NATTER ALERT!

The whole entry on YMMV.Murphy Brown for Vindicated by History, not just the second level bullet, should be removed for shoehorning.

VBH has absolutely nothing to do with being mentioned by a politician or outlasting them in the public's view, but the show's critical and audience reception improving after it was less well received when it first showed. As I recall (over two decades later, with a memory that could give black holes pointers on how to suck ) that it was well-received when it was originally airing, winning and being nominated for a bunch of TV show awards and having pretty good ratings from the audience.

edited 25th Jan '18 4:05:36 PM by Nohbody

Next, I've found a LOT of Natter on Ready Player One. Here are two examples:

• Allegedly Free Game: OASIS costs only a token 25-cent subscription set-up fee, but doing just about anything costs money, including in-game fuel and teleportation fees. You can earn money in-game from killing monsters and running dungeons (demonstrated by Wade earning about $20,000 in OASIS credits from collecting treasure in the Tomb of Horrors), but without some initial capital to get off the starting world, it's essentially impossible. IOI is seen as villainous by ordinary people because they want to, among other things, charge a monthly subscription fee, and make it ad-supported.
  • The reasoning behind that being a problem is obvious, when you take into consideration people like Wade, who, IRL, are flat broke, evidenced by the fact he was just lucky to find the first task was set on what was effectively his home planet in OASIS. All the people who are effectively barely able to afford their basic needs would find their access to OASIS effectively cut off.

And

• Arson, Murder, and Jaywalking: When the Sixers barricade the First Gate with a forcefield, the Gunter Clans bombard it with "nukes, magic missiles, and harsh language."
  • The reason that the Gunters are working in an uneasy alliance is that IOI want to make OASIS into a typical profit-making enterprise, adding things like advertising spaces within the game world. However, what gets the Gunters really pissed off? They want to charge a subscription fee, when it's implied a large portion of people on OASIS can barely afford things like food and electricity.

Zapping the sub-bullets.

Edit: One more. This one's older:

• No Endor Holocaust: OASIS credits are shown to be used as a real-life currency; At the end, half the population of the OASIS, along with their credit accounts and items they paid real money for, was wiped out, yet there's no discussion or consideration of the economic effects of the sudden disappearance of such a huge amount of lucre.
  • The story ends soon after the egg is found, but it's entirely possible Parzival would bring them all back using his newfound superuser privileges.

edited 11th Feb '18 5:04:27 PM by jameygamer

Would the two sub-bullets on this example from Three Billboards Outside Ebbing, Missouri qualify as Natter?:

• Darkness-Induced Audience Apathy: Many viewers found a large number of the characters to be a bit too flawed. Mildred is a rude Anti-Hero at best, Dixon is a racist bully, and most of the town is filled with jerks who do nothing but deride each other. The few sympathetic characters like James and Robbie are either underutilized or Out of Focus to the point that there wasn't really anyone to root for by the film's end. Hell, not even Amanda's killer is found, making any possible character development feel rather pointless.
  • Backlash from feminist/social justice circles revolved around this, especilly in response to some critics' proclamations of Mildred being a strong female - criticism especially went to Mildred's conflicted thoughts about her own daughter, and the treatment of her and her daughter as a MacGuffin. It really didn't help that the film was specifically attached to "Time's Up" (which didn't yet exist when it was being made, mind you) during its win at the Golden Globes.
  • Similarly, some have criticized the film's handling of Dixon, claiming that it's meant to make the audience sympathize with and root for a racist. That Dixon is a racist cop during a time when America is grappling with the issue of racially charged police shootings just adds more fuel to the fire. In response, Martin McDonagh claimed that he wasn't trying to redeem Dixon or make him seem like a hero, and that the whole point of the film is supposed to be that real life is messy and complicated.

That IS a violation of the indentation rules, that I can tell you.

Natter on Balto.

• Adult Fear: All of the children in a town far from any near civilization are infected with a deadly disease, and their only chance is a sleigh team that may not make it back in time with the medicine. What's worse is that this was based on a true story.^note In the actual event however, adults were infected as well as children.
  • The scene where Balto finds the woodcarver making child sized coffins really hits it home.

• All of the Other Reindeer:
  • Most of the local dogs', as well as the humans', opinion of Balto, because he's part wolf.
    • Truth in Television, at least on the part of the humans. Wolf-dog hybrids, like all high-energy animals, should not be allowed around children unsupervised, if at all.
  • Averted on the part of the wolves. A local pack surveys Balto from a hilltop, howls cordially, and seems interested in him, but Balto turns away.

The first example could have the offending bullet incorporated into the one above. The second example, I'd just delete the natter.

Deleted the Truth in Television bit from the examples listed above.

The video game section of Chivalrous Pervert is getting a bit nattery. Some of the sub-bullets could easily be condensed into one entry. How should we handle the entries for series with multiple games? Should we go with one sub-bullet per character, or per game?

It seems to me that those would be one of the few places a third-level bullet is acceptable.

A generic example to illustrate:

• [franchise]
  • [Game A]
    • [Character A]
    • [Character B]
  • [Game B]
    • [Character C]
    • [Character D]

That makes sense, although I do think most of them can be condensed to a single entry per character (and fleshed out to avoid ZC Es.)

Ive been working to clean up Our Dwarves Are All the Same but the Discwold examples are frankly to much for me. Could someone help me to 1: Combine them into one example, I would suggest putting it in the Dwarvergent category and 2: Remove the discussion/speculation on the main page.

Hollywood Cuisine seems to be rather full of natter, bad indentation, and misuse (discussing real cuisine instead of fiction's misrepresentations).

Awesome.Dear America is both poorly formatted and full of natter.

Natter on YMMV.Stargate The Ark Of Truth:

• What An Idiot: Dammit, Mitchell.
  Mitchell: (paraphrased) Don't worry, guys, I killed the escaped Replicator, which had been hanging around unsupervised on our spaceship for a while! We're totally safe now! The only possible way we could be in trouble is if Replicators were somehow capable of making more of themselves! But that would be ridiculous!"
  • They all knew that the Replicator could make more of themselves, they were just hoping they could kill it before it did.
  • It was a reasonable assumption, since he had only seen/heard the one Replicator and only a couple minutes had gone by.
  • Nobody thought to bring a P90 or a sidearm when dealing with the original Replicator? Sure, you might not want to pop a hole in the ship but it's a hell of a lot better than the alternative.
    • IOA agent James Marrick and by extension, the IOA as a whole. The sheer stupidity that went into the idea that they not only knew how to deal with the situation better than the people who'd been doing this sort of thing for years, and thinking that they could use the Replicators without suffering any ill consequences goes far beyond Too Dumb to Live.
    • To be fair, the IOA didn't believe the Ark of Truth really existed. And even if it DID exist, the Ancients left it behind millions of years ago. What are the odds that after sitting in a cave for millions of years, SG-1 would find the device intact and functional, and find a way to use it properly? The IOA wanted a backup plan, and while it was a *bad* backup plan, they didn't have anything else they could put on Ori ships that would even stand a chance of destroying or taking them over.
  • SG-1 for taking down the force field holding the replicator without a back up plan if the anti-replicator gun failed, seeing as they know replicators have the ability to adapt to technology and they didn't know anything about who had created the program to have the Asgard core manufacture replicators.
  • And Marrick again for not telling them about the immunity to the ARG. Surely he would have know the Replicator would try and escape, leading to either a crew member destroying with a bullet, ruining his plan, or the Replicator doing exactly what it did in the movie.

Trimmed it down to this:

• What An Idiot:
  • Mitchell kills the escaped Replicator and just assumes that it did not have a chance to multiply, despite it being unsupervised for a period of time.
  • Nobody thought to bring a P90 or a sidearm when dealing with the original Replicator? Sure, you might not want to pop a hole in the ship but it's a hell of a lot better than the alternative.
  • IOA agent James Marrick, and by extension, the IOA as a whole. The sheer stupidity that went into the idea that they not only knew how to deal with the situation better than the people who'd been doing this sort of thing for years, and thinking that they could use the Replicators without suffering any ill consequences goes far beyond Too Dumb to Live.
  • SG-1 for taking down the force field holding the Replicator without a back-up plan if the Anti-Replicator Gun failed, seeing as they know Replicators have the ability to adapt to technology, and they didn't know anything about who had created the program to have the Asgard core manufacture Replicators.

Think it needs any more?

Does the Replacement Scrappy entry on YMMV.Fantasmic look like it needs rewriting?

Is this natter?

• What An Idiot:
  • Star-Lord for feelings getting the better of him and attacking Thanos while the latter is temporarily subdued by his teammates. This causes Thanos to snap and overpower them before they can get The Infinity Gauntlet from his hand. To a lesser extent, Mantis for jabbering about his anguish and Nebula for confirming why and not trying to restrain Star-Lord before he could attack Thanos.
    • Particulary jarring is his choice to pistol whip Thanos rather than blow his head off while he cannnot use the gauntlet to protect himself. Hell, even if a point blank shot to the head didn't work (it wouldn't have), it's at least a more effective way of damaging Thanos than hitting him in the head. What's worse is that his thrashing accidentally hits Mantis and was what broke her hold on Thanos.
  • Thor not taking the Infinity Gauntlet off of Thanos (or just bashing his head in with the Storm Breaker to kill him) the moment Thanos was seemingly subdued. He had to stop and try to extend Thanos' agony for retribution for the death of the Asgardians.
    • For that matter, Thor not trying to cut off Thanos's left arm or hand when he made his last-ditch attack on him. If that limb was detached from his body, then there's a good chance that Thanos would not be able to snap his fingers and get rid of half of all life in the universe.
  • Thanos trying to solve the possible problem of the universe's resources being depleted due to overpopulation by using the Infinity Stones to wipe out half of the universe's population, when he could have also used said Stones to create enough resources to ensure that this doesn't happen.
    • Then again, he could have considered that creating more resources would alter and potentially devastate the ecosystems of each planet. Doubling the sizes of planets would also have a negative effect, altering the gravitational pull across the universe. Since Thanos was willing to kill the only person he loved to achieve his goals, genocide of half the universe was a quicker and easier path for him.

From YMMV.Avengers: Infinity War.

Yes, but honestly those seem like bad examples (especially the one about Thanos) in general and should be cut altogether, IMO.

It was edited to remove the natter by another user. Now it reads as follows:

• What An Idiot:
  • Star-Lord for feelings getting the better of him and attacking Thanos while the latter is temporarily subdued by his teammates. This causes Thanos to snap and overpower them before they can get The Infinity Gauntlet from his hand. To a lesser extent, Mantis for jabbering about his anguish and Nebula for confirming why and not trying to restrain Star-Lord before he could attack Thanos. Particulary jarring is his choice to pistol whip Thanos rather than blow his head off while he cannot use the gauntlet to protect himself. Hell, even if a point blank shot to the head didn't work (it wouldn't have), it's at least a more effective way of damaging Thanos than hitting him in the head. What's worse is that his thrashing accidentally hits Mantis and was what broke her hold on Thanos.
  • Thor not taking the Infinity Gauntlet off of Thanos (or just bashing his head in with the Storm Breaker to kill him) the moment Thanos was seemingly subdued. He had to stop and try to extend Thanos's agony for retribution for the death of the Asgardians. For that matter, Thor not trying to cut off Thanos's left arm or hand when he made his last-ditch attack on him. If that limb was detached from his body, then there's a good chance that Thanos would not be able to snap his fingers and get rid of half of all life in the universe.

Like I said, the first one still doesn't work because we have a pretty clear precedent about What An Idiot entries not requiring characters to be emotionless perfectly rational robots. The Thor bit I'm less certain about, but I'm still inclined to say cut it (especially the latter bits).

CowboyBebopAtHisComputer.Web Media has a lot of Word Cruft, natter, questionable examples, and some gushing.

" An image for the "Bleach Has No Backgrounds!" meme had a shot of Bleach compared to a shot from Naruto and One Piece respectively. While this isn't a problem if you want to make a point, the problem is that the pictures from the other two were of cities, while the picture from Bleach was of...Hueco Mundo, a statedly empty and barren desert. Arguably, the real issue is that Naruto had a visibly bigger animation budget (possibly because the original manga's art style was inspired by AKIRA and they wanted to do it justice), and One Piece's art style (being more cartoony) works better with a smaller budget than Bleach's does. "

" When The Nostalgia Critic announced his appearance in the Entrepreneur magazine, we all went straight to or searched for the article online! But here's the thing: Mike Ellis and Mike Michaud have been mislabeled in the article. Plus, Doug and the Mikes are listed as co-founders and runners of Channel Awesome...but not even a mention of Bhargav? Moreover, the article actually goes into detail in another Channel Awesome website, the much less popular Chicago nightlife review site Barfiesta instead of mentioning Bhargav, when that site is actually Bhargav's pet project. Weird, huh? "

" Cracked has had serious fact-checking problems with video games in particular. It's referenced at least five times on the Video Games page. "

"TV Tropes tends to get this treatment an odd number of times, especially from social justice sites, which sometimes attempt to paint the site in a sexist or racist light. Many seem to be under the bizarre impression that mentioning sexism or inequality at all is the same as supporting it. Except of course when you explicitly state that racism and pedophilia is bad. As a wiki, the site has been subject to some editors on an overly enthusiastic Pædo Hunt that justifies the site's own criticism of some such groups. "

" The authors of My Immortal have been laughed off by most Goths (and really pretty much everyone) as "posers" and "mall goths", with one particular red flag being a glaring case of Pop-Culture Isolation in Chapter 33; in which they describe The Exorcist as a Slasher Film despite being one of (if not the) most famous horror movie of all time. And even if they didn't know what it's actually about is in the name. Yet again it's apparently called "The Exercise" ,so maybe it's another movie all together. "

edited 12th May '18 11:07:50 PM by lalalei2001

Periphery Demographic needs a lot of help in the examples.

Candy♡Candy's pages seem very nattery at parts, but I don't know enough about the series to fix it.

" Hate Sink: The Regans are definitely designed so you want to get in there and strangle them to death. Yes: Mom, daughter, son. All of them! (Though only the latter two are more prominent)"

" Creator Provincialism: Averted really hard: Despite being an original Japanese manga, not only does the whole plot take place in the U.S. and England, there is not a single Japanese character to help the Japanese audience empathize with the plot. This makes sense due to the setting (1910-1920). The closest to this trope would be the very subtle use of the very Japanese "Cherry Blossoms" trope. Specially when you know what it means for the Japanese: a reflection on how brief life is... which is used to great effect as Cool Old Guy Mc Dermott passes away while sitting underneath a blooming cherry tree."

" Misaimed Fandom: Considering that Candy Candy is a shoujo manga from The '70s, it had pretty revolutionary 'messages': "Be honest to yourself", "Don't throw away your own beliefs", "Work hard to earn what you get in life", "Don't give up on your purposes", "Romance is important, yes, but not the end and be all to a life". The fandom, however, ignores almost all of them only to focus on the romantic part of the plot, and specially on loudly complaining because Candy and Terry didn't end up together. Even older fans in their 30's and 40's, who should know better, fall into this trap. "

" Values Resonance: A shoujo manga from The '70s that isn't necessarily centered ONLY on romance and tells people that they can be whatever they want to be in life, as long as they work hard for it? HELL YES! "

I think YMMV.Rise Of The Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles needs a look at.

Found this on Man of Steel (2018), which looks like it could do with a rewrite considering it's borderline Wall of Text:

I think I spotted Natter for the new episode of Westworld, on Westworld S 02 E 08 Kiksuya:

Dear God, if you thought the Mesa security was bad to begin with, it is truly shocking here. Akechta is able to pretend to have an update installed over the course of four hours, and the techs leave him alone for this. He's able to explore enough of the Mesa to find Cold Storage and make it back without a single person noticing. By the way, he's covered in black and white war paint the entire time, and sticks out like a sore thumb. Adding to this, nobody noticed he hadn't been updated for nearly ten years, and had been exploring the park in the interim, completely off script.

comments?