During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
- Why do a cleanup?: This trope definitely exists and has a well documented history of use. That being said, it frequently gets misused to a character who meets one of the components, namely that they are smart, charming while not necessarily even being a villain, or create good plans. While these are components, there is also a certain personality required, not to mention that all of the above are required to be present for a character to be a true Magnificent Bastard. As the trope attracts interest, it unfortunately brings in a lot of misuse and I thought the best way to rectify this would be a Perpetual Cleanup Thread, as is being done and has seen success with Complete Monster.
- What makes a Magnificent Bastard: Below is a list of the individual components to make this character. Note that they must all be present, not just some, which has lead to frequent misuse:
- Must be intelligent: Goes without saying, to be a Magnificent Bastard, the character has to be smart in the first place and use their brain to work towards whatever their end goal may be;
- Must be a Bastard: While going overboard in how vile the character is can be detrimental, a key aspect is the Bastard part of the trope, whether the character is an out-and-out antagonist in the work, some manner of Villain Protagonist, or something in between, they at least have some unscrupulous qualities to qualify for this trope;
- Must not be too detestable: Again, there is a ceiling on how bad the character can be before they just become too nefarious, blocking out the Magnificent part of the trope. A genocidal racist or child-raping Sadist aren't going to make the cut;
- Think on their feet: In addition to being a Chessmaster, a Magnificent Bastard, if the character deals with situations in which their initial plan is ruined, has to be able to pull a Xanatos Speed Chess and at least come up with a competent strategy to make up for lost time, otherwise they fail for being unable to think in tough spots;
- Have charm: Even if they don't necessarily make every character they meet fall in love with them and can even be detested by others, the audience has to find an amicable social relation to the character, or they are failing to make the impact required for this trope.
- What to do if a character is listed on a page but has not been approved?: They need to be removed, all candidates need to come through the cleanup thread first. The character could well count but they need to be analyzed properly and voted on first.
- Do we list Playing With this trope?: No; as a YMMV trope, this cannot be Played With, so we only want examples that are Played Straight.
- What do I do if I want a character to be listed as a Magnificent Bastard?: The greatest success Complete Monster saw for its cleanup effort was from the invention of the effort post format, so, borrowing from that, a troper wishing to propose a Magnificent Bastard will create such a post in the following format:
- Begin by describing The work, this will help establish the setting the character is in and for the reader to understand what kind of a scenario they are in;
- Summarize The character's actions, this will provide a listing for readers to understand what they do and how it applies to this trope because charm and lack of smugness are so crucial, this is a good time to be incorporating exactly the flavor of how they operate to explain this;
- List circumstances in which the character must Think on their feet, these are times where a wrench might be thrown in their initial plan and they have to adapt on the spot or even come up with a new scheme all together, this is also a good time to explain how the villain reacts to defeat when they have to face it, a true Magnificent Bastard won't break down into tears at the thought of death, they should have known such a possibility could occur and be able to handle it with more dignity;
- The competition, similar to the Heinous Standard dealt with for a Complete Monster, this section is to deal with how successful the character is in carrying out their plans compared to other characters. While, as a villain, they probably are going to lose in the end, it is good to explain how other characters handle the same situation. There is no exceptionalism case to be made for this trope but explaining the variety helps the reader have a better understanding of the proposal.
- How do you know when the character's arc is done so they can be proposed? When their tenure as a villain or antagonist finishes. This could happen in a single Story Arc in an entire work, a single work of a franchise, or the whole series in general. We'll show lenience to Long-Runners with constantly recurring candidates or series with outstanding continuities (ex. comic books), and it's entirely possible to count in a work or two but not in general for a reason like Depending on the Writer.
- What about candidates evil because of external sources? Those Made of Evil can qualify if they show enough individuality and tactical acumen — in other words, they have the personality to fulfill the magnificence requirement. Conversely, those brainwashed, especially if they're a better person without it, may fail the individuality aspect and cannot count.
- What if they are under orders from a higher-up? Depends. If the boss created the plans down to the letter and the candidate is just following them, sounds like we should discuss the boss instead. However, if the candidate takes creative liberties with the orders, adds their own charm and flair to them, fills in holes in the orders, and/or actively deals with obstacles their boss did not talk about, the candidate shows enough individual thinking to qualify.
- What about Character Development? An MB is something a character can develop into... a nice person who plots well might become more morally gray as the work goes on and hits the "Bastard" criteria, thus making them viable. Likewise, a Smug Snake might shed their ego, become more understanding of the threat others pose and gain the personality or "Magnificent" criteria, likewise making them viable. Conversely, a character who looks like this trope might suffer from a Sanity Slippage or just get outed as not being as smart as they thought they were and become incompatible with MB.
- Can an MB be a good guy? Not in the conventional sense... it is required they have at least some dubious traits lest they fail the "Bastard" criteria. That being said, a character who pulls a Heel–Face Turn or eventually stops taking villainous actions is still fair game: as there was a point in time where they were both "Magnificent" and a "Bastard" at the same time and they've merely adapted as time goes on. Now... if such a character begins showing other issues (i.e.: becomes prone to freak outs or starts getting outwitted) then they're compromising their Magnificence and will probably be deemed a cut. What's important is stylishly operating while at least for some time being willing to take at best underhanded methods to see a job done. A Heel–Face Turn in itself isn't a disqualifier but they do have to have been "Magnificent" and a "Bastard" at the same time and afterwards can't start slipping on the former front.
- What about characters whose stories can take different routes?: When proposing a character in a form of media that has them in multiple story routes. Said character must be consistent with their characteristics in all routes. (ex.: Can't have an example who shows promise on one route yet fails in another.) The only exception is if a later installment of the series confirms the character's actions which made them worth proposing are the canon route.
- Is there a timeframe rule like with Complete Monster?: Yes, please wait two weeks until after the work has concluded before proposing a character (again, usually using the North American air date). As is the case with CM, we want to give a reasonable time frame so that everyone interested in seeing the work has done so and can participate in the discussion without having anything spoiled.
- What about groups like with Complete Monster?: This is a point of divergence between the two tropes. While CM does not allow for a single entry encompassing more than three characters lest their heinousness for crimes becomes too watered down, with MB as long as they are treated as one "unit" it is acceptable to lump all characters provided they share acts of charm and intelligence.
- Can I propose my own work's character as a Magnificent Bastard?: No, this is a YMMV subject and the creator of a content is way too biased to be able to evaluate the criteria we're looking for without a second opinion taking over. That being said, you are more than welcome to encourage someone to consume your creation and if they feel a character counts, are more than welcome to suggest them.
- My example/edit has been approved, but the example subpage is locked! How do I get it added?: The moderators do not add examples to locked example subpages in the MagnificentBastard/ namespace directly. Rather, you need to do the edit to a sandbox page that follows the format Sandbox.MagnificentBastard<Name of the example subpage> (e.g for MagnificentBastard.Fullmetal Alchemist it's Sandbox.Magnificent Bastard Fullmetal Alchemist) and on a Friday, ask in the locked pages edit requests thread for the content to be swapped in.
Thread rules
When voting a troper must specify the effort post they're voting on and cannot merely vote on "Everything I missed" as in the past it has indicated the poster didn't read the effort post and is guessing instead of analyzing.
Resolved items
In general, a character listed on this trope is considered "settled". This means they should not be challenged unless information used to list them was incorrect or information was missed in the initial discussion.
However, when re-litigating a candidate, the same rules apply for when they were originally proposed. If they do not have five or more upvotes than downvotes for approval upon a re-litigation, including votes from the initial discussion if they do not change, then they are a cut.
This especially applies to the characters listed below, who have been discussed excessively and repeated attempts to get them listed/cut may result in punitive action for bogging down the thread.
Definitely an MB
- Pokémon Mystery Dungeon: Explorers: Any sadism Darkrai displays is limited in effect thanks to the game's nature and any cowardice which can be inferred about him is Alternative Character Interpretation about his tactical retreats.
- Avatar: The Last Airbender: Azula's Villainous Breakdown is undone in the sequel comic Smoke & Shadow where she regains her composure and ends up stable and in control enough to count.
Definitely not an MB
- South Park: The show's frequent use of vulgar comedy and mean-spirited humor leaves any potential candidates devoid of the dignity or charm to qualify.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:15:22 AM
Gotta love Jaws!
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to Charos, the Fox, Araton, Murn and Sax.
Leaning towards a hesitant ![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
for Pink and Blue.
Ultimate Moral Compass
Mah girl Mona
Fox, Aratron, Mum and Mona
Pink and Blue
Goku Black
Mona
Classy, Refined, Unstable
Fox, Aratron, Murn, Mona
Showtime!
With the Fox from "The Fox and the Crow" still being considered a keeper, I will now move on to my second candidate, who is also a fox, this time from the story "The Deer Without A Heart". The linked version of the story, while detailed, may also be an eyesore since it doesn't have paragraphs, and many of the facts here are different compared to my initial EP. However, it was the most detailed that I could find, so I will summarize it below
The Work
A lion had fallen ill and was unable to hunt. A fox is keeping him company, and one day the lion requests the fox to obtain a deer for it to eat. It complies, and finds a deer in the woodlands. The fox approaches the deer and tells it that the lion will be dying soon, and wants the deer to be its successor. Also, the lion wants to meet the deer personally.
The deer complies and comes to the cave, where the lion tries to attack it. However, the deer escapes, so the fox promises to retrieve it. It finds the deer, who calls out the fox, who responds by accusing the deer of being a paranoid and fearsome asshole, and that the lion never intended to hurt it. The deer is eventually convinced to return to the lions den, and this time the lion successfully kills it.
When the lion is distracted, the fox eats the deer's heart (or brain in later versions). When the lion notices this, the lion suspects that the fox ate it, but the fox responds by saying that "The deer had no brains" - after all why would a creature return to a place where it nearly died the first time?
Magnificence and Bastardry
The fox is able to trick the deer into returning to the lions den a second time, and also gets away with stealing part of the lion's meal. It does all this while keeping an affable and "innocent" demeanor
Verdict
This was another candidate whose initial proposal was an uncontroversial , but lets see how it goes this time around
Edited by magnumtropus on Mar 13th 2022 at 4:08:11 PM
Sure to Mona and the Lion. No to the Unicorns.
My first EP here. Let's see how this goes.
What's the work?
Narcos is a Netflix crime drama running from 2015 to 2017 across 3 seasons that shows a fictionalised version of the war against the colonbiam drug cartels (most prominently Medellin and Cali).
It has a spin-off called Narcos:Mexico.
Who's Colonel Horacio Carillo and what has he done?
Colonel Carillo is a prominent character in season 1 and 2. He is a incredibly competent colombian police officer with a deep seated hatred of drug dealers, who is the closest thing Escobar has to an arch-enemy.
A long-time adversary of the Narcos he has already lost dozens of partners at the start of the show and developed a reputation for going against orders.
An invaluable ally to the leads Murphy and Pena he proves himself to be a incredibly useful help to the DEA, through a combination of being cautious and clever (like spying on his own (partly corrupt) men for conversations with the Narcos he can use and hiding between the language barrier to prevent valuable information being overheard) and ruthlessly competent (like obtaining valuable information through torture). When Pablo Escobar becomes a public target he is assigned to catch him and uses young incorruptable recruits from the academies who lost friends and family to the cartels to build the search bloc.
He soon becomes a big threat to Escobar, closing down labs, arresting key members of his organisation and even leading a raid that kills his partner Gacha (despite being heavily outnumbered they have minimal losses).
After a failed attempt to bribe him, Pablo tries to have him killed on a date with his wife. Carillo survives, and (furious over his wife being endangered and pablo's numerous crimes) calls Pablo. While a self-righteous Escobar tells him that he should have taken his money, Carillo informs him about how he knows every step his family members have taken in the last few days. Challenging Escobar he tells him that he will find and kill him and hangs up when Pablo starts to rant about how he will murder everyone he ever loved.
When Pablo manages to (through terror and hostages) secure himself the deal of going in a self-built prison (which is basically a luxurious hotel), Carillo is determined to stop it by finding him before it's finalised (knowing that he won't be able to protect his men with Pablo safe in "prison"). He makes a deal with the Ochoas that gives them only fairly short prison sentences in exchange for Pablo's cousin and right-hand man Gustavo Gaviria. Carillo has Gaviria brutally beaten by relatives of Pablo's numerous victims, confronting Gustavo over the numerous murders they comitted. Gustavo, however refuses to give up Pablo, yelling that Pablo will murder the families of Carillo and all his men. Carillo then kills him and frames it as a shoor-out. While he is exiled to Spain soon after, he manages to kill off many of Pablo's most vile killers in a a night club before that (resulting in a innocent civilian being killed in the crossfire).
In Season 2 after Pablo has escaped and slaughtered about 30 policemen (many friends and colleagues of Carillo), he returns from Exile to finally catch him. He re-introduces himself by luring out Pablo's childspotters and arresting them. When he confronts them on all the people they got killed, a teenager scoffs that they probably deserved it. Carillo executes him as a warning and then lets the rest go, telling them to never spy for Pablo again.
He continues to be a big threat to Pablo, executing his sicarios, busting his labs and even causing Escobar to have nightmares about him. Unfortunately, thanks to a innocent woman, tricked into believing she would turn Escobar in, Carillo gets led into a ambush of the cartel where he's separated from his team. Carillo fights valiantly but is overwhelmed and shot multiple times. Escobar then finishes him off after Carillo defys him one last time, calling him a coward to his face. Despite this Escobar's luck eventually runs out due to a alliance of his numerous enemies (criminals and law enforcement) and after his organisation is destroyed he is killed by Carillo's own number two.
Is he magnificent?
Carillo is a absolute badass, being both a intelligent and strong leader to his search bloc who works well with his resources and often wins with smaller numbers.
He is a courageous Frontline General always leading his own raids who is deeply concerned for the lives of his men and tries hard to keep them out of unnecessary danger. Even when completely at Pablo's mercy he's still brave enough to call him a coward to his face.
He is also humanised by being a loving husband and a long time friend of Javier Pena.
Is he a bastard/ Is he too much of one?
Carillo is utterly ruthless. His interrogation methods are brutal with stuff like repeatedly suffocating prisoners with a plastic bag, having a naked sicario tortured with hot coffee and throwing two sicarios, who are unwilling or able to talk out of his helicopter. He's also not above killing his prisoners as a example (as shown with the teenager) or when they don't give him intel.
Despite this, he never is unnecessary sadistic or cruel, only using it for actually valuable intel. And his method works a lot of the time, has saved lives and gotten him some of Pablo's most important assets.
On top of that, most of his victims pretty clearly deserved to die. Some of the Prime examples are Joseph-Rodriguez Gacha (a vile drug lord who had a DEA informant gangraped by sicarios and casually shot his dog after loosing a bet), Poison (Pablo's psychotic enforcers who is even ready to murder infants and his long time partner), or Gustavo (while one of the more sympathetic cartel leaders he was involved in countless deaths and spitefully ranted that Pablo would kill the families and friends of Carillo and all his mens in his last moments). Even the teenager had previously told Carillo in his faces that Carillo's friends and colleagues he got killed were pigs who probably had it coming. He is still nowhere as bad as most cartel members and even compared to the death squad Los Pepes who murder the family members of Pablo's servants and grotesquely present their corpses his actions are less evil.
Final Verdict?
I would say he keeps but I leave that to you.
to Colonel Horacio Carillo.
Okay here is my write up:
- FBI: Most Wanted: Chattaboogie: Evan Greeter is charming but ruthless heir to "the Board", a Hillbilly Moonshiner syndicate turned drug ring. Betrayed by the others, despite personal assurances they would look after his mother, Evan vowed revenge. Whilst patiently spying on the operation Evan discovered Susan Kleinman's secret partnership with Clayton Smith, laundering gold for The Cartel and was planning to eliminate the others. Assisted only by his girlfriend Maggie, Evan beat Susan to punch killing the Shallet siblings and kidnapping Smith, tricking the authorities into believing Smith committed the murders. Forcing all he needed out of Smith Evan staged his suicide, then outsmarted and killed the remaining board member Allen and his operatives. Stealing the latest gold shipment Evan trapped Susan, calling her out for her betrayal and revealing his plans to take over running both operations. In spite of being caught by the FBI, Evan had the foresight to have already sent his mother and her boyfriend off an international cruise with a stolen fortune, ensuring them luxury for rest of their lives.
Thoughts?
Edited by MGD107 on Mar 13th 2022 at 11:01:43 AM
Took a day off, so catch-up time:
for Mason, Molokai, Zimos, Venompool, Charos, Aratron, Murn, Mona, and Carillo.
Owing to the new restrictions on the Aesop EP's, I'll happily start over with, after careful consideration, a for the Foxes. Before initially abstaining, I did have an idea for potential candidates from an adaptation of the Aesop Fables, but I think, first thing's first, let's cover the original stories.
for Pink and Blue.
Hope you've had a good one, 43.
Edited by TellAll111 on Mar 13th 2022 at 12:50:29 PM
to Carillo
Goku Black
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Send it to 43110 and hell add it to the drafts.
Carlilo.
Yes to Carillo.
I'm not really comfortable with the idea the kid deserved to die. He was a bit defiant, but he was a teenager and just a spotter, that hardly deserved a bullet to the face. More to the point as a result of that action Pablo commissions an interview with a reporter he's had an affair with in order to discredit Carillo. It doesn't quite work, but as a result of that interview, Carillo doesn't have the backup of Pena and Murphy when he's ambushed, as it was considered bad form for them to be out in the field with him. Now would that have saved him? Probably not, it was a large ambush, I'm not sure how many extra help two more men would have been. But it still indicative in my mind that he was outplayed at the end. Pablo himself can't count, he's got a huge hair-trigger temper, albeit he is quite high-functioning... I guess I'll give him a leaning . Seems comparable to an L-Light/Lelouch-Schniezel situation.
Edited by jjjj2 on Mar 13th 2022 at 7:14:31 AM
You can only write so much in your forum signature. It's not fair that I want to write a piece of writing yet it will cut me off in the mid
Classy, Refined, Unstable
Carillo
Edited by WetFlannels on Mar 13th 2022 at 11:04:50 AM
Oh, Mr. Kennedy, you entertain me. To show my appreciation, I will help you awaken from your world of clichés.
What's the work? Orochi is an early 1970's horror anthology manga series by Kazuo Umezu, framed from the titular Orochi, a supernatural girl of ancient age, as she travels the world and encounters various psychological tales about the dark side of humanity. "Stage" is one of the stories in the series.
Who's Yuuichi and what has he done? When Yuuichi was 3 years old, he witnessed his father get run over by Tanabe Shingo, a man on a television program he regularly watched. When his testimony is thrown out on account of his age and Tanabe is allowed to walk free, Yuuichi dedicates the rest of his life to tracking the man down in order to get revenge. Practicing singing, he eventually flees his home and tries to get into Tanabe's home before changing approach after being reprimanded by a guard. Changing his name and identity, he impresses the owners of the stage bar he worked at and is invited to a singing contest, where he sabotages the competition and wins the tournament in order to meet with Tanabe, who had changed his name to Hanada Hidei. He sets his plan into motion, carefully learning how to mimic the man's singing voice as well as learning every personal detail about him. Setting his plan into motion, he plays a fake recording in order to convince Tanabe's accountant that the night parade he was going to perform at was postponed and he was out with his manager, before mimicking the accountant's voice to the TV Studio airing the event and telling them that Tanabe wasn't coming that night, leading to them not sending a car over and Tanabe being late, which causes Tanabe to fire the accountant due to believing he was the cause. Yuuichi then poisons Tanabe with mercury, ruining his voice, and planting the blame on another one of his proteges. He performs a near-perfect imitation of Tanabe's voice while claiming to be him for the next records, and purchases a new car to drive Tanabe, revealing himself to be the boy that the man's father had ran over. With Tanabe taking the wheel, he swerves onto the road, confirming to Yuuichi his animalistic nature behind the wheel and the identity of him as his father's killer. With Tanabe left crippled and mute, he's unable to reveal Yuuichi's true identity, instead offering an apology letter that Yuuichi rips to shreds after reading, with the boy deciding to settle back with his mother.
Is he magnificent? Yuuichi is a careful schemer who manages to infiltrate the life of and completely destroy his father's killer. He uses considered imitation from years of practice and various ingenious schemes to do so.
Is he a bastard/ Is he too much of one? Yuuichi harms numerous people in his quest for revenge, including abandoning his mother, and seems to enjoy it when people around him fail, and he rejects the possibility of Tanabe's redemption after the man regrets his actions and leaves his life in permanent ruin. It's also shown his motivation of revenge is fundamentally misguided. However, he's careful and precise and once his goals are complete, he reunites with his mother and settles down to live a normal life.
Final Verdict? Yes. Considering we have 3 Kazuo Umezu CM's, I thought we'd get a MB eventually.
What's the work? Orochi is an early 1970's horror anthology manga series by Kazuo Umezu, framed from the titular Orochi, a supernatural girl of ancient age, as she travels the world and encounters various psychological tales about the dark side of humanity. "Stage" is one of the stories in the series.
Who's Yuuichi and what has he done? When Yuuichi was 3 years old, he witnessed his father get run over by Tanabe Shingo, a man on a television program he regularly watched. When his testimony is thrown out on account of his age and Tanabe is allowed to walk free, Yuuichi dedicates the rest of his life to tracking the man down in order to get revenge. Practicing singing, he eventually flees his home and tries to get into Tanabe's home before changing approach after being reprimanded by a guard. Changing his name and identity, he impresses the owners of the stage bar he worked at and is invited to a singing contest, where he sabotages the competition and wins the tournament in order to meet with Tanabe, who had changed his name to Hanada Hidei. He sets his plan into motion, carefully learning how to mimic the man's singing voice as well as learning every personal detail about him. Setting his plan into motion, he plays a fake recording in order to convince Tanabe's accountant that the night parade he was going to perform at was postponed and he was out with his manager, before mimicking the accountant's voice to the TV Studio airing the event and telling them that Tanabe wasn't coming that night, leading to them not sending a car over and Tanabe being late, which causes Tanabe to fire the accountant due to believing he was the cause. Yuuichi then poisons Tanabe with mercury, ruining his voice, and planting the blame on another one of his proteges. He performs a near-perfect imitation of Tanabe's voice while claiming to be him for the next records, and purchases a new car to drive Tanabe, revealing himself to be the boy that the man's father had ran over. With Tanabe taking the wheel, he swerves onto the road, confirming to Yuuichi his animalistic nature behind the wheel and the identity of him as his father's killer. With Tanabe left crippled and mute, he's unable to reveal Yuuichi's true identity, instead offering an apology letter that Yuuichi rips to shreds after reading, with the boy deciding to settle back with his mother.
Is he magnificent? Yuuichi is a careful schemer who manages to infiltrate the life of and completely destroy his father's killer. He uses considered imitation from years of practice and various ingenious schemes to do so.
Is he a bastard/ Is he too much of one? Yuuichi harms numerous people in his quest for revenge, including abandoning his mother, and seems to enjoy it when people around him fail, and he rejects the possibility of Tanabe's redemption after the man regrets his actions and leaves his life in permanent ruin. It's also shown his motivation of revenge is fundamentally misguided. However, he's careful and precise and once his goals are complete, he reunites with his mother and settles down to live a normal life.
Final Verdict? Yes. Considering we have 3 Kazuo Umezu CM's, I thought we'd get a MB eventually.
I hate spoilers
for Yuuichi, since he "seems to enjoy it when people around him fail". In addition, rejecting the possibility of someone's guilt seems kind of childish. Yuuichi is intelligent, but what he did to Tanabe feels worse than his dad getting run over. He wants to avenge his dad, but neglects his mom. This guy is sick.
Also, I'm going to assume the double-posting was by accident.
Edited by 227someguy on Mar 13th 2022 at 8:06:59 AM
Everyone look at my sandbox
The Draftsman of Doom
No to Yuu. Yes to Carillo and the fox. Will have another Gotham EP when there is enough space.
Feels good, don't it?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
Yuuichi
The Draftsman of Doom
Screw it. It's been 30 minutes. I've put this off long enough.
What is the work?
"Arkham" is the fourth episode of Gotham.A mysterious assassin assassinates multiple city council personnel on opposing sides of a plan for the Arkham district of Gotham.
Who is "Richard Gladwell" and how does he operate?
Gladwell is an assassin working for both Sal Maroni and Carmine Falcone.
Gladwell initially poses as a constituent of Councilman Ron Jenkins before tricking the latter's aide into dying using a telescopic spike of his own design, which Gladwell subsequently uses to kill Jenkins.
While Detective Jim Gordon discovers that Jenkins was in cahoots with Falcone, Gladwell has abducted Maroni's pocket councilman, Zeller, and set him on fire per Maroni's instructions.
After Ed Nygma reveals to Gordon and Bullock that the victims had similar wounds, they learn Gladwell's assumed identity and workplace from an incarcerated assassin.
At the workplace, Gordon and Bullock find evidence against Gladwell, as well as a piece of paper with the letters "CLM".
Oswald Cobblepot warns Jim about an impending hit on a politician, and Gordon subsequently figures out that the letters stand for the surnames of Mayor Aubrey James's police detail, who are conspicuously absent.
Gordon goes to the mayor's residence, where he attempts to help the mayor escape, leading to a confrontation between Jim, Bullock and Gladwell, and ending in Gladwell's death.
Charisma & Intelligence?
Manages to kill two politicians and an aide on behalf of two rival gangsters, and comes very close to assassinating the mayor, all while being a consummate professional.
Admittedly, the fact that his victims have matching wounds catches up to him, but he very nearly succeeds regardless due to using a false identity.
Moral Flexibility?
While Gladwell may be a cold-blooded murderer who kills two corrupt politicians and one aide in cold blood, plus making an attempt on the (admittedly crooked) mayor's life, in addition to killing a man and stealing his identity, his consummate professionalism stops him from being too reprehensible.
He still exploits a brewing gang war to sell his services.
Competition?
He may be working for both Falcone and Maroni, but he is less of a pawn, and more of a guy playing both sides for profit.
Gladwell's only real competition in the episode is Oswald, whose actions indirectly prevent Gladwell from assassinating the mayor.
Verdict?
Possible Contender.![[down]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_down.png "[down]"){kind=icon}
Why?
Edited by SkyCat32 on Mar 13th 2022 at 8:59:42 AM
Feels good, don't it?
Classy, Refined, Unstable
Gladwell (Tentative)
Classy, Refined, Unstable
Alrighty, 43 if you're around, the drafts are all good to go!
I'll be having another Green Arrow potential soon - looking forward to that!