Old Complete Monster cleanup thread
Welcome to the Complete Monster proposal thread! This is the thread where new Complete Monster examples are vetted, approved, and written up. If you're looking for the general cleanup thread (for cuts, rewrites, expansions, and the like), please go here
Important: Before suggesting any new examples, please read the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List; if you have any questions, the odds are high they are answered there. Additionally, please check here for the earliest date a work can be discussed (usually two weeks from the U.S. release date) and whether the work has already been reserved by another user.
Here is how the process works:
- If you have a candidate to propose, you can simply come right in and propose them! If the character's run is brief, such as a single issue of a comic book, then a simple summary of their actions and any potential redeeming qualities will be enough; for longer-running candidates, an effortpost (EP) might be helpful for organizing the proposal. An EP is not outright required, but please be mindful that if a post becomes too clunky and unorganized, it can be very hard for other people to follow.
- After the proposal, there will be a 72-hour discussion and voting period, where people may ask questions and vote on the candidate. The number of upvotes must outnumber the downvotes by at least five for the character to be considered "approved".
- Three days after the proposal has been made, if the character has been approved, you may post the writeup (the text to be posted on the trope page itself) on the thread and send it to the drafts page. Your candidate will soon be added to the CM subpage. If the work has a page, you should add your candidate to the relevant YMMV page. Voila! It's that simple!
Outside of this process, we do have a few ground rules:
- To keep the thread moving at a reasonable pace, there are some restrictions on when a proposal can be made. There should only be a maximum of four EPs posted both per page and per hour to ensure that nothing gets lost in the shuffle; additionally, each individual troper should only be proposing or writing up characters from a maximum of three works at a time (from initial proposals to end of their voting period). If your proposal would fall outside of either of these guidelines, we'd like to ask you to please wait until they would fit within; feel free to type them up on an outside document, and then when the time comes, you can just copy, paste, and post!
- No plagiarism of any kind. This is a very serious matter site-wide, as the website could get in actual legal trouble over this; as a result, this can very quickly lead to mod intervention. This can take many different forms:
- Direct plagiarism, i.e. wholesale copying. This is not only the easiest to find, but is also the most likely to warrant quick moderator intervention. To be clear, quoting in some places is perfectly acceptable, but it has to be very clear you're quoting from something else and it cannot be anything longer than a sentence or two - if you're quoting an entire work summary from Wikipedia, no one is going to believe you've actually consumed the work, so even if you cite your source, your candidate will be downvoted anyway.
- Self-plagiarism. Even if you can prove that you wrote the same text in both places, the site itself can't contain any of the duplicated text. If you already wrote something once before, it's not too hard to write it a second time.
- Using another site's work as a template for a proposal. Just because you don't copy and paste something directly doesn't mean it's any harder to detect if you're basing parts or all of your proposal on text someone else wrote. To be clear, this doesn't violate site rules and won't lead to mod intervention, but just like if you directly plagiarize, no one will believe you've consumed the work if you're clearly basing your proposal on something else. This thread largely operates on the honor system, and tweaking someone else's work to pass it off as your own is one of the fastest ways to lose trust.
- Votes must be for specific candidates, meaning no blanket voting (i.e. "yes to everyone I missed").
- If you are the first person to downvote a candidate, please provide an explanation of why when you do so. We're here for discussions above all, and a hit-and-run downvote doesn't facilitate anything.
- If a work is already reserved by another user, please don't comment on the work or any potential characters worth discussion before the discussion date. We know how exciting it is when a work has a keeper that you're waiting to talk about, but it's not fair to the person who reserved the work who is just as excited to lead the discussion to see the discussion getting spoiled before they get to do it. On the other hand, if the reservation only has one name attached, shoot them a PM - they may be down for a collaboration, which will get you in on the fun as well!
- Please keep the thread on-topic. While discussing the trope is fun and we encourage people to enjoy it, questions like "who's your favorite CM" are off-topic and can lead to thumps. That's the kind of question to take to people's PMs if they're willing. Similarly, while we encourage friendliness and familiarity with other users, posts should always have some kind of thread-relevant purpose; for instance, if you want to wish someone a happy birthday, feel free to, but if it's the only thing in the post, it's off-topic and needs something else alongside it. Again, though, while we strive for a friendly atmosphere, this is not Facebook; life updates are fun, but unless they have some kind of impact on your thread participation, please do not bring it here - we have Yack Fest for that.
- Please refrain from asking anything along the lines of "How Did We Miss This One?" In almost every case, the answer is simply "No one thought about it before". This Is a Wiki where everyone has different interests, and the fact that people missed a particular candidate, even one that seems like a textbook example of a trope or a character who is particularly iconic in pop culture, means absolutely nothing. The question is disruptive, has a simple and consistent answer, and provides nothing to any discussion.
- If you are suspended from parts of the website, it is still possible to participate!
- For users who are suspended from editing the wiki, you still have full access to this thread. You can propose candidates and write them up with no issues whatsoever; while you will have to ask someone else to post the entry to the relevant pages once it is done, all write-ups are considered thread-approved - as in, done by consensus - and thus doing so does not violate any rules regarding meatpuppeting.
- If you are suspended from the forums, your participation is limited but not impossible. It is still possible for a forum-suspended user to assist in creating the write-up for a character who has already been approved; as previously mentioned, write-ups are inherently considered a consensus-based edit and thus not tied to any one particular user. However, you can not assist in the proposal of a character; as a proposal is based around the forum rather than the wiki, doing so with a forum suspension qualifies as meatpuppeting.
- Please keep all discussions "in-house".
- What other wikis use for CM equivalents is irrelevant here.
- Please be wary of using other wikis, Fandom or otherwise, as sources of information. They are just as fallible as a site like Wikipedia in regards to accuracy because they can be edited by any user, just as this site can.
- Do not attempt to force a communication with an author in an attempt to gather evidence or settle a debate; besides the fact that this is a YMMV trope and thus author intent has variable weight depending on the circumstance, doing so may cross the line into drama exportation, which is prohibited site-wide.
If you would like to use an EP for your candidate, here's the general format. This format does not have to be followed exactly, but these are the main topics that need to be covered:
What is the work?
This is a brief summary of the work you're going to discuss. We don't need a full plot summary here, just however much we need to understand going into the discussion — it can even be as simple as quoting the summary on the work's page.
Who is the candidate and what have they done?
This is essentially the character's biography — who they are, their story, the crimes they commit, and, preferably (though not required), what happens to the candidate at the end. It does not have to include every single thing they ever do — for some villains, we'd be here all day if that was the case — but it should include the highlights of their journey.
Any redeeming qualities? Freudian Excuse?
This is where any potential redeeming characteristics or tragic backstory should be discussed. Do they have a tragic past? Do they show that Even Evil Has Standards or Even Evil Has Loved Ones? Maybe a Pet the Dog moment or two? This is where these should be discussed in full. Not every potential redeeming moment is a clear-cut disqualifier, but we should hear of any potential issues to ensure the character is discussed in full.
Are they bad enough?
A Complete Monster has to be particularly vile by the standard of the work they appear in. Therefore, you should look at what the character does compared to similar characters in the same work. This takes into account things like:
- Their resource level (a human Serial Killer can't stand up to an alien Omnicidal Maniac, but they can be bad by the standard of other human serial killers)
- The amount of time they have to work with (such as a one-shot character versus long-running antagonists)
- The quantity vs. quality of their crimes compared to others (someone with a lower victim count but far more visceral and personal crimes could be considered as equally bad overall as someone with a higher body count but less horror involved)
Essentially, this section is an analysis of the kinds of villainy shown in the work and an explanation of why this particular character's villainy stands out within it.
Final verdict?
This is where you post your final conclusion on the character in question. You can continue elaborating on your reasons or even just say a simple "yes" or "no"; at this point, we've heard everything we need to hear.
IMPORTANT NOTICE: This thread tackles very serious and dark matters on a daily basis. We will be discussing things like murder, rape, torture, human trafficking, crimes against children, and in particularly dark cases, several of these issues at the same time. We keep a lighthearted air, but all candidates carry the general assumption that these are awful individuals committing disgusting crimes. We ask that if you participate, you do so with the requisite seriousness such dark topics require; exclamations of how gross something is, whether serious or sarcastic, are disrespectful to the topics at hand, and if you cannot handle such topics, please do not participate.
And that's everything you need to know. Welcome to the thread!
Edited by Twiddler on Jan 17th 2024 at 5:42:49 AM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Yes to the duo.
What exactly IS the Leyline, or is it like the One Piece, forever a mystery?
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Not the Eye
What is the work?
Lasting Marks is Star Wars: The Clone Wars fanfic whose writer has deleted their account. Set during alternate version Zygerrian Slavers arc, where Obi Wan and Rex end up imprisoned in Kadavo Facility for weeks.
What has Keeper Agruss done here?
Cruel Zygerrian in charge of slave processing facility on Kadavo, Agruss has Torgutas from planet Kiros working in his facility under horrible conditions where they are starved and beaten by his guards with for smalest mistakes. When Obi Wan Kenobi and captain Rex are sent to him, Agruss becomes determined to break Jedi Master’s will. He orders his guards that every time Kenoby shows resistance they instead punish Torguta slaves, thought his guards don’t miss oportunity to beats Kenobi when Agruss isn’t looking, with him at one point threatening to skin his slavers when he gets worried they will kill Kenobi.
This goes on for the weeks, as Obi Wan’s will is broken from being unable to help slaves, while every day some Torgutas collapse from being overworked, with Agruss simply killing and replacing those. When he cauch some his slavers punishing Kenobi, he thretened to skin them before ordering Rex to heal Kenobi with what little he is given or all slaves will die (thought Rex reconizes it as empty threat). When Obi Wan wakes up after two days, Agruss has him beg for the life of teenage Torguta his guard Ganges up on after he collapsed from work. Kenobi of course does that, only for Agruss to have slave killed anyway after brief Hope Spot, threatening to do same to another slave.
As Kenobi is broken, battle of Kadavo commences as in canon as Count Dooku orders Agruss to threaten Torguta colonists to get Republic to back off. When Anakin goes forth with attacks either way and Obi Wan and Rex rebell, Agruss destroys control panel to make sure Torgutas die. Agruss mocks Obi Wan that Jedi woudn’t kill unarmed man, unaware that Kenobi is moment from going “screw it” and ending him, before being shoot by Rex.
Mitigating factors?
No.
Heinous standard?
Subjected populace of entire colony to horrible slavery, with children not spared, killing ones who cannot work anymore, and attempted to have them all killed when Republic comes to save them. Throw in nasty personal touches to Obi Wan in attempt to break him, which ends up having much, much bigger affects on him than in canon.
Conclusion?
Keeper is keeper.
I’ll take a potato chip… and EAT IT!
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to Agruss and the Outlaw Star duo
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Sure to Agruss.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Jogo
Agruss
Yes to Agruss and that's not relevant to the duo qualifying ACW.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Yeah, but I was curious.
More pertinently, is this just for the anime, or the anime and manga?
![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
Cool.
Edited by ACW on Apr 13th 2024 at 9:16:15 AM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Anime, I'll mark in the writeup.
Robin, Outlaw Star guys, Keeper
for Keeper Arguss.
King of the Koopas
Sorry for the wait I was on a cruise last couple of weeks but now I’m back to finishing my third and final Doc ock keeper out of all the ones I did this one is definitely the worst and most heinous so I saved the best/worst for last. Lets do this shit.
Whats the Work?
The Spider-Man Chronicles Trilogy by Megamatt 09 is a fanfiction trilogy retelling of spider man mainly based on the spectacular spider man series though it also borrows elements from other spider man properties
It's also a Gateway Series for readers as it's written in a manner that you won't need prior knowledge the Marvel Universe to read it.
It used to be on both fanfiction.net and archive of our own until the author took down the series as well as closed his account on the first site thankfully, the series is still available on archive of our own
Let's start off with spider man's first villain in this continuity.
Who is he?
Dr. Otto Octavius aka Doctor Octopus is one of the main recurring villains in the first volume who in this version is a megalomaniacal gangster and terrorist much like how he was until the 90s and future adaptations like Spider-Man 2 and Spider-Man (PS4) made him a tragic figure and mentor to Peter.
Once upon a time Otto Octavius was a shy and rather withdrawn mild mannered scientist who was an expert in many fields of science. His goal in life was to create a clean source of energy much like in Spider-Man 2 using Mechanical arms to aid him but to no avail.
In a moment of weakness Otto reluctantly went to work for the Kingpin who wanted to use his science for more sinister purposes though Otto still worked on his experiments in secret.
Unfortunately for Otto The Kingpin sabotaged one of his experiment Leaving him to be caught an explosion that fused his mechanical arms to his spine and driven insane
From that day on Otto Octavius became Dr. Octopus and dedicated his life to overthrowing in the kingpin and taking his place as the ruler of the criminal underworld.
What has he done?
In his Debut arc Doctor Octopus builds a machine called the Seismic Wave Distrupter designed to create earthquakes using it to break open a few bank vaults.
Ock sends some goons to collect some components until Spider-Man interferes and kicks their asses.
Doctor Octopus being the insufferable genius and bad boss that he is kills one of his minions with one of his spiked tentacles.
Doctor Octopus activates his machine forcing Spider-Man to choose between apprehending him or shutting down the machine to which Spidey chooses to shut down the machine allowing Doc Ock to get away and retreat to his underwater lair.
Returning in the chapter Doctor Octopus goes to camp Doc Ock invades the science camp Peter is attending Knocking out Fisks security before he grabs The Kingpins son Richard Fisk with one of his tentacles to kill him as a form of Revenge by Proxy until Spider-Man and Kitty Pryde intervene Doctor Octopus asks for kitty to step aside only to try and destroy her when she refuses. Luckily Spidey with help from Kitty apprehends him successfully and gets hauled off to jail.
Sadly, that doesn’t last as doctor octopuses arms brick in the Raven Croft and free Octavius in Dplomatic breakdown arc.
Making a third appearance in the Sinister Six arc Doctor Octopus Carolyn Trainer and his men break into a Vault and find Schematics of every major computer system in the city using it to cripple the kingpin and take control of his empire but as usual Spider-Man puts a stop to it though Ock and Carolyn manage to escape.
Doctor Octopus frustrated with the loss of his men decides to form his own team of super villains attacking Raven Croft, Hacking the security system and breaking out Mysterio Electro Sandman and Vulture respectively while also recruiting Kraven The Hunter.
Doctor Octopus then sends the five to ambush Peter and kidnap Gwen Stacy using her as bait for Spider-Man Threatening to kill her if spider-Man involves captain George Stacy the cops and doesn’t agree with his demands.
After defeating all five of the six Spider man finally reaches where Gwen is held captive and tries to free her until Ock ambushes him.
Ock attempts to kill the webhead until Gwen breaks free Doc Ock notices the base is gonna self-destruct which he initiated and flees leaving Peter and going to die but they manage to escape as well.
Doctor Octopus then goes into Hiding to take on his famous alias The Master Planner getting resources from AIM the Advanced Idea Mechanics
Doctor Octopus reappears yet again in the arc Up For Grabs using a machine That freezes the city leaves citizens of New York, including Spider-Man frozen and hacks into the police fequency causing internet loss ordering captain Stacy to handover power to him to which he reluctantly agrees.
A gang leader working for The Master Planner twists the deal and wants The Captain to hunt down Spider-Man and put him away.
Once Spider-Man arrives the master planner orders the gang to exterminate him where he stands.
Spider-Man tricks one of the thugs it’s a coming closer using whatever strength he has left to throw an uppercut and grabbing the belt to be immune to the effects of the master planners machine.
Spider-Man arrives in Carolyn trainer‘s office surrounded by the master planners men Then gets knocked out by a grenade Carolyn attempts to kill him, but Otto stops her because he wants to be the one to do it.
Spider-Man and Doc Ock begin their battle until Ock States this battle is pointless. Just tell him he’ll activate the device for real this time as the first two times were warning shots.
Doctor Octopus then gets into his Motive Rant and the full extent of his plan here as he’s taunting Spider-Man in a Sadistic manner
Spider man reluctantly gives up and stop fighting, right at that moment Ock grabs all of his arms and legs and activates the device.
Spider-Man deactivates it but Doctor Octopus reveals He set up a self-destruct sequence in case he wanted him, deactivated it and attempts to stay behind committing a Spiteful Suicide and a Taking You with Me.
Although Spider-Man escapes Doctor Octopus gets buried under the rubble.
Doctor Octopus emerges from the rubble grabbing both Spider-Man and green goblin until his arms malfunction, which causes Captain George Stacy to be killed.
Doctor Octopus unfortunately, is crippled and gets cancer due to Tony Starks unrefined Arc reactor technology, so Carolyn Trainer and Doc Ocks goons trying to retrieve the tablet of time to cure him even when that fails Carolyn says to Doc Ock that there is still time to find a cure.
But the metal armed maniac has no interest in getting a cure and decides to blow New York to kingdom come as a final act of revenge on both Kingpin and Spider-Man before he dies.
Doctor Octopus makes his final appearance In the symbiotic arc where he has his men retrieve components for a bomb That would create a shockwave And wipe out all organic life in New York.
Doctor Octopus notices Spider-Man wearing a black suit musing that he’ll peel it away for further studies after he’s finished him and destroy the city.
The Wall crawler and The mad scientist begin their final battle was Spider-Man under the Symbiotes influence ripping off each of Doc Ock tentacles severely burning him and stopping the bomb.
This is the only volume he’s in as he succumbs to his injuries and dies by the time the events of the second and third volumes start to take place.
Freudian Excuse?
Otto was originally a timid and mild mannered scientist, who originally wanted to use his genius for the good of mankind like in Spider-Man 2 unfortunately he kept getting unsatisfactory results so he went to the Kingpin to get a chance of success until Kingpin sabotaged one of his experiments and tried to kill him.
Once he becomes Doctor Octopus however he drops all pretense of his desire to help others and becomes a megalomaniacal Card-Carrying Villain bent on his goal to overthrow the Kingpin steal control of his title and Take Over the City
Redeeming qualities?
Nada unlike most versions he doesn't get in relationship with aunt May nor does he have a villainous friendship with vulture, electro, or any of the six.
He’s also a bad boss to his subordinates as evidenced when he implies one of his minions with one of his tentacles.
In his final appearance one of his men says he promised them a way out of the city if they help him but there’s no evidence that he would keep his promise given that he goes back on his word a couple of times like getting spider man to stop fighting him or he’ll activate the device then immediately activating it once he agrees.
Also unlike most versions of Doc Ock he has no qualms killing whoever is in his way when dealing with spider man like getting Kitty to move only to try and kill her when she refuses.
He treats his prized student Carolyn Trainer pretty well but but this relationship goes anywhere beyond business and there's no sign he genuinely cares for her whatsoever.
There’s a moment where he stops Carolyn from delivering the killing blow on Spider-Man but this isn’t an out of any genuine standards. It’s because he wants to be The only one to do it.
Heinous Standard?
Doctor Octopuses primary objective is to get revenge on the Kingpin overthrow him take control of his empire and become The evil overlord of the New York criminal underworld so he does the worst with the resources he's got as he limits them to New York.
He builds a machine called the seismic wave disrupter that creates earthquakes and creates underground tunnels for him to travel through to rob banks in his first appearance.
Attacks a science camp has his men knock out security.
Tries to kill Richard Fisk as Revenge by Proxy and Kitty Pryde when she gets in the way and refuses to stand aside.
Hacks Ravencroft security to break out criminals to form his sinister six then leaves Peter and Gwen to die in the exploding base.
Acquires a reactor from AIM builds a machine that that could freeze the New York residents then slowly kill them and cause planes and cars to crash.
And his final appearance has him become an Omnicidal Maniac by building a bomb and using it to blow the entire New York to absolute hell and wipe out all organic life in the city as a final act of revenge against the kingpin and Spider-Man before he dies instead of getting a cure.
In both his penultimate and final appearances he commits Spiteful Suicide and Taking You with Me.
Although other crime lords are featured such as Hammerhead Kingpin and other villains in the trilogy have bigger goals Doctor Octopus is the worst in terms of city-scale threat.
Final Verdict?
I’d say he’s more solid keeper than the other versions I proposed but what about you guys?
Edited by Godwriter on Apr 27th 2024 at 9:10:20 AM
The Ultimate Incarnation of Evil
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
"Third he was driven insane despite retaining his genius but the fact that he’d rather destroy New York and wipe out all organic living there rather than getting a cure shows he possesses moral agency and chooses to be evil"
This is the bit that concerns me. Are we SURE he's not too insane to count?
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
King of the Koopas
I’m positive everything he does is of his own free will. And he’s lucid enough to know right from wrong but chooses to do wrong as evidenced with going back on his word and choosing not to find a cure. And there’s no evidence of doc ocks moral compass being compromised.
Edited by Godwriter on Apr 13th 2024 at 10:14:04 AM
The Ultimate Incarnation of Evil
Here's the Titanic Creations candidates.
- Titanic Creations: Soul War:
- Erwin Rommel is depicted as a power hungry and bloodthirsty enforcer of the Nazi operations in Egypt and Libya. Seeking out the ancient monster Skureaus to empower the German army, the first thing Rommel has the monster do upon awakening is slaughter the workers at the excavation site. Rommel then sends Skureaus to siege Cairo, leaving it in burning ruins, until becoming bored of its rampage. Using Skureaus to fight and seemingly kill the ancient monster Titanicus, Rommel begins mutating with more of his cruelty. Rommel cuts ties with Hitler, creating a cult to his own name, regularly devouring his followers and prisoners, and running a slave camp where defiance is met with immediate execution. While batting the young hero, Wolfgang , Rommel prepares to devour the boy alive while mocking him for "failing" his parents.
- Griffixis is an alien monstrosity and the Hive Queen of an all consuming pathogen. Previously infecting a far off world, Griffixis wiped out all life on their planet, but not before the alien race created Nosferadon to stand against it. Eventually reaching Earth, Nosferadon infects two teenagers to its abducted victims, soon attacking a town as it grows big enough. Throughout, Griffixis displays a childish glee at its mayhem, through its infected proxies. Facing Nosferadon, Griffixis lures the latter into getting gunned down by Nazi missiles, before soon assimilating Skureaus, gaining a superior body and preparing to continue its rampage. When Tom Benson enters the soul realm to sever Griffixis’ link to Skureaus, Griffixis attempts to break Tom down with hellish visions. When seemingly destroyed, its two infected proxies escape and sneak into a crowd of refugees.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Comic books?
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
A coupla mammals makin' gravy
- "All The Ways to Hollow Out a Girl": An unnamed trio of sadistic youths accidentally murder the story's POV character, Nyssa, only for her to bounce back to life in front of them. Initially shocked, the boys decide to take advantage of this and Nyssa's unwillingness to fight back. The three proceed to spend their summer break killing Nyssa over and over in increasing gruesome ways; beating her to death, drowning her, and burning her alive. Finally the three of them decide to row Nyssa out to the nearby lake and chain her to the bottom so she can spend the rest of summer drowning, coming back to life, and drowning all over again.
- "Dermot": The eponymous Dermot is a chubby, unassuming man with a horrible Dark Secret. Dermot, who may not be entirely human, has a special gift; he can sniff out dangerous monsters, allowing the police to swoop in and kill them before they can do any harm, thus preserving the masquerade. Dermot is no altruist, though, and demands a sinister price for working with the police: children. Each day, as payment for services rendered, Dermot is walked down to the cells beneath the police department and offered a chained-up child, a process Dermot has been through dozens or even hundreds of times. When the cops walk back in, Dermot is naked, the "tools" in his briefcase already cleaned of blood, and the child is gone—save for their bones. Despised by everyone he works with, and luxuriating in this reputation, Dermot is a horrible allegory for the industrialization of child abuse.
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Yeah.
I've been planning on making a page for Titanic Creations themselves to link too, but I just never got around too it.
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Here's some Fridge Horror (that might not be entirely fridge): If Dermot is that bad, just how bad are the other "monsters"???
A coupla mammals makin' gravy
Here's the story if anyone wants to give it a listen. Really dark but really gripping stuff.
I'm going to abstain on fic!Ock right now...really not sure how to gauge that backstory without having read it myself.
Now we're cookin'! While nobody's lookin'! We're family! Culinarily!
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
I may give that a listen. I've been wondering about it.
Abstaining on Ock as well.
For my third slot...
What's the work?
The Butler is a drama film about the life of African American Whitehouse butler Cecil Gaines (Eugene Allen in real life). While racial discrimination is an unfortunate driving theme throughout Cecil's career and life, with even KKK members making an appearance, none are as bad as the cotton plantation owner from his youth.
Who is Thomas Westfall? What has he done?
An ill-tempered, licentious young farm owner who acts like he stepped off the Confederate South, he's seen strolling through a field of workers, his own family member looking on in horror as his eye catches Cecil's mother. Deciding to rape her, Thomas drags her to a shed and she screams as Cecil's father Earl refuses to act, telling his protesting son "It's his world, we just live in it." At Cecil's request, Earl tries to stand up to Thomas but a mere "Hey" gets him shot dead. Thomas then waves his pistol around demanding his workers resume, giving an angry "Who wants to go next?"
Cecil's mother is driven insane by the horror and Thomas' own family member trains Cecil to work in the house to keep him off the fields managed by the insane man. We last see him greedily demanding Cecil pile up his plate at dinner time.
Heinousness?
For a Starter Villain, the amount of fear he causes makes it clear his rape and murder—or at least willingness to murder—aren't isolated events and he's practically a plantation-era bastard. None of the other racists come close.
Mitigating factor?
Not much interaction between him and his family and even the racist matron is horrified by his deeds and grows to care for Cecil so "Just a product of the time" doesn't work against him.
Verdict?
I think there's enough.
Not the Eye
Thomas
Abstain on doc. Ock
Ultimate Moral Compass
Thomas
Abstain on Ock
"No running in the halls!"
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Is Cizin's simulation based on a specific incident or just his personality?