Ask The Tropers

If you change it back, it won't count as an Edit War just yet, since that would be the second edit in the chain and at least three conflicting edits are needed for a war.

But it is good to alert the other troper of what they did wrong, so they don't just do it again. Did you send them a message?

I don't really know how to PM and say "You did this wrong" without coming off rude.

So far there's no official Administrivia topic on localizations and the issue helper database is maxed out and can't have new notifiers added for ignored localization rules.

^ - I'd just raise the matter in the English Localization Cleanup thread to get consensus for a revert, revert with posting a link to the cleanup thread, and then message the troper with a link to the cleanup thread and tell them their edit has been reverted for breaking the mod ruling calling for English localizations (if they're available for a work).

Maybe at some point, the English localization rule should be added to Administrivia and the issue helper database can be expanded one day to include a custom issue helper for reverting work translations improperly (the helper system is maxed out at last check, so one would have to send a regular PM for the time being).

I brought "Aeris" / "Aerith" up once in the Localization thread. I was told that "Aeris" is correct when referring specifically to the original FFVII and to only use "Aerith" when referring to other material.

I guess she changed her name before FFVII, then changed it back after she died.

Obviously it should be "Aerith" since literally everything calls her "Aerith" now, but whatever.

Hypothetically, we could use the manual for the Steam release if we need a source for "Aerith" in FFVII proper.

(This would require us to treat the manual as part of the work, which is a bit iffy, but it's the best we have.)

I reverted the edits and linked back to this discussion.

Is this over the remake of the game? If so, which name does it use?

^ Final Fantasy VII Remake uses Aerith; however, it is irrelevant to VII proper.

Ah. Didn't realize they had separate pages

They just changed it back to Aeris again. It's now an Edit War.

At that point yeah its an edit war.

I know in most cases we use the localization name, but Aeris was admitted by the team to be a mistranslation so I think using Aerith is correct to use for it. I know I went through to clear some of those up on other pages but going forward I will defer to what is decided here first.

... aren't they... right though? Based on this thread it sounds like on a page specifically about the Playstation 1 game (which this is) it's correct to use Aeris.

Still unabashedly edit-warring, but it sounds like he's actually correct.

Honestly, since at this point even the people who made the game have stated that Aeris is a mistranslation, I honestly think we should just only use Aerith, even when talking about the original game. It also makes it a lot more consistent with the rest of the site.

To be frank, I don't know why we give Aeris so much leeway. No one refers to Peach as Toadstool anymore. Nor do I see people calling Ganon Gannon, or calling Sailor Moon Serena.

Peers at our Wiki page, which does indeed call Sailor Moon Serena

Ok that's fair.

I would like a link Ghilz.

Sailor Moon - Usagi Tsukino

Literally on the top banner. (I didn't say it exclusively calls her that, but we do list it as one of the character's names)

Plus Sailor Moon uses them pretty much interchangeably, though with more uses of Usagi.

That said, it's pretty much apples to oranges between an intentional Dub Name Change and a translation error.

I think the policy should be something to the effect of: "Localized names are used except in situations where Word of God clarifies otherwise". For example, the Dragon Ball dubs use Krillin consistently, but if one day they had started saying Krillen (just an example), and then later said it was a mistake or switched to Krillin, then Krillin should be the name we use.

Its been acknowledged by the devs that Aerith is the correct name and that Aeris was a mistranslation.

So in the case of Word of God vs videogame content, wouldn't both be appropriate? So long as no one feels the need to swap one name variant for another, couldn't we just let the troper's decide which they want to use? For instance, I personally would post a ff7 trope about the character as Aries whereas I would use Aerith for any other work but I wouldn't change another troper's name choice to match my own. As such would posting a trope under the name Aries now have someone swap it for Aerith or would it be left alone (and thus to the troper's discretion)?

^ Leaving it to tropers just leads to Fan Myopia of fans believing they know better than the creators. Even though Square-Enix rereleased the original Playstation version of Final Fantasy VII without updating the game much other than fixing a few bugs, they refer to that character as Aerith in all subsequent material of Final Fantasy VII and even the remake calls the character Aerith.

The English Localization thread on the forums had already decided to continue to use Aerith due to Aeris being a mistranslation and Square-Enix using Aerith for all subsequent new releases (despite not being updated for the rereleases of the Playstation Final Fantasy VII).

Fan opinions cannot trump what the creators officially use, but we can note Aerith's original name as trivia and we already do so. We don't need to plaster "Aeris" everywhere.

Also (and keep in mind I have zero stake in this), we just want the wiki to be consistent. While things like American/Commonwealth spellings aren't a big deal, character names can be, and we want to be professional enough to not just let any name variation be used. It's confusing and we have standards.

@neiberger: Also, that would result in a massive amount of edit warring, which is what we're in right now.

Aha, I see—so for the sake of consistency it should utilize only one name and as such it would make sense that the true name is used (true being Word of God approved) for all content on the page. I guess it would make sense and it would definitely make things consistent. As for edit warring, I recently found out first hand how easily it is to be caught up in it (even/especially being ignorant of what that is) so for the sake of us still learning the ropes, I can say I now agree that "Aries" has had her day and should remain in the Trivia section. THE AYE'S HAVE IT~

I would like to get a mod's opinion on this befote acting further.

Given that all other pages go with "Aerith", the dedicated thread on the matter decided that was the right call, and the troper is edit warring I'd say that's grounds to get a mod to revert the edit. Is there a specific place to request a mod revert a page?

Generally, this is the place to make such requests.

Given that an edit war has started and that all other pages go with "Aerith" could I/we request a mod revert the last edit and speak to helljmpr about edit warring?

Has anyone notified the user of this?

I don't believe So, I saw concerns about not wanting to sound rude.

I've messaged them and linked them to this thread to try and talk out the issue.

I've reverted the edits.

Our official stance is that Aerith should be used in all instances across the wiki. We are in 2020, not 1997.

Many thanks to everyone for your contributions.

^ Just to be clear: are we citing the Steam manual just to end this mess once and for all?

The fact we can cite something is important, because it means the policy itself doesn't have to change.

If not we can cite that the rest of the compilation of VII refers to her as Aerith and it’s in the same continuity.

^ If I'm understanding policy right, we can't use the Complication because it isn't actually FFVII.

You may cite the manual if you feel it will make a difference. Experience has shown that it usually won't matter to the people who get involved in this type of edit war, but it's worth a try, I suppose.

Apparently it's always been Aerith.

Yep. We can argue that Aeris is basically a typo if people really want a justification.

While I rethpect everyoneth opinion and the variouth argumenth that have been thummarithed here, there'th thtill one point that hath yet to be refuted: "Aerith" jutht thoundth thilly.

Is the matter resolved yet? This query already has 39 replies (40 with mine; and with all due respect, HC, yours adds nothing productive), so unless there's something else to clarify in regards of the naming convention, this should be locked.

Agreed.