Playing With Wiki: General Cleanup and Writing Help

Slashed that example

Sorry about the double post, but this Aversion looks strange:

Indirect Kiss:

• Bob and his best friend Charlie drink directly from the same bottle, but due to local cultural norms, this is not treated like a symbolic kiss by the characters or the intended audience. (International audiences, on the other hand...)

That's just kinda like "the trope could have happened but definitely didn't guys". A typical Averted Trope entry is usually just like "Bob and Charlie never drink out of the same bottle".

It's also just weirdly presumptuous about how different cultures perceive these things.

Edited by WarJay77 on Jan 7th 2024 at 4:58:17 AM

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

On PlayingWith.Toilet Training Plot, we have:

• Implied:
  • The frequency of diaper checks and diaper changes gradually dwindles as Chris ages up, to be replaced with Embarrassing Damp Sheets.
  • Chris isn't seen for most of the episode, but when he is seen again, he claims he can use the toilet now.

Neither of these seem right. The trope is Toilet Training Plot, not "toilet training exists"; if it's just implied, then it's not the plot.

For every low there is a high.

PlayingWith.Not Blood Siblings:

• Subverted: Alice and Bob were Childhood Friends. Their mothers—Alice's mom Carol, and Bob's mom Dawn—were also dear friends. They had a lot in common, both being single mothers and having kids only one year apart in age, and they related to each other easily. When Dawn got sick, she asked Carol to take care of Bob, so Carol adopted him after Dawn died. Years later, after Alice and Bob had grown up and fallen in love, Alice's Disappeared Dad came back. He told Carol he was so sorry about abandoning her when she was pregnant. He tells them a story: He was young and irresponsible, and his girlfriend got pregnant. They were having problems before that, and when she got pregnant, he left her. He moved on, met Carol, and started dating her. And when she got pregnant too, he flipped out left because it was déjà vu. But he's matured since then, and he's really sorry. He wants to make amends, both with Carol and his ex-girlfriend from before her. Does Carol have any idea where he might find her—her name was Dawn.
• Double Subverted: The Disappeared Dad and Dawn were having problems just before she got pregnant and he left. These problems were mostly about Dawn cheating on him—he didn't believe the baby she was pregnant with was his. He wants to make amends now (he did leave in a jerkass way) and Bob could be his kid. Bob gets a Daddy DNA Test, which shows that he's not his son, and thereby not Alice's brother.

Yeah way too long winded

Thanks

Edited by randomtroper89 on Jan 11th 2024 at 7:26:56 AM

I'm not sure if Double Subverted is too long, but maybe Subverted could be shortened to:

• Subverted: Alice and Bob were childhood friends, and Alice's mother Carol adopted Bob after his mother Dawn died of an illness. When Alice and Bob grow up, they fall in love... but then, Alice's Disappeared Dad comes back and reveals that he'd been with Dawn before Carol, and that Bob is Alice's half-brother.

For every low there is a high.

I feel like a lot of the entries on PlayingWith.Love Is A Weakness are awkwardly worded.

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

Tried rewriting some of the entries; thoughts?

back lol

Better.

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

Viewers Like You has strange subversions but I don't now how to replace them.

• Subverted:
  • NPTV does not run telethons to receive funding.
  • NPTV airs infomercials late at night, when doing so is unlikely to interfere with their normal programming.
  • NPTV receives all its funding from the government.
  • NPTV runs a telethon, but it's not for the network. It's a telethon for the local children's hospital.
  • NPTV shows ads in between the shows it airs.
• Double Subverted:
  • It still thanks its viewers for keeping them on the air, because NPTV is a local access or PEG channel. The funds come not from advertisers, but from a percentage of local cable subscribers' cable bills, so in a way, NPTV's viewers are paying for NPTV to air content, if not directly. Furthermore, much of NPTV's content is produced not only for viewers, but by them as well.
  • They don't have commercials, and they still run an annual telethon, and/or ask for donations via their website year-round, to cover what infomercials and government funding don't.
  • The government decides to reduce or entirely cut off funding for NPTV, necessitating the channel to either start airing commercials, ask for donations from individuals and organizations, or go off the air entirely.
  • Six months later, they have a telethon to raise money for their network.
  • The ads are for businesses and nonprofits that have made donations to NPTV.

I'm not sure why that has a Playing With page at all, to be honest. It seems like it should be Trivia.

Outside of the Web Animation, Web Original, and Real Life folders (and I'm not sure this is the right trope for the former two), all the examples are parodies or otherwise in-universe.

Anyway, those examples seem to think the trope is about the pledge drives American public television stations run, which is only tangentially touched on in the description (though I do seem to recall it used to be a more substantial part of it). It is a part of the straight example, but given the above a better subversion might be a Thanking the Viewer tag that insults them instead, or something.

Edited by MorganWick on Jan 21st 2024 at 2:58:39 AM

I don't think any of those count as subversions or Double Subversions.

---

I realized these are listed on PlayingWith.Daddy DNA Test: Should I just hide them?

I made a Trope Talk thread about this but was directed here.

So I've noticed that several tropes listed on the Fanfic Tropes index have Playing With pages. Most of them are fine, but there are Playing With pages for types of fanfics as well. I suppose it's possible to subvert and double-subvert a type of fanfic by changing its genre or something, but how do you defy, deconstruct, discuss, downplay, invert, and lampshade a type of fanfic of all things? A fanfic is a written piece of work you write and put up on a website, and a type of fanfic is the type of fanfic you create - none of these are narrative tropes.

This is Idol Tap. (My Troper Wall)

They're (more or less) genres. I don't know about downplaying or inverting, but it is perfectly possible to conversational-trope genres.

Edited by Synchronicity on Mar 1st 2024 at 9:50:24 AM

I mean...they're genres. I really can't comprehend how it's possible to trope genres of all things.

This is Idol Tap. (My Troper Wall)

I mean, a genre isn't really a trope, is it? I don't really understand either how it would be possible to trope, or play with, a genre of fiction.

Delicate and Sickly needs help. It's just female and sick, a holdover from the old name Ill Girl.

A few years ago, I noticed that someone made a Playing With page for Irony. After some discussion in ATT, it was decided that the concept of Irony was too complicated for a Playing With page, so the page was cut.

It seems that a couple of years ago, someone recreated the page here. Is this something we can cut again?

Hired by the Oppressor is divided by headings, is that okay?

I think it's ready

Edited by randomtroper89 on Mar 22nd 2024 at 11:45:01 AM

A suggestion for PlayingWith.Locked Room Mystery. Would rather ask instead of getting some parts wrong.

Basic Trope: An event happens in an isolated area with all reasonable causes of it appearing impossible.

• Straight:
  • Alice's corpse is found in her bedroom with a gun wound, but the door to the room is locked from the inside and there's no gun. There's also no window. Amateur Sleuth Bob needs to discover a counterintuitive way for how the door could have been locked.
  • A box with jewels disappears from Alice's bag, which she has left at the entrance. Everyone, including Alice, was at the meeting the entire time and no new person could have entered the building, but when Alice returns the box is gone.
• Exaggerated:
  • Alice's room is an unrecognizable mess and has several corpses. Everything was confirmed to be in order just a couple of minutes ago. Every theory Bob checks seems to be anticipated by the culprit and proved impossible. Even Utility Magic has rules that make their use here unlikely.
  • By the time of discovery, the door to Alice's room is covered by a wall of bricks.
  • In a Ten Little Murder Victims, every victim is found in a different impossibly-locked room, to the point that there's also nobody left to suspect.
• Downplayed: It seems nobody could have entered Alice's room, but a butler reveals right away that a master key has been missing, reducing the questions to only "who" and "when".
• Justified: The culprit goes out of their way to make a seemingly impossible crime scene. Even if only their alibi is lacking, they can't be arrested if Bob fails to explain how have they done it.
• Inverted: A Room Escape Game with seemingly no exit.
• Subverted:
  • The door is assumed to be locked and speculation ensures, before the person who has discovered the body clarifies that the door was unlocked, so anyone could have done it.
  • Everyone remembers that they are mages and anyone could have locked the door with Utility Magic.
  • The culprit confesses how the trick was done right away.
• Double Subverted: When the method of committing the crime behind a locked door is solved, it's revealed everyone with their luggage has checked in by the metal detector beforehand, so next Bob has to figure out where the impossible wound came from.
• Parodied: Bob finds Alice in her room and assumes she's dead. She is clearly sleeping, but Bob goes through several cases of Insane Troll Logic theorizing how the imaginary culprit could have entered the room.
• Zig-Zagged: Bob discovers ways to enter the room without the room's designated key. One by one, they don't work.
• Averted: How the crime was committed is clear at first glance and isn't a problem.
• Enforced: The work is a Mystery Fiction and producers ask to include a locked room as a plot point.
• Lampshaded:
  • Bob says that asking the building's staff would be a waste of time because any other normal ways to enter the room are unlikely.
  • When Alice's corpse is discovered, Bob hopes she doesn't have the only key.
• Invoked: The culprit is a Theme Serial Killer who likes to challenge people with puzzles.
• Exploited: The culprit is Genre Savvy in Mystery Fiction and knows that if they frame someone from the staff, the police are unlikely to pursue another possibility.
• Defied: Alice has a justified fear that she may be murdered soon and asks Bob to check the door for any secret defects and to ask the staff to verify the safety of master keys. Either Alice survives or Bob deduces the method right away.
• Discussed: At the The Summation, Bob brings up different cases of locked room murders in Mystery Fiction, one of which is exactly what happened here.
• Conversed: "It appears to be an impossible crime, but I assure you that there must be something with the door that allows locking it without the key."

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup

Something about The Beard seems wrong. Most of the time the marriage is real, but the intimacy is not.

I fixed the pronouns (due to a rather hasty rename from Mei & Rei to Alice & Bob), particulary possessives, on PlayingWith.ApocalypseMaiden, except for Implied, because I legit dont know who's who. Can someone more knowledgeable or better at syntax fix that?

"T'u gadapmagazin imhat pimushikimp'alha. K'animhat t'u k'ak'ujvn kimkap'akilteĭmvmpüca."

Is it just me or does the Implied entry not really imply the trope? It implies that Bob killed Alice but not a larger catastrophe or apocalypse.

I admittedly don't think it was necessary for the names to change anyway. Not every page absolutely must be Alice and Bob.

Edited by WarJay77 on Apr 14th 2024 at 11:36:36 AM

Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness

PlayingWith.Walking The Earth:

• Inverted: The hero brags that he's never been twenty miles from his birthplace.

...

If that's correct, then some Bottle Episode-type Environmental Narrative Game-s seem like they would fit, due to being only set in one building? Although the protagonists have left home, so maybe it wouldn't count.

Edited by Malady on Apr 14th 2024 at 3:05:13 AM

Disambig Needed: Help with those issues! tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13324299140A37493800&page=24#comment-576