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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom from tall grass (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#198426: Jan 13th 2020 at 6:41:25 PM

  • Special 7: Special Crime Investigation Unit: Warlock is the magician leader of the terrorist group "Nine", and a dragon who holds mortal species in contempt. Having led a terrorist attack on an airport in Tokyo which killed many people, Warlock had taken a young Seiji Nanatsuki captive, intending to use him in a ritual; when Detective Luka Mizuma had interfered, Warlock had retaliated by breaking Luka's spirit and threatening his brother, Nijo Kujaku. Nine years later, Warlock orchestrates multiple crimes, including an armed robbery, and a political assassination with four victims. When Nanatsuki, now a Detective, and his partner Shiori Ichinose, interfere in his machinations, Warlock has the explosives expert "B" plant bombs in three office buildings, using magic seals to amplify the blast radius, while distracting the bomb squad to prevent them from interfering. After Warlock's manipulations prompt B to attempt child murder as a sacrifice, Warlock has Nine personnel take a mall hostage, resulting in the deaths of a number of security personnel. When Special 7 engages the terrorists, Warlock sacrifices them to summon a dragon in an attempt to take out Special 7 and the hostages. Weeks after Special 7 defeats the dragon, Warlock silences a witness by sending Luka after him. Posing as his own lawyer during his supposed trial, Warlock reveals himself, murders his decoy among others, and engages Nanatsuki and Ichinose in battle at the courthouse. In his final confrontation with Special 7, as well as the disgruntled Luka, Warlock proclaims that his power gives him license to do whatever he wants, before trying to eliminate the team. A narcissist who considers himself divine, Warlock displays the worst qualities among those who seek power.

Rawr.
deathnoteFNBOI58 Since: Aug, 2019 Relationship Status: A teenager in love
#198427: Jan 13th 2020 at 7:20:49 PM

@Master N

Aren't Sirin and Herrscher of the Void the same person?

Edited by deathnoteFNBOI58 on Jan 13th 2020 at 10:21:53 AM

MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#198428: Jan 13th 2020 at 7:36:44 PM

~deathnoteFNBOI58: From what I can tell, Sirin is the reincarnation of God Kiana but is treated as a separate character. The villains wikia entry has two different pages, one for Herrscher of the End, and another for Herrscher of the Void. It also states that End is a fusion of Void and God Kiana...? But also implies that they are all separate personalities? Perhaps a Buu situation where a single character has many personalities and only one really qualifies as a CM?

Honestly, this right here is why I wanted someone to actually look in-depth at Honkai- the information given from research is far too confusing to get a clear-enough picture to actually determine if any of the Herrschers can qualify as a CM. Previously, this confusion resulted in the Herrscher of Corruption getting cut for a misleading EP and the person who posted it getting a backlash for it. The nature of Herrscher of the Void/End/God Kiana/Will of Honkai/Honkai God/Whatever the fuck her real name is- it is a very confusing issue. Again, I will look at it myself if I have to, but I cannot, in good conscience, upvote Sirin.

Edited by MasterN on Jan 13th 2020 at 7:43:59 AM

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
G-Editor Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#198429: Jan 13th 2020 at 7:46:52 PM

[tup] to Warlock.

Now then here's Wade Jenning's write-up:

  • Angel Has Fallen: Wade Jennings, the head of Salient Global, is hired by Vice President Martin Kirby to assassinate President Allan Trumbull. Jennings would do so through drone attack, putting Trumbull in a coma, while killing his entire security detail, while framing his own friend Mike Banning for the assassination attempt; Jennings would also fabricate relations between Banning and the Russian Government which Kirby exploits to start a global war between American and Russia, a war Jennings intends to profit from. Jennings also attempts to kill Banning, while trying to kidnap Banning's wife and daughter, and later murders FBI agent Helen Thompson and her men once they learn the truth before attempting to assassinate Trumbull once more by, blowing up the hospital he was in, uncaring if he'll also kill everyone else there.

Edited by G-Editor on Jan 13th 2020 at 5:48:18 AM

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#198430: Jan 13th 2020 at 8:12:16 PM

Yes to Warlock, but can we try and cut that writeup down, please? I think, for starters, the last thing a 280 writeup needs is another completely redundant summary sentence.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#198431: Jan 13th 2020 at 8:12:53 PM

Was just about to say... did a 12-episode bad guy somehow get a 270+ word writeup? Let's focus on what needs to be said.

LordYAM Since: Jan, 2015
#198432: Jan 13th 2020 at 8:13:31 PM

Jennings is mostly good but I'd change the following. Angel Has Fallen: Wade Jennings, the head of Salient Global, is hired by Vice President Martin Kirby to assassinate President Allan Trumbull. Jennings would do so through drone attack, putting Trumbull in a coma and killing his entire security detail, while framing his own friend Mike Banning for the assassination attempt. Jennings would also fabricate relations between Banning and the Russian Government which Kirby exploits to start a global war between American and Russia, a war Jennings intends to profit from. Jennings also attempts to kill Banning, while trying to kidnap Banning's wife and daughter, and later murders FBI agent Helen Thompson and her men once they learn the truth before attempting to assassinate Trumbull once more by, blowing up the hospital he was in, uncaring if he'll also kill everyone else there.

It gets rid of a few grammatical errors

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom from tall grass (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#198433: Jan 13th 2020 at 8:19:27 PM

Cut the summation in the drafts, but may need a little help summarizing.

Edit: PM'ed ACW for help.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Jan 13th 2020 at 11:26:36 AM

Rawr.
HamburgerTime The Merry Monarch of Darkness from Dark World, where we do sincerely have cookies Since: Apr, 2010 Relationship Status: I know
The Merry Monarch of Darkness
#198434: Jan 13th 2020 at 9:44:51 PM

Is Vice President Kirby a clear non-keep, or is he still coming? I'll admit that the possibility of a CM for Tim Blake Nelson amuses me.

The pig of Hufflepuff pulsed like a large bullfrog. Dumbledore smiled at it, and placed his hand on its head: "You are Hagrid now."
G-Editor Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#198435: Jan 13th 2020 at 10:16:00 PM

Good luck Scraggle.

As for Kirby, I doubt he counts. Despite being a Big Bad who from hiring Jennings to assassinate Trumbull and trying to start a war between Russia and the US, Kirby spends too much time Orcus on His Throne not really taking direct action letting Jennings do all the work

@ LordYAM looks good allow me to do a little glamour for the finished product:

  • Angel Has Fallen: Wade Jennings, the head of Salient Global, is hired by Vice President Martin Kirby to assassinate President Allan Trumbull. Jennings would do so through drone attack, putting Trumbull in a coma and killing his entire security detail, while framing his own friend Mike Banning for the assassination attempt. Jennings would also fabricate relations between Banning and the Russian Government which Kirby exploits to start a global war between American and Russia, a war Jennings intends to profit from. Jennings also attempts to kill Banning, while trying to kidnap Banning's wife and daughter, and later murders FBI agent Helen Thompson and her men once they learn the truth before attempting to assassinate Trumbull once more by, blowing up the hospital he was in, uncaring if he'll also kill everyone else there.

[down] Yeah but Jennings is more involved with the plot than Kirby committing more crimes such as trying to blow up a hospital. I mean if you think Kirby qualifies you can EP him.

Edited by G-Editor on Jan 13th 2020 at 8:35:57 AM

futuremoviewriter Since: Jun, 2014
#198436: Jan 13th 2020 at 10:29:54 PM

[up]Kirby's aware of a lot of what Jennings is doing, but whatever.

Good luck Scraggle.[tup]

randomtroper89 from The Fire Nation Since: Nov, 2010
#198437: Jan 13th 2020 at 10:41:09 PM

Okay so they were a couple of effort posts for a ASMR channel, but now I realize how fetishistic they are, I am going to blank them.

Edited by randomtroper89 on Jan 13th 2020 at 12:58:28 PM

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#198438: Jan 13th 2020 at 10:48:00 PM

[up] Good.

Edited by AustinDR on Jan 13th 2020 at 11:39:34 AM

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom from tall grass (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
randomtroper89 from The Fire Nation Since: Nov, 2010
#198440: Jan 13th 2020 at 10:54:26 PM

Yeah, never mind then. Kind of awkward really.

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#198441: Jan 13th 2020 at 10:55:27 PM

Everything should be back in order now.

Edited by AustinDR on Jan 13th 2020 at 11:40:27 AM

ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#198442: Jan 14th 2020 at 12:25:19 AM

Speaking of very long writeups, these two from Criminal Minds seem way too long:

  • Ben "Cy" Bradstone, from "Proof", has a mental disability, which makes him unique, but not even slightly sympathetic. Pretending to be far more handicapped than he is, Cy lures women out of the public eye, forces them into his shed, rapes them, and then stabs them to death. He first stabbed their eyes out, but later evolved to using sulfuric acid to burn away their senses. If they don't like the way he looks, he takes their eyes. If they spit when he kisses them, he takes their sense of taste. If they don't like his smell, he burns out their nostrils. His video journal—which strongly implies many more victims—reveals that he has been like this since he was a young boy, and he gloats that he brutalizes women for the same reason that he used to beat his dog: because it's fun. We eventually discover that he is targeting women who remind him of his sister-in-law, whom he attempted to molest when they were both teenagers. When his niece puts on a cheerleader costume that reminds him of her mother she becomes Cy’s final victim. After his arrest, his brother Matt, who has always been supportive of Cy, going so far as to offer to let him move in with him, demands to know why Cy did this; Cy laughs in his face, and tells him that he has always hated Matt and was planning to deafen and then kill him one day. A ragingly misogynistic psychopath who just happens to be handicapped, Cy is fully aware of how awful his actions are, as evidenced by this message he leaves for Matt:
    What I'm going to do to your daughter, you can see on this tape. But what I did to your wife? Now that's a video you should see.

  • Alex Zorgen runs a Human Trafficking ring that sells women, regardless of age, to serial killers and other criminals online; at least 50 women have been killed by the ring's clients. In 1993, prior to creating this ring, he abducted a woman named Donna Goldhard, and kept her as a Sex Slave, repeatedly raping and torturing her for the next 22 years. From one of those rapes came a son, named Kyle. In the season premiere "X," Alex, along with his family, kidnaps a woman and uses his website to auction her off to a serial killer. As the season progresses, Alex has Kyle stalk the BAU's newest member, Kate Callahan, by posing as an attractive high school senior online to gain their trust of her niece Meg, and her friend, who are both 14 years old. He sends his wife and son to kidnap them in the season finale "The Hunt," but Kyle only catches Meg. Due to this, Alex murders Kyle, his own son, without showing any remorse and simply moves on with his plan to sell Meg online to a serial killer. He was later arrested by the BAU, but Meg had already been sold. When they ask him where Meg’s captor is keeping her, he refuses to cooperate and just taunts Kate about the things her captor is going to do to her. Having no regard for anyone, not even his own family, and only caring about selling women to his online human trafficking ring and making money out of it, Alex Zorgen is a sociopath in its worst form and among the worst the BAU had to face.

Now, I haven't seen the eps, but Zorgen seems an easy keeper, but WAY too long. As for Ben, I'll be watching that ep later this week, so I can try and trim that.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#198443: Jan 14th 2020 at 12:26:21 AM

Ask G to trimm it. Hes one of his.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#198444: Jan 14th 2020 at 12:32:02 AM

Ah, I was gonna look and see who did it. G, any way to trim Alex?

Late yes to Warlock BTW.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
#198445: Jan 14th 2020 at 12:41:59 AM

[tup] Warlock. Good luck Scraggle.

MenInGreyToBlak V Since: Oct, 2017 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
V
#198446: Jan 14th 2020 at 12:48:11 AM

[tup] Warlock.

I'm gonna switch to cut Whiterose, because... well, why did I abstain to begin with?

I'm gonna keep my abstain on Irving tho until someone knows for sure.

I counted the Mr. Robot votes. Tell me if I got anything wrong but I think it's pretty accurate.

Vera

Yes: Menin, G-Editor, Ravok, Demonduck, Theimmortalangel, Kylo, Imperialmajesty, Captainmarkle, Pemulis_128, Georgieenkoom, Xie 323

Total: 11

No: Falcontalons

Total: 1

Abstain: ACW, Miraculous, Cloistert, MGD 107, Bullman, Skycat, Libraryseraph,

Total: 7

Whiterose

Yes:

Total: 0

No: Menin, Falcontalons, Captainmarkle, Miraculous, 4311, Georgienkoom, Delphine, The mad cr0w, Bullman, Polarphantom, Cloister, Lighty, Mastern, Skycat, Pemulis_128, G-Editor, Kylo, Demonduck, Xie 323

Total: 19

Abstain: ACW

Total: 1

Irving

Yes:

Total: 0

No: Lighty, Mastern, Skycat, Falcontalons, Pemulis_128, Georgieenkoom, Demonduck

Total: 7

Abstain: Menin, Bullman, Kylo

Total: 3

Edited by MenInGreyToBlak on Jan 14th 2020 at 7:35:53 PM

captainmarkle Limited Patients from Behind you Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
#198447: Jan 14th 2020 at 12:59:43 AM

[tup] to Warlock.

Good luck scraggle :)

Trans rights are human rights. If you don't think that, please leave.
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#198448: Jan 14th 2020 at 1:03:02 AM

Huh, Vera's not as close as I thought. I'll wait for Tyk, but seems like Vera's the only keeper.

EDIT: I think Whiterose at least can safely be cut though, so I've requested that. Holding off on cutting Irving and submitting Vera though.

Edited by ACW on Jan 14th 2020 at 9:49:11 AM

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Bullman "Cool. Coolcoolcool." Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
#198449: Jan 14th 2020 at 7:25:51 AM

Hey guys. I'm going to take a break from this site for a couple days. I haven't been sleeping and I'm swamped at work. So I'm not feeling like myself.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#198450: Jan 14th 2020 at 8:09:15 AM

Got it to just over 200:

  • Special 7: Special Crime Investigation Unit: Warlock is the magician leader of the terrorist group "(Children of) Nine", and a dragon who holds mortal species in contempt. Having led a terrorist attack on an airport in Tokyo which killed many people, Warlock had taken a young Seiji Nanatsuki captive, intending to use him in a ritual; when Detective Luka Mizuma had interfered, Warlock had retaliated by breaking Luka's spirit and threatening his brother, Nijo Kujaku. Nine years later, Warlock orchestrates multiple crimes. When Nanatsuki, now a Detective, and his partner Shiori Ichinose, interfere in his machinations, Warlock has the explosives expert "B" plant bombs in three office buildings, using magic seals to amplify the blast radius, while distracting the bomb squad to prevent them from interfering. After Warlock's manipulations prompt B to attempt child murder as a sacrifice, Warlock has Nine personnel take a mall hostage, resulting in the deaths of multiple security personnel. When Special 7 engages the terrorists, Warlock sacrifices them to summon a dragon in an attempt to take out Special 7 and the hostages. In his final confrontation with Special 7, as well as the disgruntled Luka, Warlock proclaims that his power gives him license to do whatever he wants, before trying to eliminate the team.

Edited by ACW on Jan 14th 2020 at 11:36:34 AM

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts

Total posts: 326,048
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