During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
The Universe A Hooks Killer is listed twice.
...
I didn't see my Kronos entry from several pages back on the drafts page, so I posted it there with some tweaks to make it shorter.
Edited by Pichu-kun on May 4th 2019 at 2:16:23 AM
@ACW Hang on. I got my write up and another EP coming.
Batman 1989: Still as great as it was and always has been. Always wanted to see it in a theater.
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Hi everyone. Been away for a few days, I see the thread's been busy. ![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to Gerald and Bette.
to Bette.
Okay as it seems I'm completely incapable of figuring this out despite all the help I've gotten, I've just uploaded four possible images to another site (sorry if their to blurry):
Opinions?
Oh and as Jones got eight votes, I'll post his and the duo's write ups as soon as this is resolved.
Edited by MGD107 on May 4th 2019 at 2:32:37 AM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Here's that Kronos writeup. Lighty, how's this one?
- The Cold Moons: Kronos desires to be leader (or more precisely, tyrant) of his large group of Cilgywn forest badgers, but only because he likes ruling over others. Kronos makes friends easily and is liked by many, but it's all an act as he needs other's support to get to the top of the council. It's also shown that Kronos has god complex and he convinced his brother Zoilos that he'd one day be a god. As the book progresses, Kronos weeding out any badger that either gets in his way. He is involved with the deaths of over four badgers (two being leaders) but he tries to make the deaths seem accidental: He "accidentally" trips Buckwheat into a river, has both Dandelion and an entire family of foxes killed while making it was a skirmish, and then has a boulder crush the current leader Eldon (and there were cubs around, meaning he likely didn't care if they got killed). Kronos ends up splitting the badgers into two groups, but he keeps his deserters in-line by force. Those who try to escape are captured and tortured to death by Kronos and Zoilos. Oftentimes, even those that just behave in ways that Kronos dislikes are tortured and killed by his underling Vulcan; it's implied that Vulcan himself was killed by Zoilos when Kronos sent the two on a scouting mission.
Goku Black
Uh a combined 1, 2 and 4 could work.
Though a quality upgrade wouldmy hurt. Anyone own image enchancer here ?
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Mir: Yeah sorry about that.
Any way here are my Coroner write ups:
- Coroner:
- Dylan Lee and Randal “Storm” Jefferies, from Scattered and Quick or Dead, are pair of psycho’s unified by an obsession with death. Dylan is an intelligent, handsome falsely charming sociopath who strangled his own mother Olivia, then trapped her still half-alive in a freezer to slowly freeze to death. Storm meanwhile is his creepy, quiet accomplice, possessing unhealthy fascination with pain and strength. Following a computer expert being unable to regain his novel The God Abyss detailing his rampage fantasies, Dylan murdered him. The same night upon being caught stealing computer equipment, Storm shot Professor Gideon through the head, then he and Dylan dismembered his body and dumped it in the woods. Realising the police where onto them, Dylan and Storm decided to fully embrace their fantasies and become Spree Killers. Going on a rampage with Machete’s that started with them murdering Storm’s parents, they proceeded to kill an electrician for being in their way, nearly killed Ross Cooper in an attempt to regain the manuscript and then a mechanic, all the while Dylan secretly planned to kill Storm and his girlfriend Amanda, to climax his fantasy with himself as the only survivor.
- Gerald Henry Jones, from The Suburbs and Bridges, was a wealthy Baystreet banker who moonlighted as a serial killer that preyed upon the homeless. Growing up homeless himself, Jones hated his father for failing to provide for them seeing him as a deadbeat. At fifteen Jones murdered his father, stabbing him to death with a chisel, then changed his name and enrolled in high school. For the next twenty-three year’s would murder roughly one homeless person a year in the same manner, carving in his kill count in roman numerals into their rib, slaughtering people all over Ontario, including five people in Tent city Toronto climaxing with him murdering Floyd Shipman. Imprisoned for Shipman’s death, after twelve years Jones was released following Dr. Peterson’s cases being reopened. Jones broke into Peterson’s home, and stabbed him to death for causing his imprisonment, making Peterson his twenty-fourth victim. Stalking the investigation into him upon Jenny finding his father’s body, Jones murdered Scully, a forensic investigator, stealing his suit to break into the Coroner’s office; he waited until everyone else had left before trying to kill Jenny.
If fine I need someone to put them on drafts for me.
Edited by MGD107 on May 4th 2019 at 3:06:01 AM
Gerald and Bette.
Goku Black
Well here's Image enchancer. I'm on my phone so can't use it now but anyone who wants to help enchance thise images. Please use it.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Conspiracy Theorist is a trope, BTW. Wasn't one of the Coroner spree killer duo one?
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
to Jones and Bette
Hey ACW I think you forgot to add my Hazel and Cha Cha from Umbrella Academy as I can’t find them on the weekly batch
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Ah, looking at the history, they were written over. I've re-added them to the Drafts, and hopefully get to them tomorrow. Elder Scrolls is almost DEFINITELY going next week.
Also, if anyone wants to enhance the image at Hell Boy, feel free.
Edited by ACW on May 4th 2019 at 6:02:43 AM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
ACW: Storm was yeah. But it doesn't really play into his spree killing so I didn't include. Generally it doesn't come up much, the guy's defining traits are he quiet, creepy and unstable.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
BTW, anyone heard from ~Godzillawolf? He still has the Ultra anime duo.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
Sure to Gerald and Bette. Hmmmm... @MGD As for the writeups, looks decent, but just an advice: if they appear in only one or two episodes and didn't commit a lot of rapsheet, I think shortening them could be fine. Sure, we have Apos who has a rather short length series but I'm gonna give that a leeway because Apos basically commits a lot of crimes under the sun. But, if you decided to leave the writeup as it is and feel that the rapsheet is enough to describe it, I can understand that. 
Anyways, speaking of writeups, I decided to revisit one of my own entries and have to admit I wasn't happy on this one. One of the entries in question? Is Arty from Geek Love and special thanks for 43110 for spicing it up:
- Original:Arturo "Arty" Binewski is Oly's elder brother who murdered his infant siblings in his early childhood and tries to do the same with his younger brother, Chick, by smothering him with a pillow. When his plans failed, he hires some random teenagers so that he could kill him. As the time went by, Arty tricks and manipulates Chick into becoming a surgeon for his own cult by using his psychic powers to mutilate the members of the cult. Said cult members are made up of people he manipulated into giving their lifesaving for the "privilege" of surgically removing their limbs so they can be just like him. When he caught his Siamese twin sisters, Elly and Iphy, having sex with another man, Arty gave the twins into one of his underlings and arranges the rape and forced childbirth for them. After Arty asks Doctor Phyllis to do a half-lobotomy to his twin sister so that he could kept Iphy for himself, Arty implements the lobotomy procedure to his own cult, which Dr. Phyllis disagrees with and starts a rebellion. When Arty found out that Oly is pregnant, he tries to beat her with a plunger. When Arty found out that Oly's daughter is almost like a normal person, he threatens Oly to have her own daughter being fed to Elly and Iphy's overweight child Mumpo. Arty subverts any potential redeeming qualities and is motivated to do his atrocities by his own selfish desires and jealousy to other people, and ended up ruining people's lives without any remorse.
- Rewrite: Arturo "Arty" Binewski is a horrific Big Brother Bully who murders many of his infant siblings during their infanthood. Failing in his attempts on his psychic brother Chick, Arty later tries paying a group of teenagers to murder Chick, before tricking Chick into becoming a surgeon for his cult, using Chick's abilities to mutilate cultists, maiming them into limbless beings like Arty. Catching his younger conjoined-twin sisters with whom he has forced an incestuous relationship with sleeping with another man, Arty rapes them to force a pregnancy, before ordering one of them lobotomized along with many members of his own cult. Discovering his other sister's pregnancy, Arty beats her and tries to have her child cannibalized.
Now, before everyone including Lighty or Age accuses me or 43110 on doing rewrite for the sake of rewrite, hear me out about my reasoning: The utter reason why I decided to rewrite Arty is because a huge grave mistake I made and I'll be honest that writeup of mine could be rather clunky at times. Okay, let's talk about the huge mistake that I commit because this is rather sensitive to talk to:
I... Basically ended up plagiarizing one of the lines from the unapproved writeup by the user Give 1 Take 2 and this is the said line " Said cult members are made up of people he manipulated into giving their lifesaving for the "privilege" of surgically removing their limbs so they can be just like him." Now this is one of the grave mistakes that I truly made in the past and I'm aware that TV Tropes treat plagiarism with scrutiny despite the rest of the entry is mostly originally written except for that said line. This resulted on me being haunted for years thanks to that plagiarized line and I wanted to learn from my past mistakes by deleting that line. Having talked with Scraggle on P Ms, he approved my reasoning. And yeah, re-checking my old entry again, I feel that it can be condensed so I ask 43110 for the job
Now then, reasoning aside, do you feel the rewrite is good? Or we should keep it as it is but tidying up the older one? You'll be the judge and that includes you @Scraggle as you read the book.
Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on May 4th 2019 at 5:14:37 PM
"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Sorry about taking so long on that Ultra duo, real life has kinda been crazy recently with work. I'm going to try and get them done soon.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Ah, okay, cool.
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
Anyone wanted to comment on Arty's rewrite and my reasoning behind it?
"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Goku Black
Nope.
P.M. him.
Fun fact Acadic was played Xander Mobus while Ace killer was played by Ray Chase. So Xander's fourth I think (Along with Terence T Darby, Momoshiki Otsuki, The Voices of nerat) and chases first ?
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Rewrite works for me.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Elfen: Yeah. Generally my write ups edge towards the long side. Anything you would recommend taking out?
Alright, time for the second one. If this goes well, then Robert Downey Jr. has his first CM and ends up on the Played list as well as the Fought/Opposed list:
What is the work?
U.S. Marshals is the 1998 follow-up to 1993's The Fugitive (an actual sequel with Kimble and Gerard working together was planned, but never happened) which kind of gets a bum rap if you ask me (RDJ was likely trying to get off drugs at the time and hates remembering the film experience). The movie involves Deputy Marshal Sam Gerard investigating the escape of yet another fugitive, but rather than the killing or the reasons why the killing happened being centered around medical subterfuge, it's government espionage and national security. So let us address the true culrpit behind it all.
Who is he and what has he done?
John Royce is a Special Agent in the DSS who along with Special Agent Frank Barrows is making a profit off of government secrets by giving them to Cheng, a Chinese contact and spy. Needing a scapegoat, they pick an agent named Mark Sheridan and frame him as the traitor. Two agents attempt to take Sheridan down at a drop where he unwittingly gave info to Cheng and Sheridan, not knowing they're agents, is forced to overpower and kill them. Sheridan eventually ends up caught and is being transferred on a plane with several other prisoners and guards, among which is Gerard accompanying a suspect he recently arrested.
Another Chinese spy attempts to assassinate Sheridan, but it fails and the plane crashes as a result, causing the deaths of multiple people. Gerard survives and becomes the head of the investigation to find Sheridan, who has escaped in the chaos. Royce arrives and places himself in Gerard's team to finish the job. Cheng, on the verge of being made, murders another agent at a Gym and then shoots at the Marshals and Sheridan in a cemetery. During which, Barrows is killed.
Royce eventually tracks Sheridan in a hospital and fights him. Deputy Marshal Noah Newman walks in and sees Royce about to execute Sheridan and Royce fatally shoots Newman. Gerard arrives right after Sheridan escapes and sees the dying Newman. Royce lies and says that Sheridan shot him, causing Gerard to becomes uncontrollably enraged toward Sheridan. The two eventually track Sheridan to a cargo ship and after Gerard nearly kills Sheridan, but cools off, Royce shoots at Sheridan.
Sheridan ends up wounded and captured and Royce goes after him yet again in the hospital. However, Gerard caught on thanks to the fact that he matched Royce's gun to the one that killed Newman. Royce attempts to kills Gerard as well and make up a lie about it, but his gun is empty, the magazine having been switched by Gerard. Royce makes a faux surrender and pulls another gun, but Sheridan yells out to Gerard who is then able to pull his own gun and shoot Royce, killing him.
Heinous standard?
His crimes are different enough from the crimes of Charles Nichols that he can be judged on his own. Even then, he clearly has more victims. He's selling out the country to a hostile one, murders an agent working with him, attempts the murder of others and indirectly causes a plane full of people to crash. Even if Cheng acts on his own when he shoots at everybody, he reacted that way because Royce had let him get exposed. Even if Barrows arranged a lot of things personally before getting killed, it's clear that he worked closely on it with Royce and that they were in it together up until a point. He's also responsible without a doubt for the agents Sheridan is forced to kill because it stems from framing him.
Redeeming qualities? Mitigating factors?
Barrows fears for his life when Sheridan catches and interrogates him, so there's no love between him and Royce. No loyalty or real connection to any of the Chinese and absolutely no care for any of the Marshals and no issues with killing Newman and then later attempting the same to Gerard. His only real motivation is money and nothing noble beyond that at all.
Verdict?
I will give a .
Alright, I THINK I got everything.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts