During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
- Why do a cleanup?: This trope definitely exists and has a well documented history of use. That being said, it frequently gets misused to a character who meets one of the components, namely that they are smart, charming while not necessarily even being a villain, or create good plans. While these are components, there is also a certain personality required, not to mention that all of the above are required to be present for a character to be a true Magnificent Bastard. As the trope attracts interest, it unfortunately brings in a lot of misuse and I thought the best way to rectify this would be a Perpetual Cleanup Thread, as is being done and has seen success with Complete Monster.
- What makes a Magnificent Bastard: Below is a list of the individual components to make this character. Note that they must all be present, not just some, which has lead to frequent misuse:
- Must be intelligent: Goes without saying, to be a Magnificent Bastard, the character has to be smart in the first place and use their brain to work towards whatever their end goal may be;
- Must be a Bastard: While going overboard in how vile the character is can be detrimental, a key aspect is the Bastard part of the trope, whether the character is an out-and-out antagonist in the work, some manner of Villain Protagonist, or something in between, they at least have some unscrupulous qualities to qualify for this trope;
- Must not be too detestable: Again, there is a ceiling on how bad the character can be before they just become too nefarious, blocking out the Magnificent part of the trope. A genocidal racist or child-raping Sadist aren't going to make the cut;
- Think on their feet: In addition to being a Chessmaster, a Magnificent Bastard, if the character deals with situations in which their initial plan is ruined, has to be able to pull a Xanatos Speed Chess and at least come up with a competent strategy to make up for lost time, otherwise they fail for being unable to think in tough spots;
- Have charm: Even if they don't necessarily make every character they meet fall in love with them and can even be detested by others, the audience has to find an amicable social relation to the character, or they are failing to make the impact required for this trope.
- What to do if a character is listed on a page but has not been approved?: They need to be removed, all candidates need to come through the cleanup thread first. The character could well count but they need to be analyzed properly and voted on first.
- Do we list Playing With this trope?: No; as a YMMV trope, this cannot be Played With, so we only want examples that are Played Straight.
- What do I do if I want a character to be listed as a Magnificent Bastard?: The greatest success Complete Monster saw for its cleanup effort was from the invention of the effort post format, so, borrowing from that, a troper wishing to propose a Magnificent Bastard will create such a post in the following format:
- Begin by describing The work, this will help establish the setting the character is in and for the reader to understand what kind of a scenario they are in;
- Summarize The character's actions, this will provide a listing for readers to understand what they do and how it applies to this trope because charm and lack of smugness are so crucial, this is a good time to be incorporating exactly the flavor of how they operate to explain this;
- List circumstances in which the character must Think on their feet, these are times where a wrench might be thrown in their initial plan and they have to adapt on the spot or even come up with a new scheme all together, this is also a good time to explain how the villain reacts to defeat when they have to face it, a true Magnificent Bastard won't break down into tears at the thought of death, they should have known such a possibility could occur and be able to handle it with more dignity;
- The competition, similar to the Heinous Standard dealt with for a Complete Monster, this section is to deal with how successful the character is in carrying out their plans compared to other characters. While, as a villain, they probably are going to lose in the end, it is good to explain how other characters handle the same situation. There is no exceptionalism case to be made for this trope but explaining the variety helps the reader have a better understanding of the proposal.
- How do you know when the character's arc is done so they can be proposed? When their tenure as a villain or antagonist finishes. This could happen in a single Story Arc in an entire work, a single work of a franchise, or the whole series in general. We'll show lenience to Long-Runners with constantly recurring candidates or series with outstanding continuities (ex. comic books), and it's entirely possible to count in a work or two but not in general for a reason like Depending on the Writer.
- What about candidates evil because of external sources? Those Made of Evil can qualify if they show enough individuality and tactical acumen — in other words, they have the personality to fulfill the magnificence requirement. Conversely, those brainwashed, especially if they're a better person without it, may fail the individuality aspect and cannot count.
- What if they are under orders from a higher-up? Depends. If the boss created the plans down to the letter and the candidate is just following them, sounds like we should discuss the boss instead. However, if the candidate takes creative liberties with the orders, adds their own charm and flair to them, fills in holes in the orders, and/or actively deals with obstacles their boss did not talk about, the candidate shows enough individual thinking to qualify.
- What about Character Development? An MB is something a character can develop into... a nice person who plots well might become more morally gray as the work goes on and hits the "Bastard" criteria, thus making them viable. Likewise, a Smug Snake might shed their ego, become more understanding of the threat others pose and gain the personality or "Magnificent" criteria, likewise making them viable. Conversely, a character who looks like this trope might suffer from a Sanity Slippage or just get outed as not being as smart as they thought they were and become incompatible with MB.
- Can an MB be a good guy? Not in the conventional sense... it is required they have at least some dubious traits lest they fail the "Bastard" criteria. That being said, a character who pulls a Heel–Face Turn or eventually stops taking villainous actions is still fair game: as there was a point in time where they were both "Magnificent" and a "Bastard" at the same time and they've merely adapted as time goes on. Now... if such a character begins showing other issues (i.e.: becomes prone to freak outs or starts getting outwitted) then they're compromising their Magnificence and will probably be deemed a cut. What's important is stylishly operating while at least for some time being willing to take at best underhanded methods to see a job done. A Heel–Face Turn in itself isn't a disqualifier but they do have to have been "Magnificent" and a "Bastard" at the same time and afterwards can't start slipping on the former front.
- What about characters whose stories can take different routes?: When proposing a character in a form of media that has them in multiple story routes. Said character must be consistent with their characteristics in all routes. (ex.: Can't have an example who shows promise on one route yet fails in another.) The only exception is if a later installment of the series confirms the character's actions which made them worth proposing are the canon route.
- Is there a timeframe rule like with Complete Monster?: Yes, please wait two weeks until after the work has concluded before proposing a character (again, usually using the North American air date). As is the case with CM, we want to give a reasonable time frame so that everyone interested in seeing the work has done so and can participate in the discussion without having anything spoiled.
- What about groups like with Complete Monster?: This is a point of divergence between the two tropes. While CM does not allow for a single entry encompassing more than three characters lest their heinousness for crimes becomes too watered down, with MB as long as they are treated as one "unit" it is acceptable to lump all characters provided they share acts of charm and intelligence.
- Can I propose my own work's character as a Magnificent Bastard?: No, this is a YMMV subject and the creator of a content is way too biased to be able to evaluate the criteria we're looking for without a second opinion taking over. That being said, you are more than welcome to encourage someone to consume your creation and if they feel a character counts, are more than welcome to suggest them.
- My example/edit has been approved, but the example subpage is locked! How do I get it added?: The moderators do not add examples to locked example subpages in the MagnificentBastard/ namespace directly. Rather, you need to do the edit to a sandbox page that follows the format Sandbox.MagnificentBastard<Name of the example subpage> (e.g for MagnificentBastard.Fullmetal Alchemist it's Sandbox.Magnificent Bastard Fullmetal Alchemist) and on a Friday, ask in the locked pages edit requests thread for the content to be swapped in.
Thread rules
When voting a troper must specify the effort post they're voting on and cannot merely vote on "Everything I missed" as in the past it has indicated the poster didn't read the effort post and is guessing instead of analyzing.
Resolved items
In general, a character listed on this trope is considered "settled". This means they should not be challenged unless information used to list them was incorrect or information was missed in the initial discussion.
However, when re-litigating a candidate, the same rules apply for when they were originally proposed. If they do not have five or more upvotes than downvotes for approval upon a re-litigation, including votes from the initial discussion if they do not change, then they are a cut.
This especially applies to the characters listed below, who have been discussed excessively and repeated attempts to get them listed/cut may result in punitive action for bogging down the thread.
Definitely an MB
- Pokémon Mystery Dungeon: Explorers: Any sadism Darkrai displays is limited in effect thanks to the game's nature and any cowardice which can be inferred about him is Alternative Character Interpretation about his tactical retreats.
- Avatar: The Last Airbender: Azula's Villainous Breakdown is undone in the sequel comic Smoke & Shadow where she regains her composure and ends up stable and in control enough to count.
Definitely not an MB
- South Park: The show's frequent use of vulgar comedy and mean-spirited humor leaves any potential candidates devoid of the dignity or charm to qualify.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:15:22 AM
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to the Abridged Major. The comedic tone really does him wonders ...
Also can we update Abridged Alucard's entry? I feel like it should at least mention him consoling millions of souls to return from his demise and/or threatening the round table into removing debt (even if that wasn't intentional). Both are moments of manipulation he didn't have in the original.
Edited by Idisagree on May 2nd 2022 at 7:31:17 AM
Sorry that I've been on such a losing streak. Maybe this guy will break it. He was the fist guy I thought of when I decided to do Good Guys characters. He was even more likable than I remembered, but also not quite as bastardly. Whether he makes the cut is up to you.
Work
The Good Guys
Character Carson Pulaski (alias Long) is a friendly man trying to make something out of his new business, but he has some secrets that Jack and Liz, hsi new guests, threaten to expose.
What does he do?
He's introduced being a polite host in a very nicely made hotel ($299 a day in 2010 money). He says he wanted the house to remind him of happy young couples after his marriage failed. He's a bit nervous when he hears Jack is a cop but covers it by sounding pleasantly curios and saying he's yet to have a cop as a guest.
Jack is suspicious but Liz brushes it off, a flashback shows Carson and his Manchild accomplice Tyler planting explosives in front on an armored car and blowing it as the truck passes over, knock gin th guards unconscious. They don masks and charge the truck.
In the present, Carson makes some good requests abotu what they want for breakfast and bed but when Jack hears he bought his outfitting for the hotel from Julius the thief, he's suspicious and Jack investigates and asks for a background check. Dan follows up on Jack's request and learns Carson used suspiciously new money and a different last name dealing with Julius. Their investigation alerts his wife Marion. A flashback shows Carson robbing Tyler so this can be his last job and saying he doesn't want to hurt Tyler but does want him not to get up before counting to a hundred. Dan shows up asking for Carson's financials and Carson says he has paperwork but hits Dan with a vase and tries to run. Dan captures him and the reveal Jack was working on the vacation make Jack and Liz fight.
Carson smoothly lies that he got the motel with money from racetrack winnings (they mistakenly thought he got it laundering money) and admits he's hiding from his wife and doesn't want to be in the system to be found. Carson tries to keep checking out guests smooth and unperturbed. He tries to convince Dan hsi wife is dangerous but she and Tyler, her brother, are heading out to get the money from Carson. Tyler says he likes and misses Carson and wants them to talk things through, Marion doesn't care for that an wants to kill everyone between her and the money.
When left alone, Carson is abotu to pick the handcuffs lock Dan is restraining him with when Marion and Tyler come. . Despite hsi fears, Carson happily greets Tyler. Marion's dialogue reveals Carson was an honest shoe store employee before she married him and roped him into crime. He says he left because she pushed him too hard, but doesn't get angry or scared while saying this. He dos admit the 2 million dollars played a role though. Marion and Tyler take Jack and Dan prisoner. A flashback shows Carson and Marion kissing after the robbery, then he pulls a gun and awkwardly says this is and isn't her fault but their marriage isn't working and the money is part of it but tis is fro the best and he thinks someday she'll understand. She angrily rants about planning his heists and making his bombs.
He urges Marion and Tyler not to kill dan and Jack, who get ted to the place's massage chairs. He looks upset when she tries to burn the building they're in as a fake accident. An insecure Marion asks if he left her because of a brief weight-gaining period, which he denies. He claims that being alone makes him realize he still loves her and wants to star over as he digs up the money. Marion is charmed and Tyler is happy. Marion refers to a past incident where she apparently killed a guard during a robbery when Tyler asked her not to and says in the future she'll listen to him as a sign of their renew marriage.
Her nw attitude evaporate when she learns only $2,000 is left and the rest of the 2 million went into the motel. Ignoring hsi proposal of starting a new bed and breakfast in Arizona, she prepares to kill him as he makes a speech that the bed and breakfast was his dream from the beginning. Liz rescues Jack and Dan from the burnin spa. Her says goodbye to the hotel and calmly says he's ready t die from a praying position but an annoyed Marion says she's login to take him in a robbery, make him kill the guard and then torture him to death.
Jack and Dan make the car crash and arrest Marion and Tyler. Carson runs for it and get away from Jack and Dan but not arriving uniformed cops. As he's handcuffed, he calls out that he hopes hat for what it's worth Jack enjoyed the motel stay, then frowns in disappointment when Jack says no.
Magnificent
On one hand, he didn't plan the armored car heist himself. On the other hand, he doesn't like being a ceook, pulls of a bold double-cross to start a happy new life, is brave when he's facing death, and has some intelligent moments tryin to play innocent to Jack and Dan. He also takes arrest pretty well.
Bastard
I'm not sure. He did betray and rob his wife and Tyler and took part in past nasty crimes. His wife did pressure him into it and he left when he could but those aren't exactly legal defenses.
to Abridged!Major and Carson
Edited by Loekman3 on May 2nd 2022 at 10:54:46 PM
Ultimate Moral Compass
Abridged Major and Carson
The Work
Among Us Out is a Web Animated series about Crewmate shenanigans on a desktop. My candidate is the Impostor that appears in videos 1-10 (links here and here)
The Candidate
The Impostor. Starts as Yellow, swaps with White, disguises as Purple, swaps back with Yellow, possesses Red, is exorcised, and possesses Blue
The series starts with White (not the impostor) being ejected, shortly followed by Yellow (the impostor). White manipulates the desktop to defend himself from Yellow by using lines to create a box, then heats up the box when the impostor gets on top of it to drill its way in. Yellow responds by using the calculator function to shrink the box, forcing white to erase it. Yellow attacks white while the latter is defending himself using the Among Us icon, generating the remaining crewmates and causing Yellow and White to swap.
The impostor (who is now White) reminds everyone that Yellow is the Impostor, and the crewmates arrest him. Night falls, and the impostor creates and invisibility potion, sneaks into Purple's room, and performs a Kill and Replace. He hides Purple's (now White's) corpse in White's room and returns to Purple's room. On the way, he gets caught by Cyan, but following an epic fight, Cyan gets killed.
The next day, Cyan's body is discovered, and the crewmates notice that White is missing. The crewmates head to his room, but the impostor had rigged an explosion to occur when the door was opened (everyone is knocked out, but no one dies). The Impostor stays behind with Lime, who accidentally finds out that Purple was White in disguise, who then swaps back into his original body. Before Lime can warn the others, the impostor freezes time (an Ass Pull in my opinion) and kills him by throwing knives at him.
After the Impostor absorbs Lime and Cyan's bodies, he heads up to finish off the other crewmates, who are now awake, aware that he is the impostor, and ready to fight. The impostor escapes by venting and moving through the foundation. A fight ensues, and while the crewmates are briefly able to arrest the impostor, he breaks out using a trident and kills all of the crewmates except for White and Orange. White enlarges Orange, and as he attacks the Impostor, the impostor evades his attacks and kills him too. Just before the Impostor can kill white, the ghosts of the crewmates surround him and give him Super Saiyan powers. While being trashed, the impostor once again freezes time, returns the favour, generates some more crewmates from Among Us, ditches Yellow's body, and possesses Red.
The crewmates are understandably scared of Yellow, although he is no longer the impostor. Yellow tries to scan, but the Impostor once again freezes time, and sabotages the scan. However, Super Saiyan!White realizes what happened, knocks the impostor out of Red, and annihilates him. However, unbeknownst to the crewmates, the impostor returns and hides in the taskbar. He later possesses Blue while he is away from the remaining crewmates and splashes a potion on White (later revealed to be one that removes his Super Saiyan powers). Then a hoarde of Minecraft zombies show up. Yellow dies trying to hold them back, and the impostor drops Purple to his death. He later causes Green to fall to his death by slightly dislodging the door that was being used as a bridge. After Orange uses Thor's hammer to destroy the Zombies, Blue Captures Pink, kills him, and transforms into a Minecraft Minotaur thing (IDK what it is). It kills White as he tries to escape.
However, it turns out that the Minotaur can only sense what it can hear, and Orange and Red (now the sole survivors) evade it by moving about quietly. They try to shoot at the Minotaur, but it destroys the guns. The crewmates attack it, before the Minotaur is taken out by the guns falling on it. The screen then breaks and the two crewmates are sucked out into space. They are saved by the ghosts, who create a platform for them and some of them revive themselves. The Impostor returns as a Venom-esque symbiote, who fights with the crewmates but they manage to blow it up and fix the screen with Windows Defender, blocking out the impostor.
The series is ongoing, but I doubt that the impostor who shows up in the later videos is the same impostor as the ones in 1-10, because it shows up when a crewmate inadvertently hits a "Start" button (indicating the start of a new game). This "Second" impostor is currently the one who is active.
Magnificence
The Impostor is creative in the way it manipulates and kills the crewmates. However, I think literally freezing time might give him too much power. That being said, he only uses that ability thrice. Once after Lime accidentally finds out who he is, once to sabotage the scanner so that Yellow cannot prove his innocence, and once against Super Saiyan White (though that one is justified IMO). Other than that, he fights normally, during which time the crewmates are at least able to get a few decent strikes in before getting killed.
While its Minotaur form comes off as big and dumb, it is still dangerous, as it kills White and destroys the guns, and Red and Orange have to tiptoe around it to avoid getting killed.
Bastardry
The Impostor is doing what Impostors do - killing the crewmates. That is all
Edited by magnumtropus on May 3rd 2022 at 9:51:15 AM
abridged major
Abstain on imposter
Hey guys. So I've been absent from here for several months. There's been so much that's been going on in my life. Pretty much all of my family members (my mom, my dad, my brother) all had fairly concerning injuries and/or conditions, necessitating visiting specialists. Dw, we got overall good news from that for all of them, thankfully. Then after that had passed, I was burned out by over a month of excess hours at work due to staff shortage from covid. In addition, I also had signed up for an art contest and and was kept busy with that too.
But now, finally have had some time freed up and hoping to returning to getting some EPs up soon. Thanks for taking the time to read this.
Anyways:
Abridged!Major. Would he still count for CM? As despite being funnier he still sets the heinous standard and doesn't really have anything significantly mitigating
Carson
Edited by Snowy66 on May 3rd 2022 at 5:06:34 AM
Glad to see you back Snowy, and relieved things turned out fairly happy for your family.
Glad to see Carson has some support.
I'd like to make another appeal on Kiersten's behalf. While it's true she's throwing everyone under the bus while asking to be spared, she actually has good reasons to thrown them under the bus. Nigel and (to a lesser extent) Alec were just about to shoot her when the rednecks arrived despite her relationship with Nigel (which is implied to be what made her a Dirty Cop in the first place) and all the help she gave them. Jack is a witness to her being a Dirty Cop (the same is rue of Nigel and Alec), she was ready to help Nigel kill Jack in the first place a few minutes earlier, and he did get Nigel to turn on her by deliberately pushing Nigel's Crazy Jealous Guy buttons. In that light, Kiersten saying to kill the others is actually kind of a smart thing to say hr her pop, albeit hardly a noble one.
Edited by Melinda on May 3rd 2022 at 5:20:04 AM
Welcome back Snowy and yeah, sounds like you certainly had your hands full!
Welcome back, Snowy.
Yes to Abridged Major and Carson.
I'd very much argue against Abridged Major for CM. Not only would I argue there's mitigating qualities there, but I basically said throughout the effortpost that the only reason I'm willing to say he keeps in Abridged is because the tone isn't conducive to CM-level villainy.
Anyways, I'll turn in the Major soon, but there's another candidate I'm happy to be delivering; a very brief one but a very fun villain.
What's the work?
I've talked My Hero Academia a lot on this thread. It's a smash hit Shonen manga by Kohei Horikoshi, set in a world where most human beings have a Quirk, a single superpower. We return to the My Villain Academia arc, centered around the League of Villains fighting the Meta Liberation Army, a terrorist cult run by an executive. And one of these warriors, fighting on the side of the MLA?
Miss Curious.
Who is Miss Curious?
Chitose Kizuki, also known as Miss Curious, is the head of propaganda for Detnerat and the MLA. Running a thinly-veiled stand-in for Shueisha (Very cute, Horikoshi), Curious is an Intrepid Reporter who believes authentic field work is the ideal way to capture a story. Assigned to take on the pseudo-vampiric, shapeshifting Serial Killer Himiko Toga, who can turn into anyone if she drinks their blood, Curious excitedly starts interviewing Toga about her past, simultaneously mentally breaking her while genuinely intending to martyr her for the cause and show her as an example of society's oppression of those with potentially dangerous Quirks, noting how the only reason Toga turned evil was because she never got proper help for the raging mental issues that came with her power.
Curious attacks Toga with a legion of MLA foot soldiers. When Toga tries to drink their blood, she finds that Curious has deployed a brilliantly callous tactic— using her Quirk Landmine (The powers of which are almost one-to-one with a certain Killer Queen), Curious has been turning the blood of her own men into high-grade explosives. After drinking their blood, Toga finds herself attacked from the inside. With Toga in a corner, Curious seems the victor of their match, ready to end Toga's life and indeed martyr her.
That said? This is Shonen, and for this arc, the League are basically the heroes. You know what that means... Toga willpowers herself a power-up out of a refusal to die until her genuine (if twisted) love is sated, turning halfway into lead character Ochaco Uraraka and then, for the first time in the manga, activating Uraraka's own Quirk, levitating the entire MLA kill squad into the air. Curious says in awe how amazing a headline it will be, before being brutally killed when Toga slams the entire legion to the ground.
Is Miss Curious magnificent?
Oh, yeah. Curious is introduced having run a successful propaganda effort for years. Curious is the only MLA member who dies, but she's also one of the smartest and doesn't have much of the baggage members like the other members do. Curious genuinely interviews Toga in the middle of combat, uses her own soldiers as bombs against her and even outgambits her Quirk, and when confronted with death at the hands of a power-up she could never have seen coming, Curious gleefully declares how great the headline will be. She may be crazy, but in this case, Crazy Is Cool. Her tactical brilliance mixed with an excitement I can only describe as hilarious and murderously adorable mean she's pretty solid for magnificence.
Oh, and her character page says her Fatal Flaw is that she's overzealous and indeed she cares very little for her own safety... I'm gonna argue this isn't really a flaw though, seeing as it proves to me that she's just as willing to sacrifice herself for the cause as her soldiers. It's much-needed bravery when she's as callous as she is.
Is she bad?
Yes. Torments Toga with her backstory— even if she's a murderer, dredging up someone's horrid traumas and shoving them in their face is a pretty shitty thing to do— alongside planning to murder Toga and running the MLA's propaganda wing, having presumably recruited countless people. Plus, she turns her own men into bombs. Pretty nasty customer.
That said, she's a genuine WIE, her interactions with Toga have more than a small air of genuine respect, and her enthusiasm for the job is completely legit. Even Re-Destro himself comes off worse than her, and he keeps just fine. Curious is deeply loyal to Re-Destro as well, which I'd argue helps. Overall she's a very balanced picture— a sadistic and callous Shonen villain with a fair few redeeming traits to balance out her nature.
Conclusion?
I say keep.
Yes to Miss Curious
Any more votes for this EP?
Edited by magnumtropus on May 3rd 2022 at 2:06:43 PM
Sure to Curious.
Showtime!
to Curious and the Major
Abstain on the Good Guys candidates just because we've reached a point where I'm having trouble keeping them straight
Re: the among us ep— I guess there are no major issues, I just feel weird about upvoting an Among Us fancharacter. Abstain, I guess
Absolute destiny... apeachalypse?
Woagh
to Miss Curious.
Abstain on the Impostor. Can the characters he kills respawn like in the game?
Edited by DoodSlayer136 on May 3rd 2022 at 7:23:01 AM
NOISE IS CALLING, PICK UP PHONE
Was gonna wait for more examples first as there's only three, but I got a heading suggestion for the Fillmore! tree on the Disney page:
"When it comes to the 'crimes' committed at X Middle School and those the Safety Patrol has faced in the process, these impressive and ingenious perpetrators are 'on it!'"
Edited by futuremoviewriter on May 3rd 2022 at 7:43:32 AM
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
They are revived, but they do not respawn like in the game. They are resurrected by Minecraft Golems
Woagh
Ah. In that case I'll say sure to the Impostor.
NOISE IS CALLING, PICK UP PHONE
Sure to the Impostor.
The Lord of Footrests and the alternate Cats (I think I need to read this series), MAZIKEEN HELL YEAH, Roland, Tico, Carson, Karen Kim, Ms. Curious. Abstain on Joyce.
Lies and Violence!
I very much recommend it, one of the best books I've ever read and I'm fairly certain nothing will ever be able to top it.
the Imposter and Curious, abstain on Carson due to sharing Library's issue of having trouble keeping them all straight.
- Each of the possible versions of Catherine Foundling shown in the Fourfold Crossing prove to be just as ruthless and charismatic as the real one. All three weather Praesi civil wars and Proceran invasions to emerge as the de facto ruler of Callow, while responding to Akua's overwhelming might with a defiant sword through the arrogant noble's throat:
- Had Catherine never come across a girl being raped in an alley, General Foundling would have risen through the War College to the top of the Fourteenth Legion through murder and bloody warfare. Assassinating the senior officers of the Fourteenth to take command and allying with the Sahelians in their war to overthrow Malicia, General Foundling would have recruited the pockets of Callowan rebellion that emerged in the midst of the chaos into her legion, leading them in breaking the legendary generals who had taken their kingdom in the Conquest. Shattering the Legions of Terror and keeping Grem One-Eye occupied while Akua conquers the Empire, General Foundling takes Callow for herself in the wake of the devastation, executing the remaining Imperial governors while refusing the kingdom's crown in preparation for further bloodshed.
- Had Catherine lost in the Pit and never earned enough money to enroll in the War College, the Tolltaker would have joined the Dark Guilds of Callow to become the most feared crime lord alive. Rising to the top of the Smugglers' Guild in all but name, the Tolltaker would have cowed the Thieves and Assassins through sheer brutality that filled the gutters with blood, with her will soon holding just as much sway in Callow as that of the Empress herself. Assassinating Imperial governors, selling out or aiding rebellions on a whim, and having the figurehead of Procer's "liberation" effort killed in the middle of his own army out of nothing more than amusement and a loss of faith in the kingdom she had once dreamed of saving, the Tolltaker would have always managed to survive through the chaos she fueled, fighting for no greater cause or plan other than the dance of death against the monsters of the Wasteland.
- Had Catherine been saved by the Lone Swordsman instead of Amadeus, the White Knight would have united William's band of heroes into a sword against the Empire. Ruthlessly executing Imperial spies, governors, and generals wherever they went, the White Knight's band would have slain the Warlock after killing his son and allowing half of Summerholm to burn, spurning Procer's aid while spreading the spark of rebellion across Callow. Despite the horrific collateral damage caused by her warfare, the White Knight would have nonetheless claimed her Name after a brutal fight to the death with the Black Knight, rallying her graveyard of a kingdom to march forth and finally reclaim their home.
So should I stop with the EPs? There's only three episodes left of the show.
Edited by Melinda on May 3rd 2022 at 9:19:15 AM
You may need to review and compare your Good Guys candidates after you are done proposing them
I say go for it Magnum.![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]")
Abridged!Major.
You can only write so much in your forum signature. It's not fair that I want to write a piece of writing yet it will cut me off in the mid