Are these Character Tropes?

Point of Divergence is about the point or event where a timeline gets split into 2+ timelines, nothing to do with characterization.

CSP Cleanup Thread | All that I ask for ... is diamonds and dance floors

Then what a about One-Steve Limit? I feel like it might narrative based since it involves two character sharing name (since the trope doesn't allow straight examples).

She/Her | Currently cleaning Char Clone

I guess character because it has to do with the characters' names. I can see why someone would go either way with that, though.

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Is Significant Double Casting a character trope? I'm leaning on yes (especially if one is discussing an example that's characterization-related in some way), but I wanted to make sure.

Could Same Character, But Different be used for a character whose personality has been changed by a Cosmic Retcon?

I have a draft to clean up EDENS ZERO: Ziggy, but I'm having trouble with determining whether or not the following tropes are narrative tropes. I'll be listing them here along with my rationale for why they might be removable.

• Several Death Tropes, namely Back from the Dead: As discussed in this thread, a character's death tells nothing about who a character is as a person.
• Evil All Along and Good All Along: Both are forms of The Reveal, which looks like a story trope to me.
• Future Self Reveal: Same as above.
• Hyde Plays Jekyll: There are two cases where the character does this, but they seem like very context-specific, and one is a subversion.
• Tomato in the Mirror: A person making a discovery about themselves sounds like a story moment, but it also hinges around that person's character.
• Underestimating Badassery: Could be a character trope if done enough, but this character really only does it against one enemy for one scene.

Edited by immblueversion on Dec 15th 2023 at 11:30:10 AM

I have shuffled these two specific examples around on SMPLive way too many times so I'd appreciate a second opinion on where they should be placed:

• Black Market: After the outlawing of potions, Cooper has the idea to create an underground illegal drug ring on the server. Hilariously, this is in spite of the fact that said law was instilled during his time in the server cop role just a week earlier.
• Dragged into Drag: Wilbur is the victim of this during the SMPLive Reunion when Connor has the idea to make him work as the "waitress" at Schlatt & Co.'s new "Connor Esports Bar and Grill (With Women)". It ends badly.
  Wilbur: I WAS A WOMAN FOR YOU, CONNOR!!

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The first is technically an Aborted Arc, but the way he does this in spite of his previous actions is interesting characterization wise IMO?

My reasoning with the second is that Wilbur is characterized as a Pretty Boy pretty consistently and this was directly playing into it, but it's also a one-time thing, so...

Edit: On second thought, I'm putting the first one back on the work page because there's a Drugs Are Bad entry on the character page that already summarizes his weird flip-flopping, so I don't think this specific instance needs to be on his folder. Still would appreciate feedback on the second one though

Edited by Serilly on Dec 16th 2023 at 5:16:07 AM

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Leitmotif is something that can be justifiably placed in a character's own folder, right?

I mean, the trope page and laconic says it's about a character/someone's theme, and considering how that trope is placed in thousands of pages under the Characters/ namespace.

With Great Power, Comes Great Motivation

There seems to be disagreement over whether Xenomorph Xerox and Patriotic Fervor are character tropes or not so a third-party opinion would be appreciated. Both tropes appear in Independence Day.

Makes sense to me, it's the song about the character after all. Ideally the example would talk about the Leitmotif, most of the time I see them listed it's just the song title, which is a ZCE.

Xenomorph Xerox is a Expy trope. I think pretty much all Expy tropes are character tropes, it's in the name after all (exported character).

Patriotic Fervor seems like a trope that could go both ways, but the Independence Day example is about the president rallying others using patriotism, so it sounds like a story trope to me since it applies to a large part of the cast as a whole, not just him.

~immblueversion:

#754: This is more a question for the Is this an example? thread, but I think that would count as a Justified Trope variation.

#755: Speaking without any knowledge of the work in question:

• Death Tropes are generally counted as character tropes.
• Evil All Along and Good All Along are also character tropes: they're ways a character is developed.
• Future Self Reveal I think is a gray area. I think it would count if it has a significant effect on the character going forward, e.g. Future Me Scares Me. But if it's a one-off incident it should probably be considered a story or Recap trope.
• Based on your information, Hyde Plays Jekyll should probably go as a story or Recap trope.
• Tomato in the Mirror is a gray area, c.f. Future Self Reveal above.
• Underestimating Badassery is usually a story trope unless it happens repeatedly to a particular character.

Thanks, this helps. Good thing I still had an older version of the page on hand.

Any comment on Organic Technology (this is also related to the ID page mentioned in that ATT query)?

Edited by MyFinalEdits on Jan 11th 2024 at 12:56:20 PM

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I would say Organic Technology does fit on the Alien folder of the Character page, but only because the alien folder is more of a faction / race folder (which tropers do use on Character pages).

That was my thinking as well.

Alright, I'm going to add back Quizzical Tilt and Patriotic Fervor, citing this thread. Organic Technology is not something that pertains the aliens' traits or habits, just something they're good at. By the logic you're suggesting, one would add tropes like Product Delivery Ordeal or Journey to the Sky in a Character tab because those are things a character does during a story, even though they by themselves are still story-related tropes.

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My counter-question would be what Organic Technology contributes to the plot of Independence Day (as opposite to deepening the aliens' characterization of being otherworldly and superior). Product Delivery Ordeal or Journey to the Sky advance the plot.

Edited by eroock on Jan 12th 2024 at 6:18:24 PM

Fair enough.

Soon I'll begin to crosswick examples to another alien film article, so in case I see that trope among the wicks I will not add it to the page.

Edited by MyFinalEdits on Jan 12th 2024 at 12:38:00 PM

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So, about The Dragon and its related tropes, I have a quick question: do you think Dragon-in-Chief and Dragon Lady are considered sub-tropes?

He/His/Him. No matter who you are, always Be Yourself.

Dragon-in-Chief is a subtrope of The Dragon, while Dragon Lady is completely irrelevant. Also I don't think this is the right thread for this question.

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Gotcha.

Edited by gjjones on Jan 22nd 2024 at 12:31:22 PM

He/His/Him. No matter who you are, always Be Yourself.

Does Machiavelli Was Wrong count a character trope or not?

I could see it going either way. On the one hand, it could be the central theme of a work, in which case it wouldn't be. But then it could be a character's philosophy and thus a character trope.

Late thanks.

Thoughts about Curiosity Killed the Cast? And Tempting Fate as well?

Edited by Hello83433 on Mar 5th 2024 at 6:54:51 AM

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I feel Curiosity Killed the Cast is a plot trope since it causes the storyline to start. I also feel Tempting Fate isn't very characterization-related in general so I don't feel it's a character trope either.