- One has to debate upon his genocide against the jotnar, though because it is more than likely that he believed that if he managed to destroy what was currently a threat to Asgard, he would be doing his father proud.
- I think that is an entirely credible interpretation of why he let go at the end of the movie.
- Considering the after credits scene and the fact he's going to be the main villain in the Avengers, it's doubtful.
- Considering his more sympathetic portrayal, he may turn out to be a bit more redeemable than his comic book counterpart though. (Especially since the fangirls are all over him now.)
- Or he might decide that Red Skull/Hydra/whoever he's working with is too evil (Loki's mostly defined by wanting Thor dead/to prove himself better than Thor/to impress Odin in the movie; his whole "cause Raganarok" thing has never come up) and stop them, either for an "only I get to kill you" with Thor or because whatever the villains are doing threatens Asgard (and Loki has nothing against Asgard as much as Thor, unlike in the comics). He'll probably make a HeelFace Turn and leave after it's all over before anyone can stop him, hinting that he'll get Thor "next time" and therefore laying the groundwork for his appearance in the sequel.
- He may not even have to wait for Thor 2 — it's possible that Word of God about his villainhood in The Avengers is a misdirect, and that he's only The Dragon, and will have his HeelFace Turn before the end of that movie.
- Confirmed by Ragnarok and Infinity War.
- Luke Cage has no connections to SHIELD and will not appear in Avengers. It was just a big guy that fought a powerless Thor.
- Yea, there's no way that was Luke Cage, who would have crushed the Brought Down to Normal Thor.
- Please that was obviously Brick Wall from Kickers Inc.
- Jossed. He shows up in his Netflix show.
- Considering how Ragnarok and the constant life-death-rebirth cycle of Norse myth work, this may well be the case—Thor is named after the same god in previous cycles.
- The reason the original, red-haired Thor is referred to in some sources as Odin's son is because the stories became corrupted over time, and Odin's contemporary Thor was accidentally conflated with Odin's young son Thor (assuming the Asgardians had not already left Earth by the time Thor Odinson was born). This, of course, would have only served to fuel Thor Odinson's already-immense ego.
- By extension, the Loki in the film is not the first Asgardian to bear his name, either — which is why there's a Loki in Norse mythology, and why someone can be seen wearing Loki's distinctive helmet during the scene where Odin claims the jotnar's casket.
- Or it might be a callback to the comic storyline where Loki timetravelled.
- Or maybe, in the MCU only, of course, the helmet itself comes with some important role in Asgard, like the Captain of the Guard or Head Mage or something - makes sense to throw Loki a bone when Thor is being made King of Asgard. However, this theory, if taken to its logical conclusion, also makes his continued usage of the helmet in The Avengers either a Crowning Moment of Fridge Heartbreaking (as in, he can't bear to part with the only symbol of leadership they gave him in Asgard, regardless of how it is also a continual reminder of his perceived inferiority to Thor, and the idea that he is still Asgardian at heart and resolutely doesn't identify with the Jotun), or just really weird. (Or maybe this troper just needs to get some sleep.)
- Alternate theory: We dont know how much time passed between the end of the Asgard/Jutenheim war and the Asgardians ending casual contact with Earth. Since Norse Mythology attributes the gods long life-spans to the golden apples of the Goddess Idun, rather that something biologically inherent, it could be that they mature at the same rate as humans, or something close to it. So theres plenty of launch window for both Thor and Loki to have reached adulthood and been incorporated into Norse folklore well before the end of the Viking era
- That makes a fair bit of sense, especially if we take 'The Apples of Idun' as a historic misinterpretation of whatever sufficiently advanced tech makes them immortal. In the mythology Thor didn't show up in the first war with Ymir and the other frost giants, his stories take place later. So a young and untried Thor is the character we see in the Norse Myths, dealing with the aftermath of the war.
- Except the book about Norse myths we see in the movie clearly shows a blonde Thor, so even if there was a previous Thor he probably wouldn't be red-haired. Also Fandral has a line that implies that the Thor seen in the movie was the one worshiped on Earth.
- According to Ragnarok, Hela wielded the Mjolnir before.
- Would you be able to tell a female jotun from a male? That said, I don't disagree. I could entirely see the jotnar reproducing asexually, maybe spinning off "eggs" of ice that "hatch" into their young.
- Going by the original mythology, while there were female jotnar, Ymir (the original Frost Giant) produced numerous offspring by himself, so there may be something to this...
- Also, in the original mythology Laufey was Loki's mother. So either he/she got a Gender Bender in this cycle of gods and associated beings, or Laufey's a Truly Single Parent.
- Laufey's been a male in the comics since the 60's while Farbauti has been a female, since this is based off the comics they kept the change.
- Then, if we take comics/movies as the "truth" and the myths as stories told by Norsemen who simply met Asgardians and jotnar, perhaps for whatever reason they simply ended up conflating Loki's parents into one being.
- Also, in the original mythology Laufey was Loki's mother. So either he/she got a Gender Bender in this cycle of gods and associated beings, or Laufey's a Truly Single Parent.
- Could be that Frost Giants just don't have much sexual dimorphism, and prefer to refer to one another as male (ala dwarves in Discworld). In which case, Laufey is still Loki's mother.
- Laufey and Odin are Loki's parents. After a brief but tumultuous affair, Odin won custody. Laufey's visiting rights are a sore point.
- In the mythology Ymir, who was the first frost giant(also the first living being in the universe) just kind of came out of the ice. maybe this kind of thing happens often on Jotunheim.
- Also in the mythology, Loki is most definately not asexual. He's the mother of Slepnir, for one. (Yeah, really.)
- Asexual reproduction (and one gendered species which may require asexual reproduction) is different than asexuality, as in not being sexually attracted to anyone (or anything). In theory the Jotnar could only have one of gender and reproduce asexually but still be sexually attracted to either each other or other species. Also it's not yet canon in the movie that Slepnir is Loki's child. The comics vary a lot from Norse Mythology.
- It could be that the jotnar are an inherently magical race (preferring ice magic, obviously), and are thus ALL capable of shapeshifting (hence why baby Loki was able to transform into an Asgardian - it's a subconscious defense mechanism, an attempt to integrate into a species for safety). Laufey could have transformed into a female if he so desired, and mated with a male-formed Jotun (possibly Farbauti). So, technically, he WOULD be Loki's mother.
- Since it's suggested that The Realms are defined as the nine planets connected by a natural wormhole network (see below), and the myths point to a common origin for the Asgardians and Frost Giants, this makes a good amount of sense.
- So they're the Eternals?
- The original Norse legends refer to Heimdall as "the whitest of all the gods." I can't imagine that casting Idris Elba was entirely an accident.
- The fact that the casting choice inspired real-life white supremacist groups to protest the movie probably helped the movie a little bit - No Such Thing as Bad Publicity, with the bad publicity drummed up by the lease agreeable source possible. It probably also helped quell many comic fans' complaints about the movie's color blind casting.
- Lets not forget, Loki outright said that there are three secret passageways between the Realms that are beyond Heimdall's sight. He can't be the only one capable of finding them, can he?
- I like this idea, especially as it explains why nine different planets scattered through the universe are all counted as 'The Realms' despite having little in common. Maybe they're all connected by a natural wormhole network.
- Most likely Yggdrasil.
- Jossed, Odin sends him there via "dark energy".
- Thanks to Inhumans, Lockjaw is now part of the MCU.
- Confirmed, as Loki reveals other worlds and as of the sequel Asgard may be interacting with them.
- This Troper (the one who speculated about Laufey below) is now writing an AU fanfic based on this guess.
- Post-credits Odin is likely thinking just this. We all know Loki is a 'full tilt diva' so this can't be the first time he's done something outlandish for attention. The Warriors Three note that he's always been up to 'harmless mischief'. He's the class clown of Asgard. Odin's probably said 'No, Loki' many times when Loki was a kid. That's how he wanted to treat this incident; one more attention grabbing stunt by his son. It wouldn't be the first time he wanted to sweep trouble under the rug: "These are the actions of a boy, treat them as such." A gentle chid, likely something more serious once they were safely off the bridge, and life goes on as normal. This also isn't the first time he was blind to how deep his son's flaws went; It never crossed his mind that Loki would committ suicide.
Itd keep them both as princes, with Loki and Thor on an even footing with each other. That could be the way Loki wanted it, where even if Thors Odins favorite, Thor doesnt see himself as too powerful (or more innocently, too busy) to keep adventuring and stuff with his brother by his side as an equal and a foil. He might not even view it as callously as to ruin my brothers big day at that point- post-revelation Loki is no longer rational or sane, and his much-increased jealousy of his brother after that might cause him to retroactively refer to his earlier actions much more bluntly and darkly.
- Regarding that decision, it could also be one of Loki's ideas that he believed would be in the good of Asgard. He could see that Thor wasn't fit to take the throne and that him being crowned king would not be in the good of Asgard, so he may have set up the "prank" to show his father that Thor was not ready. All he needed was for Thor to attempt to go to Jotunheim to show Odin the truth, but things just spiralled out of hand.
So, the old myths get passed down to Earth/Midgard, but since events like Loki, since the Giants no longer look human, looks like an Aesir, and no longer has monster children like Fenrir or Jormungand, are somewhat skeptically believed even by Aesirs, explaining why he wasn't chased off so much earlier and how some things still look the same but are also so drastically different at times.
- Jossed by Thor: Ragnarok.
- Or possibly, given that Hank Pym doesn't seem to be a thing in this 'verse, Tony Stark will do this.
- It's been announced that an Ant-Man movie is on its way, which would bring this WMG back to life.
- Nope. In the final issue, Odin calls him Cul.
- He said "forged in a dying star," not "forged from a dying star." If Thor's hammer was neutronium, it would weigh twenty-nine-million tons. If Thor was strong enough to swing a twenty-nine-million ton hammer like an aluminum baseball bat, he wouldn't need to. He could kill Hulk with a missed punch.
- It would need Marvel Studios to buy back the movie rights for the Fantastic Four franchise before it happens, since Galactus is considered a Fantastic Four villain. But that's not necessarily impossible.
When Thor, Loki, Sif, and the Warriors Three invade Jotunheim, he viciously snaps out with, "Your father [Odin] is a murderer and a thief!" Thief obviously refers to the casket. Murderer though seems an oddly specific word for describing a warrior. Warriors kill in battle, while murder holds particularly bad, foul connotations. It's a very personal word. So Laufey feels that Odin killed someone who was especially close to him.
Could it be that Laufey thinks that upon entering the deserted temple after the battle, Odin killed the baby Loki and disposed of the body? We only have Odin's word and perspective that Loki was actively abandoned, anything could have happened in the confusion of battle to leave the young heir alone. And besides. A temple? Why the Hell would you abandon a baby you didn't care about in a holy place? That just doesn't make sense. Hell, guards who may have been assigned to protect Loki may have been slaughtered earlier outside, rushing in headfirst to try and defend their charge for all we know.
Laufey is an experienced warlord, at least as much as Odin. He's obviously experienced in the ways of war. A warlord has to be able to accept losses and casualties, and a bloodthirsty one like Laufey even more so. It would take a kind of special loss to make Laufey willing to engage in a truce, even for a while. The death of your first son, perhaps. Hence his line: "You know not what your actions would unleash. (Beat) ...I do."
Perhaps this is an overly elaborate Cry for the Devil, but I dig me some character speculation.
- I'll bite. Laufey came off as pretty reasonable to me. Evil, but reasonable, pragmatic, and wanting to do what's best for the jotnar.
- Then they should have seen the dark haired bastard betrayer coming, because that's quite an old one. Wrong Genre Savvy?
- Just because they remember stories doesn't mean they'll change them. You can't just change a good story.
- Yes, I agree with this troper: the movie established that the nine worlds of Yggdrasil were all connected, possibly by wormholes. Theoretically, these nine worlds, then, could be in their own parallel dimensions. Time could pass on different scales between these dimensions, allowing Loki (our age scale, since we know he was a baby when it was 903AD on Earth) to be in his late 20s/early 30s on Asgard when it is around 2010 on Earth, without actually living for more than a thousand years. This would allow an Asgardian living on Earth to age as Earth-dwellers do, but an Earth individual on Asgard could live thirty or so years there, return to Earth, and find that more than a thousand years have passed. This could make for interesting developments when Jane returns to Earth after her adventures across the dimensions in The Dark World. But then how was Thor able to be banished and then rescued from Earth in the space of a few Earth days, an Earth week at most? Maybe Lokis reign only lasted a few Asgardian hours. This theory explains the 'living for endless time' part of immortality, but it doesnt explain the 'gods are indestructible' theory, that is, why Asgardian/Frost Giant individuals are capable of withstanding forces (e.g. being slammed into the side of a mountain, falling from insane heights, wrestling with the Hulk, being smooshed into a marble floor, etc.) Earth individuals couldnt really stand up to.
- There's also the fact that in the battle at the beginning (during which baby Loki was found), Odin is riding Sleipnir, who is Loki's son. Ummmm...
- Jossed. According to Ragnarok, Mjolnir was around before Thor and Loki were born
- Hogun actually looks a bit more Mongol in the comics (oddly, since he was based on Charles Bronson) but apparently Jossed by him being a Vanir.
- Technically it's not impossible that he lives among the Vanir but is originally an Earthly warrior who ascended to Valhalla as described by Norse mythology.
- Jossed. They never meet again before Loki's death in Infinity War.
- Jossed. He dies in Infinity War.
1) Loki is very easy going with the human technology, almost as if he's been around it for a long time. He came up with Tom's identity on one of his trips to Midgard when questioned by someone and he decided to keep that name, eventually starting an acting career, both to keep up appearances, but also to practice his trickster powers. Taking into account the Narnia Time theory above, so no one on Asgard would notice his long absences, and when he leaves Midgard, "Tom" will just be on vacation somewhere.
2) Tom was a real person who was killed and Loki took his persona as a disguise, discovering the power of fangirls when they would want to get his autograph and hug him wherever he went. Soon, he will have an army so massive, no military on Midgard or Asgard can stop him.
- Jossed. Hela appears in Ragnarok.
- It explains why Odin doesn't put a similar enchantment on Gungnir (his spear). Perhaps as a king, he's had to do some morally ambiguous things to protect his kingdom.
- But then how does Odin summon Mjolnir to his hand? And how is he able to throw it into the wormhole after putting the enchantment on it?
- Because before then there was no requirement to wield it. This could still be conceivably true, if Odin has done so much I Did What I Had to Do that he's not worthy of being called a hero.
- Thor has mentioned Alfheim, let's call that six.
- Thor has mentioned Nornheim, which isn't in the source material but the (admittedly non-canon) video game suggests it's the home of the Rock Trolls and a separate realm unto itself. That's seven.
- Let's take a leap and say Helheim and Muspelheim are the last two. This leaves out the traditional Niflheim (but let's face it, Jotunheim's got that covered- maybe they're the same?) and Nidavellir (again, maybe part of a larger realm?)
- Jossed, including the initial five mentioned and Alfheim, the remainders are Muspelheim, Niflheim, and Nidavellir.
- Very likely jossed; besides, there are quite a few black Asgardian background characters in all three Thor movies, even before the introduction of Valkyrie.