The Scrappy Cleanup

My thing is that in my experience Manny is hated the the reasons that the creator intended.

Edited by Bullman on Nov 24th 2023 at 3:43:58 AM

I think a lot of Manny hate comes from his actions in Cabin Fever primarily. He also has a Rescued from the Scrappy Heap entry explaining how he changed after that book.

I think Manny is a Base-Breaking Character. I've seen a lot of people who genuinely can't stand him, but also a lot of people who Love to Hate him and enjoy him for the memes. There's not much middle ground on him from the fanbase.

I was wondering if I could delete this entry from Pokémon as I don't think the character in question qualifies as The Scrappy anymore:

• The Mewtwo from Pokémon: Genesect and the Legend Awakened. It is quite unpopular with the fandom for filling a role that many believe could have been filled by the well-loved established Mewtwo character from Pokémon: The First Movie and its sequel, for having a voice and personality that contrast sharply with said original Mewtwo, for having no explanation as to how a second Mewtwo is even possible, and for generally being the Fleeting Demographic Rule personified. Even Miriam Pultro, its English voice actress and One of Us, knew that the role would be controversial. When Mewtwo returned for Super Smash Bros. and an episode of the Journeys series, they went with the original portrayal instead of this particular one, and this Mewtwo was Put on a Bus permanently with the release of Mewtwo Strikes Back—Evolution, a remake of Mewtwo Strikes Back. After the movie was released, it was discovered that this Mewtwo was created due to rights issues surrounding the original Mewtwo rather than something more oblivious or insidious, and fans criticized the fact that this hadn't been explained in the first place as it would have otherwise been an understandable (if annoying) reason for replacing the character.\\

As the entry mentions people have laid off Newtwo once they found out the reason for her creation, plus webcomics like Mew and Mewtwo have garnered Newtwo quite a large fanbase, by highlighting the differences between the twos.

Edited by Mariofan99 on Nov 28th 2023 at 8:20:00 AM

Newtwo is under/very much Replacement Scrappy, so I ask if the should also be under Scrappy if they fit the sub-trope.

Otherwise, I'd moving this to Character Perception Evolution as the hate against them has died, showing instead to their writing/handling.

Wouldn't that be Rescued from the Scrappy Heap?

CPE seems more accurate as the shift was caused by factors outside the show (which is allowed for that trope)

Maybe; I couldn't remember the scope of RFTSH.

So remove the entry, move it to Replacement Scrappy if it's not already there, and create a CPE entry for them?

Live-Action Films

• Thor: The Dark World: The Earth-based supporting cast, namely Darcy Lewis and her intern boyfriend, Erik Selvig, and Jane Foster, steal screen time away from the much more entertaining and compelling Asgardian characters. The girls are especially disliked: Jane for her underdeveloped relationship with the titular character that ultimately brought down the plot, and Darcy because many people find her just annoying rather than funny. The fact that many more interesting characters and plot points from the source material were shortchanged in exchange for her did not help. It's a shame since they were liked or tolerated well enough in the first movie, but this one just has no idea what to do with them. Later MCU projects tried to salvage their characters: Darcy via WandaVision and Jane in Thor: Love and Thunder. While Darcy's appearance in WandaVision won back most fans and is considered to have rescued her from the scrappy heap, Jane proved to become more of a Base-Breaking Character in Love and Thunder.

I'm tempted to cut as not consistently hated; being not hated the prior movie and the most hated being better received in their next appearances save Erik who isn't hated enough to warrant elaboration. Also compared to the films other Scrappy Malekith the Accursed, who's regularly brought up/remembered as the MCU's weakest villain, the humans seem more ignored than hated.

• Black Widow (2021): This incarnation of Taskmaster has very few fans, largely due to the massive deviations in almost every respect from the comic book character, one of the more popular Marvel villains at that, to the point that it's widely considered In Name Only (and even then, the civilian name has also been changed). What really makes it bad is not just the changes, but the fact that Taskmaster is reduced to a mind-controlled, voiceless mook with no personality to speak of that might have made the changes tolerable, making the character a Winter Soldier knock-off, even discounting the gender swap.

Not sure about how this works in relation to the consistently hated rule, given it's a hated portrayal of an otherwise popular character, but there's arguments for being separate. Maybe movie to Dreykov's Scrappy entry as part of why he's hated, being the in-universe reason they're this way?

I've been thinking about Heavy Rain a lot recently, and I think Lt. Blake (and maybe Captain Perry by extension) could count as a scrappy. Hear me out, while Blake is meant to be a hate sink (and so is Perry for that matter), the narrative almost bends over backwards to let him get away with his actions. Blake beats the daylights out Nathaniel, Ethan's psychiatrist, and possibly Ethan himself and not only is he never reprimanded by the police but none of them file charges against him either. He also gets away with pointing a gun at a federal officer if Ethan gets arrested and Jayden defends him. Later, he tries to have Jayden taken off the case and the investigation shut down (if Ethan was arrested the second time) before Shawn is found and with very flimsy evidence against Ethan. He is also a karma houdini in the best ending of the game as punishing him requires either Ethan or Jayden to die.

Thoughts?

Darcy does get flak for being annoying for many people, but she's listed as Rescued from the Scrappy Heap under WandaVision and I think we deemed RFTSC entries make The Scrappy entries redundant.

I wouldn't even say Malekith is hated, more that he's just forgotten and ignored for being boring.

In regards to Taskmaster I’d say either leave it or merge it with Drekov’s entry for the reason you suggested

This was added to TheScrappy.World Of Warcraft recently:

• Mizzen, the Warcraft Rumble Fanatic, is quickly becoming an example due to her incessant letters being sent to every player's character's mailboxes every day. What was initially meant to be a tie-in to the Warcraft Rumble game ended up becoming a repetitive glitch as her letters contain a quest item that becomes useless the moment its respective quest is completed, never mind about the players who don't care about said promotion whatsoever.

I've been out of the WoW sphere for quite some time now, but I don't feel like that qualifies. That's not really a character that people hate, just an annoying bug. Am I good to pull it?

EDIT: On second thought, I am just going to go ahead and delete. It's missing a lot of essential aspects of being a Scrappy, including being propped in importance up by the creator. It's just an ad character with an unfortunate bug.

Edited by MurlocAggroB on Dec 6th 2023 at 2:23:14 PM

Can a character be a Scrapoy if they were liked/tolerated in earlier entries but hated unnimously in the final installment? For example from the page for Halloween Ends

• The Scrappy: Allyson's characterization in this film was received negatively by many, mainly due to her ignoring Laurie's absolutely valid concerns that her new boyfriend is becoming increasingly dangerous. Cruelly blaming her for the events of the previous films and initially believing Laurie to have killed her actually Not Quite Dead boyfriend upon stumbling to the scene didn't endear her to many viewers, nor did her impassive and callous Bratty Teenage Daughter attitude about Laurie's Shell-Shocked Veteran status. Some fans also did not like how much of a relative backseat she took in her involvement in fighting Michael, nor does she get a chance to redeem herself by fighting Corey. To be fair, Laurie seemingly got over her shell-shocked status at the beginning of this film and falls right back into it over the course of the film after having a few more years out-of-story to deal with it. Although considering what Laurie has been through, you would think Allyson would understand

I didn't receive any responses to my previous post, so I went and wrote up my idea for an entry:

• While Lt. Carter Blake was meant to be hated for his Hair-Trigger Temper Police Brutality tendencies, many fans and critics alike hate how easily he gets away with it. Throughout the game, he violently assaults several people (one of which is an innocent civilian, not a suspect), declares Ethan to be the Origami Killer and puts out a warrant out for his arrest base on very little evidence, potentially points a gun at and threatens to kill a federal officer, and tries to get Jayden sent home before they find Shaun, all of which he does without being brought up on charges or being taken off the case. The worst of it comes in the games endings as Blake seemingly becomes a Karma Houdini in the Golden Ending and you can only punish him by getting either Ethan or Jayden killed.

If no one has any objections, I'll just go ahead and add it.

Edited by Professorchaos56 on Dec 8th 2023 at 3:12:55 AM

I think that entry is reasonable with a grammar pass. I added Cairngorm/Welegato to The Scrappy for Land of the Lustrous forever ago because she went from liked to absolutely reviled after the Moon Arc because of massive characterization changes she underwent and entering a very controversial Official Couple pairing with the Big Bad.

Edited by PhiSat on Dec 8th 2023 at 4:11:37 AM

Transformers: Dark of the Moon:

• Replacement Scrappy:
  • This was anticipated with Megan Fox/Mikaela's departure and Rosie Huntington-Whiteley brought in as a new character, as a lot of fans appreciated that Mikaela wasn't a useless screaming love interest and disliked that Rosie was a Victoria's Secret model with no prior acting experience. The potential anger was ebbed slightly when Rosie's character was named Carly after the G1 character and Rosie herself commented on being proud of being a part of the franchise. But to a lot of people's surprise, both Rosie's acting and Carly herself turned out better than expected, as Rosie wasn't a rehash of Mikaela as a blonde and she was consistently cheerful and friendly even through Sam's moody moments in the movie. On the other hand, one hilariously vicious review said that Dark of the Moon is the only movie that could possibly make you miss the acting talents of Megan Fox.
  • It's also clear at times that the script was written as though Mikaela was still in it, such as Sam having Mikaela's dog from the previous movie, and Wheelie, and the fact that the government is comfortable with Sam bringing Carly into their secret Autobot command base without any prior approval is rather forcefully handwaved, whereas Mikaela would have had the same protection that Sam enjoys, since she was there for all of the events that Sam was present for.

First off, the two entries seem to argue with each other (one says Carly is different from Mikaela, while the other says she's a blatant retread of her character). However, the bigger issue is that the entry acknowledges that Carly has some fans, or at least people that didn't mind her character, which means she isn't a scrappy.

Edit: Also, Carly has an entry on Base-Breaking Character already.

Edited by SharkToast on Dec 8th 2023 at 4:18:42 AM

I’d say add Carter Blake and get rid of Carly’s BBC entry given Mikelia has gained a better reputation in later years

Should Carly's scrappy entry be kept. And if we keep it, how should it be rewritten? Because in its current state it's a mess.

I would just cut it.

For Rick and Morty, can we say that the Vindicators qualify? Quite a few fans dislike them for being one dimensional Shallow Parodies of the Avengers, seeming to only exist to be a Take That! towards the Marvel Cinematic Universe, or superhero movies in general, and being Straw Losers for Rick. The miniseries tried to give them more depth, but fans felt that, combined with Supernova's exit being an Aborted Arc as of season 7, was too little too late.

I'd say no, at least as written, as it violates the no group rule. (Being 5 of them might be small enough, but they aren't hated as individuals.)

@Mariofan99 & PhiSat: I believe later/finale hate of priorly accepted characters requires it to overshadow/taint their prior reception as opposed to fans just ignoring their later developments. Cairngorm/Welegato sounds valid as it was all one work, Allyson doesn't seem this as it didn't taint her perception in prior works, and sounds a better fit for Unintentionally Unsympathetic.

Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaught on Dec 9th 2023 at 2:58:57 AM

One I'd like to dispute from L.A. Confidential:

• Ethnic Scrappy: Inez, in the movie (who is barely even given an identity other than "the Mexican girl" the Nite Owl suspects kidnapped and raped). She averts it in the book, becoming Preston Exley and Ray Dieterling's Girl Friday on her own merit.

Her role's reduced and YMMV on what that means for perception of character because in the books there's a lot of time spent on how she's so blinded with rage at her rapists, she causes issues in the police investigation and lets the real Nite Owl killers go free for years in universe. More to the point, while her role's reduced for the sake of compressing the book when adapting it to film, I haven't seen anyone blasting the character online, unless I'm mistaken I think this can be cut.

That's a ZCE since it never even describes why she's hated. With your info in mind, chop it.

Cut it. If it can't be bothered to explain why unintentionally hated not an examples.

Also, bottom post.