During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Alright, I'll ![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
Kliff then if I can to do that to my own post
The Emperor of Evil!
![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to Shepard but I'm just gonna give a to Kliff, mostly because of the reliance on Fridge Horror, size of the satellite doesn't give us a confirmation on bodycount.
Edited by Powermaster201 on Jan 5th 2022 at 2:45:13 PM
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Okay officially saying no to Kliff.
Edited by Bullman on Jan 5th 2022 at 1:51:36 PM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Yea to the terrorist and Shepherd, but likewise nay to Kliff.
I'll be discussing Withcer after this. My final Vice post btw: from the series finale of Vice (albeit not the last episode aired), the two-hour closer Freefall, General Manuel Borbon.
Who is Manuel Borbon?
The dictator of Caribbean nation Costa Morada, Borbon is a brutal despot known as a butcher for the slaughrer of thousands. Political prisoners are slaughtered by the truckload in Borbon's regime. Borbon also starves his people, callously implementing policies to center food among himself and the lower classes while profiting by allowing the Medellin Cartel to run rampant through his nation and to use them as a launch point to sell drugs abroad while Borbon reaps the profits.
That said...Borbon is undergoing a bit of a reckoning as a result. His little junta is facing major resistance with guerillas rising against him and the people sick of the state of affairs. Borbon, seeing the writing on the wall, decides to make a deal with the US: he'll turn state's evidence against the Medellin Cartel in exchange for safe passage and sanctuary. When his finance minister brings the issue with the ledgers over to Borbon, he realizes Borbon is embezzling funds and planning to transger them out of the country....to which Borbon states he needs a new minister of finance before shooting him dead.
Rico and Crockett are sent to extract him, but upon arrival, Borbon is seemingly killed...and turns out to be faking his death with no intention of cooperating. Instead it turns out he has major dirt on US political figures and was blackmailing his way out, basically skipping town to hold his blackmail and letting drugs and civil war ravage his nation while abandoning everyone.
our heroes track him own, Borbon trying to kill them and glee...but they open fire on his small getaway plane until it explodes. This lands them in major hot water with the federal agents involved, but Tubbs and Crockett throw down their badges, quitting the force at last.
Mitigating issues?
Nope, He's a sleazy, self interested scumbag who's killed thousands, plunged his nation into civil war and sold it out to the cartels. He starves his people, murders a man who finds out about his corruption and plans to fuck off to a life of wealth and privilege without caring of the violence he started. He does have an adult daughter, but never displays care for her and has no issue with her thinking he's dead so he can head off.
Probably the worst guy for sheer count and reach barring Maynard himself.
Conclusion?
Easy keeper.
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Goku Black
Shepard, Terror people and Bourbon
Kiff
Edited by miraculous on Jan 5th 2022 at 11:50:24 AM
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Okay so I was just re-looking into a candidate I got up and I want to suggest that we cut Mongul from Superman Returns. Replaying it I don't know what I was thinking and am a little embarrassed with myself. He is super generic. He runs Gladiator Games and that is it. His trying to drop meteors on earth is fridge horror at best and him having his men attack civilians is because the game has tied Superman's health to them and the city. I am sorry I got this guy up I was still new to this trope and my god I am embarrassed. So, I am just laying the cords on the table.
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Goku Black
Cut
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
to Manuel
"Cool. Coolcoolcool."
Again, I would like to apologize for even getting this guy.
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Shepard, Terror people and Bourbon
to Tang, Al-Shabaab Trio, Shepherd and General Manuel Borbon.
I’m here, I guess.
Actually, regarding Kliff, this is a problem I had reading through the pages for No Straight Roads a while back. A lot of entries mention him crashing a satellite into a populated city which would have killed a lot of innocent people, but May and Zuke only focus on how destroying NSR's tower would only make them as bad as NSR themselves. You can see that past the tower at 1:19:07 that it surrounded by the ocean so it doesn't seem the satellite would've destroyed much other than the tower.
So to Kliff for me.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Yes to Borbon (second for Ian McShane); so long Mongul (hey, we all have our Old Shame. Before I became active on this thread, I put Carter Pewterschmidt up ![[lol]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/lol2v12_4863.png "[lol]"){kind=small}
).
Edited by ACW on Jan 5th 2022 at 3:02:39 PM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Ultimate Moral Compass
Shepard, Terrorists, and Bourbon
Cut Mongol. It's alright Bull, we all make mistakes here.
"No running in the halls!"
borbon
Cut mongul
Edited by Mediawatcher on Jan 5th 2022 at 12:10:14 PM
to Shepard and Bourbon
Cut Mogul. Don’t beat yourself too much on it bull. I’ve made that mistake before
Edited by G-Editor on Jan 5th 2022 at 3:12:21 PM
Shepherd.
I won't lie, I thought about Kliff, but I was concerned if the satellite thing counted as Fridge Horror or not. Still a pretty big Hate Sink though.
Professor Gigachad
Shepard and Bourbon
Going with a Weak Kliff, sounds like the kind of villain that normally could make it but Fridge Horror ruins his chances.
Cut Mongul
Edited by Ordeaux26 on Jan 5th 2022 at 12:20:40 PM
CM Sandboxes, MB Sandboxes
to the Eye in the Sky trio, the Shepherd and Borbon. Kliff.
Cut Mongul.
Yes to the three terrorists, Shepard, and Borbon. Cut Mongul.
The Draftsman of Doom
Yes to the terrorists.
Shepherd...if he doesn't care about Scotland, then why exactly did he start the war? The trope page says "The Shepherd is a rabid Scot nationalist who hates the English over the fact that his family business was shut down by an English noble". Seems mitigating?
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts