The Scrappy Cleanup

Well most Star Wars fans have only watched the movies and not the EU where he's more likable so has he really been "rescued" in the eyes of the general public

At best, that entry lacks context. For the record, I'm unsure how true it is since I'm not very familiar with the community.

Edited by RandomTroper123 on Feb 24th 2023 at 10:35:04 AM

I have an entry for Yu-Gi-Oh!.

• Siegfried von / Zigfried Von Schroeder, the Big Bad of the Grand Prix Filler Arc, is widely regarded as a forgettable Filler Villain who recycles the traits of established characters (Pegasus being the most obvious). While he is meant to be shown to not be as clever as he thinks, the fact that the audience sees his plans were going to fail no matter what due to his lack of foresight causes him to be criticized as unnecessary for the plot. He is also hated for his overpowered deck and for knocking Jonouchi / Joey out of the tournament, meaning audiences never got to see a rematch with him and Yugi, while also contributing to the arc's Flanderization of Jonouchi / Joey into a Straw Loser.

Does this meet the standards?

From TheScrappy.Marvel Universe:

So...

Apart from the indentation issue at the end, and the Wall of Text factor, I'm not sure much of this qualifies for The Scrappy.

As it says, "Marvel is determined" to make him hated - he's unambiguously doing horrible stuff and the plot arc is bringing all of this to light so that others spot the Face–Heel Turn and confront him.

I don't think anything after "When the Krakoan Age rolled around" really fits the trope - it reads more like the creators realised the reaction the previous story had triggered and pivoted to a deliberate Hate Sink approach - so I'm very inclined to cut it (and possibly move it to that trope) rather than trying to tidy up.

Thoughts?

Edited by Mrph1 on Feb 27th 2023 at 10:44:20 AM

Hate Sink would fit a lot better. Recent issues have Hank using someone's decapatitated head as an impromptu weapon (it was Wolverine's head, so he was fine later), and deliberately designing his base as a giant skull. He is deliberately acting downright villanious, but the character hasn't been so entertaining in years.

Asis the entry reads like "Hank's doing bad stuff,and that's bad."

I've left a note on the discussion page as well, so I'll give it a couple more days. If there's no other feedback, I'll take that approach.

Found this on Law & Order: Special Victims Unit

• The Scrappy:
  • It seemed pretty obvious Dale Stuckey was intentionally written as one, given his obnoxious personality and the fact that he's treated as one in universe.

Not familiar with this show but if the entry states he was intentionally written to be hated, wouldn't that make him a Hate Sink instead of this trope? Thanks.

I cut the Beast entry because it contradicts entries for him in Broken Base or Base Breaking Character sections/pages. However, I believe some of the points made in his cut Scrappy entry should be salvaged and transferred to those in the Broken Base/Base Breaking Character entries in regards to the “detractor” aspect. Also, if it ever comes to it, it’s possible that an intentional Hate Sink can become too hateable to the point they become a Scrappy; and viewers/readers believe the work would function better without them.

That sounds closer to Hate Sink to me. If he's not written to be hated by the audience, then I'm unsure if he'd count as The Scrappy EDIT: namely because I don't know much about the community.

Edited by RandomTroper123 on Mar 2nd 2023 at 12:56:13 PM

Sawkman cut this entry citing Base-Breaking Character but I firmly believe that's incorrect and no discussion took place:

• Love Interest Amber in Invincible (2021) was overwhelmingly disliked by both new and returning fans for her Adaptational Jerkass behavior towards Mark. As one commentator put it, "You know it's bad when people on 4chan, Reddit, and Twitter all collectively agree that Amber was in the wrong." She frequently held Mark's time management issues against him before revealing she knew his Secret Identity all along and was hurt he didn't tell her despite the fact they had only been dating a couple of months, with the other characters in the narrative laying all the blame at Mark's feet as well. While there are some outliers in the fanbase who don't outright hate her, even within that subset of fans most seem to agree that her storyline was poorly handled and her characterization suffered as a result. And on the other side of the spectrum, you have fans cheering the scene where her comic equivalent received a black eye despite being a different person altogether. With Season 2 on the way, it's yet to be seen whether she'll be Rescued from the Scrappy Heap, but at the moment the amount of vitriol towards her character guarantees to derail most conversation regarding the show.

Returning fans hate her for assassinating a decent character, most new fans hate her for being insufferable/poorly-written, but a handful of new fans give her a pass for being toxic and abusive simply because she agrees with them politically and we call that base-breaking? For God's sake, on several occasions You Tube videos talking shit about her got millions of views with overwhelming likes. Calling her anything less than a Scrappy is intellectually dishonest.

Edited by stankykong on Mar 7th 2023 at 4:41:43 AM

I want to say Amber's been brought up here before, but I can't remember when it happened or what the consensus was, if it was even brought up in the first place.

The first time the six-month rule was violated and the consensus at the time was that it was a valid example but needed to go through the waiting period. Once it was readded there was another discussion on whether it should stay, with most agreeing and it stayed up for several months with no issue until the aforementioned user unilaterally removed it.

Edited by stankykong on Mar 7th 2023 at 4:44:15 AM

So does Frey from Forspoken count since I've heard almost nothing but vitriol for her character, namely for how unlikeable she is, her attempts at being a sympathetic criminal falling flat, and how generally pretentious she is with the dislike for her character likely playing a factor in the game bombing as hard as it did? I mean even if she was likable the game wouldn't have won any awards but at least it would have had its story and characters to fall back on.

Most of it is excessively vitriolic and often from bad-faith critics. The opinions I've seen from those who actually played the game say she's not amazing but otherwise fine and not deserving of that much hate. As for causing the game to bomb, hardly. The actual belief for why the game failed has more to do with a combination of the game itself being So Okay, It's Average, the trailers doing a poor job of showcasing what the game is actually like, and the game being regarded as prohibitively expensive, with Frey's likability being a distant fourth at best. It just seems higher because the meme-loving /v/ Hatedom is really obsessed with her for some bizarre reason.

Edited by AlleyOop on Mar 12th 2023 at 9:36:14 AM

Being a Scrappy requires a character to be hated by a majority of the audience relative to other characters. Forspoken lacked an audience to begin with.

Edited by stankykong on Mar 12th 2023 at 7:39:08 AM

And as mentioned most of the people who rail against Frey are from the Hatedom who already despised Forspoken to begin with and were never inclined to like her anyway. YMMV examples are generally troped from the perspective of fans (i.e. people who liked/finished the work or at least aspects of it).

Edited by AlleyOop on Mar 12th 2023 at 5:05:01 AM

I know we rag on game journalists but from the reviews I've read, nearly all of them rag on her character in the review so I'm not sure if it really is bad-faith that increased her hatedom. Even normally unbiased guys like Angry Joe, Yahtzee, Penguinz0, and others find her character grating so I'm not sure if it's just trolls hating on her. Here's a compilation of many big-name streamers groaning at her in general if you need evidence.

Putting aside the fact that there is no such thing as a non-biased critic, the fact that you'd pick Yahtzee "hates entire genres of games irrationally" Croshaw as an example of this non-existent thing is even funnier.

Fine I guess he's a bad example of it but still I've watched playthroughs and I can see why people would dunk on her but still it does seem like even those who have given the game a chance can't stand her as a whole. After all, if Ratchet can be listed (at least in game 1) despite his game being one of the most beloved PS2 games then it still gives the argument for main characters being Scappies.

Main character's can be scrappies if the work has a fandom that hates them. It sounds like this work only barely has that.

Currently Working On: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

To be fair, we allowed Alex from YIIK despite that "fanbase" being mostly a hatedom.

Oissu!

That's because YIIK has a fairly significant ironic fandom due to Bile Fascination. Forspoken doesn't have that, because its terrible marketing and overall mediocrity pushed most people away altogether, with the only people who continue to care being a Vocal Minority of obsessive haters and/or apologists in a sea of So Okay, It's Average.

Edited by AlleyOop on Mar 13th 2023 at 11:39:40 AM

Maybe it's because the hatedom that it suffered has died down a bit and a bunch of people started pointing out the qualities of the game, which does not include Alex?

Idk, not an expert of this either.

Due to unfortunate events, i will continue to exist until further notice. (also i'm fluid now)

Putting all of that aside, the game's only been out for like two months and the rule is we have to wait six before adding new characters. Even Creator Killers.

Edited by stankykong on Mar 13th 2023 at 12:35:03 PM

Could anyone give me permission to delete the entry for Zil from the Gone series (intended to be hated), who I mentioned earlier?

Also I looked at the scrappy page on Warrior Cats media page which doesn't seem to be the same as the mention of the series on the The Scrappy page. Anyhow as I said Firestar should not be on The Scrappy page because he's well-liked, and I also want to get rid of Rainflower from the media page because she is pretty clearly intended to be hated for the reasons she is hated. Is it ok if I could make it so the media page is the same as the The Scrappy page, and make these changes?