Follow TV Tropes


YMMV / Dark Forces Saga

Go To

  • Better Than Canon: Kyle fanboys consider the dark side ending for Jedi Knight to be a Moment of Awesome, though they understand why it cannot be canon.
    • Similarly, the dark side ending for Jaden in Jedi Academy is actually preferred by a lot of fans. It's not that the light side ending is necessarily bad or that Jaden is an unliked character, but it just leaves the state of the galaxy in a more uncertain state without compromising the core characters of the series.
      • The preference for Jaden's dark side ending may also be due in part to the way he turns to the dark side: killing The Scrappy, Rosh.
      • And hey, you get to have a boss battle against Kyle Katarn, who remains an utter badass through it.
    • Advertisement:
    • Some Legends fans are already calling the Soldier for the Empire audio drama to be a superior story about the theft of the Death Star plans than Rogue One.
    • Finn from the new trilogy is a reference to Katarn in canon as they are both traitor Stormtroppers, but many fans rather just have Katarn come back in some fashion or another regardless as to whether or not they like Finn.
    • For that matter, it could be argued that Kyle does the "new heroes, even Jedi, can come from anybody" plot that The Last Jedi was going for with Rey, even before The Rise of Skywalker renders it an Aborted Arc. Speaking of THAT, Kyle isn't treated as some amazing paragon who could represent all Jedi-hood, nor is even someone with a grand heritagenote . Unlike Rey, Kyle actually ends up unwittingly and majorly screwing up and has to be bailed or pick himself back up, which is difficult to apply to Rey's own progression. Overall, despite being similar to Han, Kyle seems like much more of an ideal protagonist for a post-Rot J trilogy.
  • Demonic Spiders:
    • Hazard Troopers without certain Force powers, AT-STs when lacking your own walker or fixed gun. The Heavy Repeater's concussion grenade launcher, the missile launcher, DEMP 2's and Force Lightning above level 1 also help if you have neither of the former two.
    • Also, the Reborn in Outcast, especially since the duels with them are pretty much a Luck-Based Mission. Shadowtroopers are even worse.
    • Rodian snipers in both Outcast and Academy, particularly on high difficulties when they can kill you in a few hits (with near-100% accuracy and able to fire multiple shots at a time, no less).
    • Jedi Knight includes the above mentioned AT-ST and also organic, dangerous enemies like the Kell Dragons, the Drugons and also the Trandoshan guards, armed with concussion rifles and rail detonators. Stormtroopers armed with Rail Detonators are also quite dangerous for the same reason as Trandoshans.
    • Advertisement:
    • In Mysteries of the Sith, basically every enemy on Dromund Kaas and in the Dark Force Temple are basically this. The fact that your weapons malfunction (except for the lightsaber) doesn't help. The Vornskr are particularly dangerous as they're frighteningly fast, hit hard and will overwhelm you in seconds, can interrupt your attacks, jump at you even if you attempt to use a ranged force power from a ledge, and even swim.
    • Pretty much any enemy that uses melee attacks in Jedi Knight and Mysteries of the Sith since their attacks ignore your shields. Gammorean guards are particularly dangerous if they get into range, as their axes will cut through your health rather quickly.
  • Even Better Sequel: Dark Forces was a well received title when it was released. Then Dark Forces II: Jedi Knight and it's expansion came along introducing lightsaber combat and being able to become a jedi. And on top of that is Jedi Outcast, where it improved a lot of the lightsaber and force mechanics, often seen as the best in the series.
  • Evil Is Sexy: Sariss and Tavion.
  • Fridge Brilliance: The numerous Reborn enemies in Jedi Outcast were a bit silly... until something clicks: Reborn. Jedi Outcast takes place at the same time as The Crystal Star! It's always nice when the EU interacts with itself. Plus, do we really need another level set on Hoth? Jedi Academy declares "Yes" wholeheartedly.
  • Game-Breaker:
    • Once you max out Force Grip, you can use it to drop all but the most powerful of dark Jedi off a cliff or throw them into the air fast and high enough to kill them, allowing you to instantly kill the only enemies that stand a chance against you. Instantly, that is, once you do get it right, since Dark Jedi are very quick to use Push to escape.
    • In Jedi Outcast, the force speed power, which has the net effect of slowing the rest of the world down. With nothing but max-level force speed and a lightsaber, the final battle with Desann can be ended in less than ten seconds without him ever landing a blow.
    • Also Dark Rage in Jedi Academy; it makes you completely invincible, faster, and makes you cause more damage. At level one and two it's (very) slightly balanced by the fact it takes pretty much all your health to use (but it can't kill you in itself), at level 3 it only takes twenty health each use (force heal makes this easily recoverable between fights) and lasts more than long enough to destroy almost anything but the toughest of enemies (the only drawback being that there's a somewhat long delay before it can be recast if it does run out).
    • If you use the two sabers style, the game breaking move is ducking, slowly moving forward while crouching, while swinging your sabers wildly like a Cuisinart. It looks stupid, but it lets you defeat most if not all Dark Jedi enemies.
    • None of these will save versus Kyle Katarn himself, and he has his own game breaking moves, notably ripping your lightsaber away and beating you down barehanded.
  • Goddamned Bats:
    • In Dark Forces and Jedi Knight, the remotes.
    • In Mysteries of the Sith, Mailocs. They're this way to a lesser extent in Jedi Knight as well, but at least in the base game you have the option of shooting them.
    • In Outcast, the mine crabs on Artus Prime. Lampshaded by Kyle when he asks how many of them are there.
    • And in Academy, Rocket Stormtroopers (the ones with the jetpacks).
    • Don't forget those damned Gran and their thermal detonators. They appear throughout the series, but they're most annoying in Outcast, where they come in packs.
    • There are also the Force Grip Cultists, and their job seems specifically to be annoying as hell by force gripping you as much as they can. And if you break their grip by force pushing them they are likely to retaliate by spamming force push and pull at you.
  • Good Bad Bugs: In Academy, if you fall into lava in a certain level, you will quickly die, whether you have god mode active or not. If you use the "undying" cheat repeatedly (sets your HP to 999 every odd (first, third, etc.) time you use it), you will eventually notice that unlike in water, you don't make choking noises. In other words, you can breathe lava. It just melts you too fast to let you.
  • Harsher in Hindsight: Go here.
  • Hilarious in Hindsight: Go here.
  • Memetic Badass:
    • Kyle Katarn made the Kessel run in less than twelve parsecs. On foot. The release of Rogue One makes him even moreso this because compared to the ordeal that the Rogue One squad went through to steal the Death Star Plans, Kyle went in alone and stole the plans in about five minutes.
    • There are Chuck Norris style memes about Kyle, such as "Kyle Katarn is still canon because Disney don't dare to call him Legends".
  • Narm Charm: Most of the live-action cut scenes in Jedi Knight.
  • Nightmare Fuel:
    • In the original Dark Forces, you've got the Dianogas that pop up out of sewage and roar in your face.
    • Stage One Dark Troopers. They look like walking metal skeletons with swords and are partially bulletproof. And Lordy, those things are fast!
    • Kell dragons. They're the size of tanks, they're practically unkillable (especially in Jedi Knight, where bullets deflect off their scales), and they sport gruesome Slasher Smiles.
    • Gran and Trandoshans, who serve as Elite Mooks in Dark Forces before assuming a more prominent role in the early levels of Jedi Knight. Trandoshans can easily kill you from as much as an eighth of a mile away with their plasma-loaded "concussion rifles", while Gran toss grenades down on you from high platforms or windows.
    • Gamorrean guards, at least after they Take a Level in Badass in Jedi Knight. Their evil piglike grunts are intimidating enough without those nasty battle-axes, which they can swing with deceptive speed.
    • Boc is probably the most unnerving of all of Jerec's followers in Jedi Knight. Not only does he wield two lightsabers at once, but he jumps around so frantically (and so high) while fighting you that it's easy to get caught from behind. That, and he's definitely The Hyena of Jerec's crew, creepily giggling and cackling nonstop until you finally slaughter him - and even then, he continues laughing until he finally chokes on his last breath.
    • Jedi Knight and Mysteries of the Sith have the Drugons, giant carnivorous fish which can kill you in one bite, can swim faster than you (if you're not using Force Speed), and may spot you from afar.
    • Jedi Academy has the Sand Burrowers on Blenjeel, which can swallow you whole if you're not careful. And that level is overpopulated with them. It doesn't help that the save file name for that level is "Danger".
    • The Rancors in both Mysteries of the Sith and Jedi Academy can be this.
      • The one in Mot S can not only kill you in two attacks, but it eats you alive when it defeats you, and you can only kill it with your lightsaber, which you won't have at first and must retrieve from a nearby vault after getting past the creature.
      • In Jedi Academy, on the Nar Kreeta mission, it's not as dangerous to deal with since you have ranged weapons that can affect it now, but it has a crapton of health, and it will just respawn if you kill it.
      • On the Tanaab mission, you are dealing with a mutated specimen twice the normal specimen's size, and you spend the whole level being chased by it, and it even plows through the terrain eating any of the cultists it comes across. You can't kill this one until the end of the level. Also, for both specimens in Academy, if they grab you and you fail to break out of their grasp in time, they will instantly kill you by eating you.
      • This can slide into Nightmare Retardant if you're playing around with console cheats. If you activate noclip mode right before the rancor eats you, it still bites of your model's torso, but then you can escape its grasp and run around as a pair of legs. Which still have full access to all your force powers. It's so over the top, it's more funny than Squick.
  • No Problem with Licensed Games: The saga as a whole is fondly remembered as a series of excellent first person shooters with the addition of Force powers and lightsaber combat from Jedi Knight onwards being unique gameplay mechanics for the genre.
  • The Scrappy: Good luck finding anyone who likes Rosh Penin, Jaden's fellow trainee in Jedi Academy. One of the reasons this game's Dark Side ending is so popular is that it is kicked off by Jaden finally killing the annoying bastard.
  • Special Effect Failure: As a Miraluka, Jerec don’t have eyes, but we can clearly see his actor’s eyes through his mask in the cut-scenes.
    • This is slightly forgivable as, at first, Jerec was simply a human who happened to be blind, and was later retconned into being a Miraluka.
    • And, end of the day, few if any would expect the actor to go Enforced Method Acting and blind themselves by way of removing their eyes just for this one part.
  • That One Boss: Desann at the end of Outcast (See The Computer Is a Cheating Bastard). Marka Ragnos at the end of Academy is also an insane fight if you don't have Force Absorb, due to his tendency to spam Level 3 Force Drain and Force Lightning, and his ability to heal himself to nearly full health a total of 4 times.
  • That One Level:
    • Dark Forces had Jabba's ship, a.k.a. the one where you have to punch Kell Dragons to death before they eat you. Jedi Outcast's arbitrary stealth mission certainly counts, though any level prior to receiving the lightsaber could apply. Then there's the first part of Nar Shaddaa, the first level you play with your lightsaber, also from Jedi Outcast, in which ten Rodian snipers are all firing at you at the same time and each can kill you in one hit if they want to and they all have great aim. Plus, they're hard to find and shoot.
      • And the preponderance of bottomless pits and walkways with no railings.
    • Ironically, the pre-lightsaber levels become the most fun part of the game if the lightsaber is acquired early with cheats.
    • Let's not forget the level in Jedi Knight where you have exactly TEN MINUTES to escape a falling ship before it crashes. Said level is also filled with Probe Droids and other baddies even when using the secret area to bypass large chunks of the level. And you have to lower the Moldy Crow AND raise the ramp so you can even get to it in the first place.
      • Keep in mind that the ten-minute limit is on the easiest difficulty. On the hardest? You get ONE MINUTE. This pretty much necessitates the use of an easy-to-miss panel in the room with the controls for the Moldy Crow that gives you an extra thirty seconds (which, if you get turned around after using it or your timing is off, can easily become a terrible Hope Spot) as well as the secret area, which is found by using the messed-up gravity of the falling ship. Hope you saved while Maw was in his death throes!
    • Nar Shadaa of Jedi Outcast is the first level after you get the lightsaber back. Does it present you with Stormtroopers to let loose on? Nope - it's crawling with snipers, whose shots you can't reflect, and other grenadiers. And given the terrain of the planet you're on, there are several segments of Bottomless Pits.
      • Oh, and it starts off with Kyle needing to stay incognito, meaning your Force powers are disabled and your lightsaber cannot be used immediately. It bears repeating: this is the first level after you get them, and the game STILL refuses to let you use them
    • In Jedi Academy, one of the first tier levels involved Jaden crash landing on a planet infested with giant sand worms. Said worms are invincible and will gobble Jaden up in one gulp if they're on the sand. Only thing you can do is to try to avoid contact with the sand while collecting four ship parts, and some of them will be out in the open. You can distract the sandworms with thermal detonators (which the game never tells you), but even that doesn't make the mission a whole lot more enjoyable (as you can't carry enough of them to kill all of them).

How well does it match the trope?

Example of:


Media sources: