GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me

Sounds good on paper (he/him)

#1: Nov 26th 2022 at 3:13:44 AM

Note: This thread was proposed by underCoverSailsman.

Very short page description that talks about continuing a dead author's work without their permission. It's unclear if the name is the worst malapropism ever (Previous discussions have wondered if the troper meant Literary Necromancy) or if the title was specifically intended to imply disgusting and unnatural activity. The later interpretation comes through in the on-wiki use.

About half of the understandable uses act as if an adaptation or continuation of a classic is inherently inferior/bad. This looks like Complaining About Shows You Don't Like, and a wider visibility on the Wiki would probably encourage this use. The other half are simply "Derivative of <Classic> exists", which looks like People Sit on Chairs, since there are plenty of other Adaptational tropes to describe different ways that a work can be riffed on, and we now have the Derivativeworks/ namespace to index derivatives of a specific work.

Wick Check summary - Full check at Sandbox.Literary Necro Check

This one is starving on wick - only 15 non-sandbox wicks, for a total of 16 uses to check. Mix of potholes and trope-usages. Some on the adaptation work page, some on the parent work page.

2/16 indexing/trope relationships
1/16 unclear
5/16 Adaptation of a classic, and that's a Bad Thing!
5/16 Adaptation of a classic exists
3/16 ZCE, one if which manages to be salty about the work even so!

Starting suggestion: Just give this one a decent burial.

Wick check:

Literary Necrophilia is Starving, has either the worst malapropism title ever, (or the troper that made it was going for shock value...) and may be intended as a Complaining Magnet. Lets see what's actually going on...

Derivative Works: Basic Index Entry
Literary Mash-Ups: Page claims to be a subtrope. LN states "Not to be confused with LM-U", so Disowned Subtrope?
Sidelined Protagonist Crossover: The Empire Of Corpses is a Steampunk Literary Necrophilia (in more ways than one) Crossover of several novels that are set in the Victorian era (and some that are not, which are given Setting Updates). Some of the representatives are not the protagonists in their original novels. Unclear, but leaning Salty?

Sequel to a classic==bad (salty comments, mostly) 5/ 16

Literature.Gone With The Wind: Scarlett, Rhett Butler's People, Winds of Tara, Wind Done Gone. Each sequel has its fans and those who think it is utter garbage with about as much relevance to the main novel as any other fan fic. Everyone tends to agree that the sequels really don't measure up to the original in any significant way.
- Scarlett is from Scarlett's perspective and gives her the chance to grow out of being 16 and become a semi-normal if still manipulative and sociopathic woman, mostly by putting her through the emotional and physical wringer (this takes so much time and effort that the book is incredibly long, and several years have to pass in-story for it to happen). While still giving a faithful reproduction of Scarlett's romanticized world view, extrapolated from where she is at the end of Gone With The Wind, it does provide evidence that this view is grounded in a larger reality that is somewhat harsher and less melodramatic than she believes it is (to her shock and horror). It gives both Rhett and Scarlett's parents' backstories, making sense of both how Rhett came to be who he is and deconstructing the social tragedy of the "belle and beau" idiom. It takes the view that when all is said and done, and both are willing to treat each other with some modicum of respect, Scarlett and Rhett have as much chance of making each other happy as anyone. This was universally panned by critics, who all hated it - criticized as being insanely uneventful, probably because of the amount of time spent examining the different societies of the era through which Scarlett moves and which shape her. Nevertheless, a lot of fans loved it and thought exactly the opposite, so much so that it was a commercial success and is still in print (making it one of the most successful fanfics ever, before the internet). Yes, this is a polarizing phenomena, and what you think of it is very much up to individual opinion. A mini-series was based on this, but the plot is quite different (time might have been an issue).
- Rhett Butler's People is an 'authorized sequel by the Margret Mitchell estate'... which still means it has almost nothing to do with the original author but is liked by the people who run her estate who say that this is the canon successor. It is mostly Rhett Butler's point of view of what was going on during Gone With The Wind from his end, focusing on Rhett with contributing narrative viewpoints from other characters with their opinions of him, his life, and events surrounding it. It arguably takes as much liberty with its characters as Scarlett. It turns Rhett Butler into an angsty modern-age antihero and has very little to do with the Scarlett love-story which was the basis for the original book, preferring to sideline Scarlett as a mostly irritating sociopath (which is pretty accurate) and glorify Rhett Butler's life and deeds (while pretending not to). It takes the view that Scarlett was basically the mistake in Rhett's life and gives a new ending to Gone With The Wind. This was produced to replace Scarlett, which the Margret Mitchell estate viewed as a 'thorough embarrassment.'
- Winds Of Tara is another sequel altogether, ignoring both Scarlett and Rhett Butler's people. This is completely unauthorized... meaning it has just as much to do with the original author as the other two. However, this book was published on a much smaller scale and is more in keeping with the length and quality of a fanfic (as divisive as opinions are on the other two sequels, they are proper novels of fairly consistent quality). Unlike the other two sequels which focus on complex character interaction and character development, the plot with this sequel is more streamlined: Scarlett comes home broken-hearted after Rhett leaves her and takes her children, and she finds Tara in jeopardy at the hands of a greedy overseer. Although one might think that this subject area had already been covered rather extensively by the original novel, apparently it still wasn't enough.
- Wind Done Gone is coined as a technical 'unauthorized parody', but it isn't a comedy. This is Gone With The Wind re-imagined again, although this book predates Rhett Butler's People and is much cleverer in its inception. The story is told by Cyanara, a slave girl who says she is the daughter of Mammy and Gerald O'Hara, and is the tale of her movement throughout Atlanta and the South during the War, and into Washington D.C during the Reconstruction. All the characters from Gone With The Wind are completely reinvented and are identified with monikers such as "Other" for Scarlett, "R" for Rhett, and "Planter" for Scarlett's father. Her ongoing rivalry with "Other" is a common thread through the book, and as she moves through Scarlett's world all the characters we know are landed with complete in-universe Alternative Character Interpretation - e.g. Ashley is "The Dreamy Gentleman" who is horrified by Other's advances because he is a homosexual, and marries "Mealy Mouth" instead, "Mealy Mouth" who is really a manipulative sociopath who had "Miss Priss" (the parallel character to "Prissy" in the main novel) brothers' alternately whipped and starved to death, "Miss Priss" who is really a crafty mastermind who kills off "Mealy Mouth" in revenge. There is a lot of very insightful commentary and critique on the narrative viewpoint of the original novel, and all the horror and destruction that the Confederacy harbors which Scarlett never sees. The author was sued by the Margaret Mitchell estate for "The Wind Done Gone" being a too similar title to "Gone With The Wind." Wall of Text. Strongly leans into characterizing all of these novels as Fan Fic, with the judgement that the original was better than any of them.
Literature.Scarlet: Scarlett is from Scarlett's perspective and gives her the chance to grow out of being 16 and become a semi-normal if still manipulative and sociopathic woman, mostly by putting her through the emotional and physical wringer (this takes so much time and effort that the book is incredibly long, and several years have to pass in-story for it to happen). While still giving a faithful reproduction of Scarlett's romanticized world view, extrapolated from where she is at the end of Gone With The Wind, it does provide evidence that this view is grounded in a larger reality that is somewhat harsher and less melodramatic than she believes it is (to her shock and horror). It gives both Rhett and Scarlett's parents' backstories, making sense of both how Rhett came to be who he is and deconstructing the social tragedy of the "belle and beau" idiom. It takes the view that when all is said and done, and both are willing to treat each other with some modicum of respect, Scarlett and Rhett have as much chance of making each other happy as anyone. This was universally panned by critics, who all hated it - criticized as being insanely uneventful, probably because of the amount of time spent examining the different societies of the era through which Scarlett moves and which shape her. Nevertheless, a lot of fans loved it and thought exactly the opposite, so much so that it was a commercial success and is still in print (making it one of the most successful fanfics ever, before the internet). Yes, this is a polarizing phenomena, and what you think of it is very much up to individual opinion. A mini-series was based on this, but the plot is quite different (time might have been an issue). Note that this is an exact copypaste of the Scarlet Sub-Bullet on the Literature.Gone With The Wind entry
Literature.The Phantom Of Manhattan: By an author who puts down the original work in favor of an adaptation at that! Salty, regarding a novel that is a sequel to Theatre.The Phantom Of The Opera.
PerspectiveFlip.Literature: Not exactly a villain / hero perspective swap, but there's more than a few latterly-written versions of Pride and Prejudice around which are told from Mr. Darcy's perspective on events as opposed to Elizabeth Bennet's. Most of these are about as good as you would expect (and tend to ignore that Darcy, for all that he's a romantic hero, is still supposed to be a bit of a tool initially); an example of one of the better ones is Pamela Aidan's Fitzwilliam Darcy, Gentleman series, which fleshes out Darcy's character and background whilst still remaining faithful to both the original novel and the period. Bolded salty pothole.
Sandbox.Ran Out Of Source Material: Sequels based on works from the Public Domain tend to get this negative response the most, being viewed as blasphemies of classic stories that dare to continue something that was never intended to continue at all, even if it's just an adaptation. Best short description of what the "trope"? is trying to be.

Late-Coming Sequels exist. 5/ 16

Hooker with a Heart of Gold: Belle Watling, the madam with a heart of gold, in Gone with the Wind, who always has clear moral insight, strangely enough, and donates generously to the cause. (Other characters of this type named Belle are probably allusions to her.) The authorized sequel Rhett Butler's People makes her even more sympathetic by revealing that she fell in love with Rhett and had his child. Bolded Pothole
Literature.A Confederacy Of Dunces: A man also calling himself John Kennedy Toole and claiming to be the original's illegitimate son wrote a sequel novel called A Cornucopia of Dunderheads that focused on Ignatius's adventures in New York.
Literature.Molesworth: In 1983, Simon Brett revived Molesworth to give his view of the perils of adulthood and life in the business world of The '80s, in two books, Molesworth Rites Again and How to Stay Topp, and a radio series, Molesworth. Willie Rushton provided the cartoons for the books and the voice of Molesworth in the radio series. The books were written in the familiar style, with a foreword in which Molesworth explained that of course he could write better now but he knew what his fans expected. Unauthorised sequel by different author
Literature.Pride And Prejudice:
- There are countless sequels by various authors. Apparently a lot of readers didn't like never seeing Lizzy and Darcy consummate their relationship (though seeing as they got married, it's implied that they did). Hence, many of these sequels revolve around Lizzy and Darcy as newlyweds and all that implies.
- There are also several variations of the original novel told from Mr Darcy's point of view.
Literature.Winnie The Pooh:
- Literary Necrophilia: A sequel written 83 years after the original, and 53 years after the original author's death. In folder: Return to the hundred acre wood

ZCE 3/16, 1 salty

Literature.Mistress Mashams Repose Pure ZCE. Page description shows that this is an unofficial sequel to Gulliver's Travels.
Literature.Winnie The Pooh: Pure ZCE in folder "The best bear in all the world"
Literature.Dune: This Penny Arcade strip. Weblinks Are Not Examples! Also, the linked strip leans hard into the trope-name metaphor, and the saltiness.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Nov 27th 2022 at 2:02:30 PM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me

Sounds good on paper (he/him)

#2: Nov 26th 2022 at 3:14:01 AM

Paging ~underCoverSailsman to the thread. As a side note, this didn't actually need a wick check since it isn't thriving, though there's still no reason not to do one, so it's not a problem.

Anyway, I'm fine with cutting this.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Nov 26th 2022 at 5:19:14 AM

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

Amonimus the Retromancer from <<|Wiki Talk|>> (Sergeant) Relationship Status: In another castle

the Retromancer

#3: Nov 26th 2022 at 3:19:04 AM

"A sequel to a work by a dead author"

Merge with Outlived Its Creator?

TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup

GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me

Sounds good on paper (he/him)

#4: Nov 26th 2022 at 3:19:30 AM

That sounds fine.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

themayorofsimpleton Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him from Elsewhere (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Abstaining

Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him

#5: Nov 26th 2022 at 3:24:06 AM

TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall

MorganWick (Elder Troper)

#6: Nov 26th 2022 at 3:27:03 AM

(As a side note, given the age of the strip I wouldn't be surprised if the Penny Arcade example in the ZCE folder was the Trope Namer, which would mean the trope name was as intended. If so, though, that's never been made clear; Dune isn't even on the oldest Internet Archive version of the page, which nonetheless suggests it was used for complaining from the start, and the next-oldest version has a bare Weblinks Are Not Examples violation with no indication of any greater importance.)

Edited by MorganWick on Nov 26th 2022 at 3:31:39 AM

Berrenta How sweet it is from Texas Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love

How sweet it is

#7: Nov 26th 2022 at 4:55:02 AM

for Outlived Its Creator merge.

she/her | TRS needs your help! | Contributor of Trope Report

Yindee Just stoic wisdom. from New England Since: Jul, 2016

Just stoic wisdom.

#8: Nov 26th 2022 at 7:21:18 AM

Vehicle-Based Characterization | Grief-Induced Split | Locker Mail

Cutegirl920fire CG for short from NYC apparently (Rule of Three) Relationship Status: Paris holds the key to my heart

CG for short

#9: Nov 26th 2022 at 8:53:46 AM

Maybe make Literary Necromancy a redirect too but if no one wants that, it'll be fine.

Victor of HGS S320 | "There's rosemary, that's for remembrance. Pray you, love, remember."

NotGonnaDoALot4 Man in the Yellow Hat from God knows. Since: Feb, 2018 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters

Man in the Yellow Hat

#10: Nov 26th 2022 at 9:58:29 AM

Merge with Outlived Its Creator, and cut the title. It sounds too complainy.

There's so much I wish I could take back.

RamenChef Since: Dec, 2017 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities

#11: Nov 26th 2022 at 11:35:53 AM

Yeah, definitely merge.

MatthewWayne The Man Outside Reality from TVA Headquarters Since: Oct, 2014

The Man Outside Reality

#12: Nov 26th 2022 at 11:56:21 AM

Merge. Anything to get rid of this trope's gross title.

Trust no one.

randomtroper89 from The Fire Nation Since: Nov, 2010

#13: Nov 26th 2022 at 2:43:20 PM

Merge

Nen_desharu Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire from Greater Smash Bros. Universe or Toronto Since: Aug, 2020 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?

Nintendo Fanatic Extraordinaire

#14: Nov 26th 2022 at 3:06:05 PM

Merge

Kirby is awesome.

wootzits Since: Apr, 2010

#15: Nov 26th 2022 at 3:10:18 PM

Merge

MacronNotes (she/her) (Captain) Relationship Status: Less than three

(she/her)

#16: Nov 26th 2022 at 3:10:26 PM

There's 12 votes for a merge so calling thread in favor of merging Literary Necrophilia with Outlived Its Creator. On-page examples should be moved to the latter if they fit the trope.

Edited by MacronNotes on Nov 26th 2022 at 6:11:19 AM

Macron's notes

GastonRabbit Sounds good on paper (he/him) from Robinson, Illinois, USA (General of TV Troops) Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me

Sounds good on paper (he/him)

#17: Nov 27th 2022 at 12:03:34 AM

Didn't take long, so putting this one back in its coffin.

Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.

Add Post

Back Top

Total posts: 17

Not Tropeworthy: Literary Necrophilia

Wick Check summary - Full check at Sandbox.Literary Necro Check

Wick check: