Just What Is an Eldritch Abomination

I don't think applying a strict definition for what constitutes an Eldritch Abomination invalidates Lovecraft Lite. I actually think it reinforces its boundaries to show what the line is between it and traditional Cosmic Horror Story (semi-related, but I feel like it's confusing that Cosmic Horror redirects to Eldritch Abomination and not Cosmic Horror Story, but I digress).

Put differently, if Cosmic Horror Story is a genre, then Lovecraft Lite is a subgenre that plays with the same themes of Cosmic Horror Story while lightening the mood/ stakes by not having a true Eldritch Abomination in it. Which is why Lovecraft Lite endings can have the protagonist actually win out against the creature and generally have a less nihilistic ending.

Cosmic Horror redirects to Eldritch Abomination because for a time everyone was using it for the latter (as in "Cthulhu is a Cosmic Horror...") to the point it almost wasn't worth the effort to clean up (according to the lazier standards of the time). This happened long enough ago that it's also why the genre was renamed Cosmic Horror Story, whereas modern-day wiki practice would probably be to name it Cosmic Horror Genre.

I think even if you adhere to a less stringent definition of Eldritch Abomination, the "truly incomprehensible" definition is a distinct enough concept to have its own page.

(Ironically, using Cosmic Horror for the creatures instead of the genre gets that element across better than Eldritch Abomination. "Eldritch" doesn't really mean anything to most people, and "abomination" could just as easily refer to ugly Hulk knockoffs. By contrast, a Cosmic Horror is clearly something horrifying on a cosmic scale.)

On most people's understanding of Eldritch...

I forget what, but something told me that Eldritch and Elves are related. Maybe that has more traction now more than ever. I want to say it was something Terry Pratchett...

And it's use in Dungeons And Dragons, seems to just means a type of Magical?

you might be thinking of The Fair Folk which is a Sister Trope to Eldritch Abomination

The thing that told me of the connection between Eldritch and Elvish, might be an old version of The Fair Folk, but the info's not on the page now?

Lovecraft Lite shouldn't be used for simply being not "true" Cosmic Horror Story, it is for those instances where it ticks off a handful of similarities but the Eldritch Abomination is treated or viewed as a commonplace, manageable or even comical within the setting. There are a number of stories that may not fully embrace the supremely powerful, unknowable, drive you to insanity nature of the abomination, but you are still generally left winded by the encounter and with more questions than answers.

Not helping any of this is the entire line of Did You Just Punch Out Cthulhu? tropes, using Cthulhu as a stand in for a godly being.

Edited by EmeraldSource on Aug 2nd 2023 at 9:27:00 AM

I think you're probably thinking of the Faerie Abomination draft. Someone did make that claim there, but the word's etymology is a bit murky.

Yeah, Lovecraft Lite always struck me as more of a parody or defiance of the Cosmic Horror Story (depending on the nature of the story being told) rather than a "doesn't meet the standards"... often, meeting the standards and then defying the expectation of the CHS is the point.

Edited by Wyldchyld on Aug 2nd 2023 at 2:36:22 PM

I think Existential Eldritch Entity is a much better name, if it is just about narrative creatures who bring the role of humanity/whatever stands in in its place, into question in the setting. If it IS about horror though, Abomination probably has to stay, as much as it kind of clashes, since an unknowable but safely ignored, accepted, managed entity will eventually stop being scary or even particularly disliked wouldn't it?

I think a split might be the thing to do, if we can't really pin point what we want to be on the trope page. It has to be the catalyst of an existential crisis or it has to be driving a cosmic horror story. That would allow say, two examples from Pokemon. The Alpha itself, Arceus, because what the hell is it? How do these Pokemon even work anymore now that we know about this one? Arceus isn't scary in of itself, it just raises a lot of questions that so far can't be answered. Bitter Cold breaks the rules of what a Pokemon even is entirely, is suffocating the dominant macrofauna just by existing, and can't be dealt with by anything in the world. It can't be reasoned with, it can't be beaten, except by bringing in a human, who don't naturally exist there, and even then just barely. It fits the abomination role to be both rule breaking and undesirable on a large enough scale, but it's not an existential issue, just an issue we hope goes away and never has to be dealt with again. It doesn't change how Pokemon work, the way the world works, the way Arseus does despite being identifiable as a Pokemon otherwise. Dark Matter, in the context of Pokemon, I don't think counts either way, by contrast. It's another Outside-Context Problem sure, but again it doesn't really make anyone question the nature of their existence in the setting, despite breaking the rules of Pokemon operation, and it tells Pokemon what it wants. Nothing good, in fact it's more destructive than Bittlercold, but it can be beaten in battle, it can reasoned with, it expresses gratitude. Definitely an abomination no one wants to come face to face with, but not eldritch enough I think, just an abomination.

As stands, I think Bittercold is the only one who counts as the page is currently described, unknowable and unpleasant, but it only breaks the rules in that it's different and challenging to deal with, it does not challenge what anyone thinks they know about their own existence. Arceus is probably the only one who does that. Maybe some other actual Pokemon could count in the way Bittercold does, to a much lesser extent. Necrozma has the whole How Unscientific! but undeniable aspect of its being that isn't fully understood going for it. It's definitely a Pokemon, but an alien one, and not alien in the same way as the Ultrabeasts, they're just the closet thing to compare it to, but overlooking it's alien origins and unexplainable powers it still behaves like a Pokemon. Eternatus has the whole changing the entire world for the worst just as a side affect of being around it while awake, and unconsciously breaking the established laws of physics while coming from even more unknown origins than Necrozma, but we still know it's a Pokemon. It still behaves like one otherwise.

Animalistic Abomination, botanical and the like might be better off as sister tropes than sub tropes as well. Rule breaking and horrible but less unknowable by identifiable animal/fungal/plant/etc traits/behaviors. Arceus would be the Existential Eldritch Entity. Yes this thing is a Pokemon, but not only is it not like any Pokemon I've ever seen before, but it makes me question just how Pokemon came to be now, what Pokemon really even are. You mean even with a master ball I can only catch a sliver of it? Bitter Cold Is the Eldritch Abomination. It's different, it's horrible, and it doesn't care and or is inexplicably malevolent. It makes me question if my continued existence will be a thing, but not the place and nature of things. It simply doesn't belong and has to be dealt with for life to continue. Necrozma would be the animalistic abomination. This animal/Pokemon goes against everything animals/Pokemon should be and we can't ignore it the way we can other animals/Pokemon we don't like, but it's still definitely an animal. We still know what animals are, what Pokemon do. Still, it's going to burn the sky, we're all going to die! Outside Context Problem would also be a Sister Trope. Dark Matter fits in nicely, but Arceus doesn't, as it isn't really bringing much of anything to an end, only being a problem to the in-universe scientific community and out of universe players who cared about what really amounts to lore that simply complements game play, to Dark Matter's kill us all/give me a Game Over. Star Fish Alien another sister trope. The alien virus has become a Pokemon now, but Deoxies is still a very alien entity imitating something familiar as best it can. The Super Trope would be Our Monsters Are Weird. Outside Context Problem isn't really a subtrope, but it's possible for two sister tropes to have different super tropes right? These aren't biological creatures, they're writing tools being put on wiki pages. Invincible Villain, Unseen Evil, Take Our Word for It, Reality-Breaking Paradox, Brown Note Being, Near-Villain Victory, Broke Your Arm Punching Out Cthulhu, You Cannot Grasp the True Form and related tropes could be listed on some index if it needs more clarity.

Edited by IndirectActiveTransport on Nov 5th 2023 at 10:45:51 AM

That may well be a possible way forward.

The way I see it, for something to qualify as an Eldritch Abomination (or whatever name we're going to use going forward), it must fundamentally break some established rule of the setting as perceived by the characters, and be impossible to classify by any in-universe system. Being a weird, scary monster doesn't cut it— the entity or object in question has to be incomprehensible from the perspective of the characters. Some questions to keep in mind are the following:

-Does the object or entity look like anything that already exists in-universe that the characters might recognize and have a name for?

-Can it be described in such a way that someone could get a good idea of what it looks like even without having ever seen it?

-Does it manage to exist without violating any real-world or in-universe laws of physics?

If the answer to at least one of these questions is "yes", then it is not an Eldritch Abomination.

Okay, well, let me throw one at you.

Part of the setting of Reign of the Seven Spellblades is that the Constructed World exists in a multiverse where the stars in the sky are glimpses of alternate universes, called tírs (from the IRL Gaelic word for "realm"), that periodically intersect with "ours" and allow things to migrate between them. Other tírs usually have their own "gods" (神 kami in the original Japanese) which establish and enforce natural laws of their own. These are pretty much Alien Geometries compared to the Earthlike planet the series is set on: for example, Luftmarz is a world composed entirely of fire, i.e. where the places you would see earth, air, and water are literally forms of fire that behave similarly to earth, air, and water.

But in "our" world, God Is Dead (magic itself is Fire Stolen from the Gods), and some tír migrations are essentially Alien Invasions by another god who sees "our" world as easy pickings, and try to impose their Alien Geometries on "our" world—both by direct invasion and by establishing cults to their worship (called "Gnostics") through servants called Apostles, both of which are in turn fought by Military Mages called Gnostic Hunters. For example, we see a migration from Uranischegar, "the Regimented Heavens", in volume 9, which takes the form of several stone-like pillars that slam into the ground and begin reshaping it from a grassy plain into a featureless white surface. We also have this bit, when one of the characters makes contact with a piece of one of the pillars:

Do you think we should consider the tír gods to be Eldritch Abominations?

I lean "no", partly because, rather than inducing existential horror at our place in the universe, mages mostly seem to approach them as very powerful and dangerous entities that need to be kept out of "our" world, but whose effects can be studied with the scientific method.

Also worth noting, I have the series as a whole classified as Lovecraft Lite rather than Cosmic Horror Story, mostly on the grounds that the ills of the series tend to more directly be a result of Humans Are Bastards than of tír invasions (one of the major reasons Gnostic cults attract followers is because Muggles are widely oppressed by The Magocracy and the Gnostics offer an alternative).

And I think that demonstrates just how many moving parts there are to this trope.

Edited by StarSword on Nov 29th 2023 at 12:37:18 PM

Actually, that is an interesting point; if the entity in question is the creator of the world and its in-universe laws, does it matter that it can break them? Personally, I feel the most important aspects are the reality-warping and being at least somewhat monstrous and incomprehensible.

I think it'll depend on how the "creator" fits into the world-view of the characters. Generally speaking, the characters will have a place and a role within their understanding of how the universe works for creator-beings. Those creator beings may have that "unknowable" aspect to them (like, for example, the real life Christian God), but it's treated in a very different way to a being that would be regarded as an eldritch abomination.

Now, if characters meet their creator and are left reeling by the eldritch experience and are left with their minds blown and rethinking everything they thought about life, their existence and the nature of the being they thought of as their creator... then we may well be dealing with a creator who is eventually revealed to be an Eldritch Abomination. In my experience, those kinds of overlaps tend to be The Reveal or a Plot Twist that the audience and characters find out together. That's the point where the "monstrous and incomprehensible" aspect of the creator comes into play.

In short, I think creator beings will be a case-by-case basis, depending on their role within the story (if they have one). Fans could easily debate whether the creator might be an Eldritch Abomination, and perhaps apply fanon, headcanon or fridge to it, but the real point is whether such a trope is in play within the work. For many creator beings, it just won't be relevant to the story that's being told, so the trope won't be in play at all.

Edited by Wyldchyld on Dec 12th 2023 at 12:20:45 PM