Note: If a newly launched trope was already given a No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only designation while it was being drafted on the Trope Launch Pad, additions to the proper index do not need to go through this thread. Instead, simply ask the mods to add the trope via this thread
.
This is the thread to report tropes with problematic Real Life sections.
Common problems include:
- Conversation on the Main Page
- Flame Bait
- Squicky content
- Impossible in Real Life
Real Life sections on the wiki are kept as long as they don't become a problem. If you find an article with such problems, report it here. Please note that the purpose of this thread is to clean up and maintain real life sections, not raze them. Cutting should be treated as a last resort, so please only suggest cutting RL sections or a subset thereof you think the examples in question are completely unsalvageable.
If historical RL examples are not causing any problems, consider whether it would be better to propose a No Recent Examples, Please! (via this forum thread) for RL instead of NRLEP. If RL examples are causing problems only for certain subjects, consider whether a Limited Real Life Examples Only restriction would be preferable to NRLEP.
If you think a trope should be No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only, then this thread is the place to discuss it. However, please check Keep Real Life Examples first to see if it has already been brought up in the past. If not, state the reasons and add it to the crowner.
Before adding to the crowner:
- The trope should be proposed in the thread, along with reasons for why a crowner is necessary instead of a cleanup.
- There must be support from others in thread.
- Any objections should be addressed.
- Allow a minimum of 24 hours for discussion.
When adding to the crowner:
- Be sure to add the trope name, a link to where the discussion started, the reasons for crownering, whether the restriction being proposed is NRLEP or LRLEO (and in the latter case, which subject(s) the restriction would be for), and the date added.
- Announce in thread that you are adding the item.
- An ATT advert should be made as well (batch items together if more than one trope goes up in a day).
In order for a crowner to pass:
- Must have been up for a minimum of a week
- There must be a 2:1 ratio
- If the vote is exactly 2:1 or +/- 1 vote from that, give it a couple extra days to see if any more votes come in
- Once passed, tropes must be indexed on the appropriate NRLEP index
- Should the vote fail, the trope should be indexed on KRLE page
Sex Tropes, Rape and Sexual Harassment Tropes, and Morality Tropes are banned from having RL sections so tropes under those indexes don't need crowner vote.
Crowner entries that have already been called will have "(CLOSED)" appended to them — and are no longer open for discussion.
After bringing up a trope for discussion, please wait at least a day for feedback before adding it to the crowner.
NRLEP tag:
%%https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13350380440A15238800
LRLEO tag:
%%The following restrictions apply: [list restriction(s) here]
%%https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13350380440A15238800
Notes:
- This thread is not for general discussion regarding policies for Real Life sections or crowners. Please take those conversations to this Wiki Talk thread.
- Do not try to overturn previous No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only decisions without a convincing argument.
- As mentioned here, the consensus is that NRLEP warnings in trope page descriptions can use bold text so that they stand out.
- The [[noreallife]] tag doesn't currently work. This is a deprecated tag that was introduced many years ago — originally, it would have displayed a NRLEP warning banner when you edited the page. However, there's been some staff conversation (Feb 2024) about what a new technical solution might look like, so we'd advise against deleting these from pages, at least until we have a decision as to whether it'll be fixed or replaced.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Mar 8th 2024 at 10:49:13 AM
the Retromancer
Is WorthyOpponent.Real Life entirely ROCEJ?
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
The Enforcer
All Planets Are Earth-Like is quite a lot of bullets and words for a section that summarizes to "no, no they aren't." If we really want to keep it, it could be moved to an analysis page, but otherwise I'd argue that it's impossible in real life.
they/them pronouns. Look at my Neocities.
The Enforcer
@Tremmor 19 Based on looking at the description, Creative Sterility specifically refers to nonhuman sentient life who can do all the sentient things except be creative. I don't think AI as we currently have qualifies especially if making "art" is literally all it does.
they/them pronouns. Look at my Neocities.
It's not entirely ROCEJ, in fact outside of the Politics section (even then, not really) there is very little.
I would however argue that the section is far too large in relation to the fictional pages we have, meaning it is most likely too common, and a natter magnet. Curious to see what other people think (provided they actually think about it and not just reflexively agree to crowner something sight unseen ...)
Re: All Planets Are Earth-Like
Real life has definitely proven that all planets are not earthlike, so it is impossible in real life. It's also a Narrative trope, being one of those Acceptable Breaks from Reality that sci-fi authors use. We could crowner on that.
I didn't choose the troping life, the troping life chose me
Took a look through Worthy Opponent and whew lad. I'll second it for Too Common.
The Enforcer
Agree on Worthy Opponent being too long. To be honest, I think almost any RL section that has more than 3 subfolders is probably too common.
they/them pronouns. Look at my Neocities.
I'd like to suggest making Adaptation Displacement no real life examples on the grounds that real life isn't an adaptation.
Worthy Opponent is too common.
Edited by VerySunshine on Nov 28th 2022 at 1:47:18 PM
low-poly Shinri
( Accidentally posted this in the No Recent Examples thread, So posting it here)
I think Contralto Of Danger should be No Real Life examples, cause it’s just listing deep voiced women with no narrative significance, much like Badass Baritone before it.
She/Her | Currently cleaning Char Clone
The Enforcer
As much as I adore the anecdotes of folks selling their souls on eBay, Deal with the Devil is impossible in real life in the absence of either souls or entities willing to buy them.
they/them pronouns. Look at my Neocities.
Chew.
I'll vote towards crownering on Worthy Opponent, All Planets Are Earthlike, Adaptation Displacement, Contralto Of Danger, and Deal with the Devil.
The Worthy Opponent mindset is way too common, and probably is Narrative/Characterization anyway. There seems to be enough consensus for this, so I'll add it.
All Planets Are Earthlike isn't Truth in Television, and I don't think we need a massive RL section to explain it. That said I think a well-written Analysis page on the subject would be worthwhile to have, the current RL examples shouldn't be the basis of it.
Adaptation Displacement's RL examples are ridiculous. It's 110% a narrative trope. Crowner with prejudice.
Contralto Of Danger isn't just another Too Common Voice Types trope, it's also a moral judgement trope (it means "deep voiced women who are evil or at least aggressive"). It's also Characterization.
Deal with the Devil is technically impossible IRL (although Folklore examples are certainly valid, none of the current RL examples are folklore though), and it's also Morality-adjacent. Selling your soul on eBay, while I'll agree with you that they're funny anecdotes, they also aren't really what this trope is about (it's about selling your soul to some evil higher power, some dude on eBay isn't "the devil").
Koichi really steals? No dignity.
Bonnie's Artistic Cousin
Folklore isn't RL anyway, it's Religion and Mythology.
Current Project: Incorruptible Pure Pureness
Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire
Selling souls on eBay involves scamming the gullible as well.
Kirby is awesome.
Crownering these two from yesterday as there is consensus and the 24 hours is up:
- Worthy Opponent - Too Common, attracting natter and page bloat (Added Nov. 28th)
- All Planets Are Earth-Like - Impossible in Real Life, we know there are many non-earthlike planets. (Added Nov. 28th)
I see Worthy Opponent was already added, so thanks for the headsup on that ...
Edited by laserviking42 on Nov 28th 2022 at 8:23:22 AM
I didn't choose the troping life, the troping life chose me
The Enforcer
Going through Tropes of the Soul, I'm Having Soul Pains feels iffy in terms of possibility. It feels notably more metaphysical than psychosomatic pain. If it does stick around, it needs some ZCE and Word Cruft cleanup.
they/them pronouns. Look at my Neocities.
The Enforcer
Speaking of souls, Empty Shell has many problems. It's morality-adjacent, debatably possible, and I don't think we should be in the business of what's basically describing folks with disabilities and abuse victims as literally soulless. Also, most examples are general.
they/them pronouns. Look at my Neocities.
NaNo 4328 / 50,000
I see mostly misuse on RealLife.Worthy Opponent. General examples and "this good person happens to be my enemy" rather than "I have grown to respect this enemy of mine". Civil wars especially attracted misuse. Folks shoehorning "this person doesn't hate their enemy" and missing the point about the trope being based on respect growing from the opposition, rather than having respect and then opposition.
Link to TRS threads in project mode here.
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
I wonder if the trope itself attracts such misuse. The name isn't 100% clear about what the trope is—someday I may do a wick check.
All Planets Are Earth-Like is more of a narrative trope than impossible in real life, since most examples are only about one planet. However, we don't know how earth-like other real planets are, so it could be both.
Edited by nw09 on Nov 28th 2022 at 7:10:31 AM
There are eight planets in this solar system, only one is "earth-like", so we know that not all planets are earthlike.
I didn't choose the troping life, the troping life chose me
Oversized Garden Ornament
All Planets Are Earthlike is definitely a narrative trope, and one that is definitely not applicable to real life since most real planets are very far from earthlike.
Listing all the counterexamples from real life is ridiculous overkill, as there are literally hundreds of counterexamples. Nowadays, we have discovered lots of planets in other star systems, and we have enough data to show that very few of them are even remotely earthlike (the sample is skewed, though, since earthlike planets may be harder to detect than giant planets).
Edited by GnomeTitan on Nov 29th 2022 at 10:42:56 AM
I don't think that All Planets Are Earthlike is a narrative trope. I think it actually needs TRS; tropes with this kind of name often have problems and while the page says one should only list aversions, lampshade hangings and the like, there are plenty of straight examples.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Stumbled into Strawman U. The actual example section doesn't have a real life category (though one is mentioned under "Other"), but all of those in-line in the description real life schools seem very stereotypical.
x8 I agree with nonexistentyeets that Empty Shell should be NRLEP
Edited by Khoshekh6 on Nov 29th 2022 at 7:06:49 AM
Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire
An Analysis page should be created for Strawman U and much of the description in the main page should be moved there.
Not just that, but examples of real universities fitting the descriptions should be removed, and I'm saying so as an alumnus of the University of Toronto (an Oxbridge University of St. Old Geezer the Posh school).
Kirby is awesome.
Crown Description:
Vote up to either forbid all real life examples (No Real Life Examples Please) or forbid real life examples for specific subjects (Limited Real Life Examples Only); vote down to Keep Real Life Examples. To add a trope to a No Real Life Examples Please index or the Limited Real Life Examples Only index, its crowner option must meet the following criteria:- Stable 2:1 ratio needed for NRLEP or LRLEO
- Must have been up for a minimum of a week
- If the vote is exactly 2:1 or +/- 1 vote from that, give it a couple of extra days to see if more votes come in.
I agree that the firearms industry is ridiculous but surely AI art is an example of a non human that can create "art" but may lack creativity? At any rate I'm disputing the take that it is impossible due to the lack of nonhuman artists