Never Live It Down Cleanup

You mean the tidbit from the OBC entry or the NLID entry?

The OBC entry.

Okay the NLID thing seems to stem from what it means that SEGA America/Europe decided to go for Cranky Food Friends instead of doing an english release of Puyo Puyo Quest (as detailed in OBC), hence it notes the minor Memetic Mutation from it aswell.

Though it may be better to check it in the Fact Checking and Removing Negativity threads to determine how much is fact-grounded and how much is bashing.

Er, isn't NLID about character actions? I'm pretty sure those are all misuse anyway.

Then again, I have no idea how Real Life examples for this thing work, because companies aren't characters and it seems like misuse getting in on a loophole more than anything.

All Real Life examples require a 25-year waiting period, though when it comes to companies I think it better fits Overshadowed by Controversy.

While the waiting period is true, it doesn't really resolve my problem any. An example added 30 years after the controversy isn't inherently fitting for NILD just because we waited a few decades.

The trope is specifically about fans exaggerating things characters do in fan works, focusing on minor details that don't even properly represent the character. How are the Real Life examples not misusing the concept?

Edited by WarJay77 on Feb 26th 2021 at 3:31:26 PM

That, is something I didn't realise whilst discussing the Puyo Puyo examples. If that's the case:

• The Cranky Food Friends example would be misuse since it's about an installment and the meta-connection as described in the related OBC entry.
• The Madou Monogatari example would be partial misuse since it affects how the installments are percieved, not the characters.
• The IGN example is misuse since it would apply more to the company giving out the statement than the game itself.
• The Toshihiro example is straight up creator misuse, because of violating the No Recent Examples, Please! rule regarding real life NLID.

This is on Medieval Times Dinner And Tournament:

Never Live It Down: The times when Medieval Times appears in popular culture is usually to be butt of jokes. So when it was announced a film adaptation is in development, many heckled at it.

Never Live It Down is specifically about characters’ actions, so that can go.

Edited by jandn2014 on Mar 2nd 2021 at 12:19:24 PM

I found this on the Real Life section:

• Atari's Christmas Rush for E.T. the Extra-Terrestrial soiled their name to the point where it eventually became impossible for them to fully recover their reputation, especially when the Crash allowed Nintendo to swipe their top spot for themselves (the game also affected the movie's reputation as well).

Is the parentheses sentence really true? I don't really see anyone saying that the film itself was negatively impacted by the game.

I don't believe the film was affected, so it's safe to cut that part.

From YMMV.Super Smash Bros For Nintendo 3 DS And Wii U:

• Robin and Corrin will always remind people of the sudden increase of Fire Emblem characters that became noticeable in this game. They are unique and fun characters in their own right that use weapons that other Fire Emblem characters don't use, but since they are both Fire Emblem protagonists who use a sword they are considered to be part of the problem instead of trying to move away from it. Even Sakurai stated after Corrin's reveal that he worried about the large number of Fire Emblem characters in the game. This stigma also carried onto the next game as many fans feared about Nintendo forcing Sakurai to add a character from Fire Emblem: Three Houses such as Byleth/Edelgard instead of waiting for the hypothetical next Smash game. Such fears would ultimately come to pass with the announcement of Byleth as the last character of Fighters Pass Vol. 1, marking the eighth character from the franchise to join the roster. To put that into perspective, it is now one character short of the main Mario series and is tied with Pokémon for unique character slots (counting each of the Trainer's Pokémon separately leads to a total of 10). As the DLC fighters were chosen by Nintendo, this brought several accusations of Executive Meddling just to promote the latest installment. The release of the DLC Wave 4 trailer for Three Houses mere moments after the presentation revealing Byleth concluded certainly didn't help.

This example seems be referring less to the characters' action so much as their inclusion in the game.

Edited by costanton11 on Mar 23rd 2021 at 5:48:35 AM

It's complaining about creator decisions, not about character actions that won't be forgotten.

YMMV.Caillou

• Never Live It Down: In "Caillou Joins the Circus", Caillou throwing a temper tantrum over the fact that he isn't going to the circus until the very next day.
  • Good luck finding anyone who forgives him for pinching Rosie.
  • People will also never let go of the fact that his mother has no qualms against leaving him alone with a total stranger. Granted, the stranger turned out to be harmless, but it's still highly irresponsible to do something like that and how the show treats this as in the right.
  • Caillou's parents are often remembered for letting Caillou have his way all the time despite his bratty attitude and constant whining without any kind of discipline.

Only the first entry is valid. Barely anyone ever brings up the pinching incident compared to the circus tantrum, same with Caillou’s mom and the stranger. The last one is just a general example, not a moment.

YMMV.Star Vs The Forces Of Evil

• Star's decision to "destroy the magic" is one that isn't going to be forgotten any time soon. Even now, it's still a common occurrence to see people compare Star to Thanos or make genocide jokes about her.

This keeps getting added back despite NLID being about unfairly exaggerated aspects. It's just complaining as written as it's fails to explain what's being exaggerated.

The issues is already covered under Designated Hero and Unintentionally Unsympathetic. It's valid complaint but not NILD unless it explains how it's being unfairly exaggerated.

Any reason not to cut or ways to fix it? Is there any mitigating context that is being ignored?

How is this revision to the entry?

• Never Live It Down: Star destroying magic dooming countless beings and civilizations in the Series Finale is practically the only thing fans talk about her since. Star alone is the target of backlash, or genocide jokes, ignoring the objectionable OOC actions of other characters this season thwarting peaceful alternatives leaving Star no clear other option to save her people.

Edited by Ferot_Dreadnaught on Apr 9th 2021 at 2:28:08 AM

From Game Grumps. Much of this seems to be troping real life before the waiting period, and the rest could be moved to Overshadowed by Controversy or Memetic Mutation or something.

• Never Live It Down:
  • Jon claims that pointing out he says "legitimately" often has led to this with some of his other friends.
  • Table Flip never really recovered from the Sling deal; the news of lovelies having to pay to get new episodes or wait 2 months for them to be uploaded on YouTube (especially on a service only available to Americans) caused a huge controversy. Videos advertising new episodes on Sling are disliked so heavily that it's become a Running Gag of sorts, and Ross even admitted that he would no longer go onto the show.
  • Brian drew attention to his PhD in several of his early appearances as a Running Gag, though quickly dropped it. You wouldn't know that from the fans, who still bring it up. He's even lampshaded it before in one of the videos, how fans and the other Grumps keep bringing it up more than Brian himself, now.
  • Arin's never going to hear the end of it with his constant Take Thats to Sonic, especially when it came to his constant attacks to the game on GrumpCade with Jirard, who is a fan of the series.
    • In fact, this mentality has extended to virtually any game he doesn't find to his taste — to mixed reception.
    • He also never reads the instructions, something the fans won't let anyone forget.
  • Even if it was a deliberate troll job, Matt and Ryan will never escape the initial release of the November 2017 Best of Game Grumps compilation where nearly every clip was titled "SOME TOKENS!", which was meant to only be used for a Leisure Suit Larry: Magna Cum Laude clip at the very end. When the video was reposted with the proper subtitle cards, an overwhelming majority of the comments were jokes or references to "SOME TOKENS!"
    • Much deeper, Ryan and Matt probably will never live down the endless fandom theories and accusations about their fallout with Markiplier, especially in regards to the abrupt cease of collaboration between the Grumps and Mark. Mark has appeared on NSP videos even after their fallout, and when the Grumps played Among Us, Mark was one of the players.

Just more evidence that NLID should be NRLEP...ugh.

It's 25 years NREP, that's already more than enough.

It's not that, it's that I'm completely convinced that "Real Life" examples of NLID are misuse of the trope. It's about character action that fans blow out of proportion. By Definition, real life people and their actions don't qualify as "characters", and any legit examples are more likely Overshadowed by Controversy.

I brought it up at the Real Life cleanup too, but nothing came of it; nobody even put it on a crowner.

Edited by WarJay77 on Apr 30th 2021 at 9:14:19 AM

Is "an action that a RL person takes that fans/haters/whoever blow out of proportion" really different enough to say it's misuse?

To me it is, because with character tropes, there's gotta be some sort of narrative that's being deviated from. We can't say a popular band member is an Ensemble Dark Horse; we can't say a specific member of a creative team is a Creator's Pet; we can't say someone in real life is Adorkable or that they're a victim of Alternative Character Interpretation; so what's the difference here? A narrative is needed, something that can be definitively and objectively compared against the moment in question and the fandom's portrayal of it. Remember, part of the trope is that the comparisons are exaggerated, sort of like a fanfic-y Flanderization based on a single event in the actual work.

I've never seen a RL example that fits the criteria, and I'm not a fan of stretching definitions just so we can continue to complain about real life issues.

Both Never Live It Down and Overshadowed by Controversy RL examples face so much misuse that the problem is more "which one do we want to curb more?"

Edited by mightymewtron on Apr 30th 2021 at 9:38:53 AM

I'd rather curb NLID (obviously), since that can be called actual misuse of the trope, whereas OBC is a shoehorn magnet but not inherently misuse.

I'm definitely doing a NLID wick check soon btw. It's been a long time coming.

Kamon The Skunk deleted this entry from YMMV.Sonic The Hedgehog Archie Comics

• Never Live It Down: Many fans aren't willing to let Sally live down the time she slapped Sonic in anger. Even after repeated displays of remorse from the character, and even a Cosmic Retcon rendering it Canon Discontinuity, there are still fans who will hold it against her. Her "vest and boots and nothing else" outfit from the cartoon and pre-reboot comics is also what a lot of people remember about her despite the reboot changing this, as it made Sally a rare, notable exception to the standard Pantsless Males, Fully-Dressed Females design scheme used by the Sonic games to this day.

His reason was: "The slap was in issue 134 which was released in 2004. Therefore, it hasn't been 25 years since it occured."

I thought the 25 years rule only applied to real life cases. The slap, being fictional, doesn't have this rule. Right?

Yes, 25 years is only for real life, while fiction is I think six months. And given that Sally was the trope namer for a duplicate of Never Live It Down, it sounds like she counts.

EDIT: Actually, we don't seem to have a waiting period for character actions at all, which feels like a mild oversight.

Edited by mightymewtron on May 7th 2021 at 3:54:04 PM