Is this an example?

I've written these two examples for the Classicaloid page quite some time ago, but I'm doubting whether they are shoehorns or not.

• Attention Whore: Downplayed. Liszt doesn't demand that she be in the spotlight but she certainly enjoys the attention. She mentions in episode 3 that she loves giving live performances, which had temporarily blinded her to Chopin's fear of them. She also doesn't seem to mind being stared at by others in episode 4.
  • This is given more focus in episode 11, where she believes that she must become the symbol of feminine beauty at the Otowa mansion while Kanae is away. Instead of doing her given chores, she hams it up and strikes ridiculously dramatic poses in various places.

• The Philosopher: Schubert's running commentary throughout episode 4 gives it a contemplative tone as he ponders about the present world around him and draws connections to his previous life.

The Attention Whore example uses bad indentation. If it's one example, it goes in one bullet. If it's two examples, they should both be double-bulleted.

The Philosopher feels like a shoehorn. It's a Characters as Device role, not a thing a character does from time to time. They must be "the philosopher" of the group, the person known for quoting Aristotle and Plato at any opportune situation, and so on.

Can you please clarify what indentation means?

Example Indentation In Trope Lists.

Recently, the following Distaff Counterpart example was changed. Unchanged version:

For the 3DS edition of Hyrule Warriors, Link receives one in the form of Linkle. It has been joked about for the longest time that Link was fairly androgynous, so it's a marvel that Nintendo waited this long to acknowledge it.

Changed version:

For the 3DS edition of Hyrule Warriors, Linkle is a subversion. Despite having a similar name and appearance to Link, she has her own distinct story branch and character. Her childish "wannabe" characteristics actually make her more similar to Tingle than Link.

Opinions?

edited 19th Jan '17 3:03:25 AM by MagBas

Now I know I am suspended for now (Until I get back on) but once I'm back on I'm curious and see if I can add it. Does this count as Underboobs?◊ All the other images of in the anime preview show simply Bare Your Midriff but this one is much more revealing than the others that seem to show the Underboobs off which the other pictures don't, so is it Bare Your Midriff or Underboobs?

edited 19th Jan '17 11:36:45 AM by ReynTime250

Bare Your Midriff

Could someone take a look at these examples from the Emerald City page, and see if their being used correctly:

• Adaptational Attractiveness:
  • Lucas (the series' version of the Scarecrow) is good-looking too, and human...
  • The Tin Man, now a knight tracking down Dorothy for the wizard, has received a similar treatment.
  • Jack, presumably this series incarnation of Jack Pumpkinhead is far easier on the eyes than a wooden stick figure with a Jack-o-lantern for a head.
• Adaptation Name Change: Toto is still called Toto, but it's no longer his name. It's Munja'kin for "dog."
• Crapsack World: Oz is not a place you would want to live in. If the Wizard ruling as an absolute monarch, his guard committing atrocities, or the all-powerful witches running around are not enough to discourage you, then the fact that an Eldritch Abomination tries to destroy the place once a generation should seal the deal.
• Eldritch Abomination: The Beast Forever is a thing that attacks Oz once a generation, taking different forms every time, and not all of them necessarily corporeal.

• Adaptational Attractiveness: Not sure what would count as adequate context, but those examples are big on telling over showing.
• Adaptation Name Change: The example literally says that Toto's name wasn't changed. "Hi, I'm not an example, delete me."
• Crapsack World: This is not just "has a nasty ruler and bad things happen sometimes", it's that life sucks for just about everyone just about all of the time, and attempts to change it for the better never succeed, or at least not for long.
• Eldritch Abomination: The example should emphasize that the Beast Forever is wrong in ways that cause people to Go Mad from the Revelation, or something similar, as that's a key element of the trope.

Could someone take a look at these examples from YMMV.Shadowhunters:

These three I need to know whether they have enough context as written:

• Estrogen Brigade: With a Cast Full of Pretty Boys on display, there are sizeable female fanbases for Jace, Alec, Luke, Magnus, Simon and even Hodge (since he got Adaptational Attractiveness).
• Growing the Beard: Fans of the show point to the fifth episode as a marked improvement. The actors settle into their characters better - especially Emeraude Tobia and Matthew Daddario, effects get a little better and the episode structure is better.
• Testosterone Brigade: Clary and Isabelle are gorgeous. Plenty of male fans watch the show just to stare at them. Lydia too when she shows up.

And I'm not sure this example is being used correctly:

• The Un-Twist: Even for those who didn't read the books, it was very obvious that Michael Weyland was Valentine in disguise.

Looking at the definitions of Estrogen Brigade and Testosterone Brigade, I don't believe a work can have both. If it's a show aimed at women, it can have a testosterone brigade; if it's aimed at men, an estrogen brigade, and if it's not aimed at any gender in particular, I don't think it can have either. One or both is misuse for "show contains a lot of hotties"—which isn't a trope, and is darn close to People Sit On Chairs In Hollywood. :)

Growing the Beard sounds ok to me. More details might be nice, but it does list some specific reasons for the fan reaction.

The one I think is lacking sufficient details is actually The Un-Twist. As a result of which, I can't answer whether it's being used correctly. :)

edited 21st Jan '17 4:36:15 PM by Xtifr

Could someone take a look at these examples from the Emerald City page:

I need to know whether these are being used correctly:

• Body Horror: When poor Jack is brought back to life, he finds that much of his body has been replaced by metal and clockwork.
• Clock Punk: The technology used to save Jack's life falls within this category, as the only visible part of it is a complicated clockwork mechanism.

The following example reads to me more like Metaphorically True than "Exact Words", but I'm not 100% sure:

• Exact Words: When the Wizard asks Glinda and West to keep the Prison of the Abject running, Glinda tells him that all of East's spells died with her and they can't replicate them. This was entirely true, but she neglected to mention that there was a ritual that could be used to retrieve the spells from her corpse.

And does this example have enough context as written:

• Finger-Twitching Revival: The first sign that Mombi has revived herself after Lucas' rather enthusiastic attempt to kill her.

The Body Horror example, as written, is definitely borderline, but I think it can squeak by. It establishes the reasons, even if it doesn't emphasize the reaction.

Clock Punk says it's a setting trope (which is odd—I would have expected it to be a genre). I don't think a single view of clockwork technology counts.

The Exact Words one sounds correct. I'm not even sure what you think is wrong with it. The relevant words are "can't replicate". Those are literally true, and entirely misleading. Seems fine to me.

Finger-Twitching Revival—I can see why you were wondering, but I think it passes. For a less specific trope, I would want a how, but for a trope this specific, I think who, when, and why is adequate, and they all seem to be minimally present. Might be worth a second opinion, though.

Could someone take a look at these examples from the Emerald City page:

• First Kiss: Dorothy and Lucas share their first kiss near the end of "Science and Magic".
• Killed Off for Real: East dies twice in the first episode: first when she is run over by Dorothy, and then tricked into shooting herself through the head, which seems to do the trick permanently.
• Letting Her Hair Down: We see Anna with her hair loose for the first time in "Science and Magic", while she's recovering from being in an explosion.
• Made a Slave: Jack is essentially enslaved by Lady Ev.

Made a Slave needs further elaboration, and it must also ditch the word "essentially" for being Word Cruft.

Bumping this one.

Does having fanservice make a work ecchi?

They pretty much all need more context to be sure.

• First Kiss: Okay, technically we can tell that this applies from the context but goddamn, there should be more. Is it the couples' first kiss or is it also their first individual kisses? Did they have UST beforehand? Is this the beginning of a relationship?
• Killed Off for Real: The fact the character dies twice raises a few flags. Makes me think that she's not Killed Off for Real. Why did the first one not take? Why do we think the second one did?
• Letting Her Hair Down: Okay, this seems like a shoehorn. The trope is "uptight girl lets her hair be free to show she's relaxed." Which doesn't really cover "recovering from an explosion."
• Made a Slave: Agree with . Just needs more detail.

edited 23rd Jan '17 6:36:55 AM by Larkmarn

No more than "a sex scene" makes a work "porno".

Here are some more examples from the Emerald City that could do with a quick look at:

• Magical Underpinnings of Reality: In Oz the weather requires a powerful witch monitoring and stabilizing it to keep it from going completely out of whack. This was Mistress East's job and her death has meant things like snowfalls in the middle of summer.
• Magic from Technology: While some characters explicitly refer to what the Wizard does as science and technology, some keep referring to it as magic, different from the magic of witches.
• Male Gaze: After Tip turns into a girl, Jack finds it hard to stop staring at her cleavage. A waitress advises Tip to cover them up.
• Nice Job Breaking It, Hero: Killing the Witch of the East means there's nobody in charge of stabilizing the weather in Oz.

Also the Made a Slave example I brought here has been changed to the following after I had commented it out:

• Made a Slave: After Jack catches the attention of Lady Ev, she decides to make Jack her property.

• Magical Underpinnings of Reality: As written, not necessarily an example. The trope is a matter of scale; one person having a magical job doing something is not this trope.
• Magic from Technology: It's describing Clarke's Third Law, not MFT.
• Male Gaze: Misuse, Male Gaze is a camera/filming trope. This seems to be describing Eating the Eye Candy.
• Nice Job Breaking It, Hero: Needs a lot more context. Who's the hero? Why did they break it? Did they have a choice in the matter? Did people call them out on it?
• Made a Slave: Looks better.

Puella Magi Madoka Magica is a Darker and Edgier Deconstruction of the Magical Girl genre, and is set in the heart of a thriving city in modern/near-future Japan that alternates between bright futuristic aesthetics with plenty of Scenery Porn and Technology Porn and forebodingly gritty alleys and industrial areas. Does that make it qualify as an example of both Urban Fantasy and Dark Fantasy?

It should be Urban Fantasy, but I'm pretty sure that Dark Fantasy is limited to works within the Fantasy setting, not just the Fantasy genre.

That's not what our article or the Other Wiki say.

Like most genre definitions, especially smaller genres, the precise boundaries are a lot less precisely defined than many people think. In this case, I've seen the term used in the wild to mean anything from "all horror with fantastic elements" (as opposed to slasher/serial killer horror) to "fantasy that has strong horror elements" to simply "grimdark fantasy".

The other wiki actually says "[a] strict definition for dark fantasy is difficult to pin down", and then offers a few different, competing-but-well-attested definitions, and a list of various examples which have been described as dark fantasy by various "reliable sources".

You say you disagree with my opinion that the Dark Fantasy genre makes use of a Fantasy setting, and your evidence is... "There's competing definitions"? You're not even offering a definition of Dark Fantasy that would include an Urban Fantasy?

(Confused emoji)

Did you want a summary of why I think the setting is part of the Dark Fantasy genre?

I did offer a definition which would include Urban Fantasy, and, in fact, it's one of the oldest and still one of the most common definitions: horror with fantastic elements.

edited 24th Jan '17 12:06:00 PM by Xtifr

An Urban Fantasy setting may not be a Standard Fantasy Setting, but it is one kind of a Fantasy setting.

And horror is indeed quite present in MadoMagi, mostly of the Psychological and Cosmic kinds.

edited 24th Jan '17 12:06:56 PM by MarqFJA