Note: If a newly launched trope was already given a No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only designation while it was being drafted on the Trope Launch Pad, additions to the proper index do not need to go through this thread. Instead, simply ask the mods to add the trope via this thread
.
This is the thread to report tropes with problematic Real Life sections.
Common problems include:
- Conversation on the Main Page
- Flame Bait
- Squicky content
- Impossible in Real Life
Real Life sections on the wiki are kept as long as they don't become a problem. If you find an article with such problems, report it here. Please note that the purpose of this thread is to clean up and maintain real life sections, not raze them. Cutting should be treated as a last resort, so please only suggest cutting RL sections or a subset thereof you think the examples in question are completely unsalvageable.
If historical RL examples are not causing any problems, consider whether it would be better to propose a No Recent Examples, Please! (via this forum thread) for RL instead of NRLEP. If RL examples are causing problems only for certain subjects, consider whether a Limited Real Life Examples Only restriction would be preferable to NRLEP.
If you think a trope should be No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only, then this thread is the place to discuss it. However, please check Keep Real Life Examples first to see if it has already been brought up in the past. If not, state the reasons and add it to the crowner.
Before adding to the crowner:
- The trope should be proposed in the thread, along with reasons for why a crowner is necessary instead of a cleanup.
- There must be support from others in thread.
- Any objections should be addressed.
- Allow a minimum of 24 hours for discussion.
When adding to the crowner:
- Be sure to add the trope name, a link to where the discussion started, the reasons for crownering, whether the restriction being proposed is NRLEP or LRLEO (and in the latter case, which subject(s) the restriction would be for), and the date added.
- Announce in thread that you are adding the item.
- An ATT advert should be made as well (batch items together if more than one trope goes up in a day).
In order for a crowner to pass:
- Must have been up for a minimum of a week
- There must be a 2:1 ratio
- If the vote is exactly 2:1 or +/- 1 vote from that, give it a couple extra days to see if any more votes come in
- Once passed, tropes must be indexed on the appropriate NRLEP index
- Should the vote fail, the trope should be indexed on KRLE page
Sex Tropes, Rape and Sexual Harassment Tropes, and Morality Tropes are banned from having RL sections so tropes under those indexes don't need a crowner vote.
As per Real Life Troping, we never trope unscripted real life sports — so sports tropes where RL examples would only apply to those scenarios don't need a crowner vote.
Crowner entries that have already been called will have "(CLOSED)" appended to them — and are no longer open for discussion.
After bringing up a trope for discussion, please wait at least a day for feedback before adding it to the crowner.
NRLEP tag:
%%https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13350380440A15238800
LRLEO tag:
%%The following restrictions apply: [list restriction(s) here]
%%https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=13350380440A15238800
Notes:
- This thread is not for general discussion regarding policies for Real Life sections or crowners. Please take those conversations to this Wiki Talk thread.
- Do not try to overturn previous No Real Life Examples, Please! or Limited Real Life Examples Only decisions without a convincing argument.
- As mentioned here, the consensus is that NRLEP warnings in trope page descriptions can use bold text so that they stand out.
- The [[noreallife]] tag doesn't currently work. This is a deprecated tag that was introduced many years ago — originally, it would have displayed a NRLEP warning banner when you edited the page. However, there's been some staff conversation (Feb 2024) about what a new technical solution might look like, so we'd advise against deleting these from pages, at least until we have a decision as to whether it'll be fixed or replaced.
Edited by Mrph1 on May 13th 2024 at 9:30:24 AM
Yes, let's see what a day or two brings.
I'm curious on the Former Child Star vote, which seems to be leaning towards keep. The only reasoning I've heard so far is that it's a thing in Real Life, but that wasn't the argument for axing them ...
I didn't choose the troping life, the troping life chose me
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
I agree. I would like to hear from the tropers that would like to KRLE for Nightmare Face suggest it is acceptable to describe RL people this way.
Sounds good on paper (he/him)
I think I'll go with a one-day delay for the ones that are a week old, but I don't intend to do the same for the other ones that were advertised recently since they've already been announced on ATT and, as I previously said, most ATT votes come in on day one. This is aside from the two-day delay for entries that are either exactly or close to 2:1, so if there are any of those, they'd still be delayed by two days instead of having it increased to three.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Sep 19th 2022 at 3:04:41 AM
Patiently awaiting the release of Paper Luigi and the Marvelous Compass.
The Grinch's RL section seems to have a bunch of complaining/justifying.
Looks like Former Child Star is going to be kept, which I still contend is poor taste (I think people take it as an Acceptable Target and just like to bash on some of those people), but even so, that "played with" folders go, right? That seemed to be the consensus here. (Even though those aren't the problematic examples...)
Edited by BeerBaron on Sep 19th 2022 at 8:27:53 AM
Now a lurker. Thanks for everything. | he/him
I'd say remove them. I think "playing with" RL examples could lead to misuse.
Side note, if we agree to just clean up the Former Child Star RL examples, I can help. If you want me to assist, just ping me over.
Edited by themayorofsimpleton on Sep 19th 2022 at 8:30:12 AM
TRS Queue | Works That Require Cleanup of Complaining | Troper Wall
^ That seemed to be the consensus a few pages back as well. Removed the offending folders and cited this thread.
I'd crowner The Grinch. "People who don't like Christmas" is totally Chairs and the tangent of how annoying Christmas songs are is irrelevant natter.
I hate to sound annoying, but I brought up Huge Guy, Tiny Girl and Huge Girl, Tiny Guy a few pages ago and they didn't get any discussion. I'm arguing that they're too common (and particularly with Huge Girl, Tiny Guy, some of the height differences are literally one inch.)
If we're recapping, there's Hello, Sailor! as Gossip and Stereotypes, and even if it doesn't get made NRLEP (which I think it should), most of the examples there can be cut as "general".
I also brought up Wife Husbandry which should be very easy to cut as a Sex, Sexuality, and Rape Tropes.
^ Agreed on the "Huge" and "Tiny" tropes.
Edited by BeerBaron on Sep 19th 2022 at 12:13:52 PM
And there seemed to be consensus that Broken Ace was worth crownering too.
Also, I'm noticing Hello, Sailor!'s hetero cousin Horny Sailors is also currently not NRLEP. Horny Sailors doesn't have a RL section, but I'd say it's worth crownering both of them on the basis of being sex tropes.
It Will Never Catch On requires a level of hindsight that can't be obtained without the work becoming successful, at which point the trope no longer applies in real life. Most examples under the Real Life folder are better fits for And You Thought It Would Fail.
Edited by badtothebaritone on Sep 19th 2022 at 1:46:29 PM
We still have a couple days left on Former Child Star, so let's not say just yet that it will be KRLE.
Regardless, we have consensus to remove any "Playing With" examples. That goes for any RL folder, since RL cannot be played with.
I'm not sure why we are still having the conversation in here to crowner items that do not have RL sections. We have a thread for discussing changes to the NRLEP policy.
(she/her)
The tropes listed on Sex Tropes are blanket banned from having NRLEP examples anyways so I don't think we need to crowner them. Horny Sailors is a sex trope so it can't have any RL examples by default.
Also, we are mostly reactive with RL sections, not proactive. Please do not suggest tropes that don't have RL sections to be crownered again unless consensus rules in favor of preemptively banning RL sections from existing tropes on the RL criteria thread.
Edited by MacronNotes on Sep 19th 2022 at 3:20:32 PM
Macron's notes
I went back and collected all the tropes that were brought up, some had discussion, some didn't (note this NOT a list to crowner yet). I'm still a little concerned that this thread is far more eager to bring up tropes for a NRLEP vote than to actually see about cleanup.
Apologies if I missed something, still a bit medicated from that whole thing earlier.
- Broken Ace - Gossip & Stereotypes, I'm still good with this being crownered.
- Hello, Sailor! - Prone to misuse and natter, however, I still think this can do with a cleanup, looking for more thoughts on this.
- Masculine Girl, Feminine Boy - No real discussion yet, thoughts?
- One Head Taller - Too Common, most examples are just celebrity couples and their heights. Perhaps a cleanup would suffice, thoughts?
- Huge Guy, Tiny Girl - As above, too common.
- Huge Girl, Tiny Guy- Same as the two above, too common.
- Wife Husbandry - Sex, Sexuality & Rape tropes, also just generally ick.
- The Grinch - Misuse and Natter, the trope requires a person to not only hate Christmas, but actively try to ruin it for others. Almost all the examples are general, or other forms of misuse and can probably be cut on those grounds alone. Will a cleanup suffice?
the Retromancer
Feeling like the highlighted post can be appended to the OP as QNA.
TroperWall / WikiMagic Cleanup
If Sex tropes don't need a crowner, then how does that work? We have two currently that fit:
Edited by laserviking42 on Sep 19th 2022 at 3:44:59 PM
I didn't choose the troping life, the troping life chose me
^ Neither of those is actually on the list, but definitely should be. Wife Husbandry is on the Sexual Harassment and Rape Tropes which should probably have the same blanket RLE ban.
(she/her)
I think crownering both should be fine after further discussion is had (if it hasn't been done already).
I see that Wife Husbandry is under Sexual Harassment and Rape Tropes but that index doesn't have the blanket ban on RL sections that Sex Tropes has in the description. We should probably extend the ban to cover those tropes as well. I am not how that was missed.
Welp, ![[nja]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/user_ninja_2074.png "[nja]"){kind=small}
Edited by MacronNotes on Sep 19th 2022 at 3:55:05 PM
Macron's notes
So how would we extend the ban?
I didn't choose the troping life, the troping life chose me
(she/her)
Responding to Amonimus since I forgot to address their last post:
Both parts of the mod post I made? (on the sex tropes blanket ban + adding tropes without RL sections to the crowner). If so, I am fine with adding that to the pinned post if others agree.
As for extending the blanket ban on Sex Tropes to cover Sexual Harassment and Rape Tropes, I'll ask the other mods.
Macron's notes
the Retromancer
Some of the Sexual Harassment and Rape Tropes are "Not always associated with rape, but very often is", like Unequal Pairing. Those few items seem to be outliers on this index, though.
Looks like I missed ItWillNeverCatchOn.Real Life.
The basic premise of a new idea being ridiculed or belittled only for it to become popular is so common as to be entirely non-notable. We (society) love to embellish and/or play up the idea of that scrappy inventor/creator/entrepeneur who persevered in the face of utter indifference/scorn only to become wildly successful. Seriously, think of your favorite band/director/writer/etc and you'll probably find a similar story lurking around.
Fittingly, the Real Life sub-page is enormous. It's folderized, but still keeps growing (Aeronautics! Electronics! Other Electronics!). As is usual with these huge pages, it's attracting a ton of natter as tropers race each other to "Well AKSHUALLY..." sub-bullets and sub-sub-bullets. Not to mention that alot of these entries sound like urban legends.
I would definitely support a crowner on this one (as Too Common, in case that wasn't clear).
Edited by laserviking42 on Sep 19th 2022 at 5:42:20 AM
I didn't choose the troping life, the troping life chose me
When you have a folder called X and another folder called Other X, you know your page is getting too big for its britches.
Crown Description:
Vote up to either forbid all real life examples (No Real Life Examples Please) or forbid real life examples for specific subjects (Limited Real Life Examples Only); vote down to Keep Real Life Examples. To add a trope to a No Real Life Examples Please index or the Limited Real Life Examples Only index, its crowner option must meet the following criteria:- Stable 2:1 ratio needed for NRLEP or LRLEO
- The item have been on the crowne for a minimum of a week
- If the vote is exactly 2:1 or +/- 1 vote from that, give it a couple of extra days to see if more votes come in.
im good with holding off for a day.
id like to hear from the handful of folks who downvoted Fair for Its Day and Nightmare Face, particularly on why exactly the latter isn't an unacceptably cruel thing to say about a real person.