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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

TheMadCr0w Gentle Laborer from Insignificant Little Blue Planet Since: Aug, 2015 Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
Gentle Laborer
#128601: Sep 2nd 2018 at 2:16:11 PM

[up][up] Here it is. I deleted my wikia account a year ago, but you can ask an admin called Prime Shockwave if you want any confirmation, he was a close friend of mine.

Edited by TheMadCr0w on Sep 2nd 2018 at 6:19:28 AM

Looperreallyreallyrocks Since: Jun, 2018
#128602: Sep 2nd 2018 at 2:19:35 PM

Okay, I'll admit, I was acting kind of stubborn and irrational. Maybe someone else can EP him later (if they're allowed to).

Edited by Looperreallyreallyrocks on Sep 2nd 2018 at 2:19:24 AM

PolarPhantom Since: Jun, 2012
#128603: Sep 2nd 2018 at 2:26:59 PM

[tup] Turtle and Dormammu.

I won't lie, reading the EP I wondered if he did enough, but was swayed by other voters. I think the reason he's been overlooked is that Carnage is just far more memorable than he was.

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#128605: Sep 2nd 2018 at 2:31:43 PM

Yes to the Queen, no to Boar and Lewis.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#128606: Sep 2nd 2018 at 2:46:13 PM

Okay, this place moved up fast once again, so... yes to Darque, yes to the Queen, yes to Kaz's, yes to Dormammu, and I'm pretty sure we've already downvoted Lewis. Regardless, yes, it's a rule to make your own information here. We can't trust the accuracy of it otherwise and thus we've got no reason to vote it up.

Edited by Scraggle on Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:48:22 AM

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#128607: Sep 2nd 2018 at 2:55:39 PM

Wait... Boar did get E Pd!? No on her. Heinous standard is as huge as Jupiter (Considered people like Tiger, the Dragon Brothers or Ox had a pretty huge bodycounts) . Didnt I create a frigging essay on why I dont think anyone counts. Yea...

Though I'm tempting to bring Ox for MB review.

Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Sep 2nd 2018 at 4:58:51 PM

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#128608: Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:06:29 PM

Leaning yes on Ebola, as it seems like he goes far beyond what his Freudian Excuse would justify.

[tup] Briz and Turtle. Maybe I missed it, but who's the Big Bad?

[tup] Dormammu. I'll put him before Carnage, and Landon before both.

[tup]Queen.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Looperreallyreallyrocks Since: Jun, 2018
#128609: Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:07:13 PM

How about this: Can I go to the VW user who made the original Dodgson proposal and have him make an EP?

TommyFresh Since: Aug, 2013
#128610: Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:15:10 PM

[tdown] Boar and Dodgson. With the latter I have doubts about how "onscreen" a lot of his worst crimes are, although it has been a while since I've read Lost World.

[up] I would recommend not pestering a user of another site to come here just to effortpost a character. If you actually think he qualifies do the work of reading the source and writing your own EP.

chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#128611: Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:16:57 PM

I went on a marathon of Spider-Man: The Animated Series a few months ago, and I have some doubts about Dormammu. Something I think was overlooked is that the series points out that Dormammu needs to feast on other universes in order to survive. I've transcribed Strange's explanation of Dormammu and his motives.

Dormammu is a powerful, evil entity who travels from dimension-to-dimension draining the life energy from all universes. Now he comes to feed on ours. He must draw the life-force of our reality or starve.

I don't recall a mention of Dormammu having a choice on whether he can feed on the life force of other universes. I think it's like a Galactus situation, only Dormammu is more of a dick about it. I'm abstaining for now, but I wanted to throw my own two cents in.

Edited by chasemaddigan on Sep 2nd 2018 at 6:19:08 AM

TheMadCr0w Gentle Laborer from Insignificant Little Blue Planet Since: Aug, 2015 Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
Gentle Laborer
#128612: Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:20:54 PM

[up][up][up] Please no. The user who made the Lewis page on VW is anonymous and inactive at this point, and leaving Scary Movie alone would be the best choice.

Aaaaaand you have already messaged him...

Edited by TheMadCr0w on Sep 2nd 2018 at 7:24:42 AM

PolarPhantom Since: Jun, 2012
#128613: Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:28:01 PM

Any counters or comments on the Dormammu issue?

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#128614: Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:30:54 PM

[up] Dunno. I think that it depends of his attitude about it. I still think [tup]

Briz and Turtle. Maybe I missed it, but who's the Big Bad?

The King of Leona, Alphonse Hangul. Or he and Ebola are a Big Bad Ensemble, it depends of how you look it.

He don't count here due to being a Well-Intentioned Extremist with some sense of honor.

[down] Man. I really can't trim Ebola. You have a tip? To give you a easier job. The issue is that a lot of the series is based in In-Universe terms.

Edited by KazuyaProta on Sep 2nd 2018 at 5:35:46 AM

Watch me destroying my country
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#128615: Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:31:52 PM

Hmm, that makes me a bit hesitant on Dormammu. Bullman?

[up]As for Ebola: Was he the only victim of Fantastic Racism to go as extreme as he did? As for trimming it, I'd need to see the writeup to see how big it is.

Edited by ACW on Sep 2nd 2018 at 6:36:54 AM

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Bullman "Cool. Coolcoolcool." Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
#128616: Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:34:33 PM

I also remember that line, but didn't't put much stock in it as in his second appearance there's no mention of it. Also when he also is far too sadistic about it and get great enjoyment out of the process.

Edited by Bullman on Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:38:16 AM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#128617: Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:37:39 PM

[up][up] Yeah. Like, Matarratas was bullied a bit but he is a pretty functional boy in a Jerk with a Heart of Gold way, his adoptive sister is a very sociable Cool Big Sis and his grandpa was a Nice Guy.

The Earth and Air elementals were genocided and the survivors really aren't trying to murder the whole world.

Edited by KazuyaProta on Sep 2nd 2018 at 5:40:35 AM

Watch me destroying my country
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#128618: Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:49:45 PM

Okay, Ebola's a definite yes for me then.

Here's the revised Ratchet tree, for next week:

  • Ratchet & Clank franchise:
    • Original game: Ultimate Supreme Executive Chairman Drek, the Big Bad, may at first come off as a humorous villain who is trying to find a home for his people by extreme means, but by the end of the game, there is no mistaking him for anything but an unrepentant maniac. To begin with, he is the one who over-polluted his own home planet and got his kind, the Blarg, into this situation, and proudly boasts about it and how he did it on purpose. His real motive behind tearing apart planets—populated planets—to build his new world, and eventually trying to blow up planets with bombs and superlasers, is the mother of all money-laundering real estate scams; he's been paid for every square inch of the new Blarg homeworld, and makes it clear once the people settle in, he'll repeat the whole polluting and planet looting cycle all over again. In addition, he almost blew up Ratchet's home planet with a superlaser so he could move his new world into its perfect orbit, and it's implied he also chose Veldin just to spite Ratchet for getting in his way.
    • Deadlocked: Gleeman Vox, the Big Bad, is the greedy owner of a media empire who kidnaps superheroes and forces them to fight each other to the death in DreadZone. He keeps them safely imprisoned with Deadlock collars that shock them or explode if they try to escape, demonstrating the collars on sentient robots. He also isn't above putting the entire planet of Stygia in danger by sabotaging the force fields that protect it from meteor storms, or attempting to murder everyone aboard his space station—including thousands of innocent audience memberss, some of which are children—all for the simple purpose of improving his ratings.
    • All 4 One: The Loki Master is the true mastermind of the Collectors. Hailing from a destroyed planet, the Loki Master arrived on planet Magnus and possessed the body of Mr. Dinkles, the eventual pet of Dr Croid. Betraying Croid, the Master took his colleague Nevo as a hostage, threatening his life to have him work for the Master. Stealing dangerous creatures from throughout the galaxy, the Loki Master dumped them on Magnus, altering various habitats to suit them better, devastating the ecosystem while also having its Collectors terrorize the inhabitants of the planet to keep them in line for over a hundred years. Its master plan is to use Croid's technology to force its own and its fellow Loki's beings into more dangerous creatures with the goal of leaving Magnus and ripping the universe apart until there is only dust left.
    • 2016 remake: Dr. Nefarious is a much darker character than in the original series. Starting off as Drek's engineer, Nefarious built the Deplanetizer that allowed Drek to destroy planets and use their land masses to build his new world. After the pair destroy Novalis and five other planets, Nefarious betrays Drek and takes over his operation, intending to destroy Umbris, a volatile planet which could set off a chain reaction and destroy the entire solar system. When he hears that Ratchet and Clank are thwarting the attempt to destroy Umbris, Nefarious goes to stop them himself and ensure Umbris's destruction, despite knowing he'd die too.

Edited by ACW on Sep 2nd 2018 at 7:31:08 AM

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Bullman "Cool. Coolcoolcool." Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
#128619: Sep 2nd 2018 at 3:59:00 PM

Hey guys I just want to thank all you who voted for Dormammu which ever way voted. I'm going to be gone for a while as my grandfather just got really sick and I am going to have to take care of him.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#128620: Sep 2nd 2018 at 4:08:36 PM

[up]sad Take care.

Judging by what you said, I think he stays a keep, especially if he's super-sadistic about it.

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#128621: Sep 2nd 2018 at 4:10:44 PM

[up][up] Take Care. I hope he gets fine.

[up] This is Ebola' entry (and Briz, I focused in him being a genocidaire, maybe I should add more in him being a emotional manipulator that always taunt their victims?)

  • 5 Elementos: In a series filled with gags that constantly mocks its own premise, this trio stands out due to their awful actions.
    • The Doctor Ebola is a Virus elemental and the greatest scientist of his era. Murdering his superior to take his place, Ebola manipulates his team in order to create the forbidden Dusk Virus —a virus that empowered it's host but eventually causes their death— before being discovered for the Secret Soldiers and Sebastian Rattengift. Killing all of them except Ember Llamaviva, which got accidentally infected with the Dusk Virus, Ebola moves to Beluga Town searching for Sebastian' family to obtain the Kimikoho —a ability that allowed him to see the chemical components of matter with his bare eye— before killing them except their baby Matarratas, which Ebola gives to an orphan girl to be raised as her brother while he watches them in the disguise of Desangrador, the chemistry teacher of the school, until Ebola discovered the Dusk Virus inside Kaji Llamaviva, son of Ember. Deciding that Matarratas was no longer useful, Ebola tries to kill him and his friends before being stopped. Returning several arcs later, Ebola returns to the Royal Army at the direct service of the King to help him in his invasion of the New World to reach Aya, the World Tree. Using several infected enemy Earth Elementals as workforce in an act that disgust even his colleage and former rival Colonel Blood, which Ebola murders, to reach its roots planning to infect Aya with the Dusk Virus and kill every non-Virus elemental in the world.
    • Kold Briz is a captain in a region bordering the forbidden beach. Being ordered to capture the protagonists, Briz shows no mercy even to the children except with Kaji in a attempt to avoid his father' wrath before the last living Earth elemental come to save them, which make Briz simply confesses to have participated in the genocide of Earth elementals in the infamous Day Zero and killed his fellow soldiers for their elements before fighting him in a fight that ends in him giving up his own life. Saving his own life by freezing himself, Briz come back to aid in the invasion to the New World before finding his old enemies and trying to kill them in revenge, promising giving them a painful death while telling to the family of his victim that he was just "finishing the job" by killing their adoptive brother. A seemingly polite man, Kold Briz is a genocidal Sociopathic Soldier that is as cold as his element.

Edited by KazuyaProta on Sep 2nd 2018 at 6:12:01 AM

Watch me destroying my country
ACW Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#128622: Sep 2nd 2018 at 4:16:17 PM

Eh, 240 words for Ebola? That's not too bad.

Wanna add Turtle before adding the tree to the Drafts?

EDIT: Oh, and DC Video Games gets locked tomorrow.

Edited by ACW on Sep 2nd 2018 at 7:18:40 AM

CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#128624: Sep 2nd 2018 at 4:20:15 PM

ACW I see it get tossed around a lot but it's actually incorrect to use Dragon Ascendant on a successful Starscream. The former specifically refers to taking over the former Big Bad's operation without a direct hand in their downfall.

edit: yes to Darque.

Edited by 43110 on Sep 2nd 2018 at 7:20:38 AM

hegelvonaxel Since: Feb, 2018
#128625: Sep 2nd 2018 at 4:25:43 PM

I wish only best for you grandpa Bull.

I guess that this is a reason why Marik qualify.

  • Literal Split Personality: Dark Marik started out as Marik's even worse side, but by the end of Battle City he gains a separate soul, kicking his other half out of the body. This comes back to bite him when Marik surrenders their final match, letting him vanish into the shadows while Marik remains unharmed.


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