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YMMV.Phoenix Wright Ace Attorney Spirit Of Justice
Bad example, because Nichody is meant to be the case villain. And his stupidity was only because he cared about his fiancée more than himself so naturally when she said "Save Sorin" he didn't hesitate. I don't think you're generally meant to feel for villains because... well... they're villains!
Edited by Klavice on Aug 1st 2019 at 10:02:59 AM
Troper Hikaru Hyouishi wrote some lengthy arguments for Unintentionally Sympathetic and Unintentionally Sympathetic about Anna and Shingetsu in the YMMV of Granbelm.
Spoiler alert for anyone who hasn't watched the show.
While I admit Hikaru does make some arguments, these entries look a bit too long to be taken seriously and come across as a bit biased. I'd like to remind everyone here that TV Tropes is not an echo chamber people can use to say whatever you want and not expect any consequences. I do believe there is a time, a place and a way to express those feelings, but this is not one of them.
Could someone take a look at Fire Emblem: Three Houses? The examples there are all really questionable. I don't think any of the characters listed are meant to be 100% sympathetic, if they are sympathetic at all, and the first example feels more like Dub-Induced Plot Hole if anything.
Here are the examples in question:
Edited by katethegr8 on Aug 26th 2019 at 2:37:42 PM
From YMMV.Young Justice
However, since Brion is being mind manipulated and being the Lights puppet, he still treated sympathetic.
Fourth is misuse. Kronya's a villain from the Hate Sink faction of the game, so we aren't meant to sympathize with her at all.
Edelgard examples can be axed as well, since Edelgard isn't meant to be sympathetic on the Blue Lions, Golden Deer and Church routes; she's a villain in all three. First is a difference with the localization writing as mentioned. Second is again about Edelgard on non-Black Eagles routes, where she's villainous and not really meant to be sympathetic.
With Rhea I'm leaning toward cut as well. The motivation for her actions is sympathetic to a degreenote Wanting to revive her dead mother and all, but in most of the routes she's not portrayed quite sympathetically, since even early on it's made clear that there's something shady and off about her through Jeralt's diary.
Edited by ILikeRobots on Sep 1st 2019 at 12:05:08 PM
YMMV.The Dark Crystal Age Of Resistance
I don't see what's unintentional here. She only redeems herself after this which she becomes The Atoner for.
Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaught on Sep 5th 2019 at 11:57:03 AM
YMMV.Steven Universe The Movie:
More than half of it is arguing against itself, what's left is Easily Forgiven. Cut?
YMMV.My Little Pony Friendship Is Magic S 9 E 15 Two Four Six Greaaat
This might be a keeper, but I'd like a second opinion. Are we supposed to sympathize with Smolder when Rainbow is technically the antagonist?
That's redundant with Rainbow Dash being Unintentionally Sympathetic. Cut.
I removed the following from Borderlands 3:
If fails to explain why she was supposed to be sympathetic. And there's other knee-jerk backlash against Ava making complaints against her suspect.
I've argued against this character before, as her entries failed to explain why it was unintentional as opposed to why she the villain. But after consideration I've isolated the unintentional parts.
The school shooting thing is the most radical of the criticism, but they are out there. Should it have a Rule of Cautious Editing Judgment warning? Is there a more appropriate way to put this?
That, plus the entry having been previously contested, is why I think it needs a warning against editing.
UPDATE: tweaked some of the words to hide spoilers.
Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaught on Sep 28th 2019 at 11:24:01 AM
Edited by MasterJoseph on Sep 28th 2019 at 12:30:35 PM
I think you isolated the parts that made Wallflower Blush unsympathetic quite well here. It gives exactly the right amount of detail, and doesn't seem like it's being nitpicky. I'd say it's good to go as-is.
Done. I tweaked a few words for the sake of spoilers.
UPDATE: I forget to add "nor showed the character flaws meant to explain this". Any objections to adding?
Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaught on Sep 29th 2019 at 3:43:42 AM
From YMMV.Batwoman 2019
In the first official trailer, Kate says she doesn't want to "let a man take credit for a woman’s work", referring to the public thinking she's Batman. Though likely intended to sound cool, the line received much flak online due to the perception that Kate was doing nothing but co-opting Bruce's tech and facilities and showing disrespect to her predecessor, unlike most other successors to established superheroes. It also doesn't help that it makes her sound like she just does this for the recognition, rather than actually caring about the people.
This is entirely base on a trailer and nothing shown in the series itself. Also, i tjink its complaining.
Considering the show hasn't aired yet, remove that. It's unfair to make these judgements based on promo material.
Edited by chasemaddigan on Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:37:13 AM
i removed this from the YMMV page on "Itchy & Scratchy & Marge", i don't think she was meant to be sympathetic in that episode.
What do you think?
It's a ZCE with weasel words.
I found this on 7th Sea:
I'm not too familiar with the tabletop RPG (I'm still reading through the books), but this reads less like a documentation of general opinions and more like a single troper has an axe to grind with this particular part of the game.
Edited by dragonfire5000 on Oct 5th 2019 at 1:21:24 AM
"It's a ZCE with weasel words. "
So should it be kept deleted?
Regarding the Marge example, the conflict is portrayed as morally gray. While she isn't really vilified for trying to censor Itchy & Scratchy, it's shown that her actions only served to make the show boring and unappealing to children. The episode concludes by pointing out her hypocrisy for not wanting to censor Michelangelo's David, and admitting her protests may have done more harm than good.
I'd say cut it.
From Unintentionally Sympathetic:
I'd be inclined to cut since: 1. They were not viewed as sympathetic by fans because they were widely disliked outside that episode. 2. The problem is Babs' was Unintentionally Unsympathetic due to the Double Standard and Broken Aesop as opposed to DT an SS being seen as sympathetic. They still encouraged Babs' actions and didn't try to rein her in despite it being worse than their normal bullying.
Should Unintentionally Sympathetic get it's own cleanup thread?
Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaught on Oct 12th 2019 at 10:51:52 AM
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How well does it match the trope?