Broken Base Cleanup

• Reaper, the game's "grimdark" hero, has several divided camps. There are those who unironically appreciate his edgy design, those who appreciate it from a cheesy-but-effective perspective or an unintentionally-hilarious perspective, and those who find him obnoxious and annoying. Doesn't seem vicious enough to count. Cut.
• While some applauded Zarya for being of a different build than all of the other female characters, others criticized her for being a stereotypical Husky Russkie woman with a far more simple and generic design than all of the other characters. Given the view that she was designed to appease feminist criticism of the game, debates regarding her can get quite heated. Her dodgy accent also doesn't do her any favors for Russian fans. Biased against Zarya, and the "designed to appease feminist criticism" comment whiffs of a ROCEJ violation to me. Cut.
• Tracer's dodgy accent combined with her role as a hit-and-run oriented harasser who appears to have been designed specifically to cause as much annoyance for the opposition as possible has earned her the ire of some players, especially those who see her personality as cloying and one-note. Others find her frantic style of play to be exciting, fun, and rewarding and regard her capacity to remain so hopeful, kind, and upbeat in the face of such overwhelming darkness and adversity to make her one of the cast's most charming and likable characters. Understandable, but I don't remember seeing fans get heated over this at all. Unsure, leaning towards cut.
  • Being the Series Mascot also naturally opens her up to fire from some corners. Some think her unique combination of design, personality, and playstyle makes her a good choice that captures the game's spirit and stands out compared to the traditional shooter mascot, others wish her position was at least shared with other characters given the roster's size and variety, and others go so far as to say that she "doesn't deserve" such a status. See above.
• D.Va has a few distinct camps of fan reception, mostly depending on whether you think her competitive, fanservice-y Gamer Chick persona is bratty and obnoxious or endearing or cute. The back and forth is often based around whether her character is too one-note or too tonally inconsistent; critics look down on her for being thematically divorced from the main Overwatch/Talon conflict, her very pointedly "cute" design that can be seen as cheap, one-dimensional "otaku bait", as well as the attempts of delving to her Beneath the Mask persona (such as with Shooting Star) as a flat, token attempt at pathos. Other fans adore her at face value and with her Hidden Depths, with an argument to be made that she serves an important role as a consistent source of levity in a series where even other "cute and cheerful" characters like Tracer and Mei come with some disheartening baggage. I can understand why some fans would dislike D.Va, but the "tonally inconsistent" point and comparisons to the baggage of other characters seems fringe. Unsure.
• Symmetra's position in the lore makes her into an example of this. One camp considers her a sympathetic woobie who was deceived by Vishkar since childhood and a compelling Noble Top Enforcer with autism. Another camp believes that merely serving Vishkar (considered an evil hypocritical MegaCorp) and going along with or justifying their ideals (combined with a smug attitude) makes her one-dimensional, delusional, unsympathetic, and annoying. Since she can be given both Draco in Leather Pants and Ron the Death Eater treatments, it's hard to find a middle ground for her. Seems fringe to me, although I wonder if this perception has changed after the release of Stone By Stone. Unsure. (Unrelated, but could this example, if it ends up being kept, describe Symmetra's autism with identity-first language instead?)
• Doomfist was added to escalate the threat and stakes of the main conflict, and while few question that he did, whether he should have and whether he helps or hurts the overall narrative is far more contentious. Some admire his prowess and see him as either an effectively intimidating figure whose performance, actions, and ambitions make him highly credible as a menace substantial enough to warrant Overwatch's return. Others see him instead as a flashy "threat-over-substance" villain who exists to generate conflict literally for its own sake due to his straightforward motivation, which for some just doesn't measure up to the emotionally complex standard set by his colleagues. I remember this being a talking point, but is it vicious enough? Unsure, leaning towards keep.
• Wrecking Ball's entire concept pretty much invites this: he's a weaponized hamster ball mech piloted by an intelligent hamster, which you're likely to think is either the most hilariously awesome thing to appear in the game yet or something so profoundly stupid, even by the standards of a cast chock-full of over-the-top characters, that it's broken the tone and preemptively tarnished any future chance of seriousness. Apparently, it was even a base breaker within the development team itself, with a big chunk of developers feeling that adding a hamster to the spherical robot would be too much. Oh gosh, if even the devs share the mix of sentiments I remember going around at the time... Then again, this example could do with being less biased against Wrecking Ball. Keep but rewrite.
• Hours after the introduction of Ashe, people have been divisive. Many believe that she looks and acts too similar to other heroes and adds nothing unique gameplay- or lore-wise, while others think her design is still quite entertaining and fits with the New Old West aesthetic of Deadlock and Cassidy. There's also her backstory as a filthy rich teen who became a villain for fun, which either frustrates fans for how boring and shallow her motivations are compared to Reaper, Widowmaker, or Sombra, or is a breath of fresh air for those who think not every backstory/character has to be complicated/tied into the larger plot or be extremely competent. That being said, Ashe's partner B.O.B. was very well-received by everyone. Cut the B.O.B. comment for natter and "hours after the introduction" because Examples Are Not Recent, but I wouldn't remember seeing intense anti-Ashe posts as well as posts in defense of her if she wasn't so divisive. Keep.

• The lore's distribution model, which is spread across multiple platforms. Some are fine with it, as they find the game itself very fun and appreciate not feeling pressured to follow its narrative while knowing it's there for them to experience at their own pace should they feel so inclined. But, considering how much emphasis the game itself places on the characters, others prefer to stay caught up and find it tedious to search and sift through multiple websites, blogs, videos, tweets, et cetera, and wish the lore was more centralized. Further compounding the issue is the game's large and growing roster. The lore already has trouble juggling everyone, especially with its frequent droughts of content, and representation varies wildly among the cast. Even at a rate of one new character every four months, many fans think the cast is expanding at a faster rate than the lore can keep pace without risking allowing some characters to fall by the wayside. Feels a bit too biased against for my liking, even though the points are valid enough. Keep but rewrite.
• Brigitte's body shape has drawn up a lot of debate and controversy within the fanbase, namely with how it's changed over time between comics, cinematics, and her in-game appearance. Is her more muscular appearance from the "Dragons" comic to Honor and Glory and her in-game model preferable to her earlier scrawnier appearance? Does her in-game model alter her design too much from her pre-rendered Honor and Glory appearance, and if so, to what extent? Does she look more generic with Power Armor? Is it "pandering"? If so, to whom? The list goes on. If you have to build up a case for BB with rhetorical questions, chances are it was a fringe division in the first place. I don't recall any discussion of this at all. Cut.
• Masquerade in general caused a bit of a rift between fans who enjoyed it as a cool Villain Episode with some good set pieces that also helped reestablish Talon's menace and those who saw it as a directionless mess that tried to do too much in ten pages and felt like it was spiting anyone who cares about the heroes by effectively leaving them with no victories. In its wake, some have even gone so far to question if the story is even worth caring about at all anymore, since Blizzard has effectively set a precedent that one side of the conflict can now retroactively claim victory and undo the accomplishments of the other at any time. Haven't read, would appreciate help from someone who has. I don't feel like I can make a judgement otherwise.
• Sigma's design, especially his going barefoot, became hugely controversial after the designer artist stated that he is barefoot to "sell the asylum look". Horribly stereotypical and offensive or Truth in Television? Another group doesn't really care and want people to focus on the rest of his design. This was definitely a hot-button issue when Sigma was revealed. Not a fan of the "X or Y?" structure, though, or the reference to a middle ground; pretty much every OW blog I lurked on had an opinion on it, and it was expressed passionately. Keep but rewrite.

• Soldier: 76 has received a mixed response in term of gameplay, which has been deried due to its similarity to common FPS games such as Call of Duty and Halo. Next to the extremely colourful cast with their varied and interesting abilities, Soldier: 76 is extremely plain with his standard assault rifle and mundane sprint. Furthermore, his ultimate ability is essentially an in-game aimbot, which removes the necessity of aiming and got worse the better you play as him, further damning his status among fans. This has split the fanbase, as some accept the character as a gateway for newer players to make Overwatch more accessible, while others condemn him for the same reasons. Almost all one-sided complaining, plus a rather weak description of the apparent split. Cut.
• Pharah. After her flight got a buff, allowing her to stay in the air longer, the fanbase has been fairly divided about her. Some say she's impossible to hit due to her aerial mobility limiting what attacks can reach her, rendering some characters almost entirely ineffective against her. Some say the complainers are just whining because they can't aim, that her pickrates at higher ranks do not support the argument that she's overpowered, and that her ultimate^note while Barrage is powerful, it makes Pharah completely immobile, resulting in a lot of deaths while using it, overall damage per second when compared to other characters, and inability to inflict headshots balances out her advantages. Some say she's fine until a Mercy comes into play^note Mercy is just about the only support hero who can synergize well with Pharah, since her ability to fly to any hero and passive that lets her float slowly down instead of falling straight down let Pharah and Mercy fly together well, which, combined with Mercy's ability to boost the damage of any hero, has made for a famously good combination, and some say that she doesn't fit in Overwatch at all. The amount of threads on the official forums about her number in the hundreds. "Fairly divided" phrasing notwithstanding, this seems valid to me. Keep.
• Doomfist's build-up made him highly anticipated among one section of the player base and dreaded among another for being, at the time, yet another offense-oriented character who would potentially further make tank and defense-oriented characters irrelevant. Once he debuted, his kit took some flak for being uninspired (a popular sticking point is how the ostensible melee character has a shotgun, apparently because Blizzard got cold feet about making a pure melee character), and his playstyle proved to live up to his hype a bit too well for a lot of the base; considered fair by some, by others as insufficiently balanced by his low range, and by nearly everyone as misleading due to some striking Hitbox Dissonance. Then, practically overnight, the dynamic flipped: patches reduced his hitboxes to a debilitating extent, bugs were rampant with his design, and players just gradually figured out how to counter him, sending him from the top to the bottom practically as soon as he'd arrived. Later patches have helped rebalance him to an extent, but players remain torn as to whether he is effective or easily countered; balanced or cheap; and memorable or now just another face in the gallery who made a chaotic first impression. Other than the middle ground implied by "everyone", valid enough. Keep.
• Following massive damage nerfs to Roadhog in June 2017, just about everybody agreed that it was too much and he needs to be fixed, but there's been a heated discussion about how to go about it in regards to his unusual design philosophy and place in the meta^note Unlike every other hero and especially other Tanks, he acts as an extremely beefy one-shotter whose threat comes not from shielding abilities, but kill potential and drawing attention. Several feel that without his kill potential, he effectively just becomes a damage sponge for enemies to farm ult charge off of. What abilities should be buffed in compensation? Were his nerfs ever necessary and should they be reverted? Or should he just be overhauled altogether? If I'm not mistaken, this is just Speculative Troping. Cut.
• Just about everything regarding Mercy's Season 6 rework^explanation Moving Resurrect to being a weaker basic ability and giving her a new Super Mode ultimate that greatly buffs her mobility, utility, survivability, and damage is wildly contentious. Fair, considering she could undo a pentakill with just the press of a button in her old playstyle? Or highly hypocritical, considering most offense heroes' ultimate similarly amounted to "press a button for potential team kill"? Is her new ultimate a fair compromise that makes her gameplay more interesting but remains stable, or is it just making her pander more to players that just want to play DPS and makes other heroes (like Zenyatta or Orisa) redundant? As well, expect any further changes (mostly nerfs) to be a point of contention. Another topic that every OW blog had an opinion on, especially among players like myself who tended to play Support. There were posts and jokes about bringing the old Mercy back long after the rework. The controversy lasted well over six months, from experience. It's infamous. Definite keep.

• As is usual for any multiplayer exclusive title, the friction between casual fans who play for fun and competitive fans who play to win is just as intense here as you would find in any other similar community. Casual fans think Competitive mode is a pit of losers who take playing a video game too seriously and get inordinately angry at what should be considered entertainment. Competitive fans think Quick Play mode is a cesspool of morons who don't even try to win. Too general. Cut.
• The game's forms of long-term monetization throughout the years have proven to be a constant source of debate:
  • For lootbox system of Overwatch as initially released: some players were content with the lootboxes being purchasable with real money, arguing the game gives them away every level up and in arcade wins, and that the mechanic being solely for cosmetic rewards kept its gameplay integrity intact, a generous offering considering other games that pounced on the lootbox trend began integrating more pay-to-win mechanics. Other players feel that the inclusion of such an element tarnishes the game's business model — the game already had an upfront retail price, so asking for more microtransactions was unnecessary — and that the system can be extremely frustrating when good things refuse to drop. Another argument against the system is how, while cosmetic in nature, the system doesn't take away from the fact that it's still tapping into players' urge to dress up their character, tapping into ethical debates around fear-of-missing-out and gambling.
  • Overwatch 2 made the game free-to-play and instead swapped out lootboxes with the battle pass system, and reactions became even more polarized. Supporters of the new system found that the more linear method of gaining rewards is much more appealing than limiting them to a dice roll of a mystery box, but critics have also accused it of being even more ruthless in terms of demanding players engagement, especially in light of having to pay for seasonal premium-level passes that introduce even more FOMO.
  • The new hero unlocking system in Overwatch 2 has its own can of worms. Unlike the first game, where every hero is available with no restrictions, all new heroes can only be unlocked by either by grinding the free battle pass, upgrading to the premium version or just buying the heroes with premium currency after the season ends. Defenders of this system claim that the grind isn't that bad and no different from similar systems in games like Apex Legends and Valorant. Detractors though claim that this system could become pay-to-win given the history of new heroes being over-powered at release. Furthermore, they criticized comparisons to other similar games like Apex and Valorant by pointing out how they lock players into chosen heroes for matches. In contrast, Overwatch emphasizes switching heroes mid-match and places more emphasis on hero abilities so that locking heroes has a greater impact on winning games.

• Due to the variety of playable characters with unique playstyles, many players often disagree on a few characters' places under Overwatch's Damager, Healer, Tank labelling system, which is a problem especially for competitive players due to the importance of team composition. Is Symmetra a DPS or Support hero? Is Mei a DPS or an off-tank? Is Zenyatta a Support or a Damage with a healing ability like Soldier: 76? Is Sombra really a DPS hero with her low damage or an aggressive and unique Support? Conflicts like this can be troubling when forming proper team compositions, due to equal parts of players who try to form teams on individual attributes to players who follow the game's recommendation system to a T. The Symmetra point is moot since she's a Damage hero now. As someone who used to main Zenyatta, the argument that he would fit better as a Damage hero came up from time to time. However, this was usually in the form of jokes about "Combat Zens" or whatever we wanted to call that player archetype. Whether or not it was particularly vicious beyond that, I don't recall. Unsure.
• Mobility versus Crowd Control versus Barriers. During Dive Meta, players claimed to notice a building "mobility creep" in Overwatch, with many characters receiving buffs to their mobility (Winston, Widowmaker, Hanzo, Mercy, and Symmetra, just to name a few) and new, highly mobile characters being introduced (Sombra, Doomfist, and Wrecking Ball, in particular). This came to a head when, for more than a year, a "Dive Meta" featuring extremely mobile heroes (Tracer, D.Va, Winston, and Genji) was nigh-unbeatable at high levels. Blizzard made several attempts to reign these characters in, culminating in the release of Brigitte, a character that excels in AOE damage, stuns, and knockback to thwart the mobile heroes. But this shifted complaints to the abundance of "crowd control" introduced to the game since launch (stuns, knockback, disabling, etc.). Case in point, of the eleven new characters introduced, EIGHT of them have at least one type of CC, while most have multiple types. This has sparked a debate over which is more overpowered: too much mobility or too much crowd control. Naturally, some players don't care what's more broken and would like to see both reduced so that characters who rely solely on aim or single-point defense could finally be viable again. ...And then, they got their wish after Sigma was released. Sigma became the third Tank after Reinhardt and Orisa to produce an exceptionally powerful barrier and, when partnered with one of the aforementioned Tanks, made it nigh-impossible for enemy teams to deal damage. Naturally, this led to complaints about barrier creep, which was seen as even worse than mobility creep or CC creep, because at least with the former two, things can still die. Could be trimmed down, but seems valid. Keep.
• Healing Creep versus Damage Creep. Since the introduction of Moira, there have been complaints about "healing creep" - an accusation that healing is way too strong and, thus, DPS characters are undervalued. Moira's introduction led to teams experimenting with a "Slambulance" comp ^note Four Tanks, two Healers which could outlast any form of damage. It wasn't seen as very viable at the time because it lacked too much damage as a trade-off for more tankiness. When Brigitte was released, however, she provided the perfect blend of tankiness, damage, and healing that allowed Slambulance to evolve into GOATS ^note Three tanks, three Healers which was argued as "proof" that healing had become far too strong. This perception continued even after GOATS was rendered impossible by Role Queue^note Preventing more than 2 of any character class, due to the release of Baptiste - another exceptionally strong Healer. However, the counterargument has always been that these strong Healer characters were specifically introduced into the game to counter dominant Damage heroes (Genji for Moira, Tracer for Brigitte, and snipers in general for Baptiste). Slambulance and GOATS, likewise, came into being because professional teams were looking for solutions to being one-shot by Widowmaker, and settled on adding more Tanks whom it was impossible for her to kill with one shot. Ditto.

• Stewie, post-Villain Decay. One side hates him for being a pathetic shadow of his former self, while the other loves him for being the most likable member of the modern Griffin family and for providing a good chunk of the series' humor.
• Brian. People either like him for being the Only Sane Man and his friendship with Stewie, or hate him for being a self-absorbed Author Avatar.
• Peter is either loved because his random and stupid antics keep the show entertaining or hated for being a Psychopathic Manchild and abusing his daughter for his own amusement.
• Fans seem divisive as to whether turning Quagmire into a Self-Deprecation avatar counts as an Author's Saving Throw or the complete destruction of his character.
• Consuela: Half of the fandom thinks she's an utterly hysterical Ensemble Dark Horse and a Fountain of Memes ("No... no..."), while the other half looks at her as being the Ethnic Scrappy who's only there to be obnoxious and troll the Griffins.
• Principal Shepherd. While some fans like the addition of another authority figure that isn't a complete idiot, others feel his increased appearances are unnecessary and that he's a poor man's substitute of Mayor West, even to the point of unfavorably comparing him to Gil Gunderson (who is also looked at as a Replacement Scrappy for a beloved retired character whose voice actor died in real life). Not helping matters is the fact that compared to other "school principal" characters on FOX animated shows, he seems somewhat boring and by-the-numbers- recall that Principal Skinner and Principal Lewis are Ensemble Dark Horses in their respective shows.
• Brian's cousin Jasper, is seen as either a rude conglomeration of nearly every offensive gay stereotype or a Nice Guy goofball who’s really not that offensive.

• Being a Long Runner, it is hotly debated among fans when (or if) the show went through Seasonal Rot, and whether or not it is still worth watching if it did. Cutting. The general opinion is that the show absolutely went through seasonal rot, and the poor quality of the later seasons is even lampshaded and mocked in a few episodes.
• Brian and Quagmire fans are quite divided over their recurring rivalry. While some have come to like it since Brian has started hating Quagmire back and evolved it into a Sitcom Arch-Nemesis dynamic, several still dislike the feud (and the increased spotlight it gets) as it revolves around the two characters' Flanderization of their most unlikeable qualities (namely being vindictive Holier Than Thou Straw Hypocrites). Keep.
• Season 9. Is it an improvement over seasons 7-8 or just as bad (if not worse)? Keep.
• Which Stewie is better: The evil Diabolical Mastermind Stewie of the earlier seasons or the nicer Camp Gay Stewie of the later seasons? Keep.
• Brian's death is either the best thing to ever happen to the show (for those that hate him for being said self-absorbed Author Avatar), or the absolute worst thing to happen to the show (for his own fans). Not a sustained conflict, since Brian came back just 3 episodes later. From what I could find, most fans seem to regard this plot as a cheap way to boost ratings.
• The storyline of Brian being kicked out of the Griffin household that lasted for three episodes ("The D in Apartment 23", "Petey IV" and "Crimes and Meg's Demeanor") Was it a great way of showing that the show continues to be Growing the Beard after several lackluster seasons earlier, or was it pointless to drag out an idea that's clearly better off only being a single episode? Same as above.
• Compared to the previous entries in the "Road to..." miniseries, "Road to India" (the final one) got a much more mixed reception among fans. Some people were happy to have another "Road to..." episode, while other people didn't think it felt like a "Road to..." episode, especially since it lacked a musical number and the B-plot with Peter revolved around him developing an obsession with bingo, something the show had done several times before. Keep.

• Whether games created by Team Symphonia ^note Tales of Symphonia, Tales of the Abyss, Tales of Vesperia or by Team Destiny ^note Tales of Destiny (and R), Tales of Destiny 2, Tales of Rebirth, Tales of Graces are the better ones. Fans of the Symphonia games prefer the simple TP bars and the more open movement systems in 3D. Fans of the Destiny system prefer the CC gauge encouraging fast comboing and Hit And Run Gameplay. Heaven forbid you if your favorite game is Tales of Legendia, which was developed by neither. This has mostly fizzled since the early 2020s, with Tales of Arise having had involvement from neither team. Rewritten to encompass some of the examples below, which are really just extensions of this debate.
• Like any long-running franchise fans will always debate over which game is the best, which party was the best, which hero and heroine are the best, and who the best villain is. Too general, cut.
• The fandom is separated into three camps, for the most part: Destiny purists, who look down on anyone who jumped into the series after 1998 as a bunch of posers (or even Phantasia purists, who consider the Destiny ones the posers); the Symphonia camp that joined because of the Newbie Boom caused by Tales of Symphonia, with each camp considering their game to be the apex of the series and the rest of the games, before or after, to being downhill after that; and finally the third, fairly well-behaved and quite small general Tales fans, who mostly scamper around and enjoy all the games, while trying to avoid being crushed beneath the previous two juggernauts lumber around the internet, slugging it out like kaijuu. This was a real debate but is probably similar enough to the Team Destiny vs Team Symphonia debate to be cut.
• The base has begun to break at how most games in the series start off as a Cliché Storm but become a Deconstructor Fleet. Some still consider the games' stories and characters to be good, others think that the formula has gotten stale and has lost its appeal. Others simply think that its premise of deconstructing cliches has lost its novelty due to how many other games also set out to be Deconstructor Fleets. Keep, this is a real debate between fans who have grown tired of the formula and fans who feel like without the formula the games wouldn't be Tales games.
• More recently, there has been a been a bit of a divide between fans who like the darker stories and bittersweet or even downer endings that more recent games have had, and fans who feel that the series is getting too dark to be enjoyable and that the unhappy endings make the stories feel pointless, and would prefer the series go back to having lighter stories and unambiguously happy endings.
• Due to just how many different versions of the Linear Motion Battle system there has been, there are of course a lot of debates over which ones were better:
  • Should the series have even "gone" 3D? Despite the Tales Series being one of the "best" transitions from 2D to 3D, some feel that the game series should have remained on a 2D plane since being able to flank enemies was cheap, while others feel that Destiny and later Hearts's battle systems focusing on aerial combat was a little too cheap.
  • Finally, Berseria and Arise not even featuring any "lines" and just letting the playable characters just run all over.
  • Whether or not it should reward offensive of defensive play - some games make it fairly easy to punching-bag enemies, while others make comboing difficult. Extensions of the Team Symphonia vs Team Destiny debate, merge into that point.
• Should the series use "HP&TP" (Usually seen in Symphonia), or "HP&Capacity core/gauge" (Usually seen in Destiny titles)? The nature of this broken base isn't so much that people like one and hate the other so much as debate "Which of these should be the norm?" Some feel the HP&TP system works because it would allow players to look at values to string together attacks and spells, while others like capacity core/gauge better because of the "Hit-and-run" style of play. Of course, Tales of Arise Took a Third Option and used TP and an "Arte gauge" system. Extensions of the same debate again.
• Did Sakuraba do better music, or did Go Shiina? Not really a strong debate, just personal preference. Cut.

Tales of Legendia

• Is this a worthy Tales Game that should get a remake? Or should it stay as an Oddball in the Series (Due to being developed by neither Team Destiny or Team Symphonia) and never be moved on? The game's worthiness as a Tales game was debated for some time. Maybe keep but rewrite to focus on that and not the remake angle, I think the remake bit is not really Broken Base.

Tales of the Abyss

• This game was overall the most polarizing game of the franchise when it initially released. Depending on how you feel about the story, it's either wildly melodramatic and overblown, or it's the high-water mark of the entire Tales franchise and one of the highest in the entire Eastern RPG genre, and relatedly, either a game its successors learned a lot from to improve themselves, or a game which its successors have never really managed to properly follow up on or surpass. Not many people take a middle ground. It's worth noting that in Japan, it was voted the most popular game in the Tales series in a Famitsu poll. Keep. People who love Abyss really love it, people who hate Abyss really hate it. There's probably more love these days than hate but I did know some people who really hated it.

Tales of Innocence

• Should it have been released outside of Japan, or should it have stayed in Japan and we weren't missing out on much? Cut. I don't know anyone who doesn't want the game released overseas for the principle alone.

Tales of Graces

• The battle system gained quite some hate on one end. Claims were made that it essentially boiled down to only dodge-and-mash tactics, and that players would be doing it over and over again to win. Not only that, but because bosses were able to break free of combos more than Tales of Vesperia, aerial game was off-limits, and that there were artes that left you open for enemy attacks (no thanks to the aforementioned combo breaks), it would be the same tactic with the same useful artes only used on almost every boss. Over and over again to win. This only seems to be a problem during solo runs, but it also happens with normal runs when given the chance.
  • In short the fact it plays much differently than what most westerners are used to (Vesperia, Abyss, Symphonia), even compared to Xillia (which played closer to the 3 games than Graces) Team Destiny vs Team Symphonia issue again, doesn't need to be repeated here.
• The base had another fracture when Tales Of Graces F was announced. Sony fans were overjoyed, while Nintendo fans were furious that they got an inferior version of the game with game breaking bugs going unfixed. In the western fandom, many people were simply happy just that they got the game period. Rewritten and keep. This was a hot button issue for a while because of the Console Wars aspect of it.
• The handling of Asbel and Cheria's romantic relationship. In the main arc, Cheria's unrequited feelings for Asbel made her eventually decide to move on and do things on her own, knowing that Asbel was too oblivious to ever realize things. Some people thought this was a lovely way to show their budding romance, leaving it subtle and not taking over the plot, with most romantic moments being relegated to optional side-quests; others thought this left their random hook up in the final cutscene that depicted one of their descendants being read to by an adult Sophie to be out of nowhere. Bamco vastly overcorrected this in R's Lineage and Legacies arc; Asbel now stutters and blushes around Cheria and the entire party has nothing better to do than to tease the two about their obvious feelings. Rather than appeasing the fans, this led both camps to discuss now whether it was necessary, saying that this arc was now too in-your-face about their romance and ruined the subtlely in the main arc and others felt it was finally showing what they had expected to see before. Keep, the main romance was a highly contested issue.
• The suddenly sprouting romance between Hubert and Pascal, again in the Lineage and Legacies arc. Similar to Asbel's ramped up acting around Cheria, Hubert now stutters around Pascal and generally acts like a typical Tsundere around the person they like. And the ending has Pascal's sister basically tell Hubert that he has her on his hands now. One part of the fanbase thought it was a quirky, funny romance compared to the sappy one Asbel and Cheria had in this arc, others felt like it was an Ass Pull of unnecessarily shoving two characters, who had no actual romantic relation in the main arc, together. Unsure. I think this was less contested than the Asbel and Cheria romance but a second opinion on this one wouldn't hurt.
• The extent to how woobiefied Lambda was. The fanbase discusses if his intense desire to destroy the world was understandable, due to his repeated torture he was submitted to for a long time. The other side says that it was a poor attempt to woobiefy him unnecessarily, when he is an entity that had no other purpose than to destroy things to begin with. Unsure.
• How Lambda was finally dealt with. Asbel talks with Lambda, who finally decides to reside in Asbel's body now and observe humanity, to see if it was worth letting them live. Part of the fanbase found this to be a nice change to how most villains are dealt with and gave Lambda a chance to see that his tendency to destroy things was not warranted, others found this to be a mediocre and very boring way to finish things off. Also unsure, but it's basically the same point as above.

Tales of Vesperia

• Arguably one for the whole franchise. Some people declare it the best game in the series and think the plot and gameplay are near-perfect. Others utterly despise its story for not focusing on Character Development as much as past titles and savagely despise how the vigilante arc is shunted to one side to make room for a global warming plot. Leaning towards cut. I think most people agree the global warming plot was shoehorned in and less interesting than the vigilante stuff.
  • The PS3 version fanned the flames after being released a year later with a great deal of additional content, including the fan-beloved Flynn as a playable character, and for not being released outside of Japan (the only Tales of of 7th generation for PS3 to stay at Japan). Also, datamining revealed that some PS3-only features were on the 360 version's disc. Thankfully the 10th anniversary Definite Edition included the PS3 new content and was available worldwide for all platforms. Keep. This was bad for a while for again, being a Console Wars feud. Tales of Vesperia singlehandedly moved Xbox 360s in Japan and gamers were furious they'd bought a beta version while the complete version yet again was exclusive to Sony.

Tales of Hearts

• The quality of the western localization. The state of the PS Vita market meant that the only feasible way to release the game in the west was to do it on a reduced budget, hence the lack of dub. Yet many other decisions around the localisation have also raised eyebrows, from the quality of the translation, to the character names (which sound particularly odd given the unchanged vocal track), to the choice of release date (which will have the game competing against a number of much more high-profile releases). Generally, fans have fallen into three categories: Those who are overall happy with the release (some of whom actually prefer the sub-only approach), those who have issues with one or more aspect of the release but still think it's better than nothing, and those who feel like they didn't put any effort into it. Real debate, though it has leaned more and more towards the Bad Export for You crowd over the years. Keep.
• The change from 2D to 3D. Some feel that the game lost its identity and plays more like a Symphonia game, when it was a "Team Destiny" production. Others at least appreciate that it performs significantly better on the Vita than it did on the DS, where it was prone to chugging even with only a party of three. Additionally, others have pointed out that it at least tries to maintain the aerial combat style in a Vesperia fashion, since the DS version could be easily cheaped by spamming items. Unsure. Probably ties into the Team Destiny vs Team Symphonia debate.

Tales of Xillia

• Milla's English voice acting. Several fans and reviewers labelled it as genuinely poor, while others found it to be an in-character quirk of hers, including the apparently purposefully-done lisp in her voice which is not natural to Minae Noji's normal speaking voice. There are also those who thought her voice acting started off fairly poorly, but improved as the game went on. Then there are those who simply don't like Minae Noji's voice acting, because she is not as good as Miyuki Sawashiro - or because she simply isn't Miyuki Sawashiro.
• Jude and Milla's relationship in the game. It's disliked because it leads to Jude ignoring Leia; neither he or Milla openly admitting their feelings for each other or the fact that it's implied that Everyone Can See It along with the Shipteasing, that doesn't actually happen. Others enjoyed it, because it was a romance that did not take over majority of the plot or was shoved into the player's face. The relationship is especially breaking the base in the English version, as there's an apparent lack of chemistry between the two voice actors (Sam Riegel and Minae Noji) and translation issues that left some of the dialogue lacking the more romantic or emotional notion in Japanese. Add this to the higher level of disdain for Milla already...
• The high amount of shilling Milla gets throughout the game. Several players found it annoying to listen to and not deserved, others didn't mind and felt it was appropriate for the party to react to Milla, who is a God in Human Form, after all. Honestly this can all be moved to Base-Breaking Character. Milla is contentious, you love her or hate her and all these points are related to the love or hate.

Tales of Xillia 2

• The fans of this game can be separated into three bases: One part is quite happy that Namco decided to go darker with the game, compared to some of the previous games. The second part is the opposite, thinking Namco went too far with going dark and caused Too Bleak, Stopped Caring. And the third considers the game to be an unnecessary stand-alone game that is filled with things that should have been in the previous game, making it feel like overpriced DLC. The "overpriced DLC" camp is especially strong in Japan. Not sure about the other two. I think people were happy at the time with the darker ending but have become fatigued with it because of the following games also having dark endings. Maybe Condemned by History or Ending Aversion.
• The translation altering certain interactions, especially between Jude and Alternate Milla. In the Japanese version, Jude refers to her as 'Milla-san' which indicates a subtle, but still distinct barrier between the two and how Jude does not consider Alternate Milla as close as he did with regular Milla. The honorific was dropped in the English version, naturally, but Jude also became much more easily accepting of Alternate Milla. Can probably go on Base-Breaking Character since this is again, all about Milla and whether you like or hate her.
• Milla's voice acting, again, now separated into Alternate Milla and regular Milla's work. Alternate Milla is more open, brash and filled with emotions, which some disliked as it felt so different from how Milla originally was, despite Alternate Milla not being the same Milla. Others enjoyed it, as it showed what Minae Noji could do. Regular Milla lost her forced lisp, which some thought was a good change and others disliked it, thinking it took a unique characteristic from her. Then there is a third camp that prefers Alternate Milla's voice to regular Milla's, due to the aforementioned increase of emotions. Regular Milla still retains a rather stoic way of talking in comparison. Ditto.
• The sudden focus on Jude and Milla in the former's later Character Episodes, which has an eerie feeling of comparison to the Graces example above. Some found it an endearing nod and bone thrown to the shippers, who would have preferred a bit more obvious interactions in the previous game, while others felt that it was unnecessarily shoved in for a pairing that they never believed to begin with and took focus away from what Jude's Character Episodes were doing: focusing on him and establishing him as more than a Satellite Character, with his own story of trying to get Spyrite technology to work. Said technology is still present in those later Character Episodes, but feels like it became a minor subplot that was ignored in favor of Milla and Jude acting awkward around each other. They Wasted a Perfectly Good Plot.

Tales of Zestiria

• Does the plot match the effectiveness of previous Tales games or is it just a stereotypical RPG with the Tales logo slapped on it? The skits and party interaction says the former, while the Lighter and Softer plot elements, predictable questline, and forgettable villains suggest the latter. Probably needs a rewrite, but generally valid. This game is highly contentious, probably the most contentious Tales game.
• The opening theme song "White Light" itself. Half of the fanbase find the song is weird and not fit with the opening or Tales series in general while the other half find the song to be refreshing from usual JPOP. There's also a third party that loves the song but don't like the animation that accompanies it. Never seen this. Cut.
• Sorey and Mikleo's presumed romantic relationship has caused for both backlash and celebration, though being a same-sex couple in a game that was expecting a completely different love interest, it was inevitable. On one hand, some are complaining about people suggesting it at all, while others consider them revolutionary and one of the most well-written couples in the series because of their chemistry and unconditional devotion to each other. Then there are some that question the validity of the whole thing, given the light amount of Ship Tease within the game. Sounds homophobic. Cut.
• The PC version being locked to 30FPS, the original frame rate of the console version (a bit of a Berserk Button for PC gamers, since their overpowered machines can run games leagues better than consoles). Some don't care, particularly because the publishers gave a perfectly good reason (i.e., it'd break the battle system^note To PC critics, tying anything to the framerate this way is considered a tacit admission of a flawed development process and bad engine, and not an excuse for the end product). Others swore to boycott the game because of the lock.
  • An unofficial fix to increase the framecap to 60FPS has been made, which has resulted in accusations that the porting team were too lazy to implement a fix if their own. This was a debate, especially when the fix came out, but I don't know if it was a strong enough debate. Most people agreed it was laziness/incompetence on Bamco's part.
• The game's dub cast has also split the base. It's generally agreed that Robbie Daymond, Alexis Tipton, Carrie Keranen, and Ian Sinclair did amazing with their roles as Sorey, Alisha, Lailah, and Zaveid respectively, but the rest of the cast is pretty divisive. Some think Kira Buckland is too bored and dry as Edna for example, while some think she's perfect for it. The biggest contender is Mikleo who's voiced by Michael Johnston. Much like Milla Maxwell and her English voice actor, many feel as though his voice talent doesn't quite live up to the character while some think he did fine. Never seen this, but maybe?
• The combat system is also this. The sheer complexity and amount of factors involved can make the system a huge turn off to some people, yet others love it for the same reason. The weapon skill system is either considered needlessly convoluted or a great way to customize characters. The armatization system is seen as an interesting new feature that allows the entire party to participate despite the Arbitrary Headcount Limit, or a criminally discriminate one that causes the Seraphim characters to act as little more than accessories for the two human characters. Need a second opinion here because I am on the strongly dislike side of the fence and am probably overlooking the people who do like this game and its combat.

• The first episode of the anime has a bit of a split base. Part of the fanbase thinks it's fantastic that it added original content and expanded more on Alisha's character, another part doesn't like it because of what Alisha ends up going through or find it just boring, while another part thinks that it was a big mistake because it was either boring or out of fear that it will cause another backlash.
• The decision to adapt the beginning of Tales of Berseria in episodes 5 and 6 of the Zestiria anime also divided the fandom. Some of them liked the change of pace, finding Berseria's darker nature more interesting than Zestiria, others disliked it because it used screentime who could have been used to adapt Zestiria's plot better. Others viewed the sudden inclusion of the Berseria plotline as a Big-Lipped Alligator Moment which didn't have anything to do with the main storyline.
• The second season of the anime. Many were disappointed, as it's loaded with filler despite its limited twelve-episode format and diverges from the game's story entirely. It consistently sidelines Sorey and the Seraphim to focus almost completely on Rose and Alisha. It also ends up contradicting in game lore from from both Zestiria and Berseria especially in later episodes. Some detractors of the game thought the original story was a mess, and the studio is trying to make something better rather than stick to an inferior script. While there are others detractors of game dislike the game's story but still feel as though the anime is actively worse than it.

Tales of Berseria

• Not even a week after the game's announcement, the fandom started fighting over Velvet's design. Some think she looks to be a badass female heroine unashamed to show some skin. Others say it's a creepy oversexualized attempt at winning back the crowd after Tales of Zestiria received so many complaints over how they handled Alisha and Rose. Also, there had been fighting over whether Velvet's design is an edgy new direction for female characters considering most other designs depict female characters in bright or cute outfits or a lazy rehash of the Gilchrist/Katrea siblings or a dark-haired Milla Maxwell with a terrible impractical outfit reminiscent of a '90s Anti-Hero. This was a genuine argument that got people angry on both sides.
• The game is confirmed to take place the same world as Zestiria. The fans opinion are divide into many groups. Some are happy that Zestiria's world will be expanded, some aren't happy because Berseria takes place before Zestiria due to a Cliffhanger ending. There are also fans who are not happy about it at all due to the poor reception Zestiria had for them.
  • The fact that Berseria is going to have to play janitor to Zestiria's numerous unexplained plot threads that it should have explained in the game but instead left hanging is also a source of contention as some welcome the chance to explore the world of Zestiria more and to improve the game's lore while some wish it was its own stand alone title and not a new game in itself. Ties in to how controversial Zestiria was. Maybe it could be brought up in the Zestiria folder.
• The way the death of Laphicet was altered in the western version caused controversy in the fandom. Bandai has issued a statement saying the scene was altered for the sake of keeping its rating. Some people are against the scene being censored, and think the company should just give the game an adult rating, while also claiming that it makes Velvet killing Artorius in a very specific way with a very specific sword lose the emotional impact that it was intended to have. Then there are people who think the whole controversy was blown out of proportion since Velvet's brother still dies, it's just a matter of how. In addition, because of how early this event is in the games story, it was very difficult to get around, with defenders pointing out that the issue really lies with the original cut of the scene since it being placed so early in the game means that there isn't a way to really hide or avoid any potential backlash keeping the same would be. There's also a third group of people who say the issue isn't with Bandai, but rather the the ESRB/PEGI ratings systems for being so backwards as to what constitutes an adult rating, and for being hypocritical since other games, primarily Western-developed games, that show the deaths of children can still "somehow" get away with a lower rating, and feel that it would have been better to not change it, but that it was a Morton's Fork for the developers. This was an issue, but died down pretty quick when the game was released. Leaning cut but wouldn't mind a second opinion.
• The ending is showing signs of becoming this. While a Bittersweet Ending is nothing new to the Tales series, several fans have expressed how they're sick of them and just want a truly happy ending for once. The biggest point of contention is Velvet's final fate. Is it a fitting end to her tale and a symbolic redemption of all the morally dubious actions she's committed throughout the story, or a needlessly cruel act of spite that goes out of its way to shoot down the notion that she may one day return like Luke or Sorey did? Others believe that after the sheer hell she's endured, Velvet deserved a happy ending instead of what she got. Response was much stronger towards dislike. Move to Ending Aversion.

I won't touch Arise because I'm not familiar enough with it.