pretty hard to kill be anyone not named Julia or Deirdre while NFU or Dragon’s Ire will be pretty good for her frontline potential when she’s on bonus

It did occur to me that Seiros could equip Dragon's Ire. She'd be down the Damage Reduction but in its place she gets an even more absurd enemy phase, and then her Seal is free for something else.

Stats are officially out and Seiros has 40 HP, 42 Atk, 18 Spd, 37 Def, and 40 Res, with superflaws in HP, Atk and Spd. A few points off the predicted statline. Dragon Wall is exclusive to dragons like Dragon's Ire, which means units like Nagi and Winter Fae can run Dragon Wall as well.

Found something on reddit about the 7th slot for defense teams.

https://www.reddit.com/r/FireEmblemHeroes/comments/l6r6zd/7th_ar_def_unit_can_be_danced_to_move/

The video shows that the 7th unit is programmed to end their turn rather than just do nothing, which means they can be danced. It seems to be an oversight, but if it isn't, then all defense mythic heroes with the extra hero blessing will most likely be used to exploit this to the fullest.

Some anonymous player contacted Int Sys about this through the feedback form and screencapped the reply. Turns out dancing the 7th unit is neither a bug nor an oversight — it's completely intended to be another nasty toy for Defense mapmakers to play with.

It should be said though: as mean as this is, it's not a metric we can use for how good Seiros is, as other New Mythics in the future will enable the same thing.

The only caveat that I'd have with Dorothea and Lene is that their Harmonized ability only affects so many units. They can refresh other refreshers but that's only like, three at the moment I believe (Sylvia, regular Lene, and summer Dorothea). That said, 3H houses some of the most powerful units like Legendary Edelgard and Dimitri, and same goes to Holy War with the likes of Legendary Leif and Fallen Julia, and refreshing at a range is very nice. Also, Dorothea's weapon is very nice, it's like a Chill all weapon, and that's excellent for any supporting unit.

Still, if we have a section for Duos/Harmonized Heroes with Extra Turn abilities would Duo Peony just be moved there? She's already pretty great with her own merits, since she also does have her unique refresh ability, while Dorothea just has regular ol' Dance.

I would say hold off for the Extra Turn abilities entry for now, but if one more Duo/Harmonized unit comes with that, then we should put them in their own entry or folder. I mean, dancers on their own are very useful for the the player (and defense teams) and there is no downside to using one on your team, but when units have the ability to dance more than once in a single turn, that something that many other dancers do not have. Like, when I see people use Halloween Harmonized Young Tiki & Ninian with Ninja Duo Lyn & Florina to cheese maps thanks to their Harmonized Skills and mobility, and the potential to have Legendary Edelgard move up to 5 times with just one Plegian Harmonized Dorothea & Lene, they're going to be a cut above other units in terms of support with those unit combos, as well as having good combat capabilities if they're needed.

In other news, Plegian Male Kris' skills are revealed to be Plegian Axe+, which has the same effect as the Plegian Bow above, Draconic Aura, Spd/Def 2, and Chill Atk. Initially I assumed that Male Kris is going to be a Mighty Glacier, but with Spd/Def 2 in the mix, he seems to be close to a Jack of All Stats with low Res, similar to Groom Marth. But until stats are out, I can only speculate.

Edit: Stats are out now. Tharja has 40/39/41/19/22, Katarina has 39/37/43/16/28, Raphael has 48/42/28/38/23, and Male Kris has 41/37/37/31/22. Male Kris basically powercreeps Groom Marth, who has 40/31/36/30/20, and Raphael seems to be the better Colorless Bow Armor unit that can run Brave Bow+/Ignis/Death Blow/Bold Fighter combo than both Valentine Faye and Halloween Jakob.

Solid, but not like super amazing banner. Sara's such a huge maybe for me because Kia being a more focused Odd/Even Recovery is really nice especially with the free buff and makes her a good AR def option so I'm very on the fence with her.

Asbel looks good, but yeah definitely not to the level of the current green mage trinity of Thrasir, L!Celica, and Y!Merric, but omnibuff+lull is incredibly nice.

Ronan (how did he get a prf?) is a no unless his statline ends up insanely good because Indignant Bow is essentially offbrand Randgridr which is definitely good especially with like Spd/Def Lull, but also probably not going to have the same ridiculous statline L!Chrom had.

Hopefully Miranda is fast

Yeah, Divine Tyrfing Seliph is excellent, but not gamebreaking since he really needs support (mainly speed and breath) to be gamebreaking imo. Sigurd I can see a bit more since he's now more or less cav Tibarn, but trading flier movement for much more durability which is a fair argument imo, but eh. Divine Tyrfing (as well as Sealed Falchion) are honestly on the level of Blazing Durandal trading raw power and more safety on enemy phase for not having Special fighter, but also Eliwood has the rarity advantage

Might be good to have another look at some units based on refines at some point but idk

Sara I at least wanted to see what others have to say about her because she has the potential to make dancer and nuker units be immune from Isolation, but if we're not adding Odd/Even Recovery as a skill here, then I don't see her having any good chance to be included as well.

So refines: there are some that makes units great now, but Game Breaking? There are only a few that can even match the other gamebreakers here, with the Brave unit's refines being overall great (besides Brave Lyn's one). By that standard, there are a few that are worth to bring up:

• Regular Micaiah's Thani: It makes her gain a guaranteed follow-up and +5 Atk/Res during combat if she has 50% HP or more at the start of combat, on top of reducing damage from the first ranged attack by 30% and effectiveness against Cavalry and Armored units. While it makes her near Fallen Julia, Fallen Julia has Light and Dark on top of having a much better default skill kit.
• Sealed Falchion: The refine gives +5 Atk/Spd/Def/Res during combat as well as denying any of the foe's follow-up if the foe is at 75% HP or over at the start of combat, on top of having +5 Atk/Spd/Def/Res if the user is either not at full HP at the start of combat or have a bonus applied to them at the start of combat and deals effective damage against them. At the very least it guarantees safety against fast foes without Null Follow-Up for Regular and Exalted King Chrom due to their naturally low Spd, and against guaranteed follow-up attacks or very fast foes for Regular Lucina and Masked Marth, but all of them have to depend on being a ball of stats to give themselves a chance in the current meta.

Kia not having the the turn limit is pretty important although that's also just more of an AR thing and I'm still not for basing unit adds on ONLY AR-D performance, but also penalty neutralization and a free +6 atk/spd is still solid especially if the team is set up to have everyone with the same hp

I mean I guess the question with some refines is about how they specifically match up to some other prfs and if that should be reason to add or remove a unit like Divine Tyrfing compared to Hawk King Claw, and weapons like Obsidian Lance/Gate Anchor Axe (Vero and Duessel were discussed with someone thinking they should be added but also didn't actually happen). Like flying beast movement is still a huge boon, but also statwise Sigurd is essentially better than Tibarn and can be just as an effective Galeforce sweeper on a more open map since he has a higher stat cieling atm

Granted there aren't that many examples atm now that I think about it because it's mainly Hawk King Claw and Gate Anchor Axe like weapons that have that comparison with Divine Tyrfing and then Blazing Durandal with Sealed Falchion. In the very least, worth keeping in mind imo

Sigurd with Divine Tyrfing active: 41/61/32/44/20 with 50% off of first magic hit. Guaranteed follow up when foe's HP ≥ 50%

Transformed Tibarn: 41/57/31/34/18. Guaranteed follow up when foe's HP=100% and ignores non wall obstacles

Since we're agreeing on not adding Sara, I think we should focus on units that are like Pirate Harmonized Veronica & Xander.

We kinda slept on Pirate Veronica & Xander because they kinda didn't compare to Pirate Tibarn, who was included in the same banner. Gate-Anchor Axe giving the user -1 special cooldown, and giving +5 Def/Res to the user and inflicting -5 Def/Res on the foe during combat and allowing the user to gain a guaranteed follow-up attack when the user is not adjacent to an ally, on top of having cavalry movement access to Atk/Def Solo 4 and Lull Atk/Def, makes them premium users for Galeforce if they have Heavy Blade 3 as their Sacred Seal, or switch out Atk/Def Solo 4 for Heavy Blade 4 and have the Atk/Def Solo 3 Sacred Seal equipped. There's also the fact that their Harmonized Skill gives the [Resonance: Shield] status, which allows them and any Heroes and Fates allies on the map to gain +4 Def/Res during combat and deny any of the foe's follow-up attacks for the first battle on each phase. The only problem I see is that they're allowing counterattacks in (although that means Wings of Mercy help from allies), and they get shut down by Null Follow-Up.

If we keep that in mind, then Regular Sigurd (and by extension Regular Seliph) seems like good candidates for the Heavy Blade/Galeforce and Lull Atk/Def build as well, alongside with them inheriting Distant Counter for great enemy phase, and while Sigurd has usable Spd to back that up if Null Follow-Up comes into play, but Seliph is better off using his refined Tyrfing with Vengeance, Distant Counter, and Vantage to use his statline and movement well.

Alongside them, we have Duessel, with his Obsidian Lance giving +3 Def, and allows him to inflict -6 Atk/Def on the foe during combat and allows him to have a guaranteed follow-up attack if he's not adjacent to an ally, as well as having Lull Atk/Def makes him seem like a good candidate for the Heavy Blade/Galeforce build, on top of having a great Mighty Glacier statline with enough bulk to take a few hits. However, like Pirate Veronica, he gets shutdown by Null Follow-Up.

Regular Tibarn now is on the fence alongside them, since while his Hawk King Claw gives him a guaranteed follow-up attack if the foe is at full HP at the start of combat and has access to Sturdy Impact over the other three and has usable Spd, he needs to transform to get the extra movement and +2 Atk, meaning that he needs dragon or beast allies alongside him (luckily for him, he has Reyson and Leanne), have Heavy Blade as his Sacred Seal, lacks access to the Lull Skills, and he can get shut down by Null Follow-Up and his low Res.

Pirate Tibarn meanwhile is one of the greatest units to use Galeforce well, thanks to his access to Heavy Blade 4, Dive-Bomb, and his Sky-Pirate Claw giving him -1 special cooldown and a 10 Atk swing to his favor is he's not adjacent to an ally. Because of that he and Regular Eliwood (and Brave Roy) set the standard for Galeforce units for the current meta.

This is kind of a pivot for all of them, where if we're adding in Pirate Harmonized Veronica & Xander because of their weapon and potential with Galeforce, then we should add Regular Sigurd and Duessel as well and keep Regular Tibarn, and if we're not adding Pirate Veronica because of their flaws, then we should not add Sigurd and Duessel in as well and remove Regular Tibarn. It's all or nothing for the four of them if we're calling them Game Breakers or not now.

Yeah, probably takes just a bit too much effort to make Sara a gamebreaking support especially since there's a bit less control with HP values unlike Atk with L!Eliwood

Honestly the comparison to normal Tibarn is why I'm for having those three cavs added. While they lack the ability to negate follow ups and flier movement, I think they do make up for it with the higher attack, Lull access, and the amount of effective bulk they get. Just off their prfs alone, the three cavs have attack and def on par with Tibarn with his impact while also all actually having res or magic damage reduction in the case of Sigurd and that's only accounting for their prfs so they have free A slot and a better B compared to Tibarn where Galeforce is concerned (since he lacks a slaying prf and special acceleration) while higher attack to help ensure the two hit kill and higher bulk easily make up for lacking impact effects imo

Tibarn's only real advantage is his movement and while that is a huge boon, I don't think the lack of that flying movement is good reason to not add those three considering the advantages they have in turn while he's here

Also Seliph is now just stupid flexible with normal Tyrfing for Vantage/Stalling sets and Divine Tyrfing to player/mixed phase which is great, but as powerful as he is now (especially with Divine Tyrfing+NFU), still really needs speed support for full potential

This new Thracia banner's decent enough but I don't think there are anyone truly game breaking. Sara's Rescue+ is inheritable and if it's really good it could just get a mention under skills or something.

As for Tibarn, Pirate Veronica, Sigurd, and Duessel, they all have something fun to offer.

• Tibarn: Guaranteed follow up on player phase, Impact, 3 Mov, high Atk and good Def, mostly on player phase
• Sigurd: Guaranteed follow up on either phase with HP checks, 50% Magic damage reduction, good Atk and good Def with a huge boost with his weapon active
• Duessel: Guaranteed follow up on either phase with a Solo condition, -6 Atk/Def on foe, high Atk and incredible Def with a big effective boost with his weapon active, also has good Res
• Pirate Veronica: Guaranteed follow up on either phase with a Solo condition, big Def and Res swing, great Atk and great Def, good enough Res, and can also deny follow ups like, once per turn with their ability

They all have guaranteed follow ups and basically demand the use of Null Follow Up so you can play fair and square against 'em. Since they're all similar in some manner should they all just collectively be given their own section and call 'em like, the 3 Mov follow up brigade? Pirate Tibarn would be moved to that too. That is if we decide that the others should be added. That way it covers 'em all, like "these units all have 3 Mov and a guaranteed follow up, often bypassing their low Spd, letting them move far and hit hard basically for free" or something, then each entry on the list would show what unique capabilities they have. Alternatively if regular Tibarn's flaws are too much now then he could just get the boot.

I'm fine with adding all of them together as one entry under Types of Units, since all of them have the same gimmick going for them, with their own merits under sub-bullet points, and their common weakness being fighting against units with Null Follow-Up and similar effects, letting their foe counterattack (while this means Wings of Mercy activation from allies, it could also mean that It Only Works Once without healing), and units that target their lower Res, especially dragons. Pirate Tibarn on the otherhand I feel should keep his own entry since everything in his kit is catered to activating Galeforce reliably while ignoring any damage done to him thanks to Dive-Bomb, as well as being colorless means that everyone outside of Nagi and -raven tome users have a neutral matchup against him at best.

Yeah Pirate Tibarn absolutely is still on a level of his own because of the combination of slaying weapon, divebomb, and that sheer movement range

Also thinking about it, just on the basis of S!Blyeth, S!Fir, Y!Merric and Courtly Fan being under NFU due to sweep synergy, probably should have at least Catherine and Lewyn there since they effectively manage the same thing with how much raw offensive power they have (more on the fence about F!Mareeta in that regard because she has less raw power but has Slaying effect for Galeforce)

All this talk about 3 movement units with guaranteed follow-up attacks... and we forget about Legendary Ephraim, whom I used as my Galeforce machine for the longest time.

There's also Legendary Eirika, with her Storm Sieglinde giving her +1 special buildup for each of the user's Atk if there are equal or more enemies than allies within 2 range of her, but she has to rely on her Spd instead, and she has low bulk, so she might be disqualified instead.

Finally, there's Regular Hrid, with his Gjoll having a guaranteed follow-up attack and denying any of the foe's follow-up attacks if at the start of combat his foe has a penalty inflicted on them, but he's more of a mixed-phase unit, due to his access to Distant Counter, but the option to run Galeforce/Heavy Blade is there.

Velouria is worth a support add imo. Granting breath effect to someone like Kiria or Brunnya without being in sniping range is definitely strong and it's a dual phase breath effect as well while dragons getting open A slot is definitely nice.

Peony basically just gets to dance a second time which is also strong so I think she's a support add as well.

Plumeria I'm more on the fence on because First-Dream Bow does have much better range than Daniel Made Bow and and will surely have a ton of res to provide Sabotage support while her dance gives good stat swings, but not sure if that's enough

Kaden, that massive speed swing is cool and Vassal Blade effect is fun, but also feels really weird that they actually put that behind a condition considering that even Nino and Karla had the effect without any condition beyond the speed check, but he is a 4 star so idk

Velouria, while being limited to give +1 special buildup to only one unit, said unit can be anyone whereas Brave Lucina is limited to physical units. I would say a yes.

New Year Duo Peony & Triandra I would also say a yes, since they can basically dance twice in one turn, where all other dancers only can do it once.

Kaden and Plumeria on the other hand I will say no.

Stats! (Not that I was waiting to see anyone's stats since most adds are support adds but still nice to have here)

Peony:38/34/40/16/23

Plumeria: 41/42/17/18/39

Velouria: 41/38/40/34/23

Kaden: 41/35/39/25/28

Keaton: 48/41/24/43/20. BST: 176 Superboons: Atk. Superbanes: Def. Weapon: Resolved Fang: Grants Def+3. At start of combat, if foe's HP ≥ 75%, grants Def+5 to unit, inflicts Def-5 on foe during combat, and then, if unit's Def > foe's Def, deals damage = 70% of difference between stats. (Maximum bonus of +7 damage.) At start of turn, if unit is adjacent to only beast or dragon allies or if unit is not adjacent to any ally, unit transforms (otherwise, unit reverts). If unit transforms, grants Atk+2 and deals +10 damage when Special triggers.

Keaton seems very solid and a good counter to L!Dimi/L!Chrom which is appreciated, but not gamebreaking obviously. Still, 62 effective attack with 51 def and true damage potential based off of being one of the units with the highest def in the game is very nice

I'm a little late due to playing other games.

NY!Plumeria: For those still on the fence about her, it might be worth considering that she has the highest base Atk of all Bow units with her Superboon while also being Colorless and airborne - the only catch is that you'll need to replace many of her skills to capitalize on it, but she starts with the most important one (Atk/Def Rein). She's surprisingly versatile for a unit class that isn't usually so threatening. Maybe.

NY!Velouria: I want to say she's worth adding because that weapon effect is really strong, but I'm stuck on the fence because it's dependent on her Support Partner. Very strong when it's active, but if there's no Support Partner nearby (or worse, she's an enemy unit that can't even have a Support Partner) she's as generic as Blue Beast Infantry gets, which is bad because her stats are mediocre aside from her Spd. Maybe for Support.

NY!Kaden: There's not much we can really say to defend the demote, but NY!Kaden isn't too bad as far as demotes go with his spectacular Spd — he'll hit hard and fast, but he can't take too many hits in return. No.

Duo!Peony: That's some Gen 1 BST right there, with her only standout stat being Spd. That said, she makes up for it with the whole smorgasbord of support skills — being able to use Sweet Dreams twice, one of them potentially to a fellow Dancer, and give allies Atk+12 for free with minimal investment is insane. It's a fair tradeoff that she'll fall over to a stiff breeze. Yes for Support.

NY!Keaton: I would say he's neat if we didn't already have a free crazy high-def unit that does cool things (Dancer Eldigan), but NY!Keaton is notable for being a free Green Beast Infantry when the only other one that exists is Bridal!Nailah. No.

Oh yeah while I loath to say it, remove normal Nailah (or replace her with NY!Velouria). Glare and difference in base Null aside, NY!Velouria is straight up better than Nailah with her higher natural attack beating out Nailah's with fully active prf while giving the atk/spd debuff and free breath effect under a much easier condition. She honestly fell off a while ago, but this is definitely nail in the coffin unfortunately

My only worry is how much the 0.8 multiplier could affect her damage output, since that's weaker than the Growing Specials, while Blazing Specials hit really hard. On the other hand, its main draw is a quick one, that is to say, she charges it all on her own, giving her some self sufficiency. Although she could always just run Iceberg or Glacies with a bit of extra help from her allies with stuff like Grandscratcher or, incidentally, her own Legendary dad.

With the Blazing AOE specials as her choice, Velouria would be her best partner with her, since she gives an additional -2 special cooldown to get that ready. However, with her default kit, it just means that she can potentially fire off multiple Gifted Magic in one turn with a dancer alongside her, especially Dancing Duo Sigurd & Deirdre (although that's doubling down on 2 Red Tome Cavalier slow Squishy Wizards on one team).

I’m insanely on the fence about her because on one hand 1 charge AOE, innate Hardy Bearing, free B for Lull, and open seal on a ranged cav has a ton of potential, but on the other hand .8 modifier coming off of like 56 or 59 attack has the damage at like 44-47 damage which isn’t actually going to be too bad to mitigate a lot of it and unlike Ophelia or even Sonya/Merric has just about zero potential for bypassing damage mitigation on anyone not named Selkie so she’s otherwise forced to do one shots which feels shaky for her.

With AR-D specifically, Eir will for sure make her a lot more manageable to fight since her own ability to get blessed is rather shaky and people already tend to res stack more on Light offense since Yune and Bram are there so the combination of that and B!Hec being a particularly popular option for Astra def have her as a big eh on her defensive potential. She’s a new option for cav lines, but I don’t actually think she’ll make them any more dangerous than they have been beyond being a B!Ike/F!Lyon counter (and latter is solely because she naturally can double him because he’ll shrug off the Ao E no problem)

As for offense, she’ll at least be good, but she also lacks the potential to either hit and run without dancer support or pseudo Galeforce sweep that L!Leif, Duo Lyn, and Reginn all have and also loses much more than they all do if her HP is low making it harder to use her as Wo M beacon and again lower power on AOE and low ability to get around damage reduction are going to be chief issues so yeah, super on the fence

That said, can do QP for instant Iceberg which is certainly worth noting and does give some fairly dangerous one shot potential, but also still has the Ophelia/Dark Excalibur comparisons and not sure if necessarily better beyond range

Okay so apparently I misunderstood how Ao E damage calcs worked and thought is was (Atk*Multiplier-def/res) and not (Multiplier*(Atk-Def/Res)) like it actually is so harder to take 0 damage than I thought since it’s not going to be subtracting from 40 attack but also 40 res still would make a unit take like 12 damage or so which isn’t terribly significant and still can’t easily get through damage reduction so eh

Even though I put the suggestion up for Legendary Lilina, I'm torn if she's actually any better than Ophelia. She has everything she needs right off the bat and can basically be slotted in any team, but some of the best dancers are Tome units, as well as Thrasir being great in AR, so why not run Ophelia in that case. On one hand her the damage multiplier for Gifted Magic is basically half of the Blazing specials, but on the other hand her in-combat Atk is very high.

In the end, I feel like she's more of a sidegrade than an upgrade to running Ophelia and the like. I get the feeling that she's great, but not gamebreaking.

I like how Sanaltina is literally vanilla Altina gaming the system to use Vantage and NCD at the same time.

But yeah, 100% agree. Altina with access to Infantry skills is a frightening concept, and if Faedunn has taught us anything, it's that one turn with their Duo/Harmonic Skill activated is all they need to decimate a map.

Agreed with kicking Keaton out and adding in Winter Harmonized Altina & Sanaki. Their statline in case someone is wondering is 42 HP, 40 Atk, 18 Spd, 37 Def, and 39 Res.

There is also the Odd/Even Recovery skill we need to check out as a skill, since removing penalties, including Isolation, is going to be big for team building, especially in Aether Raids.

Probably could've kicked Keaton off since Laslow got his refine, but yeah, this is definitely nail in the coffin. Being the third(?) unit to be able to Vantage + Null C especially from full health is strong on it's own as Y!Marth has demonstrated and dual phase brave weapon with access to Breath/Time's Pulse gives her a way to proc Twin Blades from basically any point while unlike her Mythic self, she actually can make use of blessing effects actually making her a much scarier vantage sweeper

It just also occurred to me that the Vantage effect would be granted to anyone from Tellius, so any such units can also take advantage of the effect, albeit for one turn. The first unit that comes to mind is Bridal Nailah, where if she can get enough charges beforehand, and is given Special Spiral, she could Vantage spam stuff like Ignis or Dragon Fang. Or Shinon to Vantage spam Deadeye.

Sadly (or thankfully?) no, that's not possible. The text for the Harmonized Skill reads "to unit and allies from the same titles" for the Atk/Spd buff, but only reads "to unit" for Vantage.

Oh whoops, I misread then; so it's another selfish effect just like how Ninja Lyn has one.

So I’ll get to opinions on the new units later but all three def seem solid, but the whole bonus unit change to AR kind of is forcing me to change my opinion on Freyja because being able to lose a unit and not lose lift means that suicide attacks are now viable and Freyja is actually a perfect unit for that since she can go in and galeforce and then try to get a kill on counter while also forcing the AI to waste actions trying to kill her which is pretty significant imo. Naturally this same option is applicable to Reginn

Well I'll be, they actually implemented Canto in this game. It makes me wonder if there'll be other Cantos since hers is Canto (3). It looked like there were a lot of stipulations, like you can ONLY move after, and you can't warp, you can't attack or do other Assists, and it's only for the first few turns. Still, more actions is a great effect, and it'll be excellent for hit and run strategies. Also, I think this means she could use like, a Ruse skill, then run away. That's got some interesting applications.

Also is that new AR change only if Freyja's a bonus or if you have a Mythic bonus unit? Or if she's the one who dies? If it means you can just suicide her into the enemy and do a number on 'em, and while you lose a unit you don't lose any Lift in the process, then that's also an interesting idea. You basically crash Freyja into their team, go down swinging, and now the opponent is hopefully down at least one unit, the others are impaired (Savage Blow, Smokes), and they're wasting time on Freyja.

If there is going to be a Canto with a lower number, it's more likely to be Yuri with his Fetters of Dromi from Three Houses when he will more likely be included in Heroes.

About the new feature in AR that would let you practically crash-and-burn one of your units against the foe's defense team and still get full lift? Freyja now seems to be the best unit to do that now, alongside other Galeforce solo units, such as both Tibarns and Legendary Leif. On Light Season with the right Mythic bonus hero, she's worth an add now.

Book V Begins: Reginn and More stats (According to Feh Channel

Duessel- 41/39/18/39/31 (BST: 168)

Callach- 45/40/27/31/33 (BST: 176)

Selena- 40/39/39/16/23 (BST: 157)

Knoll- 43/37/32/19/35 (BST: 166)

Natasha- 37/36/32/24/36 (BST: 165)

Reginn- 38/36/40/30/24 (BST: 168)

So Duessel has a def + 3 version of Pirate Veronica’s prf but since we don’t have Pirate Veronica iirc, then he’s not an add. Otherwise incredibly solid unit and definitely will be a scary random enemy to appear

Meanwhile Selena gets +3 speed and if foe’s hp is greater or equal to 75%, she gets +5 atk/spd and NFU which is good for sure and actually gets to stand out when Reinhardt exists, but losing the slaying effect does hurt compared to Y!Merric and S!Byleth. Still, NFU sweep is a good niche to have

Anyways the hit and run potential Reginn has and Freyja’s ability to take down multiple units both make me more on board with adding them since you can now do riskier plays with a bonus mythic and I definitey appreciate there being more of a place for non support oriented offense mythics (RIP Naga though she rendered her own support useless and doesn’t have any offensive abilities that are truly useful)

Oh also refines are solid, but nothing super groundbreaking. Mist isn't useless, Oliver is a functional meme, Nowi can null debuffs, and Sealed Falchion is a follow up denying stat stick

Superboons: Duessel - Atk, Def; Caellach - Atk, Spd; Selena - Atk, Spd; Natasha - HP; Knoll - None; Reginn - Spd, Res

Superbanes: Duessel - HP, Spd; Caellach - None; Selena - HP, Def; Natasha - None; Knoll - None; Reginn - HP, Def

I think the only reason Pirate Veronica wasn't added was because no one discussed her - she was overshadowed by Pirate Tibarn. Considering that Duessel is being very slept on and that Pirate Veronica is literally him except Green and Harmonic, I wouldn't object if both were added to the page, as I did find Duessel in the story maps very aggravating to fight. Yes.

Selena is someone I'm more on the fence about. The immediate conclusion I drew was that Selena could pull the same Windsweep crap Summer Byleth does except on a horse, but upon inspection she lacks all the other things that make Summer Byleth good - being on a horse means Selena is foiled by terrain, and not having a Slaying effect makes her Special hard to proc instantly which will hurt her against tanks. No.

Reginn was going to be a harder call until I realized she had Canto on her weapon - the hit-and-run potential on that is both incredible and encouraged. That and - as I discovered when I luckily pulled her with a ticket - she has a superboon in Spd that puts her on par with Freyja. And unlike Freyja, Reginn's Canto effect and insta-charge Special actually makes her work for the Offense Mythic purpose she was designed for. Yes.

Ah yeah makes sense. Pirate Tibarn very stong both Pirate Veronica and Duessel very strong follow up effect with that min maxed statline is very scary

Also yeah, I think Selena not having a slaying effect is just such a deal breaker in comparison to S!Byleth and Y!Merric

I think the combination of the new bonus mythic effect and sixth slot potential gives Freyja and Reginn really good cases for adds now. My issue with Freyja was that she really couldn’t shine outside of like a dedicated beast galeforce team, but being able to lose a unit while still getting max lift means that her innate DC can actually be useful (since her enemy phase is kind of iffy) and she can more actually contribute something other than a blessing to non Galeforce strategies. She can go in and disarm a pulse team and then probably at least take down someone else while wasting the opponents actions as they try to kill her. Don’t really have anything to add to Reginn that wasn’t already said. Canto, damage reduction, and instant charge special makes for really safe hit and run strats since she can also snipe structures or pull allies out of danger while she can also be a good Galeforcer in her own right. Extra unit slot also always good

Oh, worth noting that while the lift part of blessings does not apply for sixth/seventh slot units, they still give their stat buff which definitely makes for some interesting possibilities for AR def since you can now stat stack higher without sacrificing lift

Seems like Freyja has a super Lull, just with a Solo condition, though being a Beast Cav she wants to be alone anyway. She's gonna be a nightmare to go up against head on, fittingly enough, because on player phase she has the Impact effect, and on enemy phase she has Distant Counter, and in both phases, Spd based Damage Reduction. She's already stacked as it is, and she'll be quite a menace to fight. I'd say she's worth an add if her stats are good enough. Worth noting is that since her weapon and B skill already cover some good effects, her A slot is open for stuff like a Stance 4 skill for the Guard effect or Unity to try and combat any debuffs she may have.

Triandra seems like a good add for Support. While Peony's movement boosts are great, being able to inflict Guard on command is also very powerful.

I'm just kind of surprised we got 'em both, but I guess they didn't want to face the issue they did with Hel who joined like months and months after her defeat, while here we pretty much have all the Book IV fairies, and the main villain. Poor Freyr though, guess he'll stay asleep for now.

We at least know Triandra’s statline: 38/37/38/16/22 which definitely gives her great offensive presence, but she’s also ridiculously easy to Isolate which will hurt her a lot since Mila exists. Still the Guard dance itself and double Reins still give her both a good support and offensive presence and makes her a fairly easy replacement for Yune

With Freya, idk. The combination of her weapon and the pseduo Lull/buff stealing B slot are very strong for sure, but also she’s a light mythic and I think she’ll only really be good as a galeforcer and Wo M beacon which is hurt a bit by her having a solo requirement. At least from an AR perspective, the DC honestly feels kind of useless since using the Mythic as a mixed/enemy phase carry is incredibly risky and I think she'll be straight up worse than Altina in that regard since Altina can at least vantage sweep her way through

She’ll be a scary enemy for sure, but also one that we as players will rarely fight, and unless her stats are incredibly good, using her over Eir, Peony, or Mila feels like an incredibly hard sell for 90% of offense comps

That's a good point actually, I kinda forgot she's actually a Light Mythic. She might face the Altina problem: an excellent combatant, but needs dedicated support to be a carry, especially since she wouldn't have the big Mythic stat boosts that Mythic blessed carries normally get.

That said... there is something she can try: Galeforce. I think she's one of the only offense Mythics who can right now at least (Altina being the other), and while she needs some help, she can either ram into something and exchange blows to Galeforce with Heavy Blade, or she can just get one hit in against a dangerous foe, then become a Wings of Mercy beacon. The Impact effect and Damage Reduction will help her survive, but that also depends on you purposefully engaging into a tough foe. I know there's a strategy with Eir that does that better but it's still something I think.

Yeah, her being a Light Mythic is a hindrance for her, as unless she's a bonus unit, I can see her going down in two enemy attacks, even with her Damage Reduction, thanks to her 40 HP (and thanks to Triandra being a Mythic Hero of Dark and boosting Spd, Spd stacking on the enemy defense team is going to be an issue). The only reasonable support unit I can see for her is Regular Male Corrin and his unique refine Yato to bolster her stats further during combat, but even then that only reasonable for enemy phase and her HP is still an issue. The Galeforce strat seem to be reasonable, but by then Pirate Tibarn does that role better for player phase at least.

Otherwise, good for other modes. Just not Aether Raids. It's like the New Year's Lethe discussion all over again, where her player phase is great, but her mixed phase is shaky.

Yup, that’s exactly what I was getting at with her, Vanitas. She has very strong potential as a Galeforcer and player phase builds don’t lose as much from not getting blessings mixed/enemy phase builds do and even with the other beasts being to Galeforce just as well while she honestly doesn’t lose too much from switching from her prf B to a Lull since buffs are very on def while unlike Pirate Tibarn (as well as L!Edelgard) can safely be next to allies especially if switching to a Lull so there’s a niche albeit a very narrow one.

She’d definitely be hella scary as a def mythic though and really feels like she was meant as a def Mythic. DC would actually be useful there since it makes it harder to snipe her off and the second half of her B slot is way more relevant as a def unit compared visible buffs practically being dead on defense teams

I've seen Offense Mythics used on Defense before, Mila has been an uncommon annoyance. Remember, you don't have to use Defense Mythics; if you're confident enough in your strategy, you can forgo lift loss reduction and just try to crush the attacker utterly, so Freyja would fit just fine if you want to use her that way.

But yeah, I fully expected Freyja's unique skill to be a Lull on steroids. A Beast Cavalry with the functional equivalent of Inevitable Death is already disgusting, but the buff-stealing effect along with her PRF weapon is what sells it. And we've seen from the story that Freyja is a speed demon, which her PRF's damage reduction works off of, and with a player's intervention that speed is going to scale up to obscene numbers. For most strategies, she only needs to take one hit, and her Beast Cavalry effect isn't going to let many enemies hit more than once.

It's the Surtr problem: you want Freyja beside her allies so Atk/Spd Solo and Binding Necklace are turned off, but the allies themselves can be just as likely to wreck your shit if you don't run the fuck away. I fully expect this to be a gigantic pain in the neck in the MHB; she might be the first enemy to appear on the That One Boss page twice.

Some news from the datamine: Freyja's stat are the same as her enemy variant, which is 40/38/44/24/22, with superasset in Def and superflaw in Spd.

Triandra and Freyja share the same Mythic Hero Battle, which means that it's a Dual Boss situation like the Bound Hero Battles.

...Correction: Freyja will be the first enemy to appear on the That One Boss page twice, sharing the honor with Triandra.

For reference, Freyja with a Spd boon gets 61 Spd during combat just by being alone. Before buffs, buff-steal, sacred seal, etc.

Well that's no fun, I thought we'd get two different Mythic Hero Battles for twice the Orbs. I can already imagine this one being a nightmare, appropriately enough.

As long as Keaton is on the page, Laevatein should be added since they're such similar units aside from Laev having worse speed but much better res and Rein access. Beast true damage and semi bladetome about balance out imo and as far as vantage goes, there’s no real advantage to being infantry unless the weapon is the source of vantage beyond little risk of effective damage.

Lyn is pretty much same case as Leif as far as the strength of player phase goes since their weapons give 47 attack at neutral and both can essentially do ranged galeforce. Lyn having access to Disarm Trap also is a big point in her favor since she can test traps if necessary so I'm in favor as well. She also just has a nice statline for a lot of nonsense with the inheritable

Anyways shame that Hana is the grail unit and not Navarre or Zihark because as nice as her statline is, getting a lance or fast sword infantry in grails would be super nice right now

The infantry are all pretty standard but good, but the fliers are a cut above. Laevatein is the first dual phase Brave Axe with half of the Blade tome effect and Atk/Def Rein to give her some more oomph, while Lyn has her self refresh to somewhat act like a pseudo Galeforce, although it should be noted that she has to attack at some point in the turn for her to use it so she can't just use it to move first and then self refresh to get into an advantageous position.

Interestingly, if Harmonized and Duo Abilities can both be used in the same turn, then Harmonized Halloween Tiki and Ninian's refresh ability should work on Lyn too, so that's something to note.

Something new about Ninja Duo Lyn & Florina: their Duel Effect rates them as having 190 BST, so they're going to be common to see in high tier Coliseum modes.

I think Ninja Duo Lyn & Florina will be considered a gamebreaker due to their high speed. In the new Forging Bonds banner: The Princess of Bern which was started last November 17, Four heroes from Fire Emblem The Binding Blade were included.