Removing complaining, bashing and other negativity from the wiki

It'd help if you linked back to it.

Knock yourself out. I agree, lots of complaining on the Main and YMMV pages.

Found Spideys post, it was about Paper Mario: The Origami King, but they didnt go into any specifics.

Post #15 on page 158.

Edited by antenna_ears on Oct 28th 2020 at 4:05:53 AM

Here are the entries they mentioned:

I'm trying to clean up The Nostalgia Critic: The Critic and the first page alone is full of excuses to complain about the supposed difference in characterization between Critic pre- and post-To Boldly Flee. From the first subpage alone, the Aesop Amnesia, Became Their Own Antithesis, and Character Check entries are padded with complaining about gags that supposedly make him look meaner than he was pre-reboot. (I say "supposed" because meanspirited humor has always been present in the show and I know for a fact that people exaggerated the problems in the 2013 season.)

Edited by mightymewtron on Oct 29th 2020 at 2:04:38 PM

There definitely was some resentment in his videos after the reboot.

Yeah, but tropers who were bitter about Demo Reel ending exaggerated the hell out of his viciousness. In more recent years Doug has said he wasn't really that bitter and has come to enjoy his show.

Plus, there's a lot of deliberate misrepresentation on these pages - a lot of entries point out that he hit Evilina as evidence that he's a child abuser, but he only hit her after she hit him and she immediately stopped crying when he told her to, implying she wasn't even that sad. The discussion pages have a lot of fighting about moments like this and I knew a frequent troper who personally admitted to being very bitter after Demo Reel's cancellation.

Edited by mightymewtron on Oct 29th 2020 at 2:28:35 PM

Pretty sure characters that aren't in the game to begin with, like Yoshis and Lakitus, can't be wasted.

About the whole Critic thing, as an ex-fan, I do remember a lot of criticism about the newer Critic episodes versus the older ones, so I definitely buy that there is a lot of complaining on the page. Go ahead and nuke any complaining you find, we aren't supposed to use this site to whine about perceived Seasonal Rot.

I'm trying, but I wanted to bring it here to see if any other fans and ex-fans find the entries I mentioned (under the specific tropes) to have any merit, or if it's an exaggeration by bitter preboot fans. I linked the cleanup sandbox as well, since I made some notes on these entries.

Well, like I said, there was a little resentment, which is certainly understandable since the fans basically forced Doug's hand in returning the Critic, and made it very clear they came for the Critic first and foremost. But that disappeared quickly, and Doug seems to have moved on as well by the sound of it. You could reduce all that to a single short entry and delete everything else, I think.

Just checked the trope entries you mentioned. With the exception of some portions, most of what you mentioned is complaining. I'll see if I can go over the individual entries, starting with Aesop Amnesia:

• Aesop Amnesia:
  • Bullet 1 is complaining
  • Bullet 2 is also complaining. Sub-bullet might be salvageable though
  • Bullet 3 is also complaining
  • Bullet 4 starts out with complaining, second portion could be salvageable. Maybe a rewrite?
  • Bullet 5 is complaining
  • Bullet 6 is complaining
  • Bullet 7 could be salvaged, as it is not complaining
  • Bullet 8 is complaining
  • Bullet 9 is complaining
  • Bullet 10 is really complain-y
  • And finally, Bullet 11 is also very complain-y.

Most of it can be cut. I'll go over the other tropes later, either here or in the dedicated cleanup thread, wherever you would prefer me to go over it.

Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Oct 29th 2020 at 2:58:59 PM

The dedicated cleanup (plug!) is a better place, since I do want more attention drawn there, but if activity lags, bringing it to a bigger cleanup like here would suffice. I'll cut the poor Aesop Amnesia entries - I'll keep a few open-ended because some might be examples in context, but are poorly explained. (The Alice in Wonderland example is lampshaded but they didn't include that for some reason, instead choosing to whine about an unrelated review.) Note that the nature of the show means lessons like "guilty pleasures exist" can't be carried over to every single episode.

Edited by mightymewtron on Oct 29th 2020 at 3:09:13 PM

Alright, thanks. When I get to it I'll bring it there.

Found this on Molly of Denali:

They Copied It, So It Sucks!!: Some Go Animate users called it a ripoff of Dorathe Explorer before Molly of Denali even aired, although the shows have nothing in common besides Molly and Dora looking somewhat similar. There are also some people who somehow think this show rips off Wild Kratts, even though anyone with a functioning brain who has seen both shows will tell you that they have nothing in common.

Yeah that's quite complain-y. You can probably cut.

The grammar's a bit off too.

From Shower of Awkward:

• Two Guys, a Girl and a Pizza Place: Johnny's does various attempts to walk in on Sharon in the shower. Unfortunately, he gets Ashley the first and Pete's grandpa the second time. This was certainly not inspired by the ''Friends'' example from above.

Is the last sentence really worth keeping?

Cut it.

Agreed. It's Word Cruft, anyway.

Bringing up the following examples from YMMV.Supermarket Sweep:

• Replacement Scrappy: Leslie Jones received complaints on Facebook for her loud, abrasive behavior. These range from her use of profanity within the first five minutes to her use of sexual innuendo (for example: she needed a cucumber for her "Me Night") to how she yells all the time. Fans eagerly longed for the days of David Ruprecht and praised his professionalism.
• They Changed It, Now It Sucks!: Many aspects in relation to the revival with Leslie Jones and the overhaul of the Bonus Sweep being the biggest offenders. Fans complained that Leslie kept stealing the spotlight and was an overall a poor fit for the host's spot. The Bonus Sweep succumbing to Who Wants to Be "Who Wants to Be a Millionaire?" while offering no extra consolation cash didn't help matters. There was also the introduction of vendor bonuses which some people felt was a cheap shot at retailers and ill-timed due to the ongoing coronavirus pandemic. Fans who were expecting a theme re-orchestration similar to what was done for the Press Your Luck revival were disappointed to hear "Push it" by Salt-N-Pepa open the show. David Ruprecht even posted a comment on the show's official Facebook page, calling the revival a "debacle".
  • Related to the music change, Christopher Rhyne, the composer of the theme for the Lifetime and PAX runs, said of the music in a comment on this Youtube clip, "Any kid with a laptop and some beats software could churn that stuff out in 2 minutes." In his comment, he went on to say that he had had a signed agreement for the show's producers to use his original music, but they then changed their minds and blew him off at the last minute.

I have seen the 2020 revival, and I personally didn't think Jones was that bad (though I can see why people wouldn't like her style of hosting). I bring it up because, to me, the Replacement Scrappy example's final sentence feels like the editor who added it is letting their own opinions color their writing. I'm not super sure I'm saying this without bias myself, though, so I wanted to get a second opinion from others here.

At any rate, the They Changed It, Now It Sucks! entry definitely doesn't need the second bullet point. Its contents are already mentioned in the series' Trivia page, anyway.

In the spirit of this thread, I really think that Poor Man's Substitute needs either a serious overhaul or to be made to be In-Universe Examples Only. Aside from the iffy nature of the whole "A List vs B List" nonsense, I can see how many if not all of the real life examples can be disguised as a Take That!.

Making it IUEO would require there to already be in-universe examples on the wiki, and since there aren't any on the page, any potential TRS thread would have to do a wick check to see if there are any off-page in-universe examples.

Edit: I completely overlooked the in-universe folder at the bottom of the page... whoops.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Oct 31st 2020 at 8:07:03 AM

From YMMV.The Fault In Our Stars:

• Alternative Character Interpretation:
  • Some readers dislike Augustus, claiming that his grandiose mannerisms and his love of metaphor make him grating and pretentious, but others argue that he was meant to be written that way, because wanting to be impressive and memorable is an established character trait of his.
    
    There's also the interpretation that he's mainly interested in getting Hazel into bed. He's a teenaged boy knowing he might die (and for the majority of his time with Hazel knows he's going to die) and he's only pursued girls he knows were dying, suggesting to some that he's not interested in a relationship (and that he perhaps hopes they will be easier to get into bed since they know they won't get too many opportunities to try it). This interpretation seems common among readers who found his courting of Hazel shallow and the relationship itself lacking in depth and being mostly about two hormonal teenagers finding each other attractive. Also there's his comment to Hazel that he hopes bringing her to Amsterdam might get him laid, which some interpret as not actually being in jest. As to why he doesn't dump her once they've done the deed, it can be argued that as his illness progresses he wants to keep her close because she offers him comfort, or that he hopes he will get to sleep with her again.
  • Some readers also dislike Hazel, feeling that she holds herself to be better than everyone else, is very judgmental, puts down other people's emotions instead of showing empathy and that she is extremely self-entitled. The way she tells Gus to be appreciative of the life and people around him rubs these readers the wrong way, as it comes across to them as her invalidating his (perfectly understandable) desire to have a larger life than what he got. On the other hand, Hazel does have a right to be a little offended since Gus is implying he doesn't feel their relationship is important.

So I haven't read the book myself, but these entries, especially considering they go out of their way to say it comes out of dislike for the characters, seem more like Unintentionally Unsympathetic entires than ACI. What should I do with them?

There are actually In-Universe examples that are in their own folder.