To-do list:

• Move examples about translated works' plots being changed from Cut And Paste Translation to Dub-Induced Plotline Change. If a work is instead referring to translated works being composed of parts of multiple works, that's covered by Frankenslation instead. If a work doesn't fit either Dub-Induced Plotline Change or Frankenslation, remove it.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Sep 26th 2022 at 8:26:54 AM

Opening

Wouldn't Adaptation Distillation / Compressed Adaptation cover this concept?

That's for adaptations. This trope is for foreign translations making more or less massive changes to the original product. Things like Voltron compared to GoLion for example.

Adaptational X tropes seem to have use for translations as well, though that's their problem. I'd be for having Dub Plotline Change or something like that. Though that's to address misuse, for complaining not sure what to do besides just cleaning it up and putting a notice that it's not Macekre or YMMV.

Cleaning up misuse + renaming it to Dub Plotline Change.

I approve too.

Rename + cleanup

I'm good with a rename and cleanup.

While we're at it, back in the really, really early days of the site, Macekre did not mean whatever Cut And Paste Translation ends up being about. When that page first started, it referred specifically to the practice of combining multiple sources to make a new show. Most famously, Robotech was frankensteined from Super Dimension Fortress Macross, Super Dimension Cavalry Southern Cross, and Genesis Climber MOSPEADA, or how Power Rangers takes the fight scenes from Super Sentai and combines them with original footage. But Trope Decay set in almost immediately, leading to the current page.

I've felt for some time that the original definition is distinct enough to warrant a separate trope, so as long as we're renaming and redefining, can we split off the practice of combining footage from multiple sources to make a new work?

Edited by VampireBuddha on Jun 18th 2022 at 4:41:47 PM

...this was the only point that irked me about the name change. I'm OK into doing a split: Dub Plotline Change for the dubs that change parts of the original plot, and this other trope for the dubs that edit shows by combining them together or add new footage made from scratch. The only question is: will the latter be the new definition for Cut And Paste Translation or will it be a completely new trope? For the second case, what we call this other trope? Frankenstein Dub is clear enough?

I feel like it might be better to implement the Frankenstein Dub idea by bringing Macekre to TRS in the future and undoing its Trope Decay, and possibly renaming it in the process, rather than moving Macekre's original definition to a new name without touching Macekre itself.

Alternatively, if someone did a wick check for Macekre, we could handle it through this thread.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jun 18th 2022 at 4:46:44 AM

Hmm, as far back as I can go in the archived discussion and stuff I only see people discussing the translation stuff. Is there a record of the OG definition?

...Though yeah, Macekre probably deserves a separate discussion.

Here's an early capture of Macekre if anyone's interested.

Macekre needs help, but unless someone wants to work on it now this isn't a good place for it.

I'm fine with the idea of Frankenstein Dub (Should be discussed in TLP if it reaches it if it's just for dubs or any form of Non-Linear Edit to generate a new narrative works out) alongside the previously discussed "plot changes" trope.

I suspect the Frankenstein Dub idea will either turn out to be Too Rare to Trope or a Dead Horse Trope. Modern anime fandom is too purist to let it slide as a viable business model, so any recent examples will likely be restricted to Power Rangers. That only leaves legacy examples, and I'm curious to know how many actually exist.

Edited by Karxrida on Jun 18th 2022 at 3:59:59 AM

I'll be honest, outside of You Tube Poop I don't personally know cases that would suit Frankenstein Dub.

In that case, I think we should just rename Cut And Paste Translation to Dub Plotline Change without also splitting off Frankenstein Dub.

Since one of the earliest versions of Macekre in the Wayback Machine (if not the earliest; I didn't check the snapshot timeline and only looked at the specific archived page that was linked to) doesn't appear to refer to mixing and matching parts of works, either the Trope Decay happened very early in the site's life (i.e., before article creation dates were recorded), or it never happened and the Mandela Effect occurred.

The closest thing to the Frankenstein Dub idea in the wick check is The Beatles example, but that's not a dub because the songs are in English on both sides of the Atlantic; the tracks were just mixed and matched in the US instead of the original British albums being exported as-is.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Jun 18th 2022 at 6:56:30 AM

As far as I can tell, that is the earliest snapshot of the page that waybackmachine has. Paragraph 3 does mention the Frankenstein thing:

(Emphasis mine)

Edited by underCoverSailsman on Jun 18th 2022 at 9:49:46 AM

Then maybe that's something to keep in mind if Macekre gets its own thread and we retool it into Frankenstein Dub in said thread.

I do seem to remember Macekre specifically referring to frankensteining back in 2005, but that was long enough ago, and the wiki standards were so loose back then, that I might just be misremembering.

Off the top of my head:

• Power Rangers
• Masked Rider
• VR Troopers
• Big Bad Beetleborgs
• RoboTech
• Voltron

Then there's things like Mystery Science Theater 3000, and some of what's currently listed under MST might also qualify.

In any case, I'm just going to take this concept to TLP, and we can decide what to do with Macekre later.

EDIT: TLP is up.

Edited by VampireBuddha on Jun 19th 2022 at 1:53:44 PM

NVM

Edited by MacronNotes on Jun 21st 2022 at 8:24:52 AM

Renaming the trope.