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SFW-ness, the ad server, and Naughty Tentacles:
Cure CandyGOD DAMNIT ARHA!!!! .... some mod delete my thread...
Sorry, Raso, I felt that as the originator of the idea that I should be the one to go ahead and make the thread once it was agreed that we should do so. Didn't think anyone else would do it if I didn't take the initiative.
Cure CandyWas trying to get rid of the whole "be less prudish" thing that I have been labeled by doing some of the leg work. I am on the "be less prudish" side but not to that extent of not trying to fix Rape Tropes of all things....
Well, I take anything over nothing at all. So, no, I wouldn't, and I wouldn't be opposed to doing it personally, either, but then we really would have to clear which tropes we're talking about (there's a difference, as I've mentioned between Attempted Rape and Rape Is Love for example).Octo, I'm with you, but let's see how this pans out first. If we keep the creepiness out and put up the disclaimer, I won't be losing any sleep over that. Should the disclaimer extend to works that use these tropes without parody or pointing out how bad they are? I want to say yes, just to get the point across.
Okay, I just went through the Rape Tropes page and the thread blew up while I was gone. Note that I did not look at any of the example lists: Fate Worse than Death, Slipping a Mickey: Broader than rape (the latter is actually redundant on this index), as are some other tropes below. And Now You Must Marry Me: Not rape in the modern sense, though with an implication of forced sex. Mind Rape: Also not literal rape, just a sci-fi variant. Defiled Forever, Gratuitous Rape, Its Not Rape If You Enjoyed It, Marital Rape License, Old Man Marrying A Child, the "Rape is Okay when It Is X on Y" family (Rape Is Funny When It Is Male On Male, Rape Is Okay If Its Divine On Mortal, Rape Is OK When It Is Female On Male, Rape Is Okay When Its Female On Female, Rape Is OK When It Is Sci Fi): This is actually us pointing out Unfortunate Implications of the way rape is treated in fiction (or in the past), which is just the opposite of glorifying rape. The "Rape is Okay" tropes should probably be renamed as, in addition to sounding like we're actually condoning them, they're just plain uncreative titles ultimately attributable to someone who... I'm not going to say what I could say. Rape as Backstory, Rape as Comedy, Rape as Drama, Rape as Redemption, Rape Is Funny When It Is Male On Male, Rape Is The New Dead Parents: Similarly, these tropes are pointing out how fiction trivializes rape by portraying Rape as Backstory or Rape as Drama. All Abusers Are Male, All Men Are Rapists, Murderers Are Rapists, Rape and Switch: More Unfortunate Implications that we're just pointing out. Netorare Genre: Still not condoning anything. Droit du Seigneur, Honor-Related Abuse, I Have You Now, My Pretty, I Showed Her What A Real Man Is, Medical Rape and Impregnate, Pedophile Priest, Rape and Revenge, Rape Is a Special Kind of Evil, Rape, Pillage, and Burn, Scarpia Ultimatum, The Women Are Safe With Us: Rapist as villain, or at least unsympathetic. Some of these also fall into the Rape as Backstory / Rape as Drama category. Child by Rape, Rape Leads To Insanity: Not about the act of rape itself, but still falls in the Rape as Backstory / Rape as Drama category. False Rape Accusation: No rape actually happens. Just a subtrope of the Wounded Gazelle Gambit. Attempted Rape, Date Rape Averted, Near-Rape Experience, Symbolic Rape, "You're Not My Type": All variations of the theme of "rape that doesn't quite happen" of varying levels of ickyness. Rape Discretion Shot and is in the same spirit for a different reason. Anal Probing, Mate or Die: Technically could be seen as rape, but not really. Date Rape, Prison Rape: Actually comes off as People Sit on Chairs (in the latter case, has much the same problem as A Date with Rosie Palms). Bathe Her and Bring Her to Me: Not about rape, but iffy nonetheless. Sex Slave: An odd duck, as on the one hand the description seems to put it in the same category of "objecting to how fiction portrays rape" above, but on the other, by the nature of how it tends to be used for fanservice, I can see it being a magnet for the sorts of examples we don't need. Aliens Made Them Do It, Bed Trick, Love Potion: Iffy - legit tropes, but I can see why it could be read as "a way to rape people". Dude, She's Like in a Coma, Naughty Tentacles (pre-nuking), Rape By Proxy, Sexual Extortion, You Would Make a Great Model: "A way to rape people", covered relatively neutrally. Eek. Aren't You Going to Ravish Me?, Rape Is Love: Characters wanting to be raped, covered relatively neutrally. Eek. Abusively Sexy, Abusively Sexy Woman, But Liquor Is Quicker, Memetic Molester: No Just No. (This is without actually looking at the page.) And Now You Must Marry Me, Aren't You Going to Ravish Me?, Bathe Her and Bring Her to Me, Dude, She's Like in a Coma, I Have You Now, My Pretty, I Showed Her What A Real Man Is, The Women Are Safe With Us, "You're Not My Type", You Would Make a Great Model: In addition to the above-mentioned assessments, these are all stock phrases.
edited 6th Apr '12 2:50:41 PM by MorganWick
All of that (while good) is in the wrong thread.
I'm an Irene!See the link at the top of this page, Morgan Wick. Please put it all there.
Cure CandyYou would be a big help in the special efforts thread.
edited 6th Apr '12 2:53:14 PM by Raso
Hey, I started when we were only starting to discuss the Rape Tropes. In an hour or two it nearly doubled the size of the thread and got it knocked up (ba dum tish). Since Special Efforts seems to be focusing on renaming the tropes, where should I post my opinion on the proposed disclaimer? Because it seems like a number of tropes are only related to topics like rape, not actually about rape, and thus condoning them wouldn't make it look like we were condoning rape. For example, we wouldn't want to condone False Rape Accusation, but for a different reason. (This is a problem with indexes in general - have a look at the mess that is the Infernal Tropes index sometime.)
I'm an Irene!Disclaimer here. Trope suggestions at the linked topic.
Observeroh my god it's still going I'm in despair! This thread's level of activity has left me in despair!
Don't despair! * It's really important. If you didn't start it, somebody else would have.
ZzzzzzzzzzPorn Tropes have been stripped of Real Life sections from Aliens Made Them Do It through and including IKEA Erotica
'He strutted across the bedroom, his hard manhood pointing the way' sounds like he owns a badly named seeing-eye dog. 'Sit, Hard Manhood!
Nanako The NarcfaceWe should add a "No Real Life Examples" thing too.
"An MMORPG without a logout button? That's a bold decision, man!"
ObserverDAMMIT, THIS IS NOT WHAT I WANTED TO BE TVTROPES-FAMOUS FOR. -goes to the Corner of Woe™-
Zero-G Spot basically a Real Life section in disguise?
Kaspar the Friendly SpookMind if I make that my signature?
My Blog. ACAB. "The great are great only because we are on our knees. Let us rise." - Max Stirner
Spit takerYeah, I'd be wary of "Other", "Truth in Television", "History" and such folders. They tend to pop up from time to time.
"These days they have a stat for how many times a guy goes for a cup of coffee." -Mark McGwire
Faster than a laser bullet!I too believe it rather suspect...
Status of possible Fallout RP idea: Thinking of and open to new ideas. Just feelin' like a casual chat? My PM box is ALWAYS open!
There are other tropes where there's nothing to condone or condemn. Fate Worse than Death is a better example of what I'm talking about than what I went with before. By the way:
Stop with the "Is this a headline?" question. The people who fix things are here. The people who bitch about things are the ones who come in from a headline. Bitching won't help, here. We are by fiat out of the explicit biz. That is not up for discussion.To me, that's a sign the headlines aren't working the way they should, though that's off topic for this thread. Ordinarily, this should be the first kind of thing to get a headline. Going through everything we're doing without alerting the people who don't frequent the forums, to me, seems more antagonistic than alerting them to why we're doing it, especially if it doesn't change what ends up happening. If not a headline, this should get a page like The Situation, or an update to that page.
I went ahead and cleaned Zero-G Spot. It was just Real Life examples under another name.
edited 6th Apr '12 4:50:54 PM by JapaneseTeeth
Rape Tropes cleanup thread I know we're going Beige Prose on this. Does anyone want to look through Bastard Girlfriend and tell me if the examples are clean enough?
Examples look good. Description probably needs to be cleaned. I mean, it starts with "This woman is a rapist, torturer, or Domestic Abuser. And that's awesome."
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